Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: RL gun copying Shadowrun: individualized safety.
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
Critias
THE LINK SAYS:

QUOTE
The watch this guy's wearing was made by Armatix, the same company who designed his high-tech gun. Poor fellow can't ditch the ugly accessory though, because the $10,000 weapon won't fire without it.

Basically the gun is disarmed and a red LED lights up unless the corresponding watch is close enough to send a wireless signal. While I really don't see a high demand for it, Armatix's .22cal weapon will be shipping next month for 7,000 euro, which is just under 10k in Washingtons. The watch is probably included.


We're getting another step closer to personalized safeties, guns only firing when the Ares security guy (with the chip in his head) is using it, etc, etc. Piss-poor ugly stuff in the photos on the link, of course, but the concept is kind of cool.
Summerstorm
Bwahahaha... 10.000? For ten grand it better shoots either lasers or pure stable awesome. But really. That thing is worthless. And how much range would it have? Could you shoot it with left, if the watch is on the right arm? Could a mugger or such disarm you and just shoot you, while being just close to you?

But really 10.000 Bucks? Maybe i should built something like this... profit margin of what, 9.500 if i buy the the watch and the gun and cram them into a bit more plastic and have a cheap bluetoothsignal and some 4 cent- LED?

Method
And chambered in .22? Could they make it any less worth $10k?
Stry
Old news SW was working on this 10 years ago. I first heard about on the History channel TV show Tales of the Gun.
Daylen
sorry I like my firearms reliable and not with electronics or sensative chips in them.
nezumi
For real? $9,600 to install an RFID chip reader in a gun?
Daylen
dont forget the parts to interface the reader with the fireing mechanism. and a lobotomy for wanting something so stupid in the first place.
Stry
Its not a bad idea for police.

It varies from year to year, but in a given year the number of police officers fatally wounded by their own guns makes up a sizable number of all officers killed.
Rystefn
QUOTE (Stry @ Jan 30 2010, 04:05 AM) *
Its not a bad idea for police.

It varies from year to year, but in a given year the number of police officers fatally wounded by their own guns makes up a sizable number of all officers killed.


Mostly shot from very close range, though... What's the range on that RFID thing? It might work to keep your kids from shooting each other while you're at work, but only if you bring the watch with you, which I highly doubt... and only then if your kids don't know how to bypass computer gizmos, which they're likely better at than you.
Critias
QUOTE (Stry @ Jan 29 2010, 11:05 PM) *
Its not a bad idea for police.

It varies from year to year, but in a given year the number of police officers fatally wounded by their own guns makes up a sizable number of all officers killed.

Until you factor in (a) the range at which most of those officers are killed, as was already mentioned, and (b)...until you ask an experienced cop just how many times he's lost a watch in a scuffle. The last thing an officer needs is for his fancy gizmo (ugly) watch to go flying, and then be standing there with a worthless paperweight in a gunfight.

I just think it was a pretty interesting article, with some pretty butt-ugly pieces of hardware in it. It's also interesting that it's a watch, which most people wear on their off-hand wrist, which also brings up range issues on the RFID thing. Can you have the watch on your left wrist and shoot right handed? What about getting used to having the watch on the "correct" wrist, and then getting hurt and needing to shoot off-hand?

I think it's just an idea that'll have to get refined through miniaturization...and cybernetic implantation, eventually. And, for Pete's sake, it'll have to be more than a .22. Seriously.
Ryu
Armatix Homepage

Might be more useful for the European markets, where the police officer is usually the only one to carry a gun in the first place. Also, the concept would work for any type of weapon.
Sengir
Might be interesting for Tasers, which already have an electronic firing mechanism....but electronic safetys on normal pistols?
Karoline
QUOTE (Stry @ Jan 29 2010, 07:26 PM) *
Old news SW was working on this 10 years ago. I first heard about on the History channel TV show Tales of the Gun.


That's what I was thinking as I read this "Didn't I see a history channel special on something like this a few years ago?"

