Everyone useing the flechette round errata with (f) grenades?

Why wouldn't we?

what damage did they do before errata and what will they be doing after?

Same as Flechette Ammunition.

Be no change to the damage just the AP from +2 to +5 vs impact. Just wondering if treating grenades as regular ammunition as far as the errata. Never seen mention of grenades in any of topic discussions on the subject is all.

In the fifth printing, fragmentation grenades do have +5.

They still haven't updated the damn errata to account for 5th printing changes though...

I do. frag grenades do 12p damage ap+5 (impact) as flechette rounds.

Cheers

Max

+5? When did flechette ammo go to +5?
I know, I know, the 5th printing, rhetorical question. But I have not heard a breath on this up to now.

Where can one find a comprehensive list of these rule eratta?

http://www.shadowrun4.com/resources/sr4/sr4_errata_v13.pdf

Street Magic also has an errata as well on www.shadowrun4.com

The errata does not mention Grenades specifically, though, but for consistency (and balance, since my players LOVE grenades!) I have also been using +5 AP for ANY item marked (f) on the Damage Code.

Arsenal did not address this either: all the missiles, rockets, and grenades listed as (f) in the compiled table have AP +2. Even if they never address this, I will be using AP +5 as a House Rule if nothing else.

Actually, Flechette and Ex-Ex ammunition were Errata'ed quite early on in SR4's history.



It isn't quite up-to-date, but you can find the latest official Errata here.

http://www.shadowrun4.com/resources/sr4/sr4_errata_v15.pdf is the newer one I think.

http://www.shadowrun4.com/resources/sr4/sm_errata_v12.pdf is the street magic

Edit: Bah, didn't see that Fortune already gave a link that has both of these in it. Oh well.

Real life question: are normal fragmentation grenades that the military usually use flechette grenades? I mean, the whole fragmentation thing does launch some very small projectiles. But AFIAK they are not really impeded by armor that much... or are they?

Read and enjoy
Grenade Wiki

Technically grenades produce shrapnel.

WMS

so do spells that have the metal elemental effect have the +5AP, too?

Technically they produce fragmentation. Only Shrapnel Shells produce shrapnel. And since they haven't been used since about 1915....

However grenade fragments are much easier to stop then bullets and would also be much easier to stop than the common (intuitively obvious) conception of how flechettes work. Sharp, pointy and fairly long objects are actually pretty darn effective at going through flexible body armor.

But my understanding is that flechettes don't actually work in real guns (I'm talking shotgun shells or artillery shells here) the way that is intuitively obvious that they should, if you see how they are packed into a round you'll start to see why. I can't find a good web image, but they are packed in with half the flechettes pointy end aiming forward and half pointing to the rear, to maximize round fill. So many of them will be trying to flip over in flight.

Now for small arms shooting individual flechettes, that is a bit different. A brief history of the biggest sinkhole for money and skilled labor in US small arms history: The Special Purpose Individual Weapon