Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: What sort of HK material do you want to see?
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
Demonseed Elite
Branching off from the discussion on Runner Havens vs. New Seattle, I've long planned to add extra material about Shadowrun Hong Kong to my SR4 work blog (see sig for link). I'm curious what sorts of things people might want to see. Is there anything you felt was lacking from the Hong Kong section of RH that you want material for? Anything you want expanded on? I won't make any promises that a certain piece will go up next or anything, but I would like to see what people might want.
Brahm
More detailed map of downtown, and across the harbour too, would be nice. I know that's a lot of work for laying something out, but nothing hits home like a map so even if you have a roughly hand-noted one a scan of that would be cool.

I don't know if you have anything and it's sort of a tangent but it'd be nice if you had more details about their Portuguese twin to the west, Macao. I got the impression that it's the real Barrens of HK in so much as where you go if you want to run far away from Knight Errant. So that brings up illicit base of operations, skip-tracing/wetwork jobs, a place for your players to lay low for a while if they decided to pull off a simple drugstore smash & grab using grenades eek.gif ohplease.gif (yes, yes they did) but still do runs, and such.
DireRadiant
I thought the social networking flavor in RH about HK was good, and most of the geography stuff decent.

A few more things about how distinctive different a few things about the city would be good. Also a note on common cultural differences and practices.

in no particular order some thoughts
e.g. Who picks up the check at the restaurant, and why? If you've seen the lengths some people go to in order to ensure they are footing the dinner bill, it could be a 'run all by itself.
Games, Chineses chess, Mah Jong, kite fighting, all the unusual competitive games.
Food and diet, breakfast is different, congi and fish. If I ran a campaign in France I'd be pointing out one of your breakfast options is a big bowl of coffee and milk.
Anything that shows how densely populated it is. Unless you've been there, it's incredibly difficult to describe just how many people you are around. On weekends at the beaches, you literally cannot see the sand because it is covered with people and blankets. You can actually have no idea where the shoreline is because there are so many people on the beach and standing in the water.
Downtown at lunch time there will be several hundred people on the sidewalk on one city block. This is on a normal day.
It's an incredibly urban environment. Look at a housing estate, you can have 50,000 people in a couple blocks.
Demonseed Elite
QUOTE (Brahm)
More detailed map of downtown, and across the harbour too, would be nice. I know that's a lot of work for laying something out, but nothing hits home like a map so even if you have a roughly hand-noted one a scan of that would be cool.

I'm not terribly good at making maps. I didn't make the ones in RH, Mike (otaku_mike on these boards) did those. I do know where the locales I detailed are in Hong Kong and I have put the street addresses on my work blog already, along with a link to an online searchable map of Hong Kong.

If I figure out how to make decent Google Earth overlays, that may be a possibility.
cetiah
More organizations and their nefarious goals.
(Especially if I can use them in my Seattle campaign.)
cetiah
More cityscapes for Hong Kong and Seattle.
Adds a lot of flavor.
Demonseed Elite
QUOTE (cetiah @ Jan 26 2007, 12:00 PM)
More cityscapes for Hong Kong and Seattle. 
Adds a lot of flavor.

What do you mean by cityscapes, exactly?

EDIT: Also, this thread is specifically for Hong Kong material. I didn't write the Seattle section of RH and so it's not on my list right now of material to work on.
cetiah
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite)
QUOTE (cetiah @ Jan 26 2007, 12:00 PM)
More cityscapes for Hong Kong and Seattle. 
Adds a lot of flavor.

What do you mean by cityscapes, exactly?

EDIT: Also, this thread is specifically for Hong Kong material. I didn't write the Seattle section of RH and so it's not on my list right now of material to work on.

I noticed you had a beautiful cityscape of Hong Kong on your blog. If you find anymore that seem particularly inspiring, or paint the city as a "cool" or "shadowy" place, I think they always add something.
Demonseed Elite
Oh, gotcha, yeah, I can probably find more of those.
Ophis
My demands are simple.

Some details about the low level gangs who work for various triads.
Ideas of corp facilities and the sort of research they do.
Local personalities - to network with.
More detail on the Kowloon walled city and the Yama kings.
emo samurai
Echo that last line; that part was COOL.
Ophis
oh and one more thing...

Some sort of rough notes on the population in nieghbourhoods
Demonseed Elite
All of those are very possible and I'll put them on my list.
Mal-2
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite)
If I figure out how to make decent Google Earth overlays, that may be a possibility.

