I'm getting back into SR after a long leave of absence, and came up with the following character.

Jules, male elf gunbunny adept.

Backstory:

Benjamin Schmidt was a model employee. After leaving the army, he became "fast-response security support" for a fourth-rate corporation. He showed up at his job daily, chased off the local hoodlums, showed through the appropriate organized crime representatives, and generally didn't do anything that might get him fired.

And then there was the crash.

In one evening, Benjamin ceased to exist. His employer went defunct, his apartment burned to the ground, his accounts burglarized, and his SIN lost in the chaos. He was left with nothing but the clothes on his back and the hold-out he left tucked into his boot.

The ensuing years have not gone well for Benjamin. With no SIN and no references, he was unable to find another job in security. He worked as a bodyguard for hire, with nothing to show for it but some interesting scars and a really expensive suit. Craving his old army stimmies, he picked up a novacoke habit. After snorting some LSD-laced dirty snow, he also got in touch with his mystical side, which, combined with his daily trips to whatever firing range he could afford, led to further enhancement of the firearms skills which formed the last remaining shred of his identity.

Hoping to try the other side of the law, he then printed out a randomized list of 1,000 names from the phonebook...and threw a dart. From then on, he would be known simply as Jules.

Stats:

BOD:4
AGI:6
REA:4
STR:4
CHA:4
INT:4
LOG:3
WIL:2

Edge: 1
Magic: 5

Edges/flaws:
High Pain Tolerance 1
Ambidextrous
Adept

Skills:
Athletics group 3
Unarmed combat 2
Pistols 5 (semi-automatics 7)
Longarms 3
Automatics 3
dodge 1
Perception 2
Intimidation 1 (physical intimidation 3)
Etiquette 2 (corp. etiquette 4)
Armorer 1 (Firearms 3)

Knowlege skills:
Security companies 2
Corp. security tactics 4
Street drugs 2 (Novacoke 4)
Yakuza 1
Security systems 3
Military 2 (Army 4)

Languages:
English: native
Japanese 4
Korean 2

Powers:
Improved reflexes 2
Improved ability: pistols 2
Combat sense 2

Looks good, actually. Great firearms, he can take care of himself in a fistfight as well; a couple social skills and Armorer to take care of his tools of the trade. One thing-since you have Athletics Group and can use that for Dodging(gymnastics dodge), you could drop down Dodge and you might want to pick up Perception.

Looks fine to me, a simple, no-nonsense type of shadowrunner.

Hmm. I knew I was forgetting something. Character has been edited per your spec.

I'm also considering the following other modifications:
-Shunting more into Perception. He was a security guard - his job was to notice things!
-More high pain tolerance. This looks really, really useful for a combat-oriented PC.
-Thrown weapons? Should I take this skill later and just put 1 or 2 in it?

Any recommendations for equipment? I was thinking along the lines of the following:
-Two heavy pistols with Smartlinks and quickdraw holsters
-One smartlinked Streetline Special in a concealed holster (for the bonus against MAD detectors)
-One smartlinked sporting rifle with scope
-Contacts with flare compensation, Smartlink, and image link
-Armored jacket
-Cheap-O commlink
-Econobox car
-Climbing gear

Well there is the Morissey Elan out of Arsenal (if you have it), that is completely undetectable by MADs. Might look into that for the small pistol. Also I don't know if you noticed, but you won't get smartgun use if you actually try to dual wield the two heavy pistols. Nothing wrong with packing a backup, just figured I'd mention it.

Just myself, I might look into picking up a smg or assault rifle instead of the sporting rifle. Just seems a guy that worked in the military, security, and bodyguard would more likely have use for one of those than a faux sniper rifle. Just my opinion on how I was reading the guy.

Also you may want to pick up the typical long coat as well, since it increases the conceal for your weapons also. Use it for your walk around time armor so your pistol(s) don't stand out as much. You will also want to put a low-light/thermo item somewhere on your list. Just something you'll want to pick up along the way. Don't forget your armorer tool kit either.

