If you haven't heard a "fuck" by the time you had your breakfast in TV, you are watching the wrong shows O.o

Also, there's not all that much Info on the Troll-Kingdom of Black Forest.
I'll try and dig it up somewhere.
For starters, combine Ork Underground in Seattle with the Cascade Ork Smugglers.
then make Trolls the Majority instead of Orks and substitute TROLL MODIFIED HORSES for T-Birds.
That's one of the reasons why German vehicles in Shadowrun are better too.
Because our Horse-Power is better ^^


@mods, sorry for my reaction, but i am a bit allergic concerning that very topic <.< . .

Well, now you're exaggerating a bit. Yes, curses are not stigmatized and blotted out. But our morning TV shows are very timid.

Not all of the additional material from national, non-USA publishers is bad of course. Actually I don't know what the French added. It was just FanPro that made a bad impression with many German gamers. But I don't expect Pegasus to make similar mistakes - and so far I am fine with their additions.

you know that things have become strange when national tv's teen aimed show mimics the US *beep* as part of a joke...

In Loose Alliances there's a five page writeup of Maderm Facism, including the posterchild of neo nazi terror groups Nationale Aktion.

You can't get any better vilain than Nazis anyway.

There's not much preventing the German/French material to be translated into English. As far as I know, most of SOX's content was written in English. I'm not so sure about the French-only content (such as Marseille in Runner Havens) but since it's written by a translator who's already spent a lot of time translating from English to French, I guess it's not too hard for them to translate the whole chapter to English.

But I guess that it'd be better if you all learned French. This way you could read our Cyber-espace and benefit from everything I've written there... And the girls love it too!

I am very good at the french thing.
i just don't understand the language.

NEVER EVER in this my life will i dare to speak more french than "Je ne parle pas francais. Je parle allemand et anglis Punkt!"
Sorry, had too much run-ins with people from france who thought that everyone in the world should know the language and that burned me a bit.

Dunno about the legalities, but if it would be allowed i can translate the part from Shadows over Europe into english for the benefit of the community. I found it a bit disappointing that there isn't much more content about it and it seemed more like the nation is collapsing.
As far as racism in Shadowrun goes, yesterday in our Shadowrun session my players arrived in vienna and were faced with the famous austrian racism. "You are not human, you are not from austria. You better die or leave. Here, want a job?"

Actually I'm kind of jealous the European crew get some domestic stuff written by and for them.
All I got was Target Awakened Lands and its just all arse-backwards in some areas like for example: Sydney has the roaches, Brisbane has the horrible storms and Melbourne just tries hard to be noticed (but no one does ) the Universal Brotherhood was started in WA in the 1970's and if the Japanacorps moved into Cairns the local yobbo's would shoot them for 'talking funny' if the already non-awakened existing wildlife and Cat5 cyclones didn't tear them a new arsehole fresh off the boat.
But at least they got Adelaide right and no one goes there, which is a pity as its our psychopath capital

Translated the text from the Helix. Have fun

Trollkönigreich Schwarzwald (Trollkingdom Blackforest)

The Trollkingdom Blackforest is an ADL country and one of the Awakened Lands.

Capital: Freiburg
Size: around 7.500 km²
Residents: 210.000
Trolls: 48%
Orks: 34%
Norms: 11%
Other: 7%

History
After the secession of the Süddeutschen Bund (Southern German Federation) in 2038 started the government with the setup of intern camps for and pogroms against Orks and Trolls. The supressed metas defended themselves with magic. Like in America, the government couldn't, even after using the Force of the MET2000, defeat the mix of magic and guerilla-tactics.