The thing is: yes, this thing sucks big time, but it is a step towards great things.

Price will go down as it becomes more common, but what you really want is to have RFID chips implanted in your hand(s), and have the gun only operate if it is within about 5 inches of a chip. That way the only way someone could steal it from you and use it on you is if your hand is still on the gun, and that way you can't lose it in a scuffle unless they cut a big chunk out of the palm of your hand.

Imagine if -all- guns had a system like this, and that the RFID chip could be shut down from some central government place. Dude goes crazy and starts trying to shoot up his office? Shut down the chip and all he has is a paperweight. Someone steals your guns? Well, they're basically worthless without the chip.

Now, I know it would be possible to bypass a system like this, but it could be made difficult. Might be a little 'big brother'y but it could save alot of lives from: people shot by their own guns when being robbed, disgruntled employees trying to take out their office mates, children finding the gun and playing with it, and might also go a long way in reducing illegal gun ownership due to the difficulty of having to strip out the extra parts for the RFID scanner.

Doubt this will happen though, as it would cost a fortune, and there are still millions of guns out there that wouldn't have this system.
nezumi
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 09:27 AM) *
Imagine if -all- guns had a system like this, and that the RFID chip could be shut down from some central government place. Dude goes crazy and starts trying to shoot up his office? Shut down the chip and all he has is a paperweight. Someone steals your guns? Well, they're basically worthless without the chip.


1) RFID doesn't work like this.
2) You're suggesting that, in the case of an attack, the police circle in, identify the perp, look up his firearm records, get the necessary paperwork and shut down the firearms, all within half an hour? (And if it takes more than half an hour, it's not likely to be much use.)
3) Of course, this also sort of violates the intention of the second amendment. Not a concern if you aren't in an enlightened nation that recognizes the right of self-defense against an oppressive government, but for the rest of us...
Karoline
QUOTE (nezumi @ Jan 30 2010, 10:15 AM) *
1) RFID doesn't work like this.
2) You're suggesting that, in the case of an attack, the police circle in, identify the perp, look up his firearm records, get the necessary paperwork and shut down the firearms, all within half an hour? (And if it takes more than half an hour, it's not likely to be much use.)
3) Of course, this also sort of violates the intention of the second amendment. Not a concern if you aren't in an enlightened nation that recognizes the right of self-defense against an oppressive government, but for the rest of us...


1) Okay, maybe it isn't the RFID that gets shut down, but I'm sure you could shut the gun down somehow.
2) Thirty minutes? "Oh god, joe from accounting has gone crazy" "Yeah, we need Joe's gun shut down" "Okay, done." Sure, it won't always be this easy, but I'm guessing there isn't going to be a single sheet of paperwork needed to get the gun shut down. Afterwards there may need to be a pile of it, but not before. Kind of like a cop doesn't have to file any paperwork to fire his gun, but he'll have to do a stack of it when he gets back to the office.
3) Not really. It doesn't violate the second amendment any more than gun control laws do. I'm sure NRA members everywhere will disagree, but the fact is that it isn't any different than denying sale of a gun to particular people, or the fact that you have to wait X number of days before purchasing a gun.
Edit: P.S. I like how you equate a lack of gun control to an enlightened nation.
Daylen
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

definitions during the relavent time period:

Militia - every ablebodied man, its defined in detail in the militia act of 1792. but it basically means every free man.

notice it says free State, before independance it was not a free State and england was big on gun control in the colonies. also the founders were kinda big on the govt and state being of the people and by the people.

Its in the bill of rights which is the limits on what the federal govt can do. How else can shall not be infringed be interpreted? gun control by the feds is going to infringe in some way on that right.

Why is it bad to infringe on that right? after the civil war the south tried to stop blacks from arming themselfs so they would be helpless. The National Socialist parties (Nazi parties) in europe sure liked to limit who could have firearms and what kind and all that progressive stuff, then they started genocide. Same in Russia. Perhaps if you doubt the importance of an individual right to firearms uninfringed you should try reading more history and getting direct accounts that have not been watered down to take away how things really got so bad.