Another thing. I'm not for sure how twinkish you want to get with this guy. However if you can squeeze the money in for the synaptic accelerators (boosters? I always forget which) at rating 2. They cost you a point of essence. Yet that still puts you 2 points up in adept powers. Letting you buy another improved ability pistols, sustenance, nimble fingers, quick draw, more combat senses, improved senses (thermo, low light, etc). All kinds of nifty stuff out there.

Nice build overall, though there's a couple of recommendations.
Feel free to ignore them, it's just the average dumpshock optimization stuff (though you've missed out on a couple of typical SR4 newcomer mistakes, it's a decent gunbunny build overall).

Willpower 2 is dangerously low.
It determins your stun track and with good dodge and armor, you'll take stun damage much more often than physical.
Moreover, it makes you extremely vulnerable to mana spells and many critter powers.
If you leave it at 2, be sure your team's mage packs decent counterspelling and covers you all the time.
Otherwise, a single stunbolt will drop you, a barghest will make you shit your pants- and let's not even begin to speak of control manipulations.
Willpower also determines your resistance against most social skills- your character will be easy to intimidate, order around and get bad deals.

Edge is incredibly useful.
You're missing out on a very important ressource if you leave it at minimum.
I'd strongly advise changing that.
If you don't, at least take the Unlucky flaw (believe me, with Edge 1, your character is unlucky).
Getting 20 points for only using Edge to escape certain death may be worse than having a high Edge pool, but it's better than getting nothing for being stuck with Edge 1.

A word on Ambidexterity : splitting your dicepool will lead to actually doing less damage than before, unless you go up against extremely weak canon fodder.
If the enemy can dodge decently, it may very well come down to firing 4 times and not hitting at all.

This doesn't mean Ambidexterity is completely useless, but its use is limited to "two guns at least means double the ammunition".
You could also fire two shots with an unmodified Ruger Super Warhawk (the most stylish weapon in the game anyway- and it has a nice punch as well).
Or, if you have Arsenal, you could pick up two Savalette Guardians and fire one burst with each.
In both cases, you could make use of your smartlink, which would not be possible if you fire two weapons at the same time.

Edge 1 is just begging for punishment. Spend that point and prepare to be violated by a parade of glitches.

How to get the points for it? Glad you asked. Get some flaws. Don't like the flaws in the book? Talk to your GM. If you made up a bunch of flaws on your own they might think you were trying to powergame.

But if you just come to them? If they're anything remotely like me you'll get a mischevious smile.

I'd probably have some fun with the "gunbunny" comment and make the character a furry on the side. Perhaps modeling it on the addiction flaw and applying it twice (once for dressing up and once for needing to hook up with other furries).

Probably a little distinctive style there too.

Anyway after getting the flaw points drop all the specializations. Yes they're a great way to add 2 dice. But they're very BP inefficiant compared to their karma cost! Just buy them after your first couple sessions.

Also ditch dodge and just use gymnastics instead. There are select instances where you might rather use dodge but you already have gymnastics at a higher skill level.

So all that together should net you ~47 points. Spend 20-40 on edge and I'd say raise pistols to 6

Drop a point of strength to raise Edge. Strength really doesn't matter except in melee combat, and since it's half your strength value, rounded up, it won't make any difference there.

Strength isn't such a big deal in SR4. But it does show up for more than just punches. Notably

-knocking something out of someones hand. (Something that should be attempted more often
-subdual combat(grappling).

And then there are encumberance rules(130 and 500 in the BBB). These usually only come up in day to day play if the char is strength 1.

But mostly it becomes a major issue when you want to rescue the girl, and you can't pick her up. Or you can't pull yourself up onto a ledge.

This is why I don't always do the ''Odd-Strength'' twink. Don't get me wrong, many times I DO aim for odd-number strength, but if I'm playing, for example, and Ork, I'll take the 6 instead of the 5 sometimes natural. Sometimes you just, you know, see your character as decently strong. Now, if I'm *desperately* scraping for points in a sense I forgot an important skill or need a character-centric skill, and I happened to have even number Strength, then I might nab the points to get something else. Otherwise, I put the number that fits.

Hmm...if you switch Logic and Willpower it will be 2/3 instead, which could work. (again, depends how you see the character.) A few flaws and removal of Dodge will give you enough points for at least 1 Edge...maybe even 2. Of course, there is that awesome Firefight martial art that would fit this guy really well....