The Trollwars
The resistance was led by a Troll with the covername "Berthold". He lead the rebels to the "Rottweiler Befreiung" on the 28. October 2038. Here they freed the biggest Internation Camp in Svabia and killed all the guards. Three years of skirmishing in the Middle- and High Blackforest followed. Rumors had it that the awakened Nature caused as much casualties as the battles themselves.
In February 2042 the government saw their immediate defeat in the eye. To avoid this, they started a large-scale offensive called "Schwabenstreich". This attack was brutally thrown back. Nature magicians unter Bertholds Command struck back in the April of the same year. Through a series of earthquakes, they shaked up the Rheingraben and the volcanoes of the Eifel and the Kaiserstuhl spew Fire, Lava and Ash. Big parts of Karlsruhe were destroyed and the Neuwieder Becken flooded. As a consequence, Würtemberg let Baden down to wage the war alone. Berthold used the opportunity and declared on the 19. February 2043 officially the Trollkingdom Blackforest. In the february of the following year the Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer appeared to support the Trollkingdom against the svabians, or so it is told.
The battles endet with the demise of the Hunggarten government in Mai 2044 and with 08. May 45 the Trollkingdom became official part of the ADL.
The so called "Trollwars" are a reason for the strained and hostile relationship between svabiany, bavarians and trolls.

Politics
The ADL country is a monarchy with the university town Freiburg as capital and feudal structure. The privilegation of Orks and Trolls in contrast to other demographics is written firmly into the state constitution and lead to the fact that the Trollkingdom isn't well liked in the other ADL countrys and France, although Norms, Elves and Dwarfs enjoy protection of the state. Extraterritorial corporate facilitys are limited to facilitys that existed before the founding of the Kingdom. The main income come mainly from tolls of the transitroutes of the Rheintal between the ADL and Swiss and farming. The country is chronically broke and so the inhabitants are poor. This lead to a small but growing Democracy Movement, which finds many supporters in the traditional liberal Freiburg. Moreover, even some Trolls follow the idea of a "Groß-Baden" where the kingdom includes the Alliance Country Badisch-Pfalz, Karlsruhe and a part of the Elsass - of course without the anti-metahuman and racist goals of the Groß-Badische Kreuzzugsbewegung.

Awakened Land
After the beginning of the 21st century an urbanisation as consequence of the collapsing paper industry began and conquered the Blackforest landscape back. Even today around 80% of the villages in the Middle- and High Blackforest are uninhabitated. After the Awakening started the spread of Nature, many different critter, awakened plants, free spirits and astral phenomena had a chance to make a home here. And that's why the Kingdom counts as an Awakaned Land.

Even in the middle ages the Blackforest was soaked with Legends, fairy tales and myths. But what was just horror stories for children, has now awakened and stalks through the dark Forest. Magicians report of a Backgroundcount from 1 to 4; an unknown number of awakened animals and plants are suspected. Ten percent more free Naturespirits, Ghosts and astral Phenomena than in other ADL Countrys haunt the region. The hoard of the old dragon Kaltenstein is suspected somewhere on the Feldberg.
23 sectors are classified as paranormal Dangerzones.
Many of the myths and legends awakaned, for example "Die schöne Melusine" in the Sollenberger Woods at offenburg and "das Schlossfräulein von Steinen" in the Wiesental.

Pegasus (the German publisher) has a license to publish new things, too. One of the product they are planning is a plot line about (changes in) the troll kingdom, especially about the missing king Berthold. The only problem with that is the schedule, there's a big delay in published books as actually getting the license took a lot of time.
After that, there are books about Berlin and the Rhine-Ruhr-Megaplex planned, as they don't really fit into all the other books.

What is a Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer? And svabians?

Anyway, it sounds like a boon to anti-troll racists. The troll kingdom is a total shithole! All the racists are gonna be like, "see, we told you they were inferior, look at how much their only kingdom sucks." Though I do like the fact that the troll kingdom is a dangerous magical forest. It would be stupid if it were an advanced utopia, or lush verdant paradise like the elven kingdoms. That's not how trolls roll! It's also nice that it doesn't indulge the stereotype of trolls being stupid and violent, and shows that, well they might be slightly too dull to run a prosperous kingdom, it's not some kind of primitive society where everything is decided by thumping people with clubs.

Have you considered posting this as an entry in the Sixth World Wiki?

