This has been on my mind recently since characters in our group have recently been in scenarios where they have been on foot for an extended period of time (days) and still had to remain fully effective and self-contained. So how do you deal with encumbrance if at all?

Okay, so to keep characters from packing a kitchen sink while on runs, our group enforces the encumbrance rules of ShadowRun. We've found difficulty in the way characters move from fine to unconscious within minutes. This normally isn't a problem as our group almost always keeps our loads below the str x 5 ceiling. But sometimes that isn't an option. Say for an extended hike in the bush. To carry everything one might need for a week long mission in the bush, many characters will have to carry more than their lower encumbrance ceiling. And then pass out within a few minutes according to canon rules. That's obvioulsy no good.

To have more useful encumbrance rules (that don't scale 'orribly), I was thinking of going with rather simple rules that up to str x 10 causes an effective light wound (that lasts only while the load is carried), str x 15 causes an effective moderate wound and reduces movement to 75% (akin to vehicle damage) , and str x 20 causes an effective serious wound with movement reduction of 50% and no running. For every hour (or maybe bod x 10 minutes?) this load is carried, the effective wound level becomes actual stun damage (and stacks and builds). A rest period of five minutes interspersing these periods avoids this damage accumulation.

Thoughts?

What the hell do you need that you carry over the lower encumbrance ceiling Str x 5?

I loaded my charactor with everything in my military fullpack and it is well within my charactor's carry load. And I managed to stay out in the field longer than a week.

Honestly, Shadowrun could use some fatigue and encumbrance rules that exist and make sense, respectively.

Currently, I'm using this:
Str x 5 - Str x 10: +1 to Quickness-related tests and Athletics. -1 Quickness when calculating movement speed. -1 run modifier. Light Stun every (Body x 20) minutes.
Str x 10 - Str x 15: As above, but additional modifiers as from a permanent Light Stun while encumbered. Cannot run. Light Stun every (Body x 5) minutes.
Str x 15 - Str x 20: As above, but modifiers as from a permanent Moderate Stun while encumbered. Light Stun every (Body) minutes.
Str x 20+: As above, but modifiers as from a permanent Serious Stun while encumbered. Light Stun every (Body x 5) CTs.

I like the tensor function idea... maybe I should try that...

~J

shiny house rule.

We think the encumbrance rules as they stand (i.e. how much weight they can actually carry) are ok. Except for Armour. I've worn real, honest to goodness chain, plate and mail, and heavy leather armour. Its not a flak jacket, but the principle is the same - that even if it ways 8 stone, you hardly notice it when you're wearing it. You DO notice it after a full day in the stuff, but not really other than that, though you do have more inertia and can't run quite as fast unless you're really fit - which most shadowrunners are. We therefore halve the listed weight for worn armour or clothing. I think it should really be quartered, but that was quite unbalancing, so we only reduce by half.

Other than that, we use the rules from the book. Last time we had it properly figured (i.e. last time anyone went properly tooled) it seemed to work OK. Assault cannon, 2 spare clips, sidearm, four spare clips, deck, VCR deck, some minigrenades and toolkits, rations and foci was about all they could carry, which seemed about right given relative sizes and combat webbing. That was pushing it and I think they have a strength of about 6. I should also point out that I think the toolkits were miniaturised so weighed a lot less than they should have and the cannon was a custom job too. But I think it was actually heavier than the listed ones.

My gripe with the canon rules is that I've personally marched for hours carrying 25kg+, and I'm only barely Body 2/Strength 2. By the book, I should've collapsed under that weight almost immediately.

Don't forget everything but the armour counts as full weight - the sword and sheild for example. If that puts you over your Stx5 then you start to get tired quite quickly, though nowhere near as quickly as in the rules. I would guess my St as 2 as well, so if we take that 20kg armour on its own, and divide by two to get 10kg, that's St2x5 - so just wearing the armour I'm at my no-fatigue limit. the sword and shield would be another 4.5 kg which would mean I'd start taking stun damage very quickly according to the rules. You're right, that's not quite accurate, even WITH the armour/2 rule. Which I still think is reasonably accurate so



Perhaps this then (keeping the armour/2 rule): at Stx5-Stx10 you don't take stun, you just take +1 to quickness tests and move at 75% normal or something, then at Stx10 plus you start getting the usual fatigue stun?

I don't see what your problem is with the dwarf thing. So a dwarf can wear that much armour. So what? What the hell weighs 60kg? Everything else is normal weight which adds up quite nicely on its own.

Most of the time we seem to just not bother with it. If someone wants to carry the load of a pack horse or a pickup truck we'll break out the canon rules, but otherwise, if the load seems reasonable we just ignore it in favor of speed and ease.

It seems to work well for us and helps keep down on the micromanaging and such.