Dunno, myself I usually either go 6 or 1 for edge. If I don't max it I don't even bother.

D'oh!

Yeah...ambidex is likely a waste of five good build points. I may as well just get an extended clip.



Aren't Athletics rolls strength-dependent?

Most of them.
Climbing, running, swimming.
That's it.

Of course, for a pistol-based built, getting close to the opposition is important, so decent running DP may be very helpful, as well as good stealth (i also really like the concept of closing up pre-combat by fasttalking the opposition).
For the former, there's two metagenic qualities in Runner's Companion, Celerity and Satyr Legs, though i'm not sure wether you want to take the gunbunny coment upthread serious.
Especially Satyr Legs really rocks, as it also increases kicking power and Gymnastics, including gymnastic dodge.
If you don't mind being a furry.

To give less radical suggestions, if you have Arsenal, you really want the improved range finder modification and if that isn't enough, the barrel extension.
Pistols have a terribly short range, these mods bring them up to a reach that will be sufficient in many situations.
Burst fire mods are also worth considering, they can greatly expand either damage output or dodge pool reduction.

The other thing you can do with two guns besides get more ammo and split your DP into nothingness is get off two long burst per IP. That is actually +3DV per IP, at no penalty is absolutely worth 5bp.

Even then, a strength of 3 should be sufficient. That's average for humans, so with his skill, he should do OK against other humans. Given this character's build, he definitely should not try to enter subduing combat with an angry troll.

I do genuinely like the idea of making my character a furry. Not only will it make roleplaying a hoot, but I am almost guaranteed to get quite a few build points in return for taking it as a flaw. I've only got the PHB at the moment, though, so a lot of the trickery listed above won't work so well for me. (Although I'd really, really like that Morissey Elan....)

There's also the age-old issue of "Skills vs. Attributes". Were I to take one point of Adept-boosted agility over two points worth of pistols skill, I'd lose one from my pistols pool...and gain one for automatics, rifles, and all the other fun Agility-linked skills. On the other hand, pistols only become efficient once you've boosted the dice pools into the upper stratosphere - 14 dice just isn't that many. Thoughts?

NOTE: The specializations are quite important. Semi-automatic pistols are generally the only ones worth using (imagine having to reload a revolver after every combat round!), having Armorer dice for anything BUT fixing pistols is pointless, and physical intimidation just makes sense for someone who won't pick up his newspaper without a firearm full of APDS.

Finally, I'm stuck on cybernetics vs. magic for reaction boosting. While one point of cyber could replace three worth of magical goodies (and even fit into the character concept - he's ex-military and only recently discovered his magical ability!), I'm very tempted to later snag that 4th initiative pass. I'm also very keen on keeping this character "low-profile" - there's no point in having 1337 pistol skills if you can't get let in anywhere because you're a twitchy, psychotic mess that shows up on security scanners like a Christmas tree.



Athletics skills are very useful, especially when combined with the stealth skills he'll be spending karma on for the forseeable future. (Pistols generally work very well when silenced.)

Of course, there is the issue of his pathetic willpower score...which really won't allow him to function in any social capacity. I suppose he'll get along okay with a strength of 3.

On the Morissey Elan, if you want to play with it until you get the book. Just use the Streetline Special, but entirely out of cermaic/plasteel instead of just a -2 modifier, semi-auto, and about 5 times as expensive. On your comment about cybernetics vs magic. If you use bioware isntead of cyber which is the better option, since the cyber costs you as much essence as the adept does power points. Also it won't show up on your normal scanners. It says in the Augmentation book that it takes detailed medical scanners to detect them, or having someon get x-rays of specific glans that were changed, and a few show up in fecal/urine tests. So it isn't like security just waves a scanner at you and can see it like cyber.

On furries : you should really pick up Runner's Companion, then.
It contains tons of fun options for that case.
SURGE III is a great way to load up on qualities.


On the detectability of bioware : cyberware scanners have real trouble finding it (4 successes, iirc), besides deltaware, it is the next most inconspicious thing to an adept with the masking metamagic (or technomancers, who aré even harder to spot).

