Mmmmm....

Realy guys, I prefer this one.

And, of course, the Ruger Super Redhawk doesn't look all that different from an 1873 Colt Army.

This really shouldn't surprise me much, given how much modern automatics tend to look like the Colt 1911. I imagine that innovations within these classes of gun are going to be evolutionary rather than revolutionary; any "revolutionary" changes will be an entirely new class of weapon, like the difference between revolvers and automatics.

I think you meant Ruger Super Blackhawk, there. The Super Redhawk is a double action revolver that doesn't much resemble the Colt SAA.

The way I see it, the 10M damage code puts the Super Warhawk into .44 Magnum territory, and the SS mode makes it a single action. The Super Blackhawk is the only single action .44 Mag revolver that Ruger currently makes, so the Super Warhawk should be similar to it.

w00t!

Erhm... Sorry.

Edit: ...

I so quoted Centurion.

Hate to break it to you, but the Mateba revolver is a weapon of today, like the majority of the guns on that page. CZ-100 is real. Jericho 941FS is real (though AFAIK, there has never been a model 942, as the 941 designates that the pistol was originally available in 9mm and .41 AE. None of the Jerichos will ever be chambered in .50 AE. Period.). Steyr TMP is real. SIG 540 is real (again, AFAIK, there was never a 541. The 550 series are today's standard.). Ultima Ratio is real. The CZN M22 and SPIW MINI 14 are both works of fiction.

Hmm. I didn't notice that the Warhawk was SS.

I cannot argue with the logic, given the stats in the book, but I don't see why a single action revolver would be used for a combat firearm when equal quality double action revolvers are available.

I would love to see the recoil of a .500 S&W Magnum revolver. Better make that first shot count.

Edit: Cut out bizarre, half-baked rambling /edit

Mind you, the Ruger Warhawk isn't a combat gun but rather designed for hunting big game like deer, moose, piasma and troll.

-Siege

I'm not sure if this is what Traks was referring to (so I'm not speaking for him), but your wording is a bit confusing even if the end results are the same.

The pistols would be fired together as a single Complex Action instead of two Simple Actions. Like I said, it's just wording - it sounds like you intended to fire each gun only once per turn regardless. It might only make a difference if, after firing the first shot, your character suddenly wanted to change his action and not fire the second shot. Since the shots are simultaneous, this would not be possible.

The second was your reference to the "pair of Induction pads on your smartlink". The smartlink does not give any target-number bonus when firing two weapons simultaneously, although you may have only been referring to the normal bonuses of having your remaining ammo displayed, having a smartlink safety system, etc.

I would call .44mag the very outside for practical combat handgun calibers in toe 2060s, only because of Orcs & Trolls. Barring them, .357mag would be the outside.

Of course, that assumes you have a human behind the gun. Goodness knows how powerful a handgun a Troll could wield. Revolver in 12ga anyone? <shudder>

Uhm, no.

You do not need Ambidexterity as you are NOT firing the revolvers simultaneously, which is the only time you suffer that particular penalty (and thus do not need to compensate for it).

Firing a Weapon is a Simple Action. SS weapons can only be fired once per Combat Phase, yes, but each shot is still a Simple Action. You have two Simple Actions (or one Complex Action) per phase. Thus you can fire two different SS weapons in one phase, each one taking up a Simple Action. One right after the other. As opposed to firing two weapons simulataneously which uses one Simple Action to fire two weapons, at which point you suffer the +2/+2, no targeting systems, and combined recoil penalties.

Thus you can fire two Ruger Warhawks per turn without incurring the Using a Second Firearm penalty (which is intended for firing them simultaneously, not just holding them), because you're not. It's just like firing a single pistol twice, one shot after the other. Bang. Pause. Bang. If both are smartlinked and you have two induction pads, you even get your -2 TN bonus just as if you were firing only one SA pistol.

So yes, effectively, you can use two Ruger Warhawks as if they were a single SA pistol with an Ammo capacity of 12 and a Damage Code of 10M. Your only major pitfalls is that 1) both hands are full and 2) reloading is going to be a lot more difficult.