Svabians are the natives of Svabia, or Schwaben. My translator told me it was t he correct translation for the region.
Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer is, according to the Helix a battle group which was stationed in southern Württemberg in 1945. It had three infantry- and two paratropper battalions and those soldiers seemed willing to fight 'till the last of them dropped down. When the war ended, they disappeared without a trace with all their weapons and tanks.
Until today there are myths, signs of tank tracks, sights of heavy vehicles which disappear into nebula when you come near them and sound of soldiers working. No researcher could confirm those stories.

Wow, that's quite awesome. Ghost Nazis who fight for the Trollkingdom. Whatever the writer of this smoked, i want something of that too!


Nope, it's a rough translation, but if you want you can iron out the grammar and probable spelling errors and do it yourself. I don't claim any copyright on it.

Has anybody ever seen the hungarian SR-Sourcebook or some of the japanese stuff?

im really courious about the contents of these books...

Didn't AH say that there wasn't much changed in the Japanese versions? They were just straight translations?

I know he was talking about them when we were discussing the different versions of the Street Sammy guide.

Thank you for the translation Greybrother. I've heard much about the Troll Kingdom but never seen the original writeup.

well, there ar a couple (five?) books that very japanese-only.

and I own a copy of the jap. SR2-BBB which has nine or so additional pages on japan and neo-tokyo.

But it's understandable: There must be some incentive for German players to wait for the translations instead of buying the (usually cheaper) English originals immediately.

Quite right. Some of the German SR's abominations date back to early SR2 - and some people have been bitching about every German SR product ever since despite never having actually read any of them! You will find equipment that vanished from books years ago or setting details changed/revised years ago still being cited as proof why German SR sucks.
Here at Dumpshock I stumbled upon people bashing German SR based on mere rumors spread by explicit AGS-haters. Once I pointed out errors in argumentation a common answer was "Oh, they changed that? I haven't read a German SR book in years..." or even better "Sorry, I was told it's like that. I don't actually understand German so I've never read it myself...".

This is such a weird practice. I would think permitting non-American publishers the right to create new material (rather than simply translating English into German/French) would result in intellectual property issues. Dark Horse comics have the rights from Kodansha to translate Ghost in the Shell but it doesn't go about creating new GitS comics by American writers.

Obviously I'm not a lawyer.

Well damn Wes, I mean, see, *cough, shuffles feet*, I have this problem with the RIAA and I was kinda hoping...

Okay, so where's our Japanese based posters with willing translations of the Japanese stuff? That should be interesting.

It strikes me to hear that Shadowrun is also translated in Japanese... i mean... okay, until Runners Havens i never knew that there are actual french translations, so it not that of a revelation but... damn. The sixth world really goes around the world... is it translated in Russian as well? Do they have extra materials? That would be kinda cool since i loved the Russia chapter of SoA (and i hope that Runners Havens sports a Wladiwostok chapter)

ARE there wapanese based Players around here? O.o
Girlfriend and a Buddy of mine were there on student exchange and both actually found people to play with.

Yeah, actually I heard about a thing with German law and a Warhamer 40k movie. Games Workshop ended up forbidding the 3D movie Damnatus from being shown -- it was created without their permission by some 40k fans, and GW's lawyers believed that, under German law, if they let someone else put their names on the Warhammer 40k product, they would lose all intellectual property rights to the brand.

If that was true in any way though, there's no way the companies that own Shadowrun would be letting the German companies alter it... Maybe the issue with Games Workshop was that the movie was made without their permission, and not based on a before the fact licensing agreement. Or maybe GW's lawyers are just scared/confused/retarded. It seems to me that if they'd been willing to spend a little money on German counsel, they could have created an agreement that wouldn't have forfeited their rights, but when you rely on British counsel to make conclusions about German law, you get a memo that says "I'm skurred, dun do it lul!"

Off the top of my head, Doc Taotsu is stationed in Japan (Okinawa?) and DLN is Japanese, but living in America.

Those are the only two that come to mind.

@Uli: Why should they only translate stuff? What incentive would be there to buy their product? Errata imho don't really count.
and how satisfying is it to take someone else's product, translate it and sell it? And of course: What a waste would it be to only play in the USA, or even only Seattle? SR covers more than a planet, interconnected by high tech. So confining yourself to a single region is just a waste of possibilities. Especially when this would mean leaving out Europe with its diversity, history etc.




