leave a small device that can access their skinlink. And listen to all the RF traffic and find their "hidden" commlink. If the hacker is willing to remain close, the device can be a really low powered and tiny.

In theory you could do AR spam to everyone but the toll. . .

And if he's shaking your hand for a little too long, he may not be trying to hack you...he might be coming on to you...

After some thought, most of my paranoia about skinlinks could be solved with a long sleeved shirt.

Still I'll stick to my nanowire connections just to be safe. In Unwired, I just know they're going to come up with an undetectable sticky dot that broadcasts your skinlink transmissions. Someone bumps into you on the street and bam, all your cybereye and cyberear transmissions are all over the internet. Nah, I'll stick with direct hardwires for everything but my smartgun and smartdoc.

Well it is the 70s chummer.


As to the rest of your post, yeah I agree, although personally I let skinlinks work through normal clothes so long sleeve shirts wouldn't work in my campaigns, but a leather jacket would.

Considering the character in question isn't a hacker himself, running multiple PANs adds to the amount of monitoring and adds more activity to his network traffic which attracts attention. ( Even hidden mode isn't fool proof.)

All you've done is add redundancy rather then security. ( Which is helpful in another case.)

A variation of your PAN II would be a better bet.

Basically, invest in a datajack ( Which is a wired connection.) and only connect to the comlink when you need diagnostics or doing updates. Invest in a good comlink with some IC on it as the character in question isn't a hacker.

This gets rid of most of the wireless security hole, and keeps our friend flying low on the radar.

As for skin link, its still a wireless signal but is limited to the surface of the characters skin. ( Great for espionage and courier characters, good idea to only use it when needed though.)

It still will show up on wireless scans, but won't be reachable without direct touch.

I do see a way this sort of touch can be accomplished with existing gear, take a sensor RFID with a modified Radio Signal Scanner. ( Modify it so it acts as a relay, you can even add skin link to it if you wish to treat skin link as a separate type of connection)

This will force the PAN to have a range of up to 3m directly, and could allow the hacker to use nearby access points to extend access even further.

Lets put it this way, with all your other devices being wireless there is no reason why a device that provides a secure wired connection would be wireless it self. ( Aka you don't need the data jack to allow your other bits to access wireless communications.)

The whole point behind the datajack is to provide a secure/non-wireless connection.

RAW isn't very specific about the way skin link works, but I did provide a work around for either case. ( You'd just need to add skin link to the RFID sensor tag, and then it can bridge the traffic to wireless.)

Of course if you went with skin link is a separate communication type, everything you want to use with it would have to be adapted to it. ( Also brings up the issue with internal implants that don't have contact with surface skin.)

The above could be solved by adding skin link to a datajack, but then just using the datajack in the first place would've been cheaper. ( This is what happens when you have too much time on your hands and just enough caffeine in your system.)

If it were wireless it wouldn't be limited to touch. The devices that use the skinlink might still also have a wireless link though...

If you carry the wireless signal in the electrical field of the surface skin, then you could control the coverage provided and shield it from disruption. ( The entry for skin link isn't very descriptive on this, hope it gets updated.)

Thats where the modified RFID senor tag with Radio Signal Scanner comes into play. ( With or without skinlink depending on how you interpret the tech.)

The tag if modified would basically boost the signal outside the range of covered by the surface electrical field. ( With the non-wireless skin link, it would provide a bridge between the skin links signal and a normal wireless one.)

No, the whole point of the datajack is to provide a DNI connection to the outside world, the secure hardwired aspect is just an added bonus that could be easily gained by modifying a set of trodes.

Yeah, but the problem is that in order to detect/hack a skinlinked network your tags have to be in direct contact with your target, and that is more secure then a normal wireless network.

This is the way it works now, you have to skinlink adapt any device that you want to be able to send or recieve skinlinked traffic, but if you want the same device could then resend the data using a different connection type.

There is nothing preventing the following setup if you wanted to send your guncam information to one of your chummers.

Predator IV <skinlink connection> Datajack <skinlink connection> Commlink <wireless connection> Chummer's Commlink <hardwired connection> Chummer's Smart Glasses

Granted, using your datajack's wired (or wireless) connection would be 50-500 cheaper then adapting it to be capable of interfacing with your skinlinked network, but having wires trailing out of your skull is more noticalbe and a snagging hazard compared to a skinlink connection.

