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Traul
QUOTE (Karoline @ Dec 1 2009, 11:35 PM) *
I think you left out an 't or a negative somewhere.

You asked: Does a wall have to be vertical? Yes. Because the wall is not affected by gravity.

That is basically a contradiction.

It is an interesting question though: Are barrier spells affected by gravity?

You're right, sorry.
tagz
I remember having to explain to my players that you can't use Create Barrier to plane someone in half.

"No line of sight on their insides."
"What if I had x-ray vision?"
"Show me that vision enhancement on one of the tables."
"Damn..."
Stahlseele
QUOTE (LurkerOutThere @ Dec 1 2009, 11:59 PM) *
I'm at work right now. Does the text of the spell say that it can levitate or can float freely? Otherwise i'd have to determine both from a GM perspective and a legal on that unless specifically stated otherwise the barriers will still obey physics and therefore cannot just float free.

This also prevents people from brining down aircraft just by casting barrier.

Hmm, does an air craft carrier even NEED to do a crash test?
pbangarth
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Dec 1 2009, 04:03 PM) *
Hmm, does an air craft carrier even NEED to do a crash test?


Maybe not, but if an aircraft of small enough proportions were to fly into a barrier, it could certainly be affected.
Karoline
QUOTE (tagz @ Dec 1 2009, 06:02 PM) *
I remember having to explain to my players that you can't use Create Barrier to plane someone in half.

"No line of sight on their insides."
"What if I had x-ray vision?"
"Show me that vision enhancement on one of the tables."
"Damn..."


Well, couldn't you just cast it a foot above their heads and extend down? biggrin.gif

And it is called ultrawideband radar in arsenal wink.gif
AKWeaponsSpecialist
isn't it possible to multicast? Throw up two physical barriers (each attached to a different wall across the street, say), jump between the two.....





______]------ grinbig.gif * ------[___ cyber.gif
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
-----------------------------------------------

And then drop it.



_ cool.gif ____]**********[____ question.gif
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
++++|**************|++++
------------------------------------

EDIT: huh. looks like the formatting killed my illustration.

Edit2: I spent WAY too much time illustrating this thing. Looking at it now, I don't even know why
tagz
QUOTE (Karoline @ Dec 1 2009, 11:08 PM) *
Well, couldn't you just cast it a foot above their heads and extend down? biggrin.gif

And it is called ultrawideband radar in arsenal wink.gif

SSSSHHHHHH!!! Not so loud, they'll hear you. rotfl.gif
McCummhail
Wall: (n) an architectural partition with a height and length greater than its thickness; used to divide or enclose an area or to support another structure

The particular definition of the word in English does not necessarily differentiate between walls, ceilings and floors in the way mentioned.
Function is what divides them. Technically a ceiling or a roof is a wall with a purpose to set an upper bound or provide shelter and a room is multiple walls defining a space.

With these semantics (words, words, words!), it is feasible to use the spell for floors, ramps, vertical or slanted walls, ceilings, floors, etc.

For reference:
[ Spoiler ]

Also, Ice sheet doesn't specify that it has to be applied to the floor specifically
so Ice man antics are hypothetically possible.
Stahlseele
combine ice sheet with barrier and you are good to go!
Sengir
QUOTE (djinni @ Dec 1 2009, 10:53 PM) *
a basic understanding of ballistics

*beep* The neurons you're calling are not avaiable during Shadowrun sessions, please try again later.


Better for my forehead and the table wink.gif
Kurious
QUOTE (Nightfalke @ Nov 30 2009, 03:24 PM) *
So one of the characters in the game I'm running has a Reaction of 10, and is pretty much rolling 14-16 dice to react whenever anyone attacks him. I think I've hit him once with a bullet in the 3 sessions we've played, and that was with a wide long burst with an SMG.

I don't have a problem with his character whatsoever. He's the street sam, and he should be hard to hit. While I applaud his mastery of character generation, I really want to make things at least slightly difficult for him in a combat situation, preferably without turning the other characters into ground beef...

Thoughts? Ideas?

Thanks!


How does this guy have ten reaction before the reakt geneware? Just curious if he is infected or something.

Regardless, full auto is your answer. Those shooting (ideally with a good chunk of stabilization) can either add 9 damage or take away 9 from the opponents dodge. -9 dodge will make anyone squirm.
Karoline
QUOTE (Kurious @ Dec 1 2009, 07:09 PM) *
How does this guy have ten reaction before the reakt geneware? Just curious if he is infected or something.

Regardless, full auto is your answer. Those shooting (ideally with a good chunk of stabilization) can either add 9 damage or take away 9 from the opponents dodge. -9 dodge will make anyone squirm.


My guess is wired reflexes 2 and some high level of reaction enhancers, a sometimes overlooked cyberware (I know I overlook it quite a bit)
Stahlseele
Probably exceptional Attribute too. Maybe the Surge Attribute thingie too.
Ascalaphus
QUOTE
The caster can also form a wall with a height and
length equal to the spell’s Force.


