Right then starting availability is 1.5 times the norm so 18 with the quality that increases availability also suffering this increase. I have a house rule for letting cyber beta and above but I'll have to look it up all it is is an increase in availability for each ware grade. I think its +2 +5 +10 alpha, beta and delta respectively. as with the money out side of char gen ie traded with nuyen I'm temped to treat it as starting cash it some extent but that would be avlibility limit less.

One last question: Are you allowing thematic/archetypical qualities -- such as Martial Arts, Restricted Gear, Adept, Technomancer, etc. -- to be exempt from the 35/+35 limit on qualities? Martial Arts in particular can quickly and easily exceed the 35 mark all on its own, especially for characters designed for gladiatorial-style combat.

You know, I'd always treated it as a 20 BP max, but you saying that just made me realize it was a 20 point max per style and that you could take multiple styles

Oh well, hasn't affected me over much.

So would love to get in on this with a Jaguar Shapeshifter Mystic Adept, Cat Totem, Knife Fighter with Illusion/Dodge focus. 1 v 1, spells like confusion and hot potato should be able quickly even the odds agaisnt long range focused / cybered characters. But unfortunately don't have a reliable enough schedule to do anything except play on forums.

In Fields of Fire you were happy to let us buy unlimited ammo so long as we 'paid' for the availability once, are you still happy to do that?

Heh, that would suck to have to do an availability check for every 10 rounds.

Or pay the 5BP's for Restricted Gear....

True, though as GM I'd be hesitant about any ammo that is over 18 availability in the first place for a setting like this (Missiles I'm guessing?)

You can't go wrong with the MRL as a backup weapon....

Black Market Arms dealer, high connection rating should cover it, no?

Or manager with very high connection rating, who will know the black market arms dealer.

Mainly cos this way you can run a 'Your out? What the f*** do you mean, your out? Well how the hell do I get some?' side-mission, because in your last fight you fired two dozen of them.

Yes.

And yes.

Dumori, will you be doing this PbP, or will you use something like MapTools to provide terrain?

Will Edge be regenerated between bouts?

That might be a bit too often. Best character would be one with 7 or so edge and just use edge on every attack and defense for the bout.

hey, that was my plan! it might be back to the drawing board for me

Human + improved attribute + surge improved attribute + genetic optimization = 3/10 edge

I thought you had to take "lucky" quality for edge. of course, it's the same BP's.. so it doesn't matter. but it does make me wonder if the other things can improve edge(like genetic optimization)?

Hmm, yeah, you do have to take lucky... I'll have to read over the descriptions for the surge one and genetic optimization. I wouldn't be surprised if special attributes are excluded (Which edge is one, and would be weird if they didn't because that means you could technically use them on magic)

Edit: Yeah, both are physical/mental only. So best you could do is human with lucky to get 2/8

That's still an insane opponent if they get refreshed every single time they fight.

yeah, I figured with a max DP of 20, i'd only need 12 dice for a skill. I wouldn't even need cyber save for initiative

Well, how often Edge refreshes is fairly important, even without hyper edge characters. If they refresh per fight then having a high edge is going to be nearly a requirement to fight, because otherwise you'll just get beaten down with exploding sixes.

Edit: Also, I'm fairly sure that edge allows you to break the max DP of 20

Yep. If I were to make a recommendation, it would be allowing Edge to reset at the end of each "round" of matches, maybe. But even then it depends on how the matches are set up. I know Dumori is interested in more than just PC vs. PC. His original post mentioned going up against crazy monsters and NPCs. So it gets even more complicated if you consider all of that.

A point of edge per fight seems like a good rate depending, with possibilities for more based on RP or maybe 'pumping the crowd' or other things.

Some good points there. Let's see what Dumori says.

I get the sense that the contests would be along the lines of: "You are dropped into a pit. Another character in armour is thrown in with you. Kill him." This environment restricts the kinds of skills one might spend the 430 BP on. Infiltration might not be too high on the list, for example.

But the skill requirements would be different if the contest were something like: "You take off the blindfold, and find yourself in some kind of abandoned factory. Somewhere in here is your opponent. Find him and kill him." In this environment, Stealth Skills would be very important.

Knowing the target environment strongly affects Skill selection. Do we know?

I think the entire battle should take place mid air as a skydive. Your parachute is set up to open automatically when you opponent falls unconscious or dies, and cannot be opened any other way. People who attempt to avoid fighting by floating above their opponents will be zapped by shock collars. It'll be great fun

sounds like fun. Let's go.

If I play a ghoul, can he eat anyone he defeats?

Most likely.

Is their still a spot open. Because I have a character that would be PERFECT for this, I even had pit fighting in his backstory!
Link (No, not like in Zelda)

there should be. by all appearances, Dumori wants to handle this in small numbers, so large numbers of fighters just means more time between fights

And more victims contestants.

OK, after thinking about it, I am contemplating bringing in my mage hunter. A chromed out, surged Fomori martial artist with Astral Hazing. I haven't ran the numbers on this guy, but I had him make a cameo appearance in my last RL game. He wasn't involved in the fight at the bar, but when someone spilled their beer on him he put a stop to it. Of course with the background count he already hads the mage a little scared. I think this would be a perfect setting for the guy. He's big, mean spirited and if I build him right will be able take a hit. Now that I'm thinking about him I may even add Nasty Vibe just to give him that extra boost to intimidation. He won't be pretty but he should be able to garner a small following among the crowd.

