There is a lot of Shadowrun historical stuff out there, and, predictably, some of it doesn't make a whole lick of sense. I have noticed a lot of people have been asking about bits and pieces of it, and that seems kinda inefficient. So, here is the idea. People can post their questions here, along with others who answer, and I will edit this first post to include the answers. That way we can get our information faster and in one thread.



The Deal with Dankelzan:

WARNING, the following is spoileriffic and most of the populace of earth doesn't know the details.

Big D, after being elected president, elected to kill himself in the creation of a very powerful power foci, which is/was/will be used to keep some big nasties at bay. This act created an astral rift at the site of his death. Anything astral getting close to the site was sucked in and killed.

Later, in '61, an astral dragon named 'Ghostwalker' appeared out of the rift and flew to Denver. He somehow got re-aquanted with his body, and killed the section of Denver that had been given to the Azzies. Then he set up a new system of government, where he was the leader, and the current government ruled at his pleasure. Some think that Ghostwalker is Big D, but people on Dumpshock have informed me that he is, in fact, big D's brother.

Question 2.

Some elves claim to be from the previous era of magic on earth . . . HOW?

According to Dumpshock informants, there are about eight elves on earth that have lived through previous magical cycles. Apparantly, during low magic times, Elves (and Vampires) transmute into humans with one difference, they don't age. They loose all other supernatural abilities, and walk the earth for thousands of years. Dragons go into hybernation, but can retain some contact or knowledge of the outside world.

Question 3

What up with the great ghost Dance?

The Great Ghost dance was overseen by the first confirmed Shaman (at least in North America), Daniel Howling Coyote. The Dance was done in an approx. 20 meter circle with many other casters. This was the first confirmed use of ritual spellcasting in North America. Dumpshock people have proposed that some form of spirit (or possibly the son of a 'half horror') taught the natives how to do blood magic.

BIT OF FLUFF FROM ACTUAL HISTORY.
-The Great Ghost dance is borrowed from actual Native American History. During the 1800s, in the west (when Native Americans were being rounded up and put on small reservations), there were many who fought back against tyranny, oppression, and outright cruelty. One man (and it is bad of me, I can't remember his tribe, but his ideals spread to many tribes), received a vision that if he did a special dance, and put the whole of his body and soul into it, then his ancestors would come to his aid, and enchant his clothes so that no bullet would pierce it. Still today, some tribes perform the Great Ghost Dance, but never do they undertake it lightly. It is said to be such a spiritually charged event that babies and small children should not watch for fear of being overwhelmed.

#1: Ghostwalker is Big D's brother (they're assumed to be Icewing and Mountainshadow from Earthdawn). Big D commited suicide to create an artifact to undo the work of boodmages and (hopefully) delay the Horrors (Earthdawn Big Bads). It's called The Dragon's Heart, you can read about it in the Dragon Heart saga (1990s SR novel trilogy). In the books it's effectively a force 10 power foci.

#2: They're the Immortal Elves. There are only 2 or 3 known by name (Eliohan the Scribe is one), and about 6 to 8 verified (though unnamed in canon) IIRC, but many elves claim to be immortal. The IE hide out with the dragons during the low magic cycle. Dragons enter into a ~5000 year sleep/hibernation during the low magic cycle (the dates of the beginning of an age are when the first dragon wakes up to the end, when the last falls asleep).

Aren't dragons pure mana, as in no real physical body in the in the metahuman sense of the word? Because of this they become weakened and lose physical form during low mana cycles. That may have been just speculation, but I remember reading something about it. Maybe it was in Survival of the Fittest, but I can't recall of hand.

The IE's were active during the low magic cycle of the 5th world while the dragons were hibernating. Ehran and Harlequin continued their rivalry during this time, and I believe there are some rumors of IE's hunting dragons during the down cycle, and this is one of the (many) points of contention between dragons and the IEs.

IIRC, I'll add, his body was hidden near Denver, making Denver his ancestral kingdom which he felt the need to reclaim.


