Howdy folks.

I'm looking to build a character for a tabletop game I play in, in the aftermath of my Hacker finally dying (hurray for surviving longer then anyone else).

Leaving the world of the Matrix, I wanted to branch out into the Astral. I am holey unfamiliar with the Awakened Rules (I know the basics, and have piece-mailed some ideas together), and require a bit of your assistance.

I am using the Karma-Generator System from RC, and I have 621 Karma to play with in my character creation (Basically coming in at half of my old characters power, blegh).

I want to create a Magic Character (Preferably a Charisma Caster like Shaman), that can operate as both the Magic Support for the group, and a Face Character.

Now, here is where things get tricky. I really want to play with the Possession Rules. I want to basically create a character that calls in spirits to possess him, so he becomes better, and adaptable to different situations. Unfortunately, the only thing I know about Possession is what is outlined in Street Magic and Digital Grimoire. I keep seeing references to Greater Form Spirits, Homunculus, and other neat things... but I have no idea where to find them, or how to implement them into the character.

So, now I come to you. If you were building a character with the above thought process... knowing the rules (like I know all you folks here on Dumpshock normally do), how would you do it? Where would you allocate points? What skills would you take? What initiate metamagics would you get? What spirits would you use? How would you use them? Reference pages for things, and get back to me.

Just want to go ahead and say thanks to anyone who can help me out with this!

One question are you using the printed RC rules where attributes cost x3 or the so far only German errata where it is x5.

Other than that start with ELf go with Voodoo(street magic also where possession is really described), it gives you both the possession you want and is charisma based. That is the basics.

Now the real question is how min-maxed cheesy do you want to be.

We are using the errated Rules, where you do x5 Multiplier.

Race and Tradition were what I was going to go with, as it sounded like a nice combo.

As for how cheesy? Well... hmm... I'm going to say I would like something powerful, with a topping of cheese. Basically I do want cheese used, and I want it to be a badass... but I don't want anything that any reasonably minded DM (who enjoyed powergaming and min/maxing himself to a certain degree) wouldn't throw out simply because it's to much.

Now... that is not to say that you can't lay down some ground work for the supreme-cheese, so that I might see how slyly I can slip it past. haha.

Thanks!

Question: Why 621? If you were comming in at half your previous character's power rating wouldn't that be 750 karma (base from Runner's Companion Karma Creation system; Starting Karma, pg. 42) + half earned karma? Or is it half starting power? Which whould be 375 karma.

The 621 is throwing me...

We started as 575 Characters. We have amassed 94 Karma throughout our adventures. So.. cut it in half to be 48.

And you get... 623.

Woops. Cut myself 2 Karma there.

Basically we started at 575 due to the DM wanted to make us feel like the lowest of the low, that way when we crawled our way out of the muck and gained karma and did jobs, it felt like more of an accomplishment. Instead, all it has served is to tick us off and a variety of other things.

So yeah... Hope that explains!

Karma to Spend: 623

Half of 94 is 47, actually. So 622 to spend?

Now you have me thinking (on at least 4 cylenders anyhow). If you go with a non-Charisma tradition, take a troll with a high body, and use posession you could:

Use shapeshift into some unholy combat critter (normal version of one anyway) like a lion or tiger, then get posessed. Between starting with the critter's stats (I recommended using a troll becasue there are limits on shapeshift based on your body vs the body of what you want to turn into) + net hits on the spell + Force of your possing spirit.... you would have monster stats.

If you're thinking of using spirits as a magic skillsoft/combatsoft equivalent, Voodoo is definitely the Tradition to go for. See if you can homebrew a suitable mentor spirit with your GM centered around Ogun as a warrior, giving you a bonus to guardian spirits, or Obatala giving you a bonus to task spirits. Then specialize in summoning and (optionally) binding whichever one you decide to go with. That'll throw you an additional 4 dice total to whichever set up you decide to go with. If you're willing to drop 6 on both summoning and magic, you could conceivably summon up a force 9 guardian spirit straight out of chargen. I'd hate to see the opposition after runing into that

To increase your drain dicepool, consider getting a trauma damper and/or learning the martial arts maneuver "focus will."

I'm a failure at math, sometimes I wonder how I got through SR3.

You are correct. 622 to spend.



Sounds neat, but I want to stick to a Charisma Tradition. Thank you, though.



I am thinking of doing just that. Creating the Mentor Spirit will be easy, as the DM has already given me free reign to do it.