As for adapting other cyber with skinlink, well I'd imagine that its fairly simple to run a wire from the implant to the skin, but as you said, its just as easy and cheaper to connect your cyber to a skinlinked datajack. (I prefer Betagrade as it allows for nastier ICE to be installed.)

No, wireless also provides DNI so that isn't unique to a datajack. ( Otherwise a smartgun system would require a datajack for instance.)

The only advantage a datajack provides is hardwired access to communications, as one of the specific examples in the entry is secure communications between two individuals.

Direct contact isn't hard to accomplish, everything from "bumping" into the target with a adhesive slathered tag to actually planting the tag into someones clothing.

As for the security aspect, its only the extremely limited range that gives skinlink its advantage, but the modified tag acts to amp the signal or converting it into wireless signal therefore bypassing the range limitation. ( Also remember the target in question isn't a hacker so has less defenses.)

Here's the problem, the character in question wants all of his cyber implants to be accessible to the matrix for updating and also wants to monitor them.

Skin link works along the surface of the skin and provides no means for sub-dermal implants to participate in the skin link network.

Because of the security concerns and the characters lack of cyber security abilities, its best to hardwire the connections.

No, a smartlink only requires a DNI connection through a datajack or trodes (Or I imagine an induction pad ala Third Edition.) if you want to issue mental commands to your weapon. Also since we know that Simsense Vertigo affects smartlink technology it's a safe bet that a Sim Module is also needed if you want to use all of your smartlink's functions.

Yes that is the main advantage that a datajack has over trodes, it provides a hardwire connection, BUT that is a far cry from claiming that a datajack doesn't also provide a wireless connection. After all a datajack is both cyberware and an intra-PAN device which means that by RAW it has ( Signal 0 ) or in other words, a wireless range of 3 meters.

I'm not going to agrue over the ease or lack thereof in attaching your skinlink=>wireless RFID tags to someone, but the fact still stands that it is harder to detect or hack a skinlink network, so they are by their very nature more secure then a wireless network.

Yes I'll agree that the only reason skinlinks are more secure is the fact that its range is limited to a metahuman's bio-electric field, in fact I'll even agree that your skinlink=>wireless RFID tags would allow a Decker to hack into a skinlink network. Where I disagree is when you seem to be claiming that just because it's possible to bypass a skinlink's protection that skinlinks aren't more secure then wireless.

Perhaps, perhaps not, but since the doctor is already running wires to the skin, it shouldn't be that much harder to run the wire all the way to the skin's surface if that is what is necessary.

No, DNI is possible over any network connection otherwise Riggers wouldn't be able to jump into there drones.

Simsense Vertigo effects AR / VR and simsense, its basically the same problem certain people face when dealing with motion in a projected 3d scene. ( Happens with FPS games.)

Datajacks are there to provide secure network connections via hardwire, where as trodes are to get around implanting devices to allow DNI connection and to avoid using wireless connections. ( Much more popular with the essence friendly crowd.)

Considering the datajack isn't required for other devices to connect as all devices default to having wireless connections. ( Which allows for interconnecting directly or more securely through a comlink.)

And the description specifically states that a datajack is for directly connecting to devices with a fibre optic cable.

Further, the data lock which is an advanced datajack specifically states its not wireless enabled.

Never claimed that a skinlink was less secure then a wireless connection, just pointing out that skinlinks aren't secure beyond extremely limited range. ( And that an RFID sensor tag wouldn't be able to intercept the fibre optic communication, that sort of fun requires a bit more creativity.)

If we really want to get picky, a cyberware scanner would be able to pickup the presence of a skin link.

You've got to be jerking my chain. *Sighs*

When a Rigger jumps into a drone he does not have a DNI Connection to the drone, what he does have is a DNI Connection through his datajack/trodenet to a sim module which is then converted from neural signals into computer data and sent over a wireless connection to his drone.

*Edit* It's the same process as a Decker uses to enter a node using VR. */Edit*

And that may be part of it, however the problem is that we know that smartlinks make use of DNI directly, otherwise they couldn't be used to mentally issue commands to the gun.

