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Bleak
For lack of an SR4 game, I'm likely going to be playing SR3. Now, I've played before but that was years ago and only briefly with a non-awakened character. So while I know the basic rules, I'm missing a lot of the subtleties that make for an effective magician. Thus, I turn to you, dumpshock, for your assistance. I know the focus is on SR4 now, but I'm sure at least some here are veterans of earlier versions and can help me out.

I know the generalities of Chargen, namely that Magic is Priority A, you get 25 spell points, etc. It's the details of the build, attributes, skills, gear, and such, that I need help with. For instance, in SR4, it is often worthwhile to give up a point of magic for cyberware. Is the true same for SR3? What are good spells to have? Are there any unapparent advantages in Hermetic magic vs. Shamanism? How about Voodoo? These kind of things. Basically, I'm trying to make the best mage I can and avoid common pitfalls or mistakes.

At the moment, I have this idea of a troll houngan of Ghede (the image amuses me) but it's just in the preliminary stages and I'm not certain about the concept or its viability. I appreciate any assistance.




Glyph
In SR3, cyberware is easier to take, because you can take a geas for the Magic loss (assuming your GM has the Awakenings book), or have a power focus, which raises your effective Magic for determining whether a spell does physical Drain or not. Also, you could use the fetish or exclusive limitations for your high-Force spells, lowering their effective Force for Drain purposes. Keep in mind that these methods all have drawbacks (minor ones, but still something to keep in mind). On the flip side, it doesn't seem to be quite as useful - it's nice to have, but it's easier to do without it if you prefer.

Some spells are good choices in either edition - mana/stun/power bolt/ball, heal, improved invisibility and/or physical mask, levitate, some others. Mental manipulation spells are still good, but in SR3, they require a threshold of successes to work, so they aren't quite as easy. There are no indirect combat spells - they are classified as manipulation spells, instead.

Increase Reflexes is not success-determined, but taken at levels (+1 to +3), and even the +3 level is not that powerful - unlike wired reflexes, it only increases dice, not Reaction. So while the Increase Reflexes +3 spell and Rating: 1 sustaining focus combo may seem cheesy, it really isn't. It lets you go more than once a round, but it is really only the equivalent of wired reflexes: 2. Most street samurai will have much better initiative than that - at least you'll go before the grunts do.

Some other changes from SR4 -
Magic is not part of your dice pool, and there is no overcasting. Spells are bought at a set Force, and must be repurchased if you want them at a higher Force. So get them at the highest Force you will want them in the first place. Generally, any combat or resisted spell should be at 6, useful spells such as levitate can be 5, and others you can get away with lower than that. The Force of the spell is also the target number to resist it. This means that a Force: 6 spell is twice as hard to resist as a Force: 5 spell! Magical foci are easier to get at higher Forces, although for a full mage, this generally means taking Resources: B.

Drain is different between conjuring and spellcasting (for conjuring, you compare your Charisma to the Force of the spirit to determine what the Drain is - elves make good conjurers, because not only are they rolling more dice, but chances are, they are resisting less Drain, too). Note that trolls, while good at sorcery (they have a slightly smaller spell pool, but can cast and soak Drain just fine), are not very good at conjuring due to their Charisma penalty.

Shamans and hermetic mages are very different. Shamans summon on the fly, and don't have binding. Hermetic mages can bind elementals and place a number of them on standby, but they can't summon on the fly (except for watchers). Hermetic mages also tend to be a lot more expensive - they need expensive libraries and conjuring materials, while shamans only need a cheap shamanic lodge. Generally, spirits have a wider range of useful powers, while elementals offer more brute force and raw power (adding dice to your spells, etc.).

Trolls make decent combat sorcerers, but have more disadvantages as full mages, where their lower mental Attributes make them less effective when astrally projecting or summoning spirits. Still, a troll in a top hat would be pretty cool. cool.gif

Houngans are fun to play, but keep in mind that possession is not that effective until you can get invoking (to summon them in their great form - normal possession does not give you invulnerability to normal weapons as it does in SR4) and channelling (to have a small measure of control over the spirit). Unlike SR4, loa can do more than possess a host - they can also perform the same services that a watcher can, or can use their powers on behalf of the summoner from astral space.
Mercer
For Initiatve boosts, Increase Reaction is a good pair with Increase Reflexes, and since Reaction factors heavily into surprise tests in my opinion it's the more important of the two. (Having a high initiative roll is less helpful if you can't act on your opponents because of surprise.) The maximum bonus is the Force of the spell, so this takes a more expensive foci to bond.