The encumberance rules tend to come into play when a GM IMG asks, "So what's everyone taking," and someone starts reading off a list for over a minute. In other words, gratuitous infractions catch the GMs' attentions. Otherwise, we figure everyone's played DnD enough to know not to get overburdened.

A yomp through the wilderness? Sounds fun

~J

What? That's what its called! Yomping! Ask any squaddie!

Honestly, some people. Mind in the gutter...

Simple house rule.

Tell people to not carry more than they think that they should. If I find a player abusing the leeway, just wait until an inopportune moment, like the middle of a firefight, or trying to climb into the hatch of a corporate panzer to point out how awkward and overloaded they are.

People are generally pretty good about this and it saves everyone math. Math should only be used for amusement, not drudgery like calcing encumbrance.

In general, I've always viewed the encumbrance rules as more an "in combat" effect. You can hump around a great deal of gear for most of the day and be, for the most part, fit to fight (assuming an at least vaguely non-trivial conditioning routine). Soldiers of the world have been humping 30+ kilos of gear around since the dawn of time (Romans and modern infantry carry the same load, it's just different stuff). Hence, for general, moderate impact work (marching, etc), I ignore the rule.

If someone is carrying a lot of crap, and they're engaged in a very high impact activity (shooting, free-climbing, sprinting, etc), then that's when the fatigue starts to take effect. Quick-release straps on rucksacks were designed for a reason: When the enemy opens fire, drop the pack and fight.

I do agree with the general consensus to ignore the rule except when the players flagrantly abuse the situation, though.

i am loose on the emcumbrance rules... I kind of say.. i trust you if you say you are in this emcumbrance and blah blah blah... but if i know your character it carring everything including the toaster you just stole.. and you pick up every gun/ammo/item you find.. i will start going hey.. you have a light stun damage after a while... i don't say it's like having a wound because.. a serious stun, medium wouund and medium emcumbrance is a +7.. kind of hefty.. i just say you take stun damage after a while in it!

Because i am a backpacker... you walk around with 50kg backpack.. you aren't really restricted by its weight.. just its size... and after about 2 hours of non stop hiking.. you feel freaking fattigued as hell tho.. expecial with you are only to carry about 1/3 your wight.. fatigue equals you need rest.. how doyou get rid of stun.. REST.. bingo.. thats my logic.. and i am just kind of random with the mods.

I had a character with 3 str run aronud with... 6 pistols with 2 clips each, with electronic gear to make a decker scream.. and was looting everthing he foundl. did i mention he war a armor vest/plate under his lined coat! i had so much fun with him! Yeah... you pick sling that smg over you... making a total of 5... oh.. mmm... 4 minutes later.. you pass out you are unconscience!

I use the "significant items" rule. That is to say, I use the canon rules, but I only apply it for particularily heavy items. Pistols, for example, don't cause encumbrance unless you're carrying a crate of them. For situations like the one described, I only apply the penalty if the character's carrying several heavy objects. I don't generally include things like armor, small arms, pocket electronics, and the like.

My group does not bothers with encumbrance. Only time was when player tried to steal everything in gun shop after firefight with owner, then I smacked him
That character did not survive long anyway because of his stupidity.

Really, such things should be considered only when someone abuses them.

Well, the smart-ass answer would be "Get the damn rigger to drop pre-arranged supplies to us via his stealth-drone" or something similar.

Hanging around the boonies waiting for stuff to happen tends to be more problematic for the "get-shot-quick" mentality. The ones who plan always bring everything but what's needed and the scavening, opportunistic characters tend to get away with murder.
And looting.
And Grand Theft Auto.


Stalk! Hunt! Seek! Kill! Loot! Lair!

:L

i think the funniest loot was i gave my group a run from a Gang boss.. they didn't know who or what he was about.. just he was the man with the creds to fork out. But the mission was like.. this japanesse Fish and Chips shop is getting in the way of our business, the owner doesn't like us.. i want you guys to go in there.. and let him know we don't mean business... none of the runners thought "why would a gang boss want us to do his dirty work when he has a gang" hehe.. Well the runners thought it would be a good idea to just have a good ole fashion robbery... well one of my runners took the Point of Sale Credstick reader.. HAHA.. and hacked in to it later.. funniest loot i ever seen a party take.. and another runner took a few bags of chips!

We've never really used encumbrance cause the body armor, firearms and amunition weights are total BS. If we did use them we would half the weights on all armor, and pistols, shotguns and submachineguns. And the ammo would weigh less too though we haven't taken the time to figure it.

Sane soldiers in reality just carry this stuff and stash it while fighting. Don't see why you can't just do the same, as carrying around half a tent and weeks of food in a firefight is kind of silly.

Yeah, firefights usually aren't the problem, except for scrawny little mages who want to carry security armor and big guns. That's why I was mostly thinking about how long you can march with the gear when I made up the numbers above.