If you could give an example of what sort of Mentor Spirit outline you think would be good for this, plus how you would work with the task spirit (as I am not sure what you are talking about directly in correlating Skillsoft/Combat Soft and Task Spirit) I would appreciate it.



Probably go with Focus Will... I would like to stay away from any sort of 'Ware.


Question 1: If you are possessed by a Spirit, do you still have access to your own spells on top of the Spirits critter powers?

Question 2: If you are possessed by a Spirit, do you get to freely use their powers... or do you have to use a Service once they are in your body to have them do things? Such as... I use a service to be possessed by a Spirit, and I have three services left. Once they are inside of me, and can I just go about normal with the power boost... or do I need to use a service for each action I might wanna take while they are in me?

Keep it coming guys... I highly appreciate it.

What you propose, I believe only works if you can have the spirit sustain then spell then possess you. A sustaining focus might work, but I would think it would deactivate once your magic rating is replaced by the spirit's (which is what prevents you from sustaining the spell yourself).

I think that you'll find this thread very helpful:

Possession FAQ

This helps out immensely! I've been searching all over the forum for this exact thing. Thank you!

EDIT: Still, it does leave me with wanting to know more about what spirits I should use for the possessing. How to build them, etc.

Hmmm. Task spirits get as an optional power a physical or tech skill, equal to their force rating. Which means you can pretty much allow a laos to ride you with Infiltration if you need to be sneaky, or with Driving if you need to serve as the getaway driver. Seduction or negotiation if the situation calls for it, Or pretty much any other physical skill you can think of.
Likewise you could instead run with a guardian spirit, and take a combat skill, which they receive as an optional power. Which means you're otherwise spell cast built frail meat body can do a fair amount of swinging in combat when you have Ogun riding you.

As for handcrafting a mentor spirit, here's a couple of ideas I might run with in this case:

Mentor Spirit Ogun

Ogun is the traditional warrior. As such, Ogoun is mighty, powerful, and triumphal; yet, also exhibits the rage and destructiveness of the warrior whose strength and violence can turn against the community he serves.
+2 combat spells, +2 to dice rolls for Guardian spirits
Followers of Ogun can reflect the most violent tendencies of Voodoo ecstacism. While in combat, a houngan of Ogun must resist a tendency to attack both allies and enemies. Will + Charisma test (threshold 5) to prevent the character from attacking randomly for 5-net hits combat rounds while being ridden by a guardian spirit.

Mentor Spirit Obatala

Obatala is the king of the white cloth, the owner of all ori. He is the creator, of the earth and of men. As such he is master of secrets and skilled in many tasks.
+2 manipulation, + 2 to dice rolls for Task Spirits.
Obatala is cool and pure, the "last to attack". Houngan of of Obatala must make a will+charisma check (threshold 3) in order to engage in any violence while being ridden by a task spirit

Mentor Spirit Samedhi

Samedhi is the one who digs the graves, who dances the dead, and who excites lust. For anyman who is sick, they will not die if Samedhi refuses to dig their graves.
+2 health spells, +2 spirits of man
Baron Samedhi is noted for disruption, obscenity, debauchery, and having a particular fondness for tobacco and rum. While ridden by a spirit of man, houngan of Samedhi are considered top have the negative qualities Uncouth, and Addiction Tobacco/Rum.

As for the questions, the first is easy. When you're possessed, you are the spirit. You don't have your spells or skills available, but you have the full range of the critters skills and powers.

Question 2 is a bit tricky. When possessed you are the spirit, not the character, who will have different motivations from the character. If you run with a general, "help me succeed in what I am doing", your GM might agree that any critter power used in that service is acceptable. Or the may require a service anytime you get into combat, or even anytime you're making a skill check (all of these have been suggested in discussions with my GM). My recommendation is to discuss with your GM what he would consider fair use, but as a guidelines, assisting on the run itself is a single task, and if unforeseen circumstances (gangers/corp security show up, an extracted scientist needs to be protected) that require you to give a the spirit another order, that will also count as a service.

The Possession FAQ actually explains it all fairly well, however I appreciate it!

Now that I understand how it works... I'm trying to figure out the best way to build it with the Karma available to me. Anyone have suggested designs?

Damn 622 is hard without some serious cutting.

The closest I can get is 620, but no contacts, knowledge or money yet. I guess you can drop the charsima to 6 for 35 karma to blow on those 3, but damn this is tight.