I have Google Earth overlays made up for the major divisions of Hong Kong, here. I've started placing the individual locations, but it's a lot of work to go from an address (or intersection) to an actual location in google earth. I meant to work on it some more last month, but the project got set aside, and I never picked up on it again.
ChicagosFinest
Take me to the interesting places of hong kong. Name the more comon types of crime and explain how crime works in HK, how does HK culture encourage or suppresses crime?

Is HK fully of trendy honda driving, english speaking, techno glowstick dancing, extacy abusing asians? Or is there more than meets the eyes behind the tongs and gamboling parlors in HK? I know it would be cleche as well but is it like "big trouble in little china" or "Enter the dragon"? I want to go there and see the trills rub elbows with the bigwigs and send a postcard to my guys in the Chi while i get ready to be "loved a long time" by an asian prostitue I picked up in the trendy nightspot. I'm a runner with a rep to maintain. Give me the tools I need to make my vacation memorable.

Make me feel the cultrue like i have lived there for a year or 2. This is the same place where they had Kung-fu roof top pit fights to the death ("blood sport and bruce lee baby).

is that to much to ask?


Blade
You're in HK Demonseed ? Because I am right now. So if you ever need some inside information about anything, just ask.

There's so much to do about that place... It's cyberpunk even today.
mfb
i know what you mean. when i got to South Korea in 2001 and saw public videophone terminals... well, wow.
Backgammon
Some examples of runs.. like in shadowtalk format, people talking about how the hit went down: "i heard they gunned everyone down and walked out the front door"... this shows what kind of shadowrun culture exists, both in how the other runners talk about the hit, how it was executed, what was stolen/done, and what kind of payback came after them. These things depend on the local culture. Are runs sneaky and tricky, or blood n guts? Does the Triad come after you for taking a piece of action in their turf without paying your dues? Do the corps easily write off shadowruns? etc.
DireRadiant
Things like you can live in an apartment complex that is like a mini arcology. lower levels are shops, grocery stores, fitness center, restaurants and the MTR stop connects directly to the basement levels.

You do not need a car, in fact, cars are a pain to have and take care of for most people.

Pedicabs, buses, minibuses, cabs, trams, MTR, rail, water taxis, car ferries, cross harbor tunnel, ferry to outlying islands.

Outlying islands... only a couple of hours on a ferry, a fishing village from 200 years ago.

Floating villages of fisherfolk right next to high rise building downtown.

Floating restaurant.

Incredibly densely populated urban environment, yet if you go to teh right place you can in about ten minutes go up in the hills and be somewhere that no one has visited in years.

Reservoir system... Hong Kong is completely dependent on fresh water pieplines and food being shipped in daily. Not an issue most of the time, but if Warlord might make noises abotu cutting of fresh water unless they get paid.

For all the people and things to do in HK, it's actually incredibly isolated. You have to fly out, or take a ship, and there's only the one rail/highway corridor going north. For all that Macau is a neighboring city, it's actually quite remote from Hong Kong.

Macau, it's totally different. Macau is really much more like a earopean (portuguese) enclave in asia, while Hong Kong is a modern blend all of it's own.
ChicagosFinest
Of course what do people eat? DO they still speak the Kings english or do they now speak chinese?

Like mentioned before what is it close to? What are it's mystical relations to places like tibet? ect.
toturi
1) What are the differences between your HK(since you are the writer) and the present one? Culture, language, socio-economic structure, etc.

2) I do not believe that Snow Tiger, Lei Kung and some other minor players are the extent of the runners scene in HK. Seattle has a lot more "famous" runners. I'd like to see more of them. Maybe some sample HK Contacts.
Draug
The Hong Kong underground, from an Urban Explorer perspective. Storm drains, abandoned metrotubes, old maintenance tunnels, traversible sewer canals, and other stuff that makes hidden or off-track paths from A-B. Plus stuff you might run into down there.

If they exist, that is.
Magus
More details on the interrelationships (if any) between religions and martial art schools. More detail on shopping spots. I like the Golden Mile but it needed more fleshing out. Such as more detail on talismongering areas vs electronic or cultural shopping. My Social Adept went nuts shopping for business suits.
Tycho
hi,

first of all, I like the Hongkong Chapter very much and my group enjoy playing there.

things I would like to have:
- sample Connections with their Guanxi Network
- more about the Yama kings, maybe a few sample
- a overview over the talismonger business in Hongkong, it seem to be very big market there
- more locations are always fine

thanks a lot,

Tycho
ChicagosFinest
QUOTE (Magus)
More details on the interrelationships (if any) between religions and martial art schools. More detail on shopping spots. I like the Golden Mile but it needed more fleshing out. Such as more detail on talismongering areas vs electronic or cultural shopping. My Social Adept went nuts shopping for business suits.

