And I'm gonna laugh.
You probably tell kids that there's no Easter Bunny, too, don't you.
Full Version: Recovering Essence?
mfb, you are gonna shatter some poor bastard's world-view.
And I'm gonna laugh.
You probably tell kids that there's no Easter Bunny, too, don't you.
And I'm gonna laugh.
You probably tell kids that there's no Easter Bunny, too, don't you.
{2nd edism} so you are saying you have no soul?{/2nd edism}
Actually mfb one could argue essence is just the game mechanic of how functional a persons brain is. At least that is the scan I get from M&M. The way they described essence loss was very similiar to psychosis. Seeing as how I have several friends who have recovered from psychoses by the very methods I detailed, it is not out of line nor as ludicrous.
the line between psychosis and dain bramage is very thin, and very blurry. given that psychological disorders are not mentioned anywhere as causing essence loss, i'd have to disagree.
it's also worth pointing out that the definition of essence in M&M is completely batshit insane. for the love of pete, what does bone lacing have to do with your neural system? and even if you can create a link between bones and your brain, why oh why for the love of god does titanium lacing cost more essence than plastic?
it's also worth pointing out that the definition of essence in M&M is completely batshit insane. for the love of pete, what does bone lacing have to do with your neural system? and even if you can create a link between bones and your brain, why oh why for the love of god does titanium lacing cost more essence than plastic?
Especially when the human body does accept titanium with minimal fuss. Or why you're life force (which is what vampires supposedly feed off of) is affected by your neurological energy when a fish, who has almost no neurological energy when compared to a much larger creature like a human, has the same amount of Essence.
Essence is a purely metagaming attribute with only superficial (and more often than not, silly and illogical) secondary mechanics that use it. It's intended to limit the amount of benefit you can get from implants and to help restrict magicians from having their cake and eating it, too. About the only other time it comes up is when dealing with an Essence-draining paracritter, and that would fall under my definition fo the silly and illogical clause. I have no idea why they try to shoehorn it into something more than what it is instead of making the reprecussions for life-draining more appropriate (you're not even weakened afterwards, you just can't get as much cyberware installed -- what the hell?), but... whatever.
Essence is a purely metagaming attribute with only superficial (and more often than not, silly and illogical) secondary mechanics that use it. It's intended to limit the amount of benefit you can get from implants and to help restrict magicians from having their cake and eating it, too. About the only other time it comes up is when dealing with an Essence-draining paracritter, and that would fall under my definition fo the silly and illogical clause. I have no idea why they try to shoehorn it into something more than what it is instead of making the reprecussions for life-draining more appropriate (you're not even weakened afterwards, you just can't get as much cyberware installed -- what the hell?), but... whatever.
So what are you suggesting life draining critters should eat? Maybe life draining critters should eat boxes off your condition monitor?
dammit, you people made me think about how essence loss works. now my brain's on fire again. i'm losing essence.
My favorite explanation of what essence is, is that it's the connection, or similarity between physical form and the true astral pattern. That's why one arm is one arm is one essence, no matter if it's off a troll or a chihuahua. Vampires and such have too feed on this connection-energy in order to restore their own. When the connection is too weak, the body and astral form slip apart and you die. Like a starving vampire or a cyberzombie. This explanation helps me wrap my brain around essence, and cuts down on the number of embolisms, I find.
It also helps to explain why more effective cyberware impacts essence more, even when the amount of cutting is the same, simply because it changes your abilities more and makes you more different from that idea.
It also helps me rationalize why a pacemaker doesn't impact you, since it's keeping you functioning normally and it's operation is totally transparent. You can't even tell that you have one.
Natural changes to yourself, like raising a stat through karma, change the physical and astral patterns together, and so don't impact essence.
That's how I saw it explained once, and apparently that explanation is pretty cool with Earthdawn pattern magic, or something (I don't really know, I've never played ED).
It also helps to explain why more effective cyberware impacts essence more, even when the amount of cutting is the same, simply because it changes your abilities more and makes you more different from that idea.
It also helps me rationalize why a pacemaker doesn't impact you, since it's keeping you functioning normally and it's operation is totally transparent. You can't even tell that you have one.
Natural changes to yourself, like raising a stat through karma, change the physical and astral patterns together, and so don't impact essence.
That's how I saw it explained once, and apparently that explanation is pretty cool with Earthdawn pattern magic, or something (I don't really know, I've never played ED).
| QUOTE |
| So what are you suggesting life draining critters should eat? Maybe life draining critters should eat boxes off your condition monitor? |
I like this idea. Do you think they should eat boxes off the low end (i.e. give you permanent minimum damage) or off the high end (i.e. after eating 4 boxes, the character would go straight from a moderate wound to deadly)?
Probably off the high end.