But style-wise, it's still a fun alternative, especially if you just like the image of using two guns instead of one.

Well, the Super Warhawk was the only canon revolver in the game until CC, IIRC. I'm really not sure why they chose to make it SS mode, but it is. Given the explanation of SS mode (SR3.114), I assume that it's just a single action revolver, which fits in well with the current state of affairs at Ruger.

Another explanation I've heard for the SS mode is that the Super Warhawk just generates too much recoil to be fired on the second simple action at all. I don't like that much because it negates some advantages of Orks and Trolls, who, because of their size, should be able to handle more recoil than other races. Of course, all recoil is treated the same using canon rules, but hey...

Funny you should mention that. I got my hands on one this morning. Not as bad as I thought it would be, but it's still a bit less than tolerable. Loud, jarring and not good on the hands/wrists. I'd say the muzzle ended up about 65-75º from zero with my hands ending up above the level of my forehead. And it gave quite a push. I only paid $2.25 a shot to get beat up twice. It's definitely more fun to watch your friends beat themselves up. There were four of us and we couldn't manage to get through a 20-round box of ammo. I'm just glad I got the opportunity to shoot the damn thing without buying it. You really do have to make that first shot count. It'll take a couple seconds to set up for the next. But considering what people will be using it for, that shouldn't be difficult. The .500 Mag will definitely be easier to use in a rifle, though. Only a matter of time.

If you get the Outdoor Channel, I'm sure they'll be showing it in action on Guns & Ammo TV here pretty soon if they haven't already.

That's the way I handle it as well. It also explains why Lone Star beat cops would be hauling monster revolvers around. It's what they could get on the cheap and quick to better deal with disgruntled Orks and Trolls. It only became a "combat" revolver out of necessity.

Pistol firing with your off-hand is FAR easier than writing legibly with your off-hand. Especially if you aren't using iron sights, but using a laser or smartlink instead. Hand dominance is far less of a factor in firearms than in hand-to-hand combat.

Drek... I guess that saying "You learn something new every mana cycle" is true after all.

Thanks for the lesson TFB.

I don't own the Canon Companion, so I can't explictly reference it, but I am pretty sure Off Hand Weapon skills are in there.

Can I get a page reference? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

How've you been lately, Doc?

That's not a bad idea. I can imagine firing that .500 Mag more than a few times without padded gloves or recoil-absorbing grips would start to get really uncomfortable. Even after firing it twice, I have a bit of a tender spot in the web of my hand from the gun twisting up and jamming a corner of the frame into my hand. I guess you could consider that damage. It's anyone's guess as to how much damage that would work out to be in the game.

The .500 Mag develops more than twice as much recoil as the 7.62x51mm would from a gun of the same weight, actually. The 7.62x51mm has much greater range, but the .500 Magnum will likely create a much more destructive wound cavity than the 7.62x51mm. So in terms of energy and the ability to transfer it to tissue, the .500 Mag pretty much beats the 7.62x51mm hands down. At least, from a large revolver platform.

7.62x51mm NATO US M80
147 grain FMJ @ 2400 fps (from a 10" barrel)
44.5 grains IMR 4895
Gun Weight: 5.1 lbs.
Recoil: 18 fpe @ 15 fps

.500 Smith & Wesson Magnum
440 grain Hard Cast Lead @ 1654 fps (from a 10" barrel)
38 grains H110
Gun Weight: 5.1 lbs.
Recoil: 43 fpe @ 23 fps

The only things that are beefier than the .500 Magnum would be other big-bullet cartridges like the .450 Marlin (debatable), .458 Win Mag, .50 Alaskan and into the really big, super expensive dangerous game rounds like .416 Rigby, .404 Jeffery, .470 Nitro Express, .505 Gibbs, etc...

Uh, no. There's definitely a lot out there, but it's far from most. I'd say probably about a third of what I know about firearms I've learned from online sources.

Well, if you're talking to me, off the top of my head I would say that your average Troll could probably treat a .500 Mag like your average human treats a .40 S&W. I'll have to run the numbers some other time.

Look up Magnum Research's BFR in .45-70. That oughta make you shudder.

OK, I stand corrected. "A lot" it is.