Yeah, I actually already had made the change and put in a modifications column for the armor. Great minds think alike. I'm having a few issues with the drop downs, so I'll be sending what I have to Feshy to see if he can fix the delimited error I keep running into.

...looking forward to seein the update.

BTW someone at work kinda clued me in on doing drop downs. I'll have to search for my notes & get back to you.

I'm ashamed to admit this, but I'm not particularly familiar with excel, I mean I can do basic stuff, but I was wondering if there was a not too horribly complicated way to edit the sheet so that the races cost a few less BP and skills cost half. We use Frank's build rules in my home game, and right now if I use the sheet I just have to buy double skills and stuff, but going over the stated limits, even if I'm not going over the game limits, bothers me so I would like to convert the sheet to my games rules, but I can't for the life of me remember how I would do that. Any suggestions?

Chris

PS: Quite a few people seem to be trying out Frank's changes around here so if you wanted to be really nice you could just make another check box that would change things to Frank's rules.

I used the xls program, since I'm working with OpenOffice 2.3, and for some reason the Gear tab shows a bunch of spaces where gear could be put, but no drop down menus. The Main page and the Magic page seemed to work fantastically. Thanks for the obvious hard work. Thanks and great job!

Just to give you all a heads up on my progress...

I've entered all non-firearms equipment in the gear list up to page 320 in the SR4 rules. The data has been entered in list form into a worksheet that will be hidden. The main Gear worksheet has drop down menus and these are broken down in sections that are loosely based on the SR4 pdf bookmarks (Electronics, Explosives, Communications, etc.).

Separate worksheets will be made that will include firearms and armor. The reason I wanted to separate those is so that you can include upgrade accessories to individual weapons and armor.

Here are some screenshots to show the progress I'm making. It's still a work in progress and I've left some design notes that will be deleted, but what I have input is all working correctly.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v401/Ang...Gear_Update.png

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v401/Ang...ar_Update_2.png

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v401/Ang...ar_Update_3.png

I am apparently an idiot, KK, I cannot find a tables tab in OpenOffice.

Chris

...hmmm I thought there was one, must be getting mixed up with Wizdoc.xls

I have a sheet that actually has franks rules built in.. I'll post it when I get home later, it's not very hard. It won't be a checkbox, it will be an entirely new sheet built from fleshys.

Edit: Technomancers don't work, maybe I can fix that, maybe I cannot, if someone writes out a complete list of technomantic powers that would help.

http://www.mediafire.com/?0d0ywe20tyw

Technomancer stuff is basically glue and sticky tape with no actual substance, just fill out the 'number of complex forms' box at the top and it will caculate the costs correctly.

Please ignore or whatever the character built into the sheet, that is my test bed

Otherwise everything else works.

huh, i should have known the easiest way to get someone else to do this kind of work was to start on it myself - ive spent a couple of weeks learning enough Excel to add in Augmentation.

im having a little trouble downloading draft 8, mediafire claims it is password protected - normal?

also, was the original cyberlimb page as unfinished as i seem to have found? rating multipliers in cost and such? i realize they suck so much that noone would have looked at them enough to stumble across any bugs, and much of the system can be ignored with Aug... but i would kind of like to know im not insane.

I cant seem to find a Skimmer Discs under the Cyber limb accessories

Just to update: I'm still chugging away on gear. Hopefully I'll have a draft ready for Feshy to review sometime in the next week or two.

Kind of an odd of me to be performing a bit of thread resurrection with my first post on DS (shiny new account and all), but hey, this thread and the chargen sheet in it was the reason I started reading these boards.

In short, I've been using this sheet to number crunch concepts for my own kicks and giggles and, in the process, I've been modifying it as new things have come up that I wanted to make use of.

Specifically:
--I converted it to allow overloading of BP costs of various things to user-input values, for house ruling

--I converted over most of the Frank Trollman house rules that I found at http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...=19741&st=0 using checkboxes so the different parts can be turned on or off to preference.