If colonial gun control would have been successful there would be no United States of America, just repressed people around the globe. Also remember the american revolution inspired the french to revolt against thier oppressive regime, which scared the crap out of royals throughout europe and could be argued to have lead to less oppression.

On the gun in question, would police officers want to buy it out of thier own pocket? I know I dont want to pay more taxes for that kinda stuff.
Daylen
And when America was founded it was the most enlightened nation of the time and maybe ever. That whole democracy thing.

"It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything. " Stalin
"Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas."
Stalin

Perhaps you think Stalin's Russia which murdered more jews than Hitler's Germany is enlightened?

individual freedom is enlightened. Oppression and control by a govt go hand in hand and is the norm of human history.
Karoline
You're quite obviously ignoring the fact that gun control exists in the US as well.
Wounded Ronin
FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT!



Okay, on topic, I think that in practice a safety scheme like this even in the scheme of a European nation would probably just interfere with officer readiness. I read in a Vietnam War memoir how at one time there was an accident with a grenade where one person's loose grenade killed a truckload of soldiers (or was it Marines?) so the military admin in a particular area put safeties on grenades that made them unable to explode. But one day the North Vietnamese did a surprise attack on the camp where the author was and he couldn't throw any grenades because he couldn't get the safety device off. I think he managed to scare a couple enemies by throwing non-detonating grenades at them.
Critias
This early in development, WR's right -- it's just one more thing that can go wrong and disarm someone when they need their weapon most.

And, really? Yes, having some central government figure that can turn off any gun it doesn't like does infringe on the Second. It's hard to bear arms if Uncle Sam can turn them off when he wants to. "Shall not be infringed."
Sengir
QUOTE (Daylen @ Jan 30 2010, 05:12 PM) *
The National Socialist parties (Nazi parties) in europe sure liked to limit who could have firearms and what kind and all that progressive stuff, then they started genocide.

The Nazis instituted the most liberal gun laws Germany ever had since 1871. Longarms and ammo were avaiable over the counter for everybody over 18, handguns just required a trip to the city hall. Still nobody shot Hitler, neither did huge insurgent armies push back the Allies.


But still, the idea of a remote killswitch for anything sounds extremely impractical to me.
Karoline
QUOTE (Critias @ Jan 30 2010, 12:26 PM) *
"Shall not be infringed."


QUOTE
* Federal Gun Control

The first major gun control initiative was enacted by Congress in 1934 which regulated the sale of fully automatic firearms like machine guns. This legislation was followed in 1938 by a new federal law which required gun sellers to be licensed and which prohibited persons convicted of violent felonies from purchasing guns. No further legislation was passed by Congress until 1968. The Gun Control Act of 1968 regulated imported guns, expanded gun-dealer licensing requirements, and expanded the list of persons not eligible to purchase guns to include persons convicted of any non-business related felony, minors, persons found to be mentally incompetent, and users of illegal drugs. In 1986, federal legislation established mandatory penalties for the use of a gun in the commission of a federal crime. Also prohibited were "cop killer" bullets capable of penetrating bulletproof clothing. In 1990, legislation was passed which banned the manufacturing and importation of semi-automatic assault weapons.

In 1994, Congress passed what has been regarded as the most comprehensive effort at national gun control. The "Brady Bill" named for the press aide who was seriously injured in the assassination attempt on President Reagan imposed a five day waiting period for purchasers of handguns and required local law enforcement authorities to conduct background checks of all purchasers. The Supreme Court held that the background check provision was unconstitutional because it infringed on state's rights. Presently, the law has been revised so that the background check is instantly accomplished by gun dealers through a national computer system and there is no longer a waiting period. Also in 1994, Congress passed a ban on certain types of assault weapons. This ban expired in 2004. By a narrow margin , the Senate voted to extend the ban but the House did not take action and the ban was allowed to expire. Efforts to revive the ban have been unsuccessful.