Well everyones view is going to be different. In my campaign bonelacing takes no essence but the cost is outlandish (20 times as much and it has to be repaired at least yearly). And I have a special muscle augmentation program that cost no essence either again it is 15 times the normal price and requires clonal tissue. The again I also allow the use of paired cyber Smartlinks with no penalty except those for using two weapons. Of course I make them resist stun damage for firing submachine guns with both hands at once. I also use Recoil Compensation based on strength, and a reduction in essence cost if you get a pair of arms or pair of cyberlegs. I also added a power for Physical Adept to Astrally project, have always allows sorcerers and Conjurers to Astrally perceive, and I even allow Enchanting Adepts. My campaigns have Immortals, Crows, Pretenders, and at one point a free City Spirit. My final sin I created an edge that allows a person to have more cyberware. For 5 points he has 1 essence slot that does not count against him and for 10 it is a 2 essence slot. Some magicians have used this and it seems to balance out because the 5 or 10 points could have bought them so many other things.
| QUOTE (Moon-Hawk) |
| So what are you suggesting life draining critters should eat? Maybe life draining critters should eat boxes off your condition monitor? |
Actually, I would completely restructure Essence from the ground up and make it a much more important attribute. I would also restructure the Essence cost for implants and anything else that modifies it.
For starters, Essence would affect all aspects of your health, especially your ability to heal and resist disease (rather than targeting Body or using Bio Index for this, though Body would be used to resist the damage in the first place). A character with an Essence of 1 would have a hard time healing without extended medical assistance whether damage was done by implantation or a vampire's kiss. This would also make implants that heal more effective on higher-Essence individuals than quasi-cyberzombies, making it not quite a "duh" to load up to the brim with implants.
I'd also make Essence recovery possible, but a lengthy process. Maybe not as lengthy as I currently house rule, but it would still be measured in months such as (6-Essence) months per point.
Implants would have an Essence cost based upon their direct impact on your body rather than their game benefit. Neurological versus physiological impact would not be an important difference between the two; a datajack would be minimal while bone lacing would be significant. Price, Availability, Street Index, and possibly a new Surgical TN would reflect superior implants over inferior implants.
I'd lose the whole Alpha/Beta/Delta grades for implants as well and instead introduce a "brand name" set of rules into the game mostly because I prefer the color and possibilities that provides over the rather humdrum nature of the standard system. It also allows for greater control over different implants rather than a universal -20%/x2 or whatever modifier. For example, Zeiss-brand cybereyes might be the luxury model of cybereyes with a higher cost and free accessories, while another brand name might have better Essence costs and lower Availability but higher Surgical TN. It's more complicated, but it's a welcome complication in my opinion.
Blah blah blah. I'm a glutton for pain and more work than is really needed. But that's the general idea of where I'd start redesigning all of that if I had the desire or the payoff was worth it.
Moon Hawk, your explaination of Essence was great, the best I've ever heard and does definately gel with Earthdawn's view of magic and Shadowrun's as well. I hope you don't mind, but I've cut and pasted it into notepad - why let a gem pass you by? :o)
I've ruled that Essence can be recovered, however it requires a reasonable amount of time - something like 1 month per 0.1 recovered. I do allow it to be sped up though, through major phenotypal modification gene therapy. It's something like 4 months in a gene tank and costs around 100k and costs 0.6 Bio Index (which they must be able to pay for before the essence recovery) and then they need to 'heal' from a deadly wound without using magic.
I've only had 1 PC ask to use these rules, since he wanted to remove some cyber and take some bio in it's place.
Oh and I never allow recovery of magic. Just because you repair your body doesn't mean you've repaired your pattern's ability to act as a conduit for mana.
I've ruled that Essence can be recovered, however it requires a reasonable amount of time - something like 1 month per 0.1 recovered. I do allow it to be sped up though, through major phenotypal modification gene therapy. It's something like 4 months in a gene tank and costs around 100k and costs 0.6 Bio Index (which they must be able to pay for before the essence recovery) and then they need to 'heal' from a deadly wound without using magic.
I've only had 1 PC ask to use these rules, since he wanted to remove some cyber and take some bio in it's place.
Oh and I never allow recovery of magic. Just because you repair your body doesn't mean you've repaired your pattern's ability to act as a conduit for mana.
Er, isn't his explanation the former official one?
~J
~J
| QUOTE (Kagetenshi @ Oct 27 2004, 12:37 PM) |
| Er, isn't his explanation the former official one? |
Which would probably explain why I've never heard it before :o)
Could very well be. I don't remember where I got it, exactly. But it seems to make sense (at least to me) with all the different aspects of essence, and whenever they add something it seems to jive pretty well.
Ah, the old "Aural Template" theory. I need to make a note to write that down somewhere for discussion purposes, I think I had half a Fragment dedicated to Essence Ponderings...
Good stuff. Personally, I combine the 2nd Ed theory with the 3rd Ed theory.
Good stuff. Personally, I combine the 2nd Ed theory with the 3rd Ed theory.
There you are. I was waiting for you to show up and tell these people I'm not a total loon. Do you know where that theory originates, AH?
In addtion to the removal of the offending cyber and a long time of recovery I could also see permanent burning of Karma Pool at a sharp ration, maybe 2:1
| QUOTE (Moon-Hawk @ Oct 27 2004, 02:21 PM) |
| There you are. I was waiting for you to show up and tell these people I'm not a total loon. Do you know where that theory originates, AH? |
First came into being in Tir na nOg as I recall; then was reprinted in Cybertechnology to help explain cybermancy and one or two other places, I think.
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