Well, another generic 'question' thread from moi...

I'm soon to be running a campaign which is composed exclusively - at least in terms of the PCs, of course - of magic users, whether those are Aspected Mages or Adepts (there are at present no full mages). No Shaman out of personal preference since with the exception of the more abstract ones presented in MitS I'm not overtly comfortable with them (and the MitS ones I just find intriguing)...

Has anyone run this type of campaign before (I would say obviously, but you've got to ask) and, if so, do you have any advice?

What overt problems would you expect? How would the opposition be reasonbly stacked if they have foreknowledge of the nature of the group?

I'm sure that there re other questions, but I thought that I would just get this posted and see what kind of response there is...

Kage

Main problem would be if you go up against guys who have initiative mods that allow them to go MUCH earlier in the turn than you. Other than that, probably not much that I can think of.

You'll probably need to NPC a decker. Athough I've always wanted to try a physad decker if the group has one, I'm sure you'll do find. I've GMed for a group composed almost entirely of mages before. They started their own initiatory magical group and lots of the story was centered around that. You'll have plenty of metaplane runs, and you can really go all out on them because all the group could be present. Hope this helps

I love pure magic-user campaigns. We're about to run an 'Ultimate' game and so far we have 7 characters turned in, all Magic Users except 1. Looks like it'll be more fun than the half/magic group. Seriously, as wonderful as a Sammie can be, anything a Sammie can do, so can a Mage, so I think a game is improved by a high number of magic users.

As far as problems... None if the GM knows the rules well.

Sphynx

As far as what targets would do with any sort of knowledge that a magic-heavy team was on the way, CorpSec covers a lot of the anti-runner toys out there and mentions a few magic-specific ones (e.g. FAB, wards, living walls/mesh/nets, anchored spells, astral patrols, paranimals, etc.). If you've got it, break it out again and give it a once-over. If not, then think of the really cheap basics...

1. Smoke grenades. LOS spells don't work well absent LOS. 20m of spell-free joy for 2 rounds. Go with IR smoke if your security can "see" through other means.

2. Flash-paks. +4 TNs to anyone facing the flash-pak. +2 TNs otherwise due to the strobe effect. The last thing a mage needs is trouble concentrating or seeing his target.

3. Standard physical security. Mages are really good at handling a lot of things, but few can outrun normal guards, defeat a mediocre maglock, or get over a wall quickly.

Of course, if the target facility in question knows that runners are coming, they'll increase security across the board. If they know that a largely awakened group is involved, they'll stack specifically for it. They may be very interested in getting their hands on any awakened subjects for research or possibly re-education, too. If the target in question has no such idea that any particular threat or type of threat is involved, then security should be no more than is normally reasonable given the circumstances.

It's been many years since I ran the campaign composed primarily of mages. However, I remember throwing them up against just about all the magical rarities, without any concerns for their safety (blood spirits, insect spirits, plenty of paranormal criters, the occational dragon). It's definitely odd that you don't have any mages capable of astral projection. That'll definately be their achilles' heel. If I remember correctly, a mage in the astral plan can still attack a mage on the physical plane if they have an active foci. You're team can make up for this with elementals, but you should still exploit this. Physical and electronic security will also be a challenge for the team, but not too big a deal. Most mages aren't exactly experts at getting through maglocks and such. As far as balancing opposition between mages and mundanes. I leaned more toward mages, but I stuck to the approach I always use when setting up the opposition. Strength-in-numbers!!!

Actually, my currently fresh PBP game called "Vampires of Seattle" is made up entirely of magically active characters. HMHMVV infected ones, true, but magically active nonetheless.

I ran an alternate saga once where the players were all members of the Dunkelzahn Institute of Magical Research, and all but one (the token mundane muscle) were magically active. But since it wasn't a traditional Shadowrun game -- the players were sent on missions all over the world to look for ancient relics, break into museums and mansions to recover stolen artifacts, and things like that -- it's kind of hard to give advice as I had more freedom in creating tailored opposition for the group.

Well sure, you're free to do the same in a standard game (including both of the examples of "runs" I gave above), but most shadowruns deal with corporate espionage and that sort of thing. That didn't come up very often here, and the characters were well sponsored, albeit still deniable assets.

But I'm rambling now. The best advice I can give for a game like this is: Don't do anything you wouldn't normally do. Keep the opposition at exactly the same level as you would before -- at least in the beginning until their reputation starts to demand better runs -- and let them figure out how to get around their weaknesses and how to exploit their strengths.

There's no such thing as an "unbalanced team." "Unbalanced teams" tend to be the most fun to be in, as you do often have a significant weakness that you have to figure out how to cover. Thinking is the best part of gaming... so just let the players think their way through things and keep the opposition sensible for whatever run they've been hired for.

Since it has yet to go anywhere; no.

If anybody in my game reads this spoiler, I'll shoot you dead.

Fun with anchored spells:

1. Astral barrier: Not only is it handy for keeping dual-natured critters out of certain areas, it'll keep astral spies and active foci out, too. Place these along corridors wherever you please and they'll cause no end of trouble for focus-happy characters. Added bonus: adds force to TN to cast at targets through the astral barrier.

2. Phantasm or Trid Phantasm: What's cheaper than a real security system and works almost as well? A sign that says you have one! A couple of guards here, a paranimal there, a drone or two mulling about... It'll slow the characters down and either have them disbelieving everything the see or assuming everything is an illusion. This one isn't just for the mages, of course.