* State and local gun control

Guns are additionally regulated by state and local legislation and there is little uniformity among the states. (Click to see map) The major regulatory issues are:
o Child Access Prevention laws

Many states have passed legislation making it a crime to leave a loaded weapon within easy access of a minor.

o Concealed weapon laws

About seven states prohibit concealed weapons. Many others require an individual to show a need prior to obtaining a license to carry a concealed weapon. In over half the states, all non-felons are able to obtain licenses to carry concealed weapons. Only one state, Vermont, has no licensing or permit requirement.

o Regulation of private sales to minors

Under federal law, minors under 18 are prohibited from possessing guns and minor under 21 are prohibited from purchasing guns from dealers. However, unless regulated by state law, minors 18 and over are able to freely purchase weapons through private sales. Currently 21 states either prohibit or substantially regulate this secondary market for minors.

o Regulating all secondary market sales

Over twenty states regulate all secondary sales through registration or licensing requirements. In the states that have no such regulation, the secondary market allows minors and criminals to easily obtain weapons. This is the so-called "gun show" loophole.

o Ban on "assault" weapons

In 1989, California was the first state to ban certain types of automatic weapons. More extensive bans have been enacted in New Jersey, Hawaii, Connecticut and Maryland.

o "One handgun a month" laws

Many purchasers (felons and minors) have circumvented federal law by purchasing firearms from individuals who have legally made bulk purchases of handguns. Four states (South Carolina, Virginia, Maryland, and California) have laws that limit legal purchases of handguns to one a month per buyer.

o Ban on "Saturday Night Specials" and other "junk guns"

These are small, easily concealed lightweight guns which are unreliable but have appeal to criminals because of their portability. A minority of states have laws which regulate the purchase and use of these weapons. Additionally, local laws in a number of cities outlaw the possession of these weapons.

o Preemption

The majority of states have laws which prohibit local authorities from passing local gun control ordinances. These "preemption" laws have been supported by the opponents of gun control. Officials in cities which are able to pass such ordinances, such as New York, credit their existence to a dramatic reduction in violent crime.

o Waiting periods

Although background checks are no longer necessary under federal law, about half the states still use state data in addition to federal data to conduct background checks prior to issuing a handgun permit. Eleven of these states impose waiting periods as well.


Wow, that's quite a few laws that infringe on a person's ability to own a gun.
Daylen
In germany Jews were not allowed to have firearms. Thats a big infringement.

I agree Karoline. In the last century progressives took over the law schools that produced judges and lawyers. They got into govt positions and started making catastrphies so they could limit individual freedoms on the premis that they knew better. The single worst attack on the constitution was probably when they stopped teaching in law schools that the constitution should be interpreted as the founders did. Instead they started this nonsense of precedence, which allowed gradual misinterpretations to become huge over time. There is supposed to be one way to change the constitution, Ammendments, not a change of how its interpreted or through federal code changes. Trick is it takes 2/3 or 3/4 majority to do so, I forget which one. Course thats alot harder to do than just getting 51% of the vote now and then to appoint a new judge.

Daylen
oh and there is no "gun show loophole". That implies that at gun shows you can buy something without a nics (National Instant Criminal Background Check System) check. This is not true without breaking the law. If there was a gunshow loophole I would be happier though and not want it closed anyway. Unfortunetly every time I buy at a gun show they do a nics check as they are legally required to do:(
nezumi
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 01:04 PM) *
Wow, that's quite a few laws that infringe on a person's ability to own a gun.


Yes.
Sengir
QUOTE (Daylen @ Jan 30 2010, 07:22 PM) *
In germany Jews were not allowed to have firearms. Thats a big infringement.