This is a rather literal reading, but...

And I was just beginning to think of the possibilities for instant-ramps during car chases; or slides to quickly descend buildings, or sudden bridges, or, or..
Nightfalke
QUOTE (Kurious @ Dec 1 2009, 06:09 PM) *
How does this guy have ten reaction before the reakt geneware? Just curious if he is infected or something.


Move-by-wire 2 + Reaction Enhancers 2 = +6 reaction
Karoline
QUOTE (Nightfalke @ Dec 1 2009, 08:56 PM) *
Move-by-wire 2 + Reaction Enhancers 2 = +6 reaction


Wow, shows how much I overlook reaction enhancers, I thought they were only +1 each.
Ol' Scratch
They are. Move-by-Wires gives +2 reaction per level.
pbangarth
QUOTE (Karoline @ Dec 1 2009, 07:04 PM) *
Wow, shows how much I overlook reaction enhancers, I thought they were only +1 each.


They are. Move-by-wire is +2 each.

EDIT: Damn! Doc Funk must have been a nano-second faster!
Ol' Scratch
MBW 3, baby.
Kurious
QUOTE (Nightfalke @ Dec 2 2009, 01:56 AM) *
Move-by-wire 2 + Reaction Enhancers 2 = +6 reaction


Right, but the cap is usually 9. Unless you take one of the many listed and non-listed methods of raising it. I was just curious which method was being taken.

MBW is kind of funny that way, it is one of only two things that can stack with reaction enhancers, but since it gives 2 per level... you are almost certain to hit the racial cap early and not actually get all those l33t warez.
Jericho Alar
QUOTE (Dr. Funkenstein @ Dec 1 2009, 09:29 PM) *
MBW 3, baby.


MBW 4! .. wait. wrong edition... cyber.gif
The Jake
MBW also adds to Dodge, compounding this situation.

Reaction 10 is easily doable.
Enhanced Attribute (Reaction) + Metagenic Attribute (Reaction) + Genetic Optimisation (Reaction) can give you a natural Reaction of 9 -- that's before factoring in MBW or Reakt.

- J.
Karoline
Oh, totally misread MBW as wired reflexes. Getting too late and I didn't get enough sleep last night.
Kurious
QUOTE (The Jake @ Dec 2 2009, 02:48 AM) *
MBW also adds to Dodge, compounding this situation.


But only at the cost of your own action. A almost fair trade imho. biggrin.gif
Jericho Alar
QUOTE (The Jake @ Dec 1 2009, 09:48 PM) *
MBW also adds to Dodge, compounding this situation.

Reaction 10 is easily doable.
Enhanced Attribute (Reaction) + Metagenic Attribute (Reaction) + Genetic Optimisation (Reaction) can give you a natural Reaction of 9 -- that's before factoring in MBW or Reakt.

- J.


you'll need an unaugmented reaction >6 anyway to support the augmentation bonuses.
The Jake
QUOTE (Jericho Alar @ Dec 2 2009, 03:00 AM) *
you'll need an unaugmented reaction >6 anyway to support the augmentation bonuses.


If you can get Reaction to 8 at chargen (which is doable), then MBW2 + Reakt will bring that up to a 13. Assuming they stack that is (I can't recall to be honest).

- J.
Kurious
QUOTE (The Jake @ Dec 2 2009, 03:35 AM) *
If you can get Reaction to 8 at chargen (which is doable), then MBW2 + Reakt will bring that up to a 13. Assuming they stack that is (I can't recall to be honest).

- J.


Nitpick: actually that would be reaction for dodge (specifically) of a 14.

Hella expensive though.
Jericho Alar
QUOTE (The Jake @ Dec 1 2009, 10:35 PM) *
If you can get Reaction to 8 at chargen (which is doable), then MBW2 + Reakt will bring that up to a 13. Assuming they stack that is (I can't recall to be honest).

- J.


no reason to expect that they don't. -> MBW2 doesn't include any indication that it doesn't stack with other reaction enhancements.

that said, with reaction 8 at chargen you can only get to an augmented reaction of 12. - you *really* want reaction 9 (which gets you to 14? can't remember which way the augmented limits round.) I think a raw reaction of 10 is possible if you really stack the positive qualities though.

[edit]not that you'd be able to afford any other stats at all with a reaction that high.
The Jake
QUOTE (Jericho Alar @ Dec 2 2009, 03:53 AM) *
no reason to expect that they don't. -> MBW2 doesn't include any indication that it doesn't stack with other reaction enhancements.

that said, with reaction 8 at chargen you can only get to an augmented reaction of 12. - you *really* want reaction 9 (which gets you to 14? can't remember which way the augmented limits round.) I think a raw reaction of 10 is possible if you really stack the positive qualities though.

[edit]not that you'd be able to afford any other stats at all with a reaction that high.