On specialties. They are very usefull. But they are also very Karma cheap compared to the BP they cost. Therefore I advise picking them up in the first session or two instead of buying them at creation.

If you can swing the 180K:nuyen: on chargen, Synaptic Booster rating 2 costs only 1 essence, freeing up 2 points of magic for other adept powers. Wired Reflexes isn't worth it for an adept though, since it costs the same essence as the adept power costs in magic.

It's costly though, since you need to spend 40+ BP on cash.

That's a lot of BP.

I was actually thinking of Improved Reflexes III. Totally invisible...until you don't need it to be.

Taking specializations later does seem like a good idea - I can use all the BP I can get!

I've been reading Arsenal, and noticed a few really nifty items:

-Morrissey Elan. Very small, has a decent clip size, completely metal-free, and semiautomatic. I wonder if I can get a nonmetallic silencer?

-HK Urban Fighter. No metal at all...and designed for use with sealed clips! So long as you use Hi-C ammo and nobody looks too closely, you can take these anywhere.

-Weapons World Infiltrator. Can be disassembled into itty-bitty pieces and reassembled when convenient. The only problem is hiding the clips.

-Ares Desert Strike. All of the insane damage in a durable, no-muss no-fuss package! Negates 7 points of ballistic armor when used with APDS ammo!

-Ares Light Fire 70. Combined with a silencer and subsonic rounds, it has a -7 penalty to perception checks to hear it - and it's cheap, too!

And, my #1 favorite:

The Ruger Thunderbolt. Basically a submachine gun with internal recoil compensation which may be fired with the pistols skill. And Lone Star buys them by the truckload - getting parts, mods, and ammo is a snap! Furthermore, combined with an underbarrel weight, the recoil can be completely negated on both bursts, each doing a whopping 7P damage Score! The only problem is the dinky clip - even extended, it's only 15 rounds, but apparently a non-cybernetic Smartlink system allows for automatic clip ejection.

Were it not listed in Arsenal as the "#1 official favorite weapon of the game's biggest security force" complete with all munch-y specs, I wouldn't believe it.


Any other recommendations?

EDIT: I HAZ PORTRAIT!

SpasticTeapot's Jules

Hey dude,

One thing to consider is the optional rule for geasa that allows a 25% reduction in adept power costs kinda like in SR3. Further info is on Pg. 27 and 31 street magic. It is optional, but it can sure help on those big purchases like Improved Reflexes.

The other thing is that for .25 power points you can get attribute boost level 1. With your Magic of 5 and rating 1 of this skill you can spend a free action to get an average +2 to your agility, and only have to resist 1 stun when it is over.

I really like this one for gunbunnys, not just because it is good mechanically, but I picture it as the character taking that free action to "become one with the gun".

Look in the weapon modification section. Under the cermaic/plasteel component mod it says how much getting other options costs when the weapon is cermaic/plasteel. I don't see any reason why you couldn't use the same multiplier on an accessory silencer instead of a mod silencer.

Try the additional clip mod.
Doubles your ammo for 2 slots.
Combining it with extended clips, you get 30 rounds and even get to pack 2 different kinds of ammo if you want to.
Also, underbarrel weights only work in full auto.
I'd go with electronic firing and probably high STR instead.
I'd also recommend the improved range finder and probably a longer barrel, as pistols have terribly short reach.

Yeah, I think if you manage to tweak a 5 Strength out, you get the +1 Recoil...if I remember correctly. I don't have the book in front of me.

But between that and other recoil mods, you should be able to fire it quite well.

What I would do with his stats...

It's a bit twinky, but Elves DO start with a natural 3 charisma. You could shift 1 from there to his Strength, for a 5, and get your Recoil.

You could also drop Logic to 2(though he DOES have his armorer skill linked to it)-a 2 is sort of considered these days as the ''Joe Average Stat'' rather than a 3. You could up his Willpower to 3 with that.

6-9 STR = RC1, 10-12 STR = RC2, IIRC.

doh! One less. In FoF, I recall....the 5-6 DID get you a recoil. That's what I was getting it from. Ahh well.