Some may have hidden out, but some supposedly lived through the intevening years. Harlequin is hinted at being a few prominent historical figures, and in Worlds Without End, Aina gives some of her history during the downtime and mentions a few other IE's she shared some history with during that time.


Dragons are dual natured. They definitely have a physical body and it gets left behind when they project.

He pretty much killed all the political opposition and then took over. He runs the place now. Check out Year of the Comet, Shadows of North America and the Shadowrun Missions (the Denver ones).

Actually the primary "opposition" GW took out were the fragments of Zebulon (the splintered ancient and powerful free city spirit of Denver) and the small (but pretty powerful) Atzlan presence in the city. The info on Zebulon comes from the GM's SB from the Denver boxed set.

Before GW came to Denver, the city was like Berlin after WWII. No one really owned the city, and each nation involved had their own "territory" that they could do whatever they wanted with. When GW came he basically concured Denver. GW created his own army that has cross sector athourity and whatever he says goes now. Azland was completely wiped out by GW, including their prized temple.

In game, some people believe that Ghostwalker is Dunklezhan, but most don't know. His appearance splintered the Children of the Dragon cult, which probably provides for endless Matrix debates on his origin.

Ghostwalker attacked the Aztlan sector first, and primarily, using the fractured zones to wage gorilla war against their forces - which left them surprised when CAS troops started pressing into their zone invasion style. The Azzies still have smuggling routes into the city, contacts, and such, but ultimately it was the rewriting of the Treaty of Denver which meant they'd have to go to war against the rest of North America to reclaim their slice - something they're still considering...

Another important part about the re-writing of the Treaty is that Seattle got Council Island from the Salish.

He didn't take out the fragments of Zebulon, he bound them; he's trying to reunite the spirit of the city into a whole, rather than eradicate it.

1. True or false? Immortal Elves and Great Dragons are always about during low mana cycles (such as the Fifth World), however they take on the forms of "ordinary" people. Otherwise, I have a very funny image in my head of dragons and elves piled up like kittens in basket taking a 5000+ year nap.

2. Not a new question but one that's never been answered to my satisfaction. Mana ebbs in flows in 5000+/- year cycles. However, recorded human history dates back to 4,000BC. Given that there is no precise date for the beginning of the Fifth World, were dragons and Immortal Elves hanging out with the Sumerians?


Vampires, as I understand my Shadowrun lore, are the result of a HMHVV virus, of which the side effect is agelessness. I think of it as a type of mana-based AIDS. However, it hasn't been established if one were to become a vampire if he would be truly immortal.

1. Dragons were hibernating, though there's some suggestion that at various times they were able to Astrally Project, and even stretch their wings during mana spikes (Dark Ages is mentioned). Elves walked around in human guise, building their power bases and getting rich.

Astrally Projecting would make sense as Dunklezhan's will made reference to John Lennon and John F. Kennedy.

1. True. Dragons sleep during the low mana cycle but Elves metamorph into humans kinda like Drakes.
2. The Shadowrun storyline is a parallel world to the our world and as such magic can exist and go through ebbs in flows ~5000 years. This means that while the Shadowrun universe shares a common history with our timeline from the dawn of civilization till now, Earthdawn would pickup around the time of the Sumerians in our time.

So the Therans existed before, after, or in conjunction with the Sumerians? Or did the Sumerians not exist in the SR timeline? I'm curious to know if Harlequin kicked it with Hammurabi, King Tut, etc.

Re: #1 - Let me appent that this is why he died, but only if that's what you want the reason to be. D died in what blatantly appeared to be an assassination attempt, and Jak Koke's book dictated that it was suicide. However, this was very much an explanation by that author - and that author alone - after the fact. The sourcebook where he was killed was written by different people.

Also, I think the Dragon Heart and everything surrounding it is patently retarded. Could you tell?

I consider both canon because the general public thinks it was an assassination (and/or that Ghostwalker is Big D back from the dead,etc), but that a much more interesting tale is told behind closed doors, and that anyone who actually knows it is dead.