9 is the highest base score you can get Reaction. Why would you choose to pay 25BP for that final point and not use Augmentations to push it to the augmented maximum of 13, is beyond me.

Unless there is a race that has a modified Reaction of 7+ (and there isn't by RAW) then no - no way to push it up to a raw of 10 I'm afraid. Also, with hard DP caps of 20 too, you're approaching diminishing returns when you factor in a decent Dodge and all the bonuses.

(Yes, you would be gimping yourself if you beefed up Reaction that high).

- J.
Glyph
Remember that the 20 dice hard caps are an optional rule for everything except social skills. And even then, it is 20 dice or double natural Attribute + skill.

The other posters are correct, though, that move-by-wire: 2 and reaction enhancers: 2 still can't get Reaction to 10 unless the character also has at least one quality that raises his augmented maximum.

To me, that dice pool isn't that big of a problem. Multiple attacks, area affect attacks, wide bursts, and any spell except for an indirect combat spell are all good for challenging the character.

Surprise, on the other hand, while remaining effective, is not this character's Achilles' heel. Surprise is resolved with an initiative test - guess what, with a Reaction of 10, he's going to be hard to surprise. Which is how it should be. Perception is an important skill, but it doesn't contribute that much to surprise tests. You get a +3 bonus, if you make the perception test, that's all.
Jericho Alar
QUOTE (The Jake @ Dec 1 2009, 11:32 PM) *
9 is the highest base score you can get Reaction. Why would you choose to pay 25BP for that final point and not use Augmentations to push it to the augmented maximum of 13, is beyond me.

Unless there is a race that has a modified Reaction of 7+ (and there isn't by RAW) then no - no way to push it up to a raw of 10 I'm afraid. Also, with hard DP caps of 20 too, you're approaching diminishing returns when you factor in a decent Dodge and all the bonuses.

(Yes, you would be gimping yourself if you beefed up Reaction that high).

- J.


I *think* infection would do it, I believe ghouls get a +2 minimum/maximum bonus.
AKWeaponsSpecialist
QUOTE (tagz @ Dec 1 2009, 02:02 PM) *
I remember having to explain to my players that you can't use Create Barrier to plane someone in half.

"No line of sight on their insides."
"What if I had x-ray vision?"
"Show me that vision enhancement on one of the tables."
"Damn..."


So, should someone (again, theoretically) be invisible, could Force Barrier *then* slice through them? I mean, since you're targeting the air, and they *just so happen* to be in the place where you're targeting........... they may be warping the light around them, but not necessarily the mana you're using for the spell. Would the invisibility spell become a weakness that caused a gory end to itself (and its caster)?
Medicineman
they may be warping the light around them,
Sorry for being a Nitpick ,but nobody/nothing is warping Light around them.
This is Wrong on more than one Level(and that's why this explanation for Invisibility is errattaed & erased).
Sorry ,but whenever I read this, I get a little Mad

with a little mad offtopic Dance
Medicineman
Stahlseele
And we don't like him getting mad. The eye-rolling and the froathing at the mouth are just such an unsightly occurence . . *runs like hell*
Furthermore, you could leave your natural Reaction at 1 and then buy it up to 9 with cyberware no problem. Aside for money/essence-cost.
The augmented maximum ATTRIBUTE is NATURAL MAXIMUM x 1.5. With SKILLS it's CURRENT LEVEL x 1.5. That's the whole difference.
Jericho Alar
QUOTE (Medicineman @ Dec 2 2009, 04:28 AM) *
they may be warping the light around them,
Sorry for being a Nitpick ,but nobody/nothing is warping Light around them.
This is Wrong on more than one Level(and that's why this explanation for Invisibility is errattaed & erased).
Sorry ,but whenever I read this, I get a little Mad

with a little mad offtopic Dance
Medicineman


what if my metavariant is Human - Very Small Black Hole? (ok, so that's bending and not warping...)
StealthSigma
QUOTE (Glyph @ Dec 2 2009, 12:43 AM) *
Surprise, on the other hand, while remaining effective, is not this character's Achilles' heel. Surprise is resolved with an initiative test - guess what, with a Reaction of 10, he's going to be hard to surprise. Which is how it should be. Perception is an important skill, but it doesn't contribute that much to surprise tests. You get a +3 bonus, if you make the perception test, that's all.


That all depends on if this is an ambush or not. The ambushing party will get a +6 over him, which will negate a significant portion of his reaction bonus to the check. There's no indicator whether the ambushers also get +3 for being alerted. A sniper would likely have around 14-15DP, mine has 16DP for surprise when ambushing for this check, which is competitive with the reaction whore.

Remember, Intuition factors into this....
Bignaffer
FA shotgun...

wide full auto burst with choke set on wide. -13 to dodge. he is getting hit. he may not take much damage though...
Stahlseele
Use Flechette Ammo.
Flechette Ammo that has been dipped in poison.
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