--Finally, I added a kind of cheesy Martial Arts worksheet for Arsenal Martial Arts styles, advantages, and maneuvers.

Anywho, I'm not sure how one would go about submitting changes to the sheet to be included in the next official draft, but whoever is in charge of that (or anyone else who'd want a copy of the sheet with my modifications) can feel free to PM me and I can send it to you or post it somewhere temporarily to download.

Thanks for a great little tool and hope the work on getting a gear list to add to it goes well.

-sombranox

P.S. I couldn't find anything on the sheet itself forbidding modifying it and redistributing it or whatnot, but if I've stepped on toes or infringed on creative works or anything like that, just let me know and I'll refrain from sending it to anyone and just keep it for my own use.

Kairo, are you still out there?



I think we are at least two or three main authors removed from the original at this point. Thank Autarkis for having the foresight not to forbid any modification or distribution; it's his original work that I believe we have all been building on.

As far as someone being in charge, I think that being 'in charge' of this document is like a 'herd' of butterflies. That is to say, to an outside observer, it isn't statistically impossible that you might see someone in charge at a given time, or progress in a certain direction, but it is an illusion generated by the mathematics of chaos that truly underly the system. That said, as the person who started this thread, I'll update the first post with an address to any updated sheet that people give me an address to, and I'll do the same with sheets I get via PM or at my e-mail (which will shortly be in my profile.)

Lastly, I don't have Arsenal yet, so I've got no way to update or verify any information in that book yet.

http://personal.palouse.net/shade/sr4/SR4C...%20Arsenal).xls

There's mine then. Enjoy.

I just upgraded to Office:mac 2008 and have problems with the spreadsheets not listing all items in dropdown menus. It happens with several versions of the sheet though so I think it might be a problem with Office though (woot).
Everything worked fine with 2004.

Yep, I'm still working on this. I'll email what I have to Feshy and see if he can clean it up a bit to conform to the standards of the rest of the spreadsheet. The gear is still a work-in-progress and due to my real world work ramping up, I haven't had as much time to devote to it of late. I'll keep hammering away as time permits though.

Great work dudes! keep it up!

A fan

Max

Sweet sheet man. Thanks.

The Spreadsheet does not implement Genetic Optimization ie Body, Str etc.

I like transgenetics also.

WMS

I went back to using Office 2004 for now because 2008 is a buggy pile of drek. My guess is that MS themselves can't decide about proper OOXML in their own products...
While entereing a recent char with skimmer discs in draft 9 I noticed there are no modular cyberlimb plugins in the sheet. I guess there's already a plan for that stuff?

I just noticed this and thought I should note it.

The main post claims its Draft 7, but I just downloaded it as draft 8 from the link provided.

just in case people where waiting for an update its there

Hurrm,
Just found a bug- The "Type O System" positive trait from augmentation does not appear to work in the .xls spreadsheet. I see something referencing it in the essence cost formula, but I get no change in the essence costs for bioware.


--Ikarius

I don't know what going on in your preadsheet, becouse it definedly works for me at least(using draft 8, if it makes a difrence) it correcly halfs the essence cost for basic bioware.

I've tracked this down a bit better. The bug is definitely there, and it manifests when you do NOT check the House Rule of "Modifiers are handled additively". I was mistaken in the "no change"; that was for a piece of cultured bioware. Basic bioware actually goes UP in essence cost when you do not check the house rule, and goes down in cost by half when you do check the rule. I tracked down the cell named Bio_Essence_Reduction, which does 2 different calculations based on the state of the house rule, and if the house rule is checked, it comes out as -0.5, if the house rule isn't checked, it comes out as 0.5; no negative. I'll see if I can decipher what the non-additive method was supposed to be and come up with a working replacement formula.

Ikarius

If someone can email me the file, kelvaris (at) gmail (dot) com, I would be happy to host it on my domain, add free. I have a couple of gigs of bandwidth so I think I would be okay.