Also, Re: Denver

Denver is now technically CAS territory (due to GW pushing out the other armies/governments) but the CAS isn't going to try and enforce it, GW owns Denver, it might as well be a free state. The Treaty of Denver was brought up as having been possibly violated, but GW invited all involved over for lunch and ate them and worked out some kind of agreement whereby he owns the city.

Anyway, the Big D is gone, and not even to the hevenly hoard he deserves after a life spent trying to make the world a better place, he's gone to patrol the metaplanar shasm that divides our world from the horror's home metaplane; his brother got back (from where nobody knows) in the Year of the Comet trought the Watergate Rift and gone back to his body, than procided to make clear that Denver had been built on his turf and that they were better to aknowledge his right to rule, with the exception of Atzlan which recived a "get your fragging ass out of here" message in no unclear terms (actualy the terms did seem more like a "die fragging bastards" message). After reclaiming the place he got himself an army and started to put some order into his home.

Immortal elves (plus or minus a "t") are elves whos ancestors were into bestiality and got a wild ride with one or more dragons, their immortality gene needs the presence of mana to be primed but once primed it keeps going even during the downcycle; they do not hybernate like dragons and have affected history (Leonardo Da Vinci, Richard the lionhearted, Alachia got involved with the Nazi) to various extents, the biggest limitaion they face in the downcycles are due the lack of mana needed to work magic.

But that would make brown nipples non-canon. And we can't have that.

I'll give you one: who was it that sent the myserious message that Fastjack intercepted?

Either:
The Monolith ("ALL THESE WORLDS ARE YOURS EXCEPT EUROPA. ATTEMPT NO LANDINGS THERE.")

or...

Mirage. But that's just because Mirage is my explanation for a lot of inexplicable shit.

I don't even want to think about how a mammal (elf) mates with an egg-laying lizard-thing.


That wasn't ever revealed, was it? But it sounds like the writers were spoofing/paying homage to Mona Lisa Overdrive so I'm guessing either aliens or spirits (which are pretty much the same thing in SR lore). Now that I think about it a "Metaplanar Matrix" is kind of a cool idea.

Er, as of when? Last I heard, the Frontier Force was still made up of troops from all the Treaty signatories save Aztlan.

Well, for one, you're only assuming they're egg laying lizards (but they probably are)
Two, MAGIC. Solves all problems.
Likely dragon spunk is so....spunky that it persists even when the dragon is in an alternate metahuman form. Sorta like D&D's explanation.

If we went by DnD standards, dragons are the horniest bunch of creatures this side of Penthouse.

Here's a good one: did Mitsuhama / Renraku gain any insight about the bugs from Project: HOPE (I think that was the corp / name). And if they did, what kind of research did they get?

I would say the Therans were the Sumerians in the Earthdawn/Shadowrun timeline. Harlequin probably kicked it up with Hammurabi and the likes at the time (maybe the source of the fueds he has with the other IEs).

Actually, that was a rationalization for why there were so many half dragons (most of which were PCs). Council of Wyrms really messed with things.
(Not that I mind, I enjoyed playing half dragon characters)

From: http://secure.commandohq.com/download/File...Q-06-lowres.pdf


Nope, it's Zone territory alright, not CAS.

Dragons of the Sixth World goes into all the biology. So yeah, they lay eggs. But I can accept that they took metahuman form when they got their freak on (cue: the best pop band of 1993, Another Level) with the elves.


And the most sexually confused this side of Catherine the Great.


Project Hope was a joint effort between Renraku and New Dawn Environics, a subsidiary of the Universal Brotherhood (before they were outlawed). They gained a lot of good dirt on "subjective time dilation" through illegal experimentation but, at the time, they were unaware of the insect spirit connection with the project. There was probably a collective head-slap in Neo-Tokyo after that day.

I've got the book but its been a few years since I cracked it open. I've read about mammalian dragons (See: Irene Radford's The Glass Dragon) so I was jesting about it (people assume XYZ about dragons and it isn't universally true, such as wings or flying, or well, any property typically ascribed to them, see Our Dragons Are Different).

