Hullo

I am building a new character for a campaign and was thinking about using the Wendigo option from Runner Companion- partly cos I wanted something different from a character this time round.

Can Wendigo exist in 'normal' society? If I take enough contacts to have a gang on my side, and thus a supply of SINLess snacks when required, plus some cops etc could a Wendigo Adept 'get away' with operating inside society? Pass off the fur as a SURGE effect perhaps?

Since Wendigo are not duel natured can their Infected status still ping if someone astrally looks or assesses them?

Overall is the 100BP worth it for what you get back?

Look alone at the plus on attributes in addition with the abilities they gain and 100 points are ways too cheap. All the infected have a really high-power-BP-ratio. As for the acceptance: you get a bounty of 15 or 20k Nuyen on the head of an Wendigo, only a Nosferatu gives more. So i would say NO to acceptance.^^ But with masking (they are all magicians) and an illusion spell, you can get along. But for real: orks suck and mutated orks suck even more. A common ork stinks and a mutated one stinks like a wet dog with all this fur.^^ Play a Vampire, this is easier AND cooler.^^

Yes, the Infection is always visible on the astral, even if a specific type of Infected isn't dual natured.
There's no given Threshold for assensing it, but it should be either the same as "classify type of magical being" or "diagnose disease", so 2 or 3 hits on an Assensing test should be enough.
Better load up on Masking as soon as possible.

And Illusion spells, too.
Even though certain jurisdictions grant civil rights to the Infected now, in the case of a wendigo this could just mean that they are allowed to starve while running around broadcasting their status over wifi all the time, constantly being monitored by law enforcement...not what you'd want for a shadowrunner.

Plus, their habit of forming cabals of mindwiped cannibals about to become future snacks could lead to some...issues as far as trustworthines is concerned.
Besides nosferatu, they're probably the most feared Infected around.
Don't rely on screaming "don't shoot, the white fur is just a SURGE effect!" when cops, critter hunters, humanis goons or about anybody else points a gun at you.

I'd handle it this way :
Sit down with the other players and explain your character concept.
Link the wendigo to as many other PCs as possible.
It's hard to trust a man-eating, mind-raping, Awakened, regenerating, super-strong monster, but it may be easier if said monster is your best friend from high school/younger brother/father-in-law or whatever.
Always use either an Illusion spell or wear at least a hazmat suit (not that unusual with all the allergies and air pollution around, right?).
As soon as you have earned enopugh karma, initiate and learn Masking.
This would eliminate at least a huge part of the usual issues.

Or you could go for hiding your status from the other PCs (and probably even the players) as well, if you know that all members of your group prefer a PvP approach.
This could easily work for some time if you're the only Awakened character around and may be an interesting challenge.
If you're all about teamwork and no backstabbing, though, i'd absolutely advise against this.

I think that is simply wrong. Orks are much better than trolls for most roles, and orks are only slightly less viable as dwarves. The upside (pun intended); dwarves are short. Therefore orks are cooler than dwarves, despite dwarves being mechanically superior. And besides, vampires are simply emo.

You must be at least this tall for me to play you.

Orks get a bigger BOD and STR bonus, don't suffer the decreased max REA, are faster and cost 5 BP less.
Their decreased CHA and LOG may be a hindrance for some roles, ok.
But i wouldn't say that that, combined with +1 to WIL and Toxin resistance, makes dwarves mechanically superior.
They are simply more versatile, as they can excel at every role, while orks have a stronger physical focus.

But yes, orks are awesome, on that i fully agree.
In fact, i've lost track of the human builds on DS or other SR boards that would have been better off with tusks.

Wendigos can operate in normal society insofar that they enslave the brains of lesser men and make them do their bidding. One of the SR novels is based around a wendigo leading a magic group and doing some fun stuff with that. So the answer there is 'yes'.

on the flip side, wendigos are hugely overpowered for PCs. Unless the other party members are dragons and horrors, as a GM I would probably shoot down a wendigo.

I would just like to refute that orks suck. Orks are the shit.

Witness my unassailable logic.

Never deal with a dragon, ay?

It's sequal, Choose Your Enemies Carefully, actually.

*Sniff* I love that book. Twist is starting to get all growed up! I loved when they interviewed him for one of the late sourcebooks. Wonder if he's still 'Running in '70?

I know Dodger is missing, and Kham is retired...

Yeah, I meant the Secret of Powers trilogy, Never deal with a dragon was the first name it came to my mind. They are the only shadowrun novels that were translated to portuguese (not that I have any problem speaking english now) and were one of my first RPG novels...
My old shadowrun books are all falling apart now that I'm afraid to read them

Is that why they have rules to play them, complete with balanced BP costs?


Congrats for racism! It's the tusks, isn't it? Or the 'k'? Would they be better spelled "Orcs"?