More details on Interacial relationships period. Its a global setting White, Hispanic, and black people would probably be a minority but present none the less.

How is HK differant from the rest of China is what I wanna know and the big question you might want to look into.
Demonseed Elite
QUOTE (ChicagosFinest)
More details on Interacial relationships period. Its a global setting White, Hispanic, and black people would probably be a minority but present none the less.


It's really not a major topic for Hong Kong in 2070. As Runner Havens mentions, Hongkongers are more comfortable around native Chinese, but because the city is so international, they have few hang-ups dealing with people of other races and nationalities.

There aren't really any white, black, or Hispanic racial enclaves in the city. There are expatriate areas (such as Stanley) but those are usually a mix of all types of expatriates.

QUOTE
How is HK differant from the rest of China is what I wanna know and the big question you might want to look into.


It's hard to answer that question without detailing the rest of China, which I definitely do not have the time to do. Shadows of Asia is a good source of information on the other Chinese nation-states, and once you know how those operate, the differences start to come out.

There are some obvious differences between Hong Kong and the rest of China. First, Hong Kong is a corporate-run enclave. Second, it is a very international city, whereas the rest of the Chinese nation-states tend to be more isolationalist (with the possible exception of the Canton Confederation). Third, Hong Kong is a wealthy city. By comparison, the other Chinese nation-states are struggling. The rest of China was wracked by war for a long time, while Hong Kong was thriving on a Japanese-fueled economic bubble.
ChicagosFinest
And thats all you need to say in your write up. biggrin.gif
PBTHHHHT
QUOTE (ChicagosFinest @ Jan 27 2007, 12:00 PM)
Of course what do people eat? DO they still speak the Kings english or do they now speak chinese? 

Like mentioned before what is it close to? What are it's mystical relations to places like tibet? ect.

The people of Hong Kong eat a variety of things. There's a lot of different ethnic food (Indian food, Japanese food, French, Korean bbq, you name it) that would sit next to a traditional style chinese restaurant that's across the street from a McDonald's (or Wendy's, etc...) Plus, there's the fusion type restaurants.
The cuisine will have fads and such of foods from other countries, a few decades ago, it was all the rage for this soup, Russian soup, basically a hearty vegetable soup.

They also have the equivalent of a diner type restaurant that's everywhere. You can order a meal with lots of rice and a drink for a very cheap price. Lots of meat and veggies. Food can be very cheap in Hong Kong, it's just that rooming accomodations itself is expensive.

Yes, they speak english there with the british accent, usually it's for business. There are four main television stations, two are in english, two are in chinese, but that was back in '99, and yes the english stations have a lot of programming that are ones with british accents, though some shows are from Australia and such I think, and then there's the American shows too (don't forget Babewatch nyahnyah.gif). But what timeline are you asking about because currently with the takeover by China, mandarin chinese is now more pronounced, they use it for the administrative affairs for government and with the rise of the Chinese economy on the mainland, there's more reason for folks to use mandarin. However, the local dialect, Cantonese, is still the main language spoken by most of the population. There also several other dialects depending of who's emigrated to the city.

The province of Guangzhou, while the main local dialect is Cantonese, hosts many other dialects (some villages being in remote areas will have variations on their local spoken language). What unifies them is that they all use the same written characters.

Mystical relations? There's the host of buddhist temples and such throughout the area. There's even a large statue of buddha on this island located nearby (it's mentioned in the Runner's Haven book, I've never been to it *grumble*). What are you asking about? To tibet? It depends, because there are a variety of different sects within the Buddhist religion also. There's also taoist priests and the host of other religions, there's some rather old churches in Hong Kong too.

QUOTE
It's really not a major topic for Hong Kong in 2070. As Runner Havens mentions, Hongkongers are more comfortable around native Chinese, but because the city is so international, they have few hang-ups dealing with people of other races and nationalities.


Well, that's interesting, Hong Kong did note the increase in crime and such after the opening of the borders to mainland China for awhile after reunification with China. There's actually some stereotypes and prejudices between those of Hong Kong and those from the Mainland. But for RL timeline with the rise of the economy of China, the attitudes have changed in some regards, though there some tensions because of different views of society and politeness (like spitting in public) between those of Hong Kong and mainland China.