Ok I got that site to let me download it. If you keep me posted on the revisions I will happily mirror for you. It's a lot easier to click on a link and start the download then to jump the add hoops.


sr4chargenrev8

this is the non rar version as is compatible through office 07 as far as I know.

Hey Guys, I'm here posting just to let you all know that I really appreciate the hard work you all have put into this wonderful sheet. Also: I eagerly await the new and improved revised draft. Keep up the great work!

This sheet is seriously probably the best community tool out there for all us SR4 players. If there is anything I can do to help bring this next release to fruition, let me know. I don't know excel but can probably learn.

Most Gratefully,
Narse

Edit: Just fired up the sheet again after several months, and realized that I never mentioned that draft 8 still gives an Err:502 in the modified initiative pass field right from the get go. Edit2: Tracked this down to cell T34 on the cyber/bio ware page. It's formula is:
Since T2 throught T33 can have blank values (and do before I add any ware that modifies IP's) I would guess that this is another Open office issue with lookups of blank cells throwing Err:502. (T34 displays Err:502 in these circumstances). I consider this bug to be of low importance, because the field on the main sheet displays the proper value as long as IP enhancing augmentations are present. Note, however that if a character is built with adept powers that enhance IP's and no IP modifing ware (but why would someone buy Wired Reflexes if they also had Improved reflexes?) then the field (main sheet: O14) displays Err:502.
On a related note the cell Magic.P17 (the total IP mod due to adept powers) does not throw Err:502. I believe this is because it calls SUM(P3:P16) rather than MAX(x:y). This seems to cause bugs in very uncommon circumstances. That is when multiple instances of Improved Reflexes are taken. This of course is obviously a bad user input, and therefore is potentially not worth worrying about. However, it does seem significantly more likely that more than one piece of IP modifying 'ware may be present (what with 3 different ways of increasing IP via ware) which precludes using the same formula (i.e. SUM, specifically Cyber_Bio.T34=SUM(T2:T33) ) for the calculation of total Initiative Pass modifier due to ware.

To conclude: Change the formula of cell Cyberware_Bioware.T34 so that if all the cells that are referenced are blank it assumes a value of 0 (all the other cells in that row take 0 when the above cells are blank [at least in open office]) Potentially consider using this same function for cell Magic.P17. I think you could try to do some error handling here (if excel/OO even allow that) as you only need to set the values of the cells to zero if MAX(x:y) throws Err:502. Of course, this might break excel compatibility as you mentioned that excel returns 0 from blank cells and OO returns Err:502. Note that this would still allow you to call MAX($Cyber_Bio.T34;$Magic.p17) in the main sheet as both cells would always have a value in them of at least zero.
Perhaps you could use the following for Cyber_Bio.T34 (top line) and Magic.P17 (bottom line):

This takes advantage of the fact that SUM(x:y) returns 0 even if MAX(x:y) returns Err:502 (which is the case as far as I understand it.) Anyhow, since I don't know excel, you should really double check my work as I am only guessing that =IF(x;y;z) means "If x is true, then assign value y, otherwise[else] assign value z" from the context it seems to be used in, in the worksheets.

Hope this was helpful,
Narse

...cool cool cool.

thanks.

The larger gear page is sweet. I actually prefer the manual gear entry as it allows you to put in comments like "Fake License 4 [Concealed Weapon] or "Virtual Person [Mom]" without having to hack into various tables.

I agree, but I'd like some way to pick the gear from a list as well... After a while, I get tired of looking up prices for everything.

The packages cyberware suites do not give the bonuses to stats or skills. If you format the cells to have borders it makes it easier to see which column to add the stat bonuses to.