I'm really not inclined to jump on the "wendigos are overpowered" bandwagon. For one thing, Vampire costs the same, actually give you some bonuses to stats, and 3 IPs! Sure, you miss out on Fear and Influence, and Magicianhood isn't built-in, but Mist Form is nice, and that's 3 IPs we're talking about. No synaptic boosters needed, you can leave the Sustaining Focus at home. 3 IPs, all day.

Of course, Infected qualities like Wendigo and Vampire are more like 150 BPs worth of positives rolled up with 50 BPs worth of negative (Wanted, requires metahuman blood/flesh, Wanted, allergic to sunlight, and Wanted)

EDIT: Oh, right, advice to build one! The fur isn't a biggie, you could either as suggested wear full-body clothing or just shave it or something. Still, living in a nasty part of town (and befriending the guy who you call when you need a new SIN fast) wouldn't hurt at all.

Also, Fear and Influence are neat tricks, and plenty of excuse to invest in a good Magic stat. Maybe buy some average stats with a nice Willpower and Charisma, get a Charisma based tradition and summon some spirits. For meatworld interactions, you can use Influence to avoid fights, Fear to divide and conquer, and your regeneration will get you through most damage. Just invest in Counterspelling (you don't regenerate spell damage) and wear a nice, thick helmet (you don't regenerate CNS damage). Finally, they can never make you check your claws at the door, so a nice Unarmed skill point or two is a good backup.

Pretend your a Sasquatch and hope that the Public doesn't know the difference! Also throw in some funky sign language and a voice-synth to make all the fun noises Sasquatchs can make and your set!

No, sir. That's +3 Initiative and +1 IP, for a total of 2 IP. The +3 comes from an increased Reaction and Intuition. Vampires get an additional 2 Reaction and 1 Intuition, which equals an Initiative rating 3 points higher. The asterisk next to initiative points to this text:



To help the OP, I'll fish out my Prince Arthas/Lich King clone...

Goodness! So the 1 before the equals sign is constant. I thought it was just explaining that the +INI didn't stack with other things. Well, that's a good bit less broken than I'd thought it to be. Thanks.

Male Nosferatu Mage - Prince Arthas/Lich King Clone:


EDIT: This character has been used successfully using the method I detail in the link in my signature. I have obtained a Force 8 Ally Spirit with Inhabitation and have gone from "Prince Arthas" to "The Lich King." We're about to retire the campaign (I'm going to remake my Runeblade - a Frostmourne clone [F6 Weapon/F6 Power Stacked Focus Claymore]), and the next campaign will be entirely devoted to destroying this character and the Ghoul army (and other special Infected Generals) he has been raising in a Z-zone.

EDIT 2: I just realized that this post is suppost to be in the Infected thread. Oh well, browse over it for ideas I guess..

It works like this:

Reaction +2
Intuition +1
Initiative +3*

* = +1 IP; this is not cumulative with any other form of IP augmentation; only the highest number of IPs apply

It might be a little easier to understand like this:

Reaction +2
Intuition +1
Initiative +3/N

N = +1 IP; this is not cumulative with any other form of IP augmentation; only the highest number of IPs apply

Orcs don´t suck because of their stats, but they definitely suck for the fluff. Minimum lifespan, stupid, ugly, and they stink. Dwarfs have the same strenght and more willpower, no decrease in mental attributes what makes them better mages and they don´t have the problem with racism. They are slower, ok, but when did you have your last sprint-contest? And if you don´t like it, let him surge and give him "celerity".^^

(IMO) Wendigo is very hard to play..if you want big,strong and playable character: Troll Changeling (W/level 2 SURGE)

Thanks for all the advice!

So Wendigo are possible but somewhat powerful. A good tailor/barber and some cosmetics should cover the worst up in conjunction with a good spell selection of "this is not a Wendigo" mind tricks.

Do they always form cannibal cults though or just the ones discovered so far?


Stingray- what lev 2 SURGE powers/qualites would you take though? Is there any way apart from Leonization to extend a Ork/characters lifespan?


Neraph - I showed your PC to my GM and he's reply was "OMG!" He did like the design though... then told me I could not copy him...

The Secret of Powers trilogy was one of the first Shadowrun fictions I read; I remember enjoying it esp Kham- though I thought Changling was better! Be cool to have a 'where are they now' screamsheet for these characters.

my Surge 2 level Metagenetic qualities for troll changeling:
(5 BP)Ogre Stomach (-20 % living costs + +2 die to resist in ingested toxins) (Adept,Street Samurai)
(5 BP)Celerity (Running and Walking speed +50 %) (?)
(10 BP)Biocompatability (-10 % essence cost) (Street Samurai)
(10 BP)Quick Healer (+2 die to healing checks) ( Adept,Street Samurai)
(10 BP) Dermal Deposit (+1 Natural Armor) (Adept,Street Samurai)
Personally i would take:Quick Healer,Biocompatability (Cyberware)(i play Street Samurai)
in additional for 5 Bp worth Ogre Stomach.(Changeling can take Metagenetic more than quality gives but must pay them normally,
althought limit of of 35 BP..