Would it be that in the Shadowrun timeline that these differences are even more pronounced since the rest of China is broken up, coupled with lots of tension and strife that the folks there have a very different attitude on life and such. When they arrive/visit Hong Kong, the folks there would be put off by what they perceive as being rude or backwards. The visitors would in return see Hong Kong residents as being arrogant, materialistic and greedy folks. (Actually in RL there's an attitude by those from the Mainland that those who are from Guangzhou are greedy, materialistic folks, my sister got that attitude from some lady who's originally from Beijing).
DireRadiant
Interesting Demographic fact, probably not relevant to 2070 HK.

Not so long ago over 50 percent of the population of Hong Kong was under 18. This has an enormous impact.
PBTHHHHT
Maybe, maybe not, but it's good to know so you can possibly what might be different from the alternate timeline and such. But if you know what the base mentality is, it may help predict how it'll be in the 2070 HK.
Demonseed Elite
QUOTE (PBTHHHHT)
QUOTE
It's really not a major topic for Hong Kong in 2070. As Runner Havens mentions, Hongkongers are more comfortable around native Chinese, but because the city is so international, they have few hang-ups dealing with people of other races and nationalities.


Well, that's interesting, Hong Kong did note the increase in crime and such after the opening of the borders to mainland China for awhile after reunification with China. There's actually some stereotypes and prejudices between those of Hong Kong and those from the Mainland. But for RL timeline with the rise of the economy of China, the attitudes have changed in some regards, though there some tensions because of different views of society and politeness (like spitting in public) between those of Hong Kong and mainland China.

Would it be that in the Shadowrun timeline that these differences are even more pronounced since the rest of China is broken up, coupled with lots of tension and strife that the folks there have a very different attitude on life and such. When they arrive/visit Hong Kong, the folks there would be put off by what they perceive as being rude or backwards. The visitors would in return see Hong Kong residents as being arrogant, materialistic and greedy folks. (Actually in RL there's an attitude by those from the Mainland that those who are from Guangzhou are greedy, materialistic folks, my sister got that attitude from some lady who's originally from Beijing).

Actually, bad me, I definitely mistyped there. I should have said that Hongkongers feel more comfortable with native Hongkongers, not with native Chinese. There are slight prejudices against anyone not from Hong Kong, whether it is someone from Beijing or someone from Seattle. In general, a human resident of Hong Kong will feel more in common with a troll from Hong Kong than he will with another human from Beijing. Unlike Seattle, metahuman prejudice isn't common in Hong Kong, instead it is based on whether you are from out of town or not.

That said, Hongkongers are not xenophobic. They may look slightly down upon people from elsewhere, but that will not stop a Hongkonger from doing business with them.
Demonseed Elite
QUOTE (Mal-2)
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite)
If I figure out how to make decent Google Earth overlays, that may be a possibility.

I have Google Earth overlays made up for the major divisions of Hong Kong, here. I've started placing the individual locations, but it's a lot of work to go from an address (or intersection) to an actual location in google earth. I meant to work on it some more last month, but the project got set aside, and I never picked up on it again.

I intended to reply to this post before and I somehow forgot. That overlay is very nice! I have a solid idea where all the individual locations from RH are in Hong Kong, so if I can figure out how to edit overlays and add those locations, I could do that at some point.
FlakJacket
Wouldn't mind some extra information on the local prison system for when things really go pear shaped or if you want to set a game in them. smile.gif

Now from what I've read Hong Kong's prison system seems to actually be pretty good, well it gets a good write-up from the usual suspects of international campaigning groups at least. But of course that doesn't fit with the whole dystopian world thing Shadowrun has going, so with HK becoming a corporate town I figure that would be one of the first departments to be farmed out to private corporations for a fee so you can almost guarantee standards will drop like a stone. Hell, with all the private corp prisons already mentioned in canon I could see them shipping the long term prisoners off the the Philippines or somewhere in mainland China.

Edit: Knew I'd remembered seeing something about this. Seems the Legco floated the idea a few years back about building a single large super prison to replace all the other seperate sites on Hei Ling Chau island. Lots of people got up in arms about it though so it never went through, makes an interesting idea at the least.
PBTHHHHT
heh, speaking of prisons, there's a local prison on the road in Kowloon on the road to Saikung, located in a moutain pass. I see it whenever I visit HK as I go to Saikung. For the most part, most of Kowloon peninsula is rather rural (relatively) with lots of space especially on the mountainous area which would be ideal for additional prison facilities.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012