IANAL. But what I gathered from web discussions is this: You have to actively defend your claims on a brand if you do not want to lose it. But this is for certain categories only, so a movie shouldn't create problems with board games/toys/whatever WH40K is officially classified as.
If they protected it as a movie brand, that's another thing alltogether, of course...

And English speakers don't behave like this??



I would really be interested in the Hungarian book. Never heard of it!

@Larme (and others, I guess): I'm not going to steer the thread off-topic again, so I won't comment here, but if you're actually interested I could try to shed some light on those IP issues by PM.

It sounds like there was a bit of ignorance on both sides. The fans should never have created the thing without seeking permission of the owners (legal issues aside it's just common courtesy). And GDW shouldn't have made a stink about IP rights. If Star Trek and Star Wars fandom have show anything it's that fan-produced content doesn't threaten IP rights... so long as it's clear the fan films are made by fans and the creators don't pass themselves off as the IP owner's representatives. Those fans are the company's biggest customer base and supporters.


It's the same in the US. Keeping your clients scared and litigious is a common business strategy for not only lawyers but consultants as well. Protecting entertainment property rights should be handled a bit differently than, say, protecting pharmaceutical manufacturing techniques.

Wesley,

GW not GDW... GDW is gone man. Your showing my age again.

BlueMax
/older
//than
///dirt

Except that as Games Workshop people view it, their games have no fans. What they have are customers.


Huh. Thanks for them. It's probably the most favorable review of SoE I ever read.


To me, the SOX sourcebook and campaign prove, if still necessary, that you can play nearly anything with Shadowrun. In this case the aforementioned Mad Max, Fallout or STALKER, as you like. Old-time players will be in for some surprises. Actually, to me, reading SOX first made Feral Cities Chicago chapter rather disappointing. As far as "feral" as a meaning, a few cities blocks cut out from the rest of the world for three years barely stands the comparison with an entire region isolated for sixty years (though it sure doesn't help that I'm not a big fan of insect spirits). As a local, funniest part is that SR timeline has Cattenom accident happening in 2009 (or 2008 in some books). Thus, cars, techs, supermarkets brands, ads and everything else lying around in the SOX is those you see nowadays. It greatly helps with some description.


I guess a more appropriate translation would be a "a big campain". They're not confident enough to claim it be a great one, yet.

Kinda strange to remember how I exposed in a French EuroSB/SoE team reunion in may 2001 the plot that would become the central point in this campaign years later.

Corrected version of "Trollhattan", which would of course be in Norway. Thinsg I have not checked names of regions vs locations, spelling of German terms and corresponding English ones. Instead of Svabia, I have used the more common English one of Swabia. At the bottom I have corresponding English terms translated of paranormal phenomena derived from German mythology.

Trollkönigreich Schwarzwald (Trollkingdom Blackforest)

The Troll kingdom of Blackforest is an ADL country and one of the Awakened Lands.

Capital: Freiburg
Land area: around 7,500 km²
Population: 210,000
Trolls: 48%
Orks: 34%
Norms: 11%
Other: 7%

History

After the secession of the Süddeutschen Bund (Southern German Federation) in 2038, the government initiated pogroms against orks and trolls and the setting up of internment camps. The metahumans being repressed by the government defended themselves with magic. Similarly as in America, the government could not, even with the use of external armed forces such as MET2000, defeat the deadly mix of magic and guerilla-tactics.

The Trollwars

The resistance was led by a troll with the alias of "Berthold". He led a small insurgency force to the "Rottweiler Befreiung" on 28 October 2038, where they liberated the largest internment camp in Swabia. During the fighting the insurgents killed a large number of guards and afterwards executed the remaining internment camp personnel. The insurgency after the liberation continued operating with guerilla tactics in the wooded mountain range in Baden-Württemberg known as the Blackforest region. Unsubstantiated sources attributed that the awakened nature caused as many casualties as the insurgents.