*Edit* Hmm, upon futher reflection you may be right on Simsense Vertigo, although I'm not entirely convinced that if it were merely the motion sickness FPS can give people that it would affect people while in VR Mode at all. */Edit*

*Edit 2.0* However that doesn't change the fact that you still need a datajack or trodenet if you want to issue mental commands to your gun. */Edit 2.0*

Well you are partially right, as trodes are an Essense friendly way of achieving DNI and that datajacks do offer a hardwire connection. However, we know that datajacks have the same wireless reach as trodes, so that also means that anything you can do with a trodenet, I can also do with a datajack. (Except remove it without visting a street doc of course. )

Wait a moment, if "all devices default to having wireless connections" as you've just admitted then that means that a datajack also defaults to having a wireless connection.

As for the datajack's description, it says that a datajack has a hardwired connection, but nowhere does it state that it doesn't also have a wireless connections, which remember "all devices default to having wireless connections".

And sure, you can use the wireless link built into your cyber to connect them to each other or to your commlink directly, no datajack needed (I think it's more secure to use your betagrade datajack as a really nasty ICE infested chokepoint for the rest of your cyber, and thats why I suggested doing it that way.) However you still won't be able to issue mental commands to your nonimplanted gear without either a datajack or trodenet.

Firstly a datalock is not an "advanced datajack", it's nothing more then a specialized version of a datajack that allows people to play Johny Memoric if they want to. Secondly if a baseline datajack wasn't wireless enabled then that fact wouldn't have to be noted in the datalock's description because it would have appeared somewhere in the datajack's description.

Ok sure, and I'll agree with the exception that skinlinks should be in widespread use among anyone who is both security minded and has the extra nuyen to blow on skinlink adapting his gear.

As for wires, yeah, they are more secure then skinlinks, however they are also a bigger hassle and skinlinks are generally speaking secure enough.

Meh, I don't know enough about millimeter-wave scanners to comment, but so what even if they did detect a skinlinked PAN? Skinlinking your gear is perfectly legal as long as your commlink is broadcasting whatever information the zone requires.

Deckers are no more, there are only Hackers now.

And heres what it says about Jumping In.

and for Security riggers.

So, yes riggers have a DNI with the drones they jump into.

Once again note the section on riggers jumping in.

SR4 Pg.312

Much more important to protect the commlink rather the datajack.

Not as far as I'm concerned.

Nice try, but I think you need to read a little deeper as well as quote enough to get the full context of what RAW really says.

(Boldfacing added.)

(Boldfacing added.)

It's clear that a Rigger "jumping into" a drone or a security network uses full VR, just like a Decker does when she jacks into the Matrix. Now lets see what RAW has to say on the issue of Virtual Reality.

(Boldfacing added.)

Hmm, it seems that now that we know we need a sim module and a datajack/trodenet in order to access full-VR. Lets read up on what else RAW has to say on the issue.

(Boldfacing added.)

Hmm, it seems that a sim module can only be accessed using a set of trodes or a direct neural interface such as a datajack, ect. Hmm, maybe we should go and see exactly what DNI is supposed to be again.

(Boldfacing added.)

Hmm, so DNI is the connection between a person's brain and a computer system, and we already know that DNI ends with the sim module and that a Rigger or Decker both need a sim module in order to experience full-VR in order to hack a node or "jump into" either a drone or a security system. So unless your sim module is installed in your drone you do not in fact have a DNI Connection to your drone, you are however using DNI to issue commands to the drone through a sim module and a datajack, ect.

Oh and before you try to bring up using AR to hack or command drones, lets see what RAW claims is the most common, albeit not the only way to experince AR as well.

So even with AR most people still use a sim module to feed simsense data directly into your brain, ala a trodenet/datajack in order to create DNI. Although for some reason RAW doesn't notice a difference between someone who uses a keyboard and mouse to order his drones around and someone using DNI, but that doesn't really have any bearing on the issue at hand anyways.

So, lets see what else RAW has to say on the matter.

(Boldfacing added.)

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Hmm not quite as definative as I would have liked, but lets move on and see what else RAW can tell us.

(Boldfacing added.)