3. Mask or Physical Mask: Doors, windows, cameras, etc... they suddenly look like normal walls.

4. Detect Object + Physical Barrier or any debilitating illusion: If anyone tries to take the goody through the door, a barrier pops up and detains them until security can arrive or the characters get whomped with blindness, confusion, or something else similarly debilitating.

5. Detect Magic + Magic Fingers: A person walks through the affected area and, if they have any active spells or foci, the Magic Fingers spell triggers and pulls the alarm for that area (complete with corresponding lockdown of the area and whatever else you care to have conected to it). This is a great one for those who rely on physical mask or improved invisibility too much.

This is a very limited sample of what you can do. The trigger-based expendable anchors are especially fun. Just remember that an unsuspecting or unthinking corporate employee may set off one of these too and the corp wouldn't want them dying needlessly, so detainment and non-lethal harm will be the primary objectives.

Many effective anti-mage spells are resisted by strength or increase TNs. Spells like Decrease Attribute (Strength), Cause Allergy, Intoxication, Mass Blindness, Net, and Lock are pretty nasty. Decrease Attribute is especially harmful to mages, most of whom can barely carry the clothes on their backs without breaking into a sweat - and that's when they're at their best.

A final tip for any GM, not just one dealing with mages: use encumberance. PCs really can't carry half of a warehouse with them everywhere they go...

Troll Combat Mages can.

OK, here's a yummy listing of non-lethal stuff to use on stereotypical mage-boys.

Atropine
CS/Tear Gas
Hyper
Nausea Gas
Pepper Punch

They all do things to whack out TNs, thus making anything difficult. Hyper is especially mean when combined with something else that causes Stun, because then they take the normal Stun, then half of that due to Hyper.

Edit: These can all be found in Man and Machine in the section with all the drugs and chemicals and such.

I just had a thought...a group of all mages are gonna stand out like a beacon in the astral until they get the masking metamagic technique. Astral signatures and ritual spellcasting aginst them could be a bugger! Heaven help 'em if any of 'em get shot and bleed on the floor if they are dealing with a AA mega or higher! Astral Chameleon and Poor Link might be good advantages to take.

A mundane blood splatter is just as easy to ritually manabolt as that of a mage. They are not more visible from the astral except when astrally percieving or projecting, though their methods may draw such attention (astral sig as the result of a method).

BumsofTacoma thinks to himself........ (You'll have to imagine the wavery dream lines)

4-6 physical adepts running around together......and shivers.

Then he thinks to himself of 4-6 mages/shamans (imagine wavery flames)

"SWEEEEEEEEET JEEEEESUS! NOOOOOOOOO!!!!"..........and wheeps...........

Kage2020: Just what is your problem with Shamanic characters?

Yes...

Spider is telling me to cast "Slay BumsofTacoma" right now.

*looks around*

...What?

The game I am running now has an Owl Shaman, a follower of Horus, and a cybered sorcerer( my NPC). I have only done a few runs but have many planned. It is a little different than past games, but is a lot of fun. I can tell you it wouldn't work with all groups but I highly recommend it if you can find the right people.

Your choice, but I find the Hermetic with his stable of 6 Elementals and 6 Watchers a little more overpowering than a Shaman who can conjure up only one Spirit at a time. The Hermetic also really doesn't have to deal with Drain when it comes to Conjuring, as he can just rest afterwards. On the other hand, the Shaman summoning on the fly has to keep Drain in mind, so will more than likely Conjure lower Force Spirits than the Hermetic.

I see a lot of people giving advice on taking out full magicians, but the trick here is to keep out the adepts first since they'll be the ones doing the tanking and sneaking around.

In case you've forgotten adepts have the advantage over almost any archetype. Silent, fast and deadly.

Nagas are particularly nasty critters to throw into a mage's way. I almost inadvertently killed my group by putting one too many of those in the opposition once.

Make sure the opponents have Shielding metamagic. You might have enjoyed the look on the faces of the three mage group when they came against shielding the first time. With their toughest spells pretty much negated, they resorted to their other fighting skills... er.... wait... what other fighting skills.

okay heres a serios reply from me.

i have played in all mage groups and run them.
same with physads.

its to so much a problem. it's just you have to so much more creative as a gm.

a group of physads arent that bad if you keep them in check. there is always a way to make it more challenging, yet still fun.....well maybe thats not 100% true.

sometimes you have to frag a few pc's untill they calm down

So am I. There's nothing abnormal about a starting Shamanic conjurer with Invoking.

Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't initiation at chargen an optional/house rule?

It's an official "optional" rule. SRComp, p. 15, "Resources."

o dear.....o dear o dear o dear.........................

I have to tear that page out before players see it.......

You can let them see it. Just put your foot down and say "No!"

But they bite!


i know, i use that word at every available turn of the road!
hers an example

whiney PC:"I go to the stuffer shack because you keep telling me im hungry"

GM: "NO!!!!"
WPC: "no what?"
GM: "NO!?"
wpc: thats it im leaving ive had enough of your exentric behavior ((translates i cry because i cant live up to your standards of a shadowrunning team.even though they are very low standards))
GM: "NO!!!
WPC: "You need help!"

getting unwanted players out of a group is fun mwahahahahahaha

Or get it through your head that it's -0- problem and accept it. If they're spending points on initiating or creating an ally spirit, they're not spending them somewhere else (like spells, foci, or bonus build points).

I play my game how i want. you play rules lawyer how you want.

just kidding, man. you take things to seriosly. or do you?