Body 3
Agility 2
Reaction 3
Strength 1
Charisma 7
Inuition 3
Logic 3
Willpower 4
Essence 6
Magic 5

Elf
Magician Voodoo
Mentor
Spellcasting 5
Summoning 5
Counterspell/combat 4(6)
Binding 2
Ritual Magic 2
Banishing 2
Influence 4
Arcana 2
Enchanting 2
6 Spells
620 total so far.

I've made characters on less points but the house rules capped stats before racial mods at 3 with one stat at 4. So it was easy. When you have free reign on stats I want that 7 charisma and the 5 willpower I dropped to 4 so you have 12 drain dice out of the gates. Under a BP system I'd cheese out the focus rules since it is so cheap to bind them that way, karma no such luck.

Were you using 3 or 5 karma per attribute? Also free metatypes? I'm just curious because I'm giving it a try but my cost is coming up a lot lower than yours.

Elf 30 points, x5 for attributes, double karma cost on the qualities. Which reminds me you can take negative qualities to cover what I was missing.

This is correct on how we do things for our building. So you are on the right path.

Here is something I've played around with... if someone could correct any obvious errors, please do:


Body 3: 25
Rea 2: 10
Cha 7: 110
Int 2: 10
Log 2: 10
Will 5: 70
Magic 6: 100
Initiate 2: 18
Edge 3: 25
T: 378

Conjuring 5: 50
- Summoning (Guardian): 2
- Binding (Guardian): 2
Influence 4: 40
- Con (Fast Talk): 2
- Negotiate (Bargaining): 2
Sorcery 2: 20
Arcana 1: 4
Assensing 3: 14
- Aura Reading: 2
Astral Combat 1: 4
Enchanting 1: 4
T: 156

Binding Foci 3: 9 - 30
Sustaining 4: 8 - 40
Counterspelling 4: 12 - 20
T: 29

Nuyen (90,000): 36


This build leaves approximately 23 Karma for spells though... which is only, what, 4 spells, and no extra gear. Thoughts? Reworks?

the most obvious one: you missed Agi

i'd drop Cha to 6 and increase Rea, Int. ini 4, seriously?

as written there's an error with your edge...
plus your missing the most important shadowrunner skill of them all: Perception

I actually didn't throw in the cost for Elf, either.

As for Agility, I didn't miss it. I purposefully dropped my Physical Stats, as this character is all about augmenting himself with Spirit Possession. I know if I have higher physical stats, it'll mean I don't need that high of Force spirits, but that's fine for a tradeoff for me.

What's wrong with the edge? First point is free, second point is 10, third point is 15, so it's 25 right? Oh, I see.. I marked 2, being that I'm going to 2, not increasing by 2. I'll fix that in an edit.

As for Perception, you are not wrong about that... need to figure out how to slide it in. Dropping Charisma might be the way to go.

I'm away from my book right now, and stricken with stupidity, but what is Ini, again? I know Elves start with a 2 in it... but it's not Initiative, right? Because Initiative is a derived attribute, like Judge and Composure?

I'll just leave this here:
http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=31853

Initiative is derived stat, but it's intuition plus reaction. With your build right now it's 4.

Right now, I'd suggest dropping magic to 5, and raising both conjuring and sorcery by 1, dropping charisma to 6 and raising intuition to 4. Also raise will to 6.

Drop the sustaining focus and counterspelling focus to 3. Drop enchanting and arcana entirely, you won't need them out of the gate nearly as much as you need perception, which should start at 3.

That should free up a little karma, and keep most of your dice pools at the same level they were previously.

I need Enchanting for preparing vessels for possession. However, you might be right in not immediately needing that.

I'd never get a binding focus. I will always save for the power focus instead of the specialized ones. Also normally you can't specialize skills that are in groups. It is a GMs call on this since it is a replacement character but the normal char-gen rule is you'd have to wait in game to break it out of the group to specialize. I'm not a fan of the rule but there it is. With a logic two only 2 of your focuses can be active at the same time. I understand where you are coming from with the physical stat dump so given that you are being allowed to initiate from the get go that should usually be fine, though I'd try to bump them up in game especially reaction and body. Also an intuition of 2 is harsh since it is there for both perception and assensing, but at your point level it is probably fine. Not everything can be good when you are below the normal starting point.

I don't see any qualities listed but they may be in the math. Basically with magician and mentor that is 40 points, though you can gain up to 70 in negative qualities, so net 30 unless you want another positive quality. Surged 10 point giving you more flaws and 20 points in surge qualities like maybe increasing your max charisma, agility, or willpower by 1. I include agility just because if its max becomes 8, the max augmented becomes 12 which matters for possession types.