Hmm, although we aren't quite there yet, it's very interesting to note that a user has to be able to mentally command the smartlinked weapon if you want your smartlink to do anything other show you crosshairs and how many bullets you have left. And we've already been over what is needed to issue mental commands to your gear, that's right, a sim module and a datajack/trodenet.

However just to be on the safe side of things, lets look at what RAW says about the other half of a smartlink system.

Hmm, don't you find it rather interesting that the second half of a smartlink system doesn't even talk about how it too gives you the same ability to issue mental commands to your gear as a sim module would? In fact it doesn't look like there is any mention whatsoever of being able to actually issue commands to your weapon at all. However, just to be sure lets look at what the cyberimplant version does.

Hmm, so the implanted version isn't any more capable then the version you'd install in your glasses. So once again we've struck out on being able to issue mental commands to your gear without a sim module and everything that goes along with it.

However just to be perfectly clear, once you've achieved DNI to a sim module and the sim module has converted the DNI into computer data yeah, you can then transmit the computer data that used to be DNI over any type of connect you want to, whether it's wireless, skinlink, or hardwired. But it's incorrect to say that wireless connections allow you access to the goodies that DNI provides you.

Well it depends on what you your goals are, mine is to make fragging sure that even if my commlink's security is breached or if spirits forbid my commlink is lost or damaged my cyberware is still as protected as possible.

Besides, since the ICE are going to be the only programs running on my datajack I can install and run as many of them as my betagrade datajack's ( Device Rating 5 ) can hold at all times, where-as I'd have to worry about mircomanaging the commlink's system load everytime I needed to change my program usage.

Although I will agree that protecting your commlink is very important as well, but in this case focusing on the datajack will provide the most security for my implanted cyberware since I might need to interact with a device using my datajack directly instead of my commlink sometimes. Or a sneaky Decker might be able to get within three meters of me while I have my datajack's wireless enabled for some reason. Yeah, it might not be very likely, but it is possible and I really don't want to have some Decker to be able to turn off my cybereyes or make my cyberhand crush my tricked-out predator's grip.

*Edit 1.2*

Plus one more upside to protecting my datajack is that in a search, 'Da Man' is less likely to look at what types of programs are running on my datajack then my commlink, plus it's harder for them to prevent me from shuting down and erasing anything illegal since I have fulltime DNI control to my datajack. Granted I'm not saying that it's foolproof by any means, but it is one more edge that I might need someday.

This is RAW, stop dancing around this.

AR isn't the same as VR, as it doesn't require DNI interface. ( It also doesn't require simsense and only uses simsense for feedback.)

AR isn't immersive like VR, all its does is take the most important matrix information and presents them as objects in your field of vision. ( The picture at the top of SR4 pg. 211 illustrates this.)

The side bar on SR4 pg. 209 example #1 has Sketchy Alex using his devices through AR via a scroll wheel on his commlink.

As for...

The OP was trying to find a way to protect his commlink.

I'm not dancing around anything here, all that sentence says is that if someone without a sim module and everything that goes with it wants to use his keyboard and mouse to issue commands to the weapon remotely he can do so. (Not something that I see as generally being useful in battlefield conditions although it is an edge that someone somewhere might possibly be able to make use of.) Now show me how a smartlink system gives you the ability to issue mental commands to your weapon. (Hint, it involves a sim module as I've proven is needed for DNI commands using Deckers and Riggers.)

Hmm, and I thought I had already covered this when I said the following;

(Boldfacing added.)

(Boldfacing added.)

Yep, it seems that I've already stated that you don't need a sim module and DNI to use AR, but that doesn't change the fact that sim modules and DNI is the most common way for people to interact with AR.

(Boldfacing added.)

And of course if you aren't using simsense and a sim module with AR then you aren't able to experence the full range of what AR has to offer.

But yeah as I had stated in the very post you had responded to it is perfectly possible to use your keyboard and mouse to interact with AR and you can even hack or command your drones doing so without penality under RAW.

Now please understand that I mean no disrespect if it's true, but is English not your first langauge? In the very portion of MadPirate's post that you quoted MadPirate was looking for a way to give one of MadPirate's players some peace of mind when it came to protecting the character's cyberware.

So your saying that the Street Sam archetype can't use his smartgun link as he doesn't have either a datajack or sim module?