Yeah, people who were no longer considered citizens (or even human beings) could not own firearms. I'd dare to say that was the least of their problems....
Daylen
oh dont forget the 86 ban on machine guns. previously a license was needed but in 86 the progressives slipped in an ammendment to the law that disallowed issuing new licenses so pre86 lisenced machineguns and even trigger groups are worth thousands or tens of thousands of dollars and no new ones can enter the market.
Tanegar
QUOTE (Daylen @ Jan 30 2010, 01:29 PM) *
If there was a gunshow loophole I would be happier though and not want it closed anyway. Unfortunetly every time I buy at a gun show they do a nics check as they are legally required to do:(

Really? You're really fine with the idea that a violent felon can go to a gunshow and buy whatever kind of gun he wants? You're really going to take a stand that people who have committed violent felonies should be allowed to own firearms? Really?

Really?
Daylen
If its so unsafe for them to have firearms (which I would agree with) then they should either NEVER be let out of jail untill they are trustworthy enough to have firearms or executed. otherwise its just the path to having a prison state instead of prisions in the state. or perhaps deport them to sea or to a country that would accept them.
Tanegar
Who decides when they're "trustworthy?" Who decides what the legal definition of "trustworthy" even is? Definite (as opposed to indefinite) prison terms are the principal defense against a prison state. You serve your time, you get out. That doesn't mean you're not a felon anymore, it just means you've paid your debt to society.
Critias
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 01:04 PM)
Wow, that's quite a few laws that infringe on a person's ability to own a gun.

You're right, it is. Which is all the more reason to fight, tooth and nail, against more such laws (like some silly "RFID chip in every single gun, that Uncle Sam can turn off when he wants to"), isn't it?

QUOTE (Tanegar @ Jan 30 2010, 02:48 PM) *
Who decides when they're "trustworthy?" Who decides what the legal definition of "trustworthy" even is? Definite (as opposed to indefinite) prison terms are the principal defense against a prison state. You serve your time, you get out. That doesn't mean you're not a felon anymore, it just means you've paid your debt to society.

If your debt is paid, why are your freedoms still limited? It seems like it should be an either/or -- either you're safe enough to be let out of prison, having served your time and paid or debt, or you should continue to have you rights infringed and be monitored by the state. If you're not safe enough to let out of a cage, why are you out of your cage? It's the same issue I have with, for instance, Sex Offender Registries. If they're still such a danger to kids we need to keep track of them, publish their information, monitor them, etc...why aren't they still in prison?
Karoline
QUOTE (Tanegar @ Jan 30 2010, 02:48 PM) *
it just means you've paid your debt to society.


I always find it funny when people say that. Prisons after all cost money to run, and thus it can be taken that a prisoner has actually increased his debt to society rather than decreased it.

QUOTE
If your debt is paid, why are your freedoms still limited? It seems like it should be an either/or -- either you're safe enough to be let out of prison, having served your time and paid or debt, or you should continue to have you rights infringed and be monitored by the state. If you're not safe enough to let out of a cage, why are you out of your cage? It's the same issue I have with, for instance, Sex Offender Registries. If they're still such a danger to kids we need to keep track of them, publish their information, monitor them, etc...why aren't they still in prison?


That's an exceedingly black & white view of things. Felons that have been let out of jail are assumed to be more or less 'normal' and 'safe' but they've already proven they can do X, so there is no reason to make it easy for them to do X again.

Kind of like how a pet snake or something is safe, but that doesn't mean you wrap it around your neck a couple times. Or even more tame, a pet dog is safe, but you don't go sticking your hand in its mouth.
Daylen
trustworthy - society is willing to let them have firearms go anywhere they want without notifying anyone, get any job they are qualified for.

"The term police state describes a state in which the government exercises rigid and repressive controls over the social, economic and political life of the population." wikipedia

"a country that maintains repressive control over the people by means of police " princeton

People should either be free like anyone else with full constitutional rights, full federal and state privileges; or they should be in a prison sitting out their sentence. If they have paid their debt to society why punish them more by taking away their rights. otherwise you are suggesting that they can never be trusted as a full member of society, in which case they should not be allowed back into society.
Daylen
so felons are subhuman? perhaps we should stop them from breeding with humans then because of bestiality laws.
Karoline
QUOTE (Daylen @ Jan 30 2010, 03:01 PM) *
so felons are subhuman? perhaps we should stop them from breeding with humans then because of bestiality laws.