Cyberware is usually useful for a magician in SR3, but it's probably not that useful at the start. If you are a troll you've got natural thermographic vision (and natural vision in SR3 has less penalties than cybered vision mods) and things like Flare Comp can be put into equipment. It may not be worth it to give up that point of Magic to start throwing in cyber, especially if you want to cast a lot of Force 6 spells without taking Physical Drain (and it will probably be awhile before you can afford Power Foci).

[ Spoiler ]


JaronK
First off, just use Gaesa to offset any magic loss. I wouldn't go nuts on that, but losing a point of essence to cyber is a fine tradeoff. With that said, the best gear for mages is cultured bioware, which isn't available at chargen. Trauma Dampeners and Cerebral Enhancement are generally the best things to get, though I love having a Sleep Regulator. A Datajack and Knowsoft Link with a DNI linked 10000MP optical chip is rather nice too, and shockingly cheap. If you don't have special vision naturally, then Cat's Eyes is advisable too. Other than that, there's little that's worthwhile considering you can quicken Increased Reflexes +3 quite easily.

As for spells, Force 5-6 Treat is certainly important, as is Force 1 Increased Reflexes +3. Remember to make many spells Exclusive (if you never plan to quicken them or use them in the astral) or Fettished (if you don't make them exclusive and don't think they're critical if you're separated from your gear). This gives much more flexibility as you can have far more spells. Even something as simple as Exclusive Force 2 Nutrition and Fast is free and wonderfully helpful in a pinch.

Detection spells are key, especially extended detect spells. Extended Detect Enemies at high force protects you from snipers and ambushes, in addition to immediately telling you if you've been spotted (since suddenly a lot of people turn hostile). Extended Detect Explosives is also great for locating possible shooters (remember that bullets have explosives in them) and Extended Detect Individual will let you instantly locate a potencial extraction target.

From the health line, as above Treat and IR+3 are great. If you plan to get quicken spell (you probably should) then the Increase spells are amazing as they can quickly shoot your stats way up, with Increase Willpower being the most useful.

And of course Stunbolt and Stunball are wonderful attack spells, though worthless against drones. Hey, you can't have everything. Don't forget Invisibility, Mask, and Phantasm.

JaronK
Snow_Fox
If you give up just a point of magic you can gain a smart link, chip jack and eye mods enough for thermographic eyes and optical boosts.

You should have at least one spell to hurt people- either combat or an elemental effect like lfame thrower and one first aid spell, like heal or treat, then it's really up to what sort of character you have B&E, knowledge, combat, mess with people's heads? I mean a false memory spell and stuff to change your clothes and appearance are great if like like to talk your way in, maybe invis and gecko hands if you you want to by pass the guards entirely. If you're more of a combat moster than various protection spells are going to work better than clairvoyance or cure disease spells.

Moirdryd
You can get away with a point of magic Drop for some Cyber or Bio.

You do want to have a good Willpower and Charisma. Also do not overlook a reasonable Body stat because at some point you will get shot. The Hermatic and Shamanic differances have already been listed. Dont get any spells with a force lower than 4 and Combat spells should always be 5-6. If you can afford it start with some Foci (No one has mentioned summoning Foci yet, but it's a good thing to get. Spell pool can help against spell drain and casting but there is no pool for Conjuring, only totem bonuses).

Skill wise Sorcery and Conjuring should be at least 5. Aura reading is good but not essential (as actual Assensing is an Int roll, Aura reading is a complementary skill). A decent close combat skill (almost certainly unarmed) is a must have and get Pistols (if nothing else) at around 4 (preferabley specialise for the extra die). Etiquette (Magic) 2(4) is a good way to go ( 3(5) if you can get it) and Negotiation should be around 3 (for getting those magical goods at a better price).

Knowledge skills, Magical Background is a must have. Talismongering is also a solid buy.

If possible start with whatever Conjuring stuff you need and / or circle and lodge requirmenets. Even if only at a low force they will help out before you can afford the bigger ones.

Also, Buy some good armour.
JaronK
I forgot to mention: mental stats should be 6s (you could afford a lower Int but I wouldn't recommend it). In fact, a 7 Willpower is best due to the way the Increased Attribute spells work (an edge will get you there, or being a dwarf would do it). 6 Sorcery and 6 Conjuration are expected, though you might consider Conjuration 5 (Summoning 7) as Summoning is the main thing you'll do. You want one F6 attack spell, but plenty of spells work just fine at low force (you don't need Extended Detect Explosives at higher than F1, for example).

Stat priority should be Willpower, Charisma, Int, Quickness, Body, Strength. Body is pretty critical if you want to live, but Quickness says how much armor you can wear so that's key too and Quickness also contributes to combat pool and reaction, which helps at least as much.

JaronK
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