In February 2042 the regional government fearing defeat, initiated a large-scale offensive termed "Schwabenstreich" in the region held by the insurgents. Large scale fighting resulted in the defeat of government backed troops. Berthold, with mages controlling nature under his command, initiated a wide-scale counterattack in April 2042. The mages through a series of earthquakes the Rheingraben region shook with seismic activity and caused volcanic eruptions of Eifel and Kaiserstuhl. Large sections of Karlsruhe were destroyed and the Neuwieder Becken flooded. As a consequence, Würtemberg let Baden in to wage the war alone. Berthold used this opportunity to declare on the 19 February 2043 the independence of the Trollkingdom Blackforest. On February 2043, Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer[1] appeared to support the independence of the Trollkingdom against the Swabians.

The fighting ended with the announcement of the fall of the Hunggarten government in May 2044. On 8 May 2045 the Trollkingdom became an official part of the ADL.

This period of time, called the "Trollwars", are the reason for the strained and hostile relationship between Swabians, Bavarians and trolls.

Politics

The ADL country is a monarchy with the university town Freiburg as the capital with its governance comprised of a feudalistic system. The first citizen status of orks and trolls in contrast to other demographics is explicitly written in the constitution and has caused a point of contention between other ADL countries and France. Nonetheless, norms, elves and dwarves Extraterritorial corporate facilities are limited to those facilities that existed before the founding of the Kingdom. The primary income of the Kingdom comes mainly from road taxations of major road traffic conduits of the Rheintal between the ADL and Switzerland. A second major revenue source is agriculture. The country suffers from increasing inflation and lack of state funds. The increasing anxiety of a destitute populace has lead to a small but growing movement for democracy, which finds many supporters in the traditionally liberal Freiburg. Moreover, even some trolls follow the idea of a "Groß-Baden" where the kingdom includes the Alliance Country Badisch-Pfalz, Karlsruhe and a part of the Elsass. This is of course without the anti-metahuman and racist goals of the Groß-Badische Kreuzzugsbewegung.

Awakened Land

From the beginning of the 21st century a lack of urbanization due to the collapsing paper industry, caused a strong reforestation in the Blackforest region. Even today around 80% of the previous small population centers in the Middle- and High Blackforest region are uninhabited. After the Awakening, and the increasing rapid reforestation, caused many different paracritters, awakened plants, free spirits and astral phenomena to appear and inhabit the region. For these reasons, the Kingdom counts as an Awakened Land.

Even in the middle ages the Blackforest was rife with legends, fairy-tales and myths. But what were once just horror stories for children have now awakened and stalk through the Blackforest. Mages report a background count from 1 to 4; also an unknown number of yet to be categorized paracritters and awakened plants have been noted. There are 10% more free nature spirits, ghosts and astral phenomena than in any other ADL Countries in the region.

The hoard of the old dragon Kaltenstein is suspected somewhere on the Feldberg.

23 sectors are classified as paranormal danger zones.

Many of the myths and legends of awakened, for example "Die schöne Melusine" (Melusine) in the Sollenberger Woods at Offenburg and "das Schloßfräulein von Steinen" (The castle girl of stone) in the Wiesental region have been reported by eye witnesses who have encountered these paranormal phenomena.

[1] A mythological unit from World War II based on an actual unit. The Kampfgruppe was an ad-hoc combined arms formation, usually employing combination of tanks, infantry, and artillery (including anti-tank) elements, generally organised for a particular task or operation.

When the 21st Panzer-Division arrived in Tunisia, it was put under the control of 5.Panzerarmee, and then used as a number of Kampfgruppen in a series of successive engagements against the Allies. From January 30th, 1943 to February 3rd, 1943, the 21st Panzer-Division was split into two Kampfgruppen for action in the Faid-Maknassy engagements. Kampfgruppen Grun was led by Werner Grun and was formed from Panzer-Abteilung I/Panzer-Regiment 5, while Kampfgruppen Pfeiffer was led by Major Pfeiffer, being formed from the Panzergrenadier-Battalion II/Panzergrenadier-Regiment 104, Panzergrenadier-Battalion III/Panzer-Grenadier-Regiment 104 and Tunis-Battalion 2. Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer was then itself divided into "task forces" consisting of Nord, Mitte and Sud.