I only know because I very recently looked it up.

Arsenal is full of goodies - notably the weapon modification rules. A double clip system will give me a not unreasonable 26 rounds - each clip is 3/4 normal, for a total of 28 rounds.

Remember, the Ruger Thunderbolt has a two points of recoil compensation bone-stock. Combined with electronic firing, I have three points of recoil compensation - enough to completely negate the penalty for firing two short bursts.

I do really like the temporary attribute boost - it's a cheap way to further improve my already ridiculous stats, and I can do exactly the same thing with reaction for yet more fun.

If you're sticking with Ambidexterity, you could also remove the internal gas vent, get a sound supressor instead, come up with 3 points of non-GV recoil reduction and fire one silenced, recoil free short burst with each hand without having to split your pools.

With SMGs, this is even more fun.
Try something like this with an FN P93 Praetor, it's just amazing.
I had the idea for an ork or troll sam with two cyberarms, each with high STR and built-in gyromount, as well as maxed-out AGI, along with two P93s modded to the max, with external sound supressors and all the bells n whistles.
Two recoil-free, silenced wide bursts per turn.
Lovely.

I'm not going to bother with ambidexterity - more trouble than it's worth. I need the Smartlink bonuses too much.

I'd prefer to stick with maxing out my pistols. A tweaked-out heavy pistol is almost identical to a SMG, but will let me use the pistols skill - which is, in turn, very handy when you want to be sneaky.

In that case, i'd recommend considering long, wide bursts from time to time.
Only a minor change to firing selection and against stronger opponents who can jump/fly around like crazy, they're a worthwile option.

Especially spirits.

See, these suckers get hardened armor- if your base DV + net hits isn't higher than twice their Force, your bullets won't do squat against them (and getting up close with a fire spirit can be a real pain in the ass).
So the added DV from burst fire won't do that much.
Which is why you go for decreasing their high Dodge pools with wide bursts, to get in as many net hits as possible.
Along with APDS or AV ammo, a wide burst from you should be able to harm most spirits of the saner levels (4-6).

Just another quick bit of advice. Unless you are attracted to the coolness of not having a trigger, go for personalized grip over electronic firing. It takes one less slot, and is 100 nuyen as opposed to 1000. Does the same thing recoil wise.

Except electronic firing gives an additional -1 to perception tests to notice the firing of the weapon. So it really depends on what you want from the pistol. If it is your sneaky sneaky pistol, electronic firing is a better bet. If you are using it on your "well we're boned on this run, pull out the big guns" weapon, then the grip is probably better.

Considering that the gun will have an extended barrel, double clips, a Smartlink system and some sort of scope, I may as well bolt a silencer on to the end and use electronic firing. If nobody sees you enter, nobody sees the hand-cannon attached to your belt.

One thing I can't figure out is why on earth the pistol-sized mini-grenade launcher uses heavy weapons skill. Anything that weighs less than a breadbox is, by definition, not heavy.

EDIT:

I've been playing around in the character generator, and it seems that cyberware is the way to go. While using the Synaptic Boosters actually costs more build points than the 20BP of magic they replace, it does very conveniently leave me with a magic rating of 3 - much easier to improve than a Magic of 5.

Furthermore, I can upgrade them to Synaptic Boosters 3, and add on a reflex recorder and enhanced articulation - or maybe just some muscle enhancements. Sure, I'll lose a second point of Essence, but I come out way, way ahead.

And this is the major issue I have with the adept creation rules as written: you seem to be better off going down to 1-2 essence from bioware before you actually start getting cost-effective power choices. =/

You're likely right on that one. Beta-grade muscle augmentation is 0.6 essence, and replaces 2 magic worth of attributes...and the absurd cost of improved reflexes just a joke.

Spastic, (Or anyone else that could help)

Would you mind posting an updated version of your build? I'm entirely new to SR, and I've been trying to build a similar character, so I'm interested in how you've tweaked your character because of this thread.

Also, could you explain why it's more beneficial to take the Essence/Magic reducing gear as an Adept? I'm still trying to wrap my head around that one.

Thanks in advance,
Jonny

Welcome on DS! Be warned, the chargen advice we give is usually very efficiency-minded.