Hey, it's not my fault you play a crazy system.

I can't imagine playing a game where, if you bite someone, he now becomes your mindless thrall, allowing you to make, well, your own secret, magical cabal who gives you all of their cash to spend as you see fit. But hey, if your GM is cool with it, go for it.

HAHAHAHA! My morning is complete.

Seriously, I'll go draw up a Wendigo build real fast and see if you like it.

Actually, you can't. Unless you're referring to the Influence power, which would take multiple uses on a single target to accomplish.

You confuse me because you have not accepted my unassailably awesome point that Orks Are Better. Obviously you must be playing the game wrong.



Orks Are Better, see my above points.

Also, they can reach the top shelf.

Try this out:

Ork Wendigo (120 BP)

You have 24,375 for other gear. The Nutrition spell is to help with your Deitary Requirement (IE: use it when you can't/don't want to find a corpse), and Physical Mask, along with the FFBA and HEL suit cover the whole body, except the face, making concealing your wendigo-ness fairly easy.

The weapons are for intimidation purposes; people will be less likely to attack you if they see you with weapons. Your actual weapon will be Stunbolt, so you'll even get an edge if someone tries to pick a fight with you, as you won't have to draw a weapon. If your GM allows it, with your 8 Magic (see below) you can buy 3 successes on your spellcasting test, and buy 2 successes on your drain test, allowing you to cast a Force 6 Stunbolt with 3 successes, successfully buying your drain. Or double-casting 2 Force 4 Stunbolts with 3 successes of the test, buying off the drain.

The first thing you should do is go find some bums and drain them dry, getting up to 12 Essence, and then boost your Magic 4 points (using 8 Essence, going from a 4 Magic to an 8 ). At the end of that 12 hours, you'll lose 4 Essence, retaining 4 (for a total of 9). Go find someone else and drain that last 3, and do it again before you go to sleep. Prostitutes work well; visit 3 in the morning and 3 at night for 1 point of Essence from each. Make it like 7 in the morning and 7 at night, or 6/6 for less hastle with your Sunlight Allergy.

When you boost your Magic using Essence Drain, cast Increased Attribute (Willpower) on yourself to help with your drain dicepool since you will be able to cast higher force spells. Astral Chameleon will help you leave less of a trail. Think about starting with some Psyche to help with sustaining penalties (and boosting a couple of your stats).

You're best off taking a Cha-based tradition since some of your powers work off Cha as well. Shamanism (not a great one) and Shinto traditions are good secondary choices, but hands-down Black Magic or Aztec traditions take the cake. The fluff fits with you having to eat people fairly well (Aztecan blood rituals/Black Magic sacrifices).

As soon as possible, Initiate and take Masking. You'll need it.

EDIT: The reason I chose Stunbolt was simple.
1) It has the lowest Drain Value of all the combat spells.
2) Since it is Mana based you can cast it on the Astral as an alternative to Astral Combat.
3) It deals stun damage, so if the job does not require it (or you just don't want to), you don't have to kill someone. Also, if you do want to kill someone, you can just stun them unconscious and cast on them some more and they'll overflow.

I'm talking about the novels and three editions of stats. You can download Critters yourself for details, if you'd like. Prior to getting neutered for SR4, they were very, very dangerous creatures.

Well apparently they got rid of that part of Wendigo, at least from a game-mechanic PoV.

The forming of such secret societies has been a standard feature of wendigos since SR1, always coming up in relevant fiction.
It also ties in closely with the Amerindian folklore on which the critter is based.

However, this aspect has been significantly downplayed in RC.
This can be regarded as an attempt to make wendigos more playable, but has been criticized a lot as a part of SR4's attempt to "spay and neuter the Infected", retconning previous fluff to shoehorn certain Infected into playability.
There's apparently a lot of people who feel that it's somehow "untrue" if wendigo don't act this way, but even though HMHVV tends to change a victim's personality to some degree, they are still individuals, not Monster Manual entries.
Especially in the case of PCs.

Honestly, it's up to you and your group.
You could as well just play how your character fights the urge to indulge in such behavior.
There's nothing that mechanically forces your character to form a cannibal cabal to feed on.



On SURGE :
One of my favorite SURGE Qualities is Satyr Legs.
+50% speed, +2 STR to kick attacks and +2 on Athletics tests, including Athletic Dodge.
Sure, Raptor Cyberlegs do the same, but cost 2 points of Essence and are costly enough to be almost on par with a 10BP Quality.
I'm also fond of Nasty Vibe- +3 on Intimidation for 5BP is sweet, even though there's tons of ways to get a bonus to that skill- but hey, they all stack, right?

For longevity, you may want to take a look at G3 from Arsenal.
Keep on chewing that ginseng...

Up to 2x your Skill + Charisma, yes.