Through-out the battles in North Africa, the 21st Panzer was used in numerous Kampfgruppe formations like the one above, with Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer taking part in many different actions being used again and again.

Kampfgruppe Pfeiffer surrendered on May 11th, while the rest of the 21st Panzer surrendered on May 13th when the Tunisian Bridge-head in North Africa finally fell.

Oh, durrrr on me.

It must be quite depressing to work for that company.

There was two books published in Hungarian:

Shadowrun szerepja'te'k ... written by Jordan Weisman et al.,
tranlated by Szabolcs Serflek, Gergely Na'dori]
Budapest : Beholder, cop. 1995.
299 p., ill., 29 cm.
Original title: Shadowrun
ISBN 963-85454-0-2

A'rnye'kmagyarorsza'g : Shadowrun ja'te'kkiege'szito" / szerk.
Na'dori Gergely. - Budapest : Beholder, 1996. - 166 p. ill., 29 cm.
ISBN 963-85454-9-6

Information directly from:
Susanne Berke
Head of Collection Development & National Bibliographic Centre
National Szechenyi Library
1827 Budapest

I have once (3-4 years ago) put in a bid for the second book (the Hungarian Sourcebook) on ebay, but I didn't win the bid and have never seen it on ebay since.

Lars

Thanks for the info, though.... now you may have a competitor on eBay.

Not in real life. Those who think that they own the world are mostly french speaking guys. I once had to register someone on a campsite and tried to communicate with him with everything my body had, even used that little bit latin i knew to tell what i mean.
After half an hour i presented him his registration with every information correct and that guy (around 30-40) had the f*ckin nerves say "I can speak german too." in little accented german.
But this was the worst case in actually meeting a french person. The culture in itself is something alien and abhorrent to me, so yes i am quite biased.
Most british, australian and people from the US behave and actually try to learn some words and phrases for the countries they visit. But i'm really glad i don't work in tourism anymore.

as far as I know, there is no russian version of SR.

I've seen german (SR1-4), french (SR2-4), spanish (SR2-3, maybe 4), italian (SR 2), polish (SR 2), hungarian (SR2) and japanese (SR 2 and 4) translated books and I've heard of a hebrew translation but never a russian one.

the only countries with exclusive publications in their respective language were/are france, japan, hungary and germany.

The SOX has a paragraph in Target: Wastelands - and that's about how specific it should be.

Please don't get me wrong: I'm fine with any well-done addition. I, personally, do not need them. But there is another reason for translations:
Not everyone has a high English literacy. Yes, it is the lingua franca, but half of my group simply does not like reading English. For them it is bothersome, more taxing, and takes more time. So they prefer the German books, even though they have to wait a little.

I do like the SOX book. My only beef was the decision to give two completely different sets of inhabitants the easily confusable names "Glowpunks" and "Radpunks" - neither are punks, just for starters. The one group are peaceful villagers, the other marauding gangs (in Fallout terms Wastelanders and Raiders, respectively).

Recently, German developer Tigger made a SOX-related shot at Catalyst for offering radiation rules in Arsenal that are completely different from the (Catalyst-approved!) rules presented in SOX...

<Voice from Babylon 5 opening> And so it begins</voice>
ANEW!

Which of those rules are less lethal?
I have the Sox Book somehwere, i just can't find it.
Maybe a buddy borrowed it or something.
But i think i remember the radiation rules being pretty damn lethal.
So even if you do manage to stay alive in the Zone for some days, you WON'T stay alife afterwards for more than some MORE days . .

I wish that the spanish translators added more content to our stuff, not only direct translations.

Though, to be honest, now days I'd just wish they continued translating, it's been years since they translated the last book to spanish (Renraku Arcology: Shutdown with rules modified to fit SR3...).

I envy you all. ((

Renraku Shutdown with SR3 Rules? O.o
Heck, anybody know if that's been done in english/german? ^^