Wow, you're good at grossly misinterpreting what I said. No, what I said was that there are more than two states of existence: Willing to let someone hold a gun to your head, and dead. Personally I think 99.99999999999999999999% of people fall somewhere in this range. There aren't many people I would trust to hold a loaded gun to my head. That doesn't mean they should be in prison or dead.

An ex-prisoner basically falls into that category, I don't really trust them with a loaded gun, but at the same time, I don't think they need to be languishing in prison. After all, there isn't really any way to tell for sure from prison if a person will go out and be reformed or just commit another crime, thus they are given a chance to go out and be reformed, while at the same time making it harder for them to commit another crime by limiting their rights to things like gun ownership.
Daylen
I'm not misinterpreting anything I'm anticipating a eugenics argument based not on race but some other criteria.

Saying one group can have full rights and another can't is wrong. Otherwise they are not inalienable rights.

and I dont trust anyone with a gun to my head. the moment a gun gets pointed at me there is a big problem. The business end of a firearm should only be pointed at a target to be shot weather that is paper, an animal or a human.
Karoline
QUOTE (Daylen @ Jan 30 2010, 03:15 PM) *
I'm not misinterpreting anything I'm anticipating a eugenics argument based not on race but some other criteria.


Like the fact that someone killed 14 nuns?
Daylen
that should be a death sentence. perhaps I have not been clear enough.

If someone shows they are a threat to society and prisons cost to much I do not think they should be released I think they should be deported or executed. To do otherwise leads to that list of violations on the constitution and tyranny.
Wounded Ronin
In my hypothetical ideal fantasy every US citizen is forced to attend intensive firearms training in school. Only that will put to rest all the persistient myths that lead people to try and make gun control laws, like the idea that hitting your target is easy, or the idea that having full auto or burst fire mode on your rifle somehow morphs it into Excalibur.


Actually, I wonder what the skill level of criminals such as gang members is with their firearms. I always wondered what a "realistic" benchmark should be for the skill level of random gangbangers in shadowrun. I am primarly a SR3 person, so in the context of SR3 rules would they all be defaulting to Quickness due to not having formal training, or would they have an actual Pistols skill? In that case what would the Pistols skill be? My hunch was always to make it 2, again citing the lack of formal training. OTOH that means that Lone Star running around with Pistols 5 are pretty damn hardcore.
nezumi
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 02:58 PM) *
That's an exceedingly black & white view of things. Felons that have been let out of jail are assumed to be more or less 'normal' and 'safe' but they've already proven they can do X, so there is no reason to make it easy for them to do X again.


1) I've never been to prison, but I can still 'do X'. Should I not be permitted to have a gun?

2) Here's the conflict. An ex-con has a right to self-defense. In fact, an ex-con is MORE likely to need to be defended than the general pop, because he's more likely to live in a bad neighborhood, to have left behind bad debts, etc. So are we saying that this person, who has done his time and we're pretty sure is 'safe' and 'normal', isn't permitted to fight back if he's attacked? Sounds a little clockwork orange to me.

3) Does anyone here really believe that limiting civilian access to weapons has had any impact on the availability of weapons, or the violent crime rates?
Penta
Can I inquire as a plaintive reader what the hell any of that has to do with SR?smile.gif
Critias
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 02:58 PM) *
I always find it funny when people say that. Prisons after all cost money to run, and thus it can be taken that a prisoner has actually increased his debt to society rather than decreased it.

Which is why I think they should be made exponentially less comfortable (and as such expensive)...but it's really neither here nor there, I guess.

QUOTE
That's an exceedingly black & white view of things. Felons that have been let out of jail are assumed to be more or less 'normal' and 'safe' but they've already proven they can do X, so there is no reason to make it easy for them to do X again.