Adepts are given the choice of investing 3 power points into Improved Reflexes 2, or 160k¥ and one point of magic loss (=1 power point) into Synaptic Accelerators 2. You pay more BP for having 3 IPs (32+10=42), but your power point budget takes only 1/3rd of the hit.


Another gunslinger adept build can be found in the Community Projects section: Sample Character Archive

I've been thinking about adept gunslingers too. Reducing Combat Sense by one to add the Agility Boost and natural vision mag seems sensible... until I saw the Nimble Fingers in Street Magic. "Insert Clip" is a free action with that, so it doesn't matter how small your clip is, you can fire non-stop just like Chow-Yun Fat and Jet Li!

Regarding Ambidexterity, you have to split your pool and forego Smartlink bonuses if you fire two guys at once... but ONLY at once, right? If you take one Simple Action to fire your right-hand gun and your next to fire your left-hand gun, both are at full pools and can use the Smartlink bonus, correct? And no recoil modifiers, since it's the first shot from each? Thus on your next Init. Pass, you'd fire another shot from each gun that'd be taken up by the recoil comp (presuming a Colt Government 2066 here).

I rather like the Ruger Super Warhawk on a two gun adept. Modded up with a larger cylinder (8 shot), long barrel, personalized grip, improved range finder, melee hardening (for pistol whipping), and BLING!

There is just something about a character weilding two pistols the size of S&W X-Frame 50 cals with 8" barrels covered with black chrome, custom etchings, real wood grips, etc.

I prefer a polished orichalkum plating and mantid spirit carapace handles, but besides that, i totally agree.

Sorta in the same thought process... what is the accepted way to post characters so people can comment on them. I use Daegaan's character generator and therefore it's just a copy/paste for me to post a character and ALL of his gear. I was thinking to post each part (stats & qualities, 'Ware, software, weapons & armor, and gear) in it's own spoiler tag so it's easier to read. Please tell me if that would be annoying.

That would probably be a bit annoying. It's better to be able to see the whole set of stats. Spoiler tags are most commonly used as a pair of them for the stats/gear, and another pair of them for the description/backstory.

Other tips:

It really helps when you have either a breakdown of the point costs, or at least the point cost listed for each section (like Attributes (180), for example).

Don't use tables unless you know how to use the code tags! I have seen characters for review where the stats were all but unreadable because of misaligned rows of stuff.

Be sure you tell people ahead of time what char-gen limitations or house rules the character was built with.

Some bioware offers abilities that are far more expensive if bought with power points. You can get 2 points of muscle augmentation and 2 points of muscle toner for less than a point of Essense. In other words, they drop your Magic by 1, but you get 2 points to 2 Attributes - much cheaper than the improved attribute power, where you would spend that same point of Magic to raise a single attribute by 1 point. Similarly, synaptic booster: 2 lowers your Magic by 1 point, but buying improved reflexes: 2 (which does the same thing) costs 3 Magic points.

So even though you are losing Magic points, you still come out ahead with 1 or 2 Essense points' worth of bioware.

The drawback, though, is that bioware is very expensive. So in addition to buying up your Magic, you are also spending more points on resources. So an adept with bioware tends to be more effective than an adept without bioware, but be less well-rounded, since the points they spent on resources could have been spent on secondary skills.

Secondary skills are frequently over-rated. You can often get by with a very low secondary skill score, with a wisely-chosen specialization to make up the gap. For example, on a noncombatant, Pistols 1 (Semi Auto) is a good choice. You're seldom going to pick up a pistol that isn't semi-auto, so you've made a good investment. Con (Fast Talk) is another good choice.

It depends on the build. Muscle toner is so cheap, BP-wise, that I would recommend it for nearly any adept build. Synaptic booster: 2, on the other hand, costs 160,000 , or 32 build points. So for that, you are essentially comparing 2 Magic points vs. 8 skill points. Usually, the Magic points are the better deal, but some builds are more skill-intensive than others (gunslinger face with sneaking and driving skills, etc.).

OK, I can see that. Thanks for the advice.

Ah, I see. Thanks Glyph.