Genetic Optimization gives not bonus to any stats?
You will need to add/insert these to the Advantage list on Sheet1
Genetic Optimization (Body)
Genetic Optimization (Agility)
Genetic Optimization (Reaction)
Genetic Optimization (Strength)
Genetic Optimization (Charisma)
Genetic Optimization (Intuition)
Genetic Optimization (Logic)
Genetic Optimization (Willpower)

Then add/edit the following to the cells in the M2-M9 cells to implement it.

IF(AA2=-1,5,IF(AA2=-2,4,6+AA2))+IF(ISERROR(MATCH("Exceptional Attribute (Body)",O33:O46,0)),0,1)+IF(ISERROR(MATCH("Genetic Optimization (Body)",Cyberware_Bioware,0)),0,1)

Insure that each cell for each stat is changed to reflect that stat ie Body for Genetic Optimization (Body) etc.

Genetic Heritage/Genecrafted gives no cost savings on Genetic Optimization.

Why was the karmic analysis added? I must have missed that topic discussion?

Also add/insert to the Advantage list on Sheet1
Martial Art 1 5
Martial Art 2 10
Martial Art 3 15
Martial Art 4 20

WMS

To implement some transgenetic features add the following to the WareList sheet


To change over to Franks rules save spreadsheet to another name ie "halfcost" etc. Then load that spreadsheet and change the following cells
Main Sheet AA18 to =IF($A18<>"",IF(ISERROR(FIND("(Group)",$A18)),D18*2+IF(D18>6,2,0),D18*5),0
Main Sheet AB18 to =IF(F18<>"",1,0)
Then just dragfill the cells down to line 46.

For Race Edit Main Sheet S3 for the costs of Franks Races
For racial costs on my sheets I used a different method since I have put the subraces and other things into effect.

WMS

Formula in sheet Bioware_Cyberware cell D2 is
=IF($A2="","",(VLOOKUP($A2,Complete_Ware_Table,4,FALSE))*(IF($B2="",1,IF(ISERR(FIND("A",VLOOKUP($A2,Complete_Ware_Table,5,FALSE))),$B2,1)))-IF($C2="2nd Hand",1,IF($C2="2nd Alpha",1,0)) + IF($A3<>"",IF(ISERR(FIND("P",VLOOKUP(A3,Complete_Ware_Table,5,FALSE))),0,$D3),0))

Why is it referencing cells A3 and D3?

The entire column of D has the same error?

WMS

I think the error in that cells formula is supposed to reference the availability code of the cell above it, the "P" flag in your sheet is for a added feature of a piece of cyberwear.

WMS

I've only just started looking at SR4 and thus it may be me missing something from the rules, but as Magic is a stat shouldn't you be able to take Exceptional Apptitude (Magic). I notice this doesn't seem possible with the sheet but wasn't sure if it was me missing a rule or finding something missing form the sheet.

Kithran

I think it says in the description of exceptional aptitude that it can only be taken for physical and mental stats, which is the normal six. And then somewhere in the magic section that the only way to raise magic limits is through initiation.

Which is good, because mages are scary as hell as it is at Magic 6 starting out. Once they start initiating, they can get truly nasty.

I don't have my books on this computer, but I'm semi-sure that those wordings were in there.

Book says "The Exceptional Attribute quality allows a character to possess a natural Physical or Mental attribute at a level above the metatype maximum." Magic (and Resonance) are classified as Special attributes, which leaves them out.

With is further confirmed by the Lucky quality that allow to raise edge (a special attribute too) by 1 point.

Wait, one of my players had the draft 9 version of the sheet, w/Arsenal and Frank's custom rules imped. I looked over the thread, but didn't find it. I missed it somewhere?

Links not working, but if you look on this page someone quoted the person who has a link to draft v9.

Soo.... what ever happened to the update that was supposed to be coming out that gave drop down lists for items, weapons, and other fun things?

I'm getting a very odd error. My Physical Attributes are all messed up in the XLS for Loki (in sig). It says Err:502 but I use OpenOffice, so that may be a unique error to OO. Can anyone verify if my error happens elsewhere, or how to fix it?