Ok, how about another question. Who was it that taught the blood magic rituals to the NAN shamans for the Great Ghost Dance? Was it something the NAN shamans just stumbled on? Also, any other information about the GGD? Like, where or who?

I'm away from my books right now, but SR1, IIRC, tells about the creatiom of the SR universe in a bit more detail. I think the same guy who led the native americans out of the internment camps, through a hail of ineffectual gunfire, was also instrumental in organizing the GGD, and the NAN, and it is hinted at the formation of Tir Tairngire, then disappeared.

It is also claimed that Aina's half-horror son taught the natives the dance.

In Halequin's back, the team goes to the physical location of the GGD to begin their astral quest.

I always thought that the scene in Harlequin's Back where they travel to the site of the GGD was still a part of the astral quest, even though it appeared to take place in the real world. And even then, it's not terribly specific about where the GGD actually took place. But even though the mana spike there has supposedly been leveled out, you've got to imagine that it'd be an awfully impressive power site.

Daniel Howling Coyote was the Amerind leader and prophet who led his followers out of the Abeline Re-Education Center. It's never been specifically stated where the Great Ghost Dance took place, though it's probably safe to say it was somewhere in the West and we know the actual dance took place in a 20 meter circle. In Harlequin's Back, Harlequin expressed his own amazement at how the Amerinds had utilized the GGD and rhetorically asked if the participants used drums, just danced, if the ground opened, how many died, and how many wished they'd died. And, yes, once the runners encountered Harlequin, they were technically on the astral quest. Everything they were seeing was representational.

I'm fairly sure it's something a wee bit more powerful, but only in the hands of Dunkelzahn's spirit or another dragon.

No. There are a *lot* of named Immortal Elves who were kicking around in Earthdawn, but only Frosty (and MAYBE Alachia's daughter) have the immortality gene and have been born in the new age. They don't hide out with the Dragons, the dragons would eat them. They do not get along very well at all, in fact. It's why Aina is persona non grata in IE society, because she sided with the wyrms instead of the immortal elves over something. This is where my understanding gets fuzzy, but the elves are actually the children of dragons in elven form mating with metahumans and then working draconic ritual magic on them. There might be other immortal members of races out there, but I doubt it. Somewhere, the IE's decided to say "Sod off" to the Dragons, as they were done being their wacky servants, the purpose for which they were originally created. Enter drakes.

The GGD is a part of native American culture. Back in the 1800's the US government tried to stop it (along with all elements of NA culture). Like with Voodoo in Central America. When the world become awakened, the old mystical acts started to really work.

I thought they were all stolen during the downtime by evil wizards who corrupted them.

No, that happened in the 4th world and resulted into the creation of the Hydras.

I think it was the Sea Dragon's eggs that were stolen, by a member of the OUtcast's house. Again, fuzzy.

Which message was that?

Also, wasn't GW freed by Talon in The Burning Time? Not positive that's the correct book, but I'm pretty sure.

Dragons of the Sixth World says it was Rhonabwy that stole the eggs. A dragon's type is determined by their mentor not the type of their parents. As such dragon eggs are worth more then all the gold in the world to a dragon. It gives them a chance to influence and control the next generation of dragon kind. The fact that Rhonabwy has the largest clutch of eggs means he is trying to immortalize himself and possibly possition himself to be able to take the position of Loremaster in the future.

I meant one clutch previously - and Hestaby has those eggs, not Rhonabwy. He gave them to her for safe keeping.

That's correct. There are two other key points revealed in the storyline of those eggs:
1) It's very unusual for a great dragon to have an urge to mate. Typically, it's only adult dragons that mate.
2) Dragons don't ever raise their own eggs. They're always entrusted to a different great dragon. The Sea Dragon is considered a bit of a pervert for wanting to hatch her own eggs.

No, but he did supposedly witness Ghostwalker's arrival in the astral.