Yeah, "won't be pretty" is only part of it. I see a bunch of monsters showing up in this ring. No Skills beyond those required to turn someone to goo.

"Trund hit --- Trund Kill!"

Um... this dice pool limit of 20 thing ... I assume it applies to Resistance Tests too?

I plan on making him more balanced than just a big dumb thug of a troll that hulk-smashes everything. I don't see myself as having a poorly min-maxed combat machine, but instead having an interesting character that can handle himself inside the ring. I am still going to give him some skills to handle himself outside the ring too. He just isn't going to be a face.

I can see some combat monsters being put into play and I hope I can keep up with them, but I prefer a more balanced character. If I am understanding Dumori right then this isn't just a bunch of combat scenes but an entire campaign with scenes outside the ring as well.

Yes but it might have some social conicens as well bodies tend to be wanted by kin/friends though just eat those internal goodies that no one needs to see. If you where a vamp drinking your victims blood would certainly fair game its drained out anyway. As consider this is a to yield as well fight so you wont just get your food from your "job" and infecting everyone you fight might make you unpopular.


It would be closer to the first option however the range of arenas would be wide.


I was thinking or refreshing after every round already with maybe some extra regen from good RP.


I'll be running t however each player want it to be run. I.e in non PvP fights if you want to play over IRC you can your use google wave fine by me same with IM PbP would tend to be slower but it is an option. On a related note I currently have 21 googel wave invites so if you want wave tell me your email so I can invite you also if you have wave and you want to game on it add me "saunders.mitchell@googlewave.com" All my IM infmation is on my profile. As for maps I'm not quite sure I normaly never use them or if I do an MS paint/photshop or and hand draw job normally works fine.

I didn't miss a question did I?

There's the 20 dice limit on pools question: Does it apply to Resistance tests too? I assume so, but just checking.

While I'm at it, I also wonder if the 20 dice limit is after all modifiers. So, for example, someone has BOD 8 and Armor 16, giving 24 dice to resist damage, but the AP of the attack is -3, so that makes 21, dropped to 20. Is that correct?

I'd imagine that's how it works. The cap may not apply to resistance tests though, vehicles alone would easily break the cap after all.

With resistance test you in dicey water unless its stated in the SR4A as the limti is 20 or attribute+skill there is no skill for resistance test thus either armor takes its place as there are many veicals with 20 armor and a high body. I'll look it up I might teven hose rule it as the only exeption.

Given the argument going on in a thread on the main discussion board, Dumori, you should probably specify what interpretaiton of Spirit Immunity (to weapons, elemental effects, etc.) you intend to use. One of the folks who is supposed to know, for example, has said that with the description in running wild, AP does not even count for seeing if you pentrate spirits hardened armor from Immunity to Normal Weapons. (AP counts for resolution only if you exceed the armor with out it. ) Other folks are using the itnerpretation I am mor eused to, that AP counts towards penetration, although burst modifiers don't.

Yours,
Joel

Are you limiting the 50 Karma traded for nuyen to the 18 availibility as well? I wasn't sure if you were just thinking that or if that if you had decided.

Also when it comes to astral hazing, my background is limited to under 1m. The listing for it states magic coming into the affected area, but I have been reading on the forums that there is some question as to whether a spell cast from outside a BC into a BC will be reduced in Force by 4. WHat is your opinion on this.

Why wouldn't it be? In order to affect you the spell has to enter an area with a BC count. Any spell that enters an area with a BC count has its force reduced by the BC. The other entertaining thing about astral hazing is that any melee adept that you fight will have their magic reduced by 4 in order to get close enough to strike you, so they'll get a bunch of their abilities burned out trying to hurt you.

I agree with you but I have read some arguing points in the forums and wanted to verify Dumori's position. I mean Astral Hazing will be a big boon in the ring if that is the case but if it isn't the lack of healing I am going to be able to get outside the ring is going to suck and would mean I'd want to take something else. Even with the small area covered I think the dislike frm magic users is going to be quite a penalty. But it will make roleplaying those situations interesting.

Well, I've not any of those threads before (Though I don't doubt you) but I don't see any real reason that spells wouldn't be affected besides game balance.

Should we post our characters? I know we may be pout into matches against each other but I would like to get feedback and I don't think posting our builds is going to make that much of a difference.

No reason you can't post it. I'm sure everyone will do their best to not use OOC knowledge in the game.

The quote from SR4A, p 61, is:Presumably, the "natural Attribute" is before implants and spells, etc. So, if as Dumori is thinking, we replace Skill with Armor, then the dice limit for Damage Resistance would be 2 X (natural BOD + Armor) or 20, whichever is higher. I guess with Drain Resistance, it would be 2 X (natural Drain Attribute1 + natural Drain Attribute2) or 20, whichever is higher.

It's not likely that Drain Resistance would go over 20, though I suppose it could, but Damage Resistance certainly could.

Yeah! That's right.

EDIT: After a bout or two, every character's tricks will be evident anyway.

Here is what I have so far. I know he's not specialized in any one style of fighting. I wanted him to be able to be dropped into any situation and not be majorly handicapped. He is just as proficient in all types of weapons. I am trying to figure out how to get him a little more cash and maybe some intimidation skill. I am trying to make him a more rounded character but I just ran out of BP. That is why I prefer Karmagen but that isn't here or there.

Ravensoracle, check Runner's Companion, p. 72. I believe your guy's BOD should be 10 always, not just for damage resistance.