If any part of our society should be exceedingly black & white, isn't it our justice system? You're either guilty or innocent, right? So you're either still in prison (because you're still being punished and you're still a menace to the public), or you're not. This half-assing it crap we do now infringes on the supposedly inalienable rights granted to citizens and endangers the general public by letting habitual re-offenders back out on the streets. It's a lose/lose, and all while bloating government (and spending our tax dollars) with the staff and security necessary to keep tabs on all these guys. If they're not safe to let back out on the streets without probation officers, databases, and limited rights...they're not safe enough to let back out on the streets.
nezumi
QUOTE (Penta @ Jan 30 2010, 09:34 PM) *
Can I inquire as a plaintive reader what the hell any of that has to do with SR?smile.gif


Actually, I think it has quite a lot to do with the Shadowrun, and specifically cyberpunk philosophy. Firearms are an equalizer. In Shadowrun, the greatest victory for the corporations is that they can now arm their own militaries and police forces. Within a decade, they become a totalitarian state. Those who have power have it at the barrel of a gun. Free men are free only because they are armed.
Method
And freedom from government is the the only freedom.
Wounded Ronin
QUOTE (Method @ Jan 31 2010, 12:03 AM) *
And freedom from government is the the only freedom.


Goddamn, you just made me imagine Janis Joplin jumping around in Shadowrun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FMhnl0__Vo
Rystefn
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jan 30 2010, 02:27 PM) *
Imagine if -all- guns had a system like this, and that the RFID chip could be shut down from some central government place. Dude goes crazy and starts trying to shoot up his office? Shut down the chip and all he has is a paperweight. Someone steals your guns? Well, they're basically worthless without the chip.

Now, I know it would be possible to bypass a system like this, but it could be made difficult. Might be a little 'big brother'y but it could save alot of lives from: people shot by their own guns when being robbed, disgruntled employees trying to take out their office mates, children finding the gun and playing with it, and might also go a long way in reducing illegal gun ownership due to the difficulty of having to strip out the extra parts for the RFID scanner.


Actually, this would accomplish pretty much nothing. Constructing a firearm from scratch is pretty trivial. This is seven or eight hundred year old technology by now. Far too late to keep it under wraps.
kzt
And it's not hard for an organized covert group to make some ammo. Like a few million rounds of 9mm.
Tanegar
QUOTE (Method @ Jan 31 2010, 12:03 AM) *
And freedom from government is the the only freedom.

I hate to sound like a broken record here, but:

Really? You're really fine with absolute anarchy? You're really going to take a stand that taxes and laws and police departments are so abhorrent that Mad Max-style every-man-for-himself guy-with-the-biggest-guns-makes-the-rules lawlessness is preferable? Really?

Really?
Zen Shooter01
This product has oodles of amazing stupidity in its design.

As has been mentioned, at what range from the watch does the weapon function? Too short, and you can't shoot with your off hand. Too long, like a meter or so, and you're still getting shot by someone you're in hand to hand combat with who's gotten your weapon away from you. It does little to prevent theft of firearms, because the thieves will just steal the watch, too - making what might have been a burglary without any face-to-face between homeowner and perpetrators into an assault.

It does prevent your spouse, teenager, platoon mate or fellow officer from using the weapon in an emergency, though.

And why design a whole new gun? Why not just add this device to a popular and proven model (Beretta 92F, Glock 19, 1911), and thereby keep down development costs and increase public acceptance?

And why in f!cking frogtown does it cost $10,000?

an earlier poster suggested that all firearms with a feature like this could be shut down at will by the government. As a gunslinger and Second Amendment advocate, that idea is absolutely revolting. Thanks for coming out tonight, Mr. Orwell. Stand up, take a bow.
Daylen
Absolute anarchy... I've thought about how that would work and it would probably be more like ancient Rome than mad max.

But I dont think anyone is going for that here, I could be wrong though. Freedom from govt is what the constitution was supposed to grant. Just enough fed govt to keep foreign powers from taking over but not enough fed govt to do much of anything that would stifle freedom or get into peoples lives. Just enough state and local govt to keep the federal govt from overstepping its bounds and keep general order. How far we have come from freedom in that last century of progressivism.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012