No the egg's stolen by the Outcast's clan were from the Loremaster before Master of Secrets; she mated before becoming a Great Dragon and chose to raise the hatchlings herself (just like Allwing did before her), it seems that she was one of the most eager among the dragons to hunt down the offspring of the Outcast when he refused to stop producing dragonkins, he tooke it personal (I don't think he proved any particular feeling for his offspring thought) and instructed one of his dragonkins (one that managed to survive the hunt) to win the Loremaster's friendship and trust, and when the eggs were about to hatch he stole them and performed a rite that merged several of them together creating the first Hydra, the Loremaster seing it went insane, slain the fragger and committed suicide impaling herself with a mountain (the one in wich she had hers lair).

..
No. See, that IS All-wings, not all-wings before her. All-Wings who committed suicide on Wyrmspire, her lair. I forget why. As far as I know there is only one Leviathan-Great in Earthdawn (I don't have the Dragons book available now at your local Ancient HIstory's friendly download area). And I was wrong, it's Thermail who's eggs were stolen and used to create the Hydra, not the Great Leviathan.

I'm sorry but I'm not native to english and I can't quite get the point of your post.
Anyway I was speaking of Thermail, you can take a look to the Ancient Files for more info on her and Master of Secrets

I do want to point out that Big D's and Ghostwalker's mother raised her own cluth of eggs. She was celebrated for having done so because her cluth of eggs resulted in some of the most impressive dragons to come of age.

My understanding is a bit fuzzy as well -- it's been a long time since I ran Earthdawn -- but I'm pretty sure that's not correct. Below is what I've worked out: it's a mix of direct statements and strong implication in the source material.

• All elves, immortal and non, are the product of draconic magic: they were originally created by the dragons (from human stock, I would presume) to be their servants, as well as to take care of the dragons' bodies during the downcycle. Alamais/Alamaise was the one who came up with the idea. This was done during the Second Age. Immortal elves were intended to be the bosses/overseers/favored servants.
  
• Sometime during the late Second Age, an IE whose name I forget (although there was an implication, IIRC, that she was related to Alachia or was Alachia herself) led a rebellion and freed the elves, inflicting a horrible wound on Alamaise in the process. There are references to a scar on Alamaise's chest in Earthdawn (and I *think* in Shadowrun as well) that's where it comes from. The dragons were beginning to go nighty-night at the time, and couldn't do much about it.
  
• In the early Fourth Age, Alamaise attempted to reclaim the elves as servants. With typical draconic sense of tact (i.e. none) he did it by eating an elven Queen. Needless to say, this did not endear him to anyone. Alachia came to power as Queen in the primary Elven community at the time (called Wyrm Wood) and kept power for a good long time, doing her best to fan the flames of hatred. (Alachia is a b*tch of the first water, but that's neither here nor there.)
  
• Icewing (aka Ghostwalker), in a search for more reliable servants, drew on his well-known mastery of spirits and invented the ritual to create Drakes. Drakes in ED source material were created from pure mana. Some time later, a young Human girl (named Aardelea) came along who could somehow acquire and exhibit Drake abilities. There was a series of ED adventures and adventure seeds that had the party rescue her at Icewing's behest, lose her to (I think) the Therans, rescue her again, etc. The implication is that this is where the SR Drakes came from, but that's pure conjecture.
  
• Mating with metahumans (or at least mating with metahumans to produce children) was, in Draconic society, a complete and utter no-no. A great dragon named Denairastas the Outcast did it anyway, using his progeny as servants. I don't remember whether he was outcast for doing it, or whether he did it because he was outcast and Icewing wouldn't give him the drake creation ritual, but the fact remains that he was the only one to do it, and the other dragons hated him for it. Since he doesn't appear to be around anymore, and Dunkelzahn/Ghostwalker survived till the 6th age, I would assume the prohibition on children is still in place.... although there is at least one dragon in SR canon who does the blanket hornpipe with metahumans, so maybe non-procreation is OK...

And Glasgian Oakforest. We shouldn't forget that little <censored>, much as we'd like to.

From what I recall from SR3 (Dragons of the Sixth World) Bred Drakes were the progeny of created drakes.