As an alternative to armor stacking, i was hoping i could get an analysis of high defense tactics/builds. Here's the way i see it;

-Method 1-
High reaction stat. What's the max reaction a person can get? 9 is the aug max but then you can add 2 other things to increase that (gene mod and something else i believe), so that's 11 max?

-Method 2-
High dodge/gym/unarmred/weapon skills. Add on top of that skill enhancing bioware/cyberware/spells/adept powers such as synthacardium, reflex recorders, improv combat skills, combat sense. I like to call these buffs.

-Method 3-
High modifiers against the enemy. Debuffs baby. Decrease stat spells, thermal smoke, mist, shadow, invisibility. The best debuffs are the ones that help you and harm the enemy.

Ultimately a person wants to borrow from all 3 methods, correctly and effectively stacking them.

13 is the highest for normal people, 15 for ghouls and vampires. 6+Genetic Optimization+Exceptional Attribute+SURGE=9 Base, which equals 13 augmented. Vampires and ghouls have 8 base, but cannot take gene therapies, so it's 10(15) for them.

Cool, then that's 1/3 of the equation done


13 (no infected) reaction+method 2+method 3= profit

I'd like to propose that the max debuff would be -6 (blind equivalent). I mean if you are invisible and throw a thermal smoke nade they can only get a -6 to hit all other vision mods aside. Invisibility +mist would stack but would reach the max -6 for visual tests, correct?

so
13+x+(-6)=profit

Don't forget to add to your buffs section Tactical Networks. 6 drones with sufficent sensors, + a rating 4 TacSoft program will yield 4 dice for defense.

Also don't forget the Adept Power "Combat Sense".

EDIT: D'oh! Didn't see you mention "Combat Sense" under buffs. Still, 9 natural reaction, +3 from Improved Reflexes, +6 from Combat Sense, and your adept is pretty hard to hit, even before he dodges.

-DrZaius

The Reakt geneware is .4 essence, 30k and provides a +2 modifier to all tests using reaction to defend.

good

13 reaction
+
combat senses +6 (adept power)
improv reflex +3
Suprathyroid Gland +1
reaction enh +3
combat sense spell +hits
increase attrib spell +hits
+
6 thresh mod adjustments from various blinding spells, equip, etc

Now this is in terms of no active defense (ie full defense). I'm guessing the Reakt geneware +2 modifier to all tests using reaction to defend is for full defense rolls only. Correct me if i'm wrong, so i can add it in the equation above.

would +4 be the max? or.. how does that work? for active defense or passive??

The 13 reaction is the augmented cap, i.e. Improved Reflexes and Reaction Enhancers cannot further enhance it. Basically, you're limited to:

13 reaction
+
Combat Sense +Rating
Reaktin +2
Combat Sense Spell +Force/net hits

where can i find this?

Geneware should be in Augmentation.

I knew i forgot something, same idea on the skill caps (1.5)

You get +N where N is the rating of the tacnet, provided that you have 3 members that can contribute 2N channels of sensory data.

And you get +N to "anything you can justify."

Isn't stealth a form of defense? Just throwing that out there. They can't hit you if they can't see you.

Covered:

It would take some karma gen and initiation but here we go. And I'm going with hypothetical situations here, mainly getting max hits on a spellcasting.

Mystic adept. Magic 9(8[reduced for 'ware]) Adept5/Mage3

Reaction: 13
Combat Sense: 8
Tactsoft: 4
Reakt: 2
Combat Sense Spell: (Overcasted) 6
Deflection Spell: (Overcasted) 6

Not sure if they all stack, but there ya go. thats 39 dice to avoid attacks. You're rolling more than most people are allowed to roll on an attack.

They aren't overcast, unless you're playing by FAQ.

You forgot Method 4: Cover.

I prefer a troll.

For method 2 bonuseseses, you also have a choice of:

Dodge: move-by-wire 3. Total 3

Gymnastics: synthacardium 3, enhanced articulation. Total 4.

Unarmed/blades/clubs/<other melee skill>: Weapon focus. Total (at character creation, with restricted gear) 4.

Any: Improved ability(adept power) and reflex recorder(for appropriate skill) but these are capped at 1/2 your skill rating, total.

Aptitude(quality) helps give you more of the improved ability, etc.

So skill 7+(3~4)+(1~6 [EDIT:1~4, 1/2 skill rating]) added to defense when using full defense.

The idea I played around with was a R8 Pixie Adept, with combat sense 6, Improved Ability (Dodge) 3, Imrpoved Reflexes 1, Dodge 6, Edge 6

That gives you:

Ranged Dodge: 15 dice
Ranged Full Dodge: 24 dice

Melee Dodge: 24 dice
Melee Full Dodge: 30 dice

But there are probably better dodge builds out there.

MBW bonus is capped in the same way, because it specifically adds to the Dodge *rating*.

I've read that on the adept power and I think I remember reading it as a general rule for skill rating enhancements, biut I can't find it anyomre. You got a quote for me? As far as I can tell atm, the 1.5x skill rating only applies to the Adept power.

[pulls out Augmentation...]

Well I'll be, It DOES say rating. Thanks. I still like the MBW for biker duels, though

ya, when you get into skills there's no real limit since you could potentially level up your skill with enough karma after chargen. That's why i wanted to stick to passive defense (not full) with chargen limitation at around 400bp. We haven't even touched on the semi passive defense aka two weapon style. Technically it's full defense but passive as well since you can attack without leaving full defense.

Granted, I think the rules are insufficiently aggressive about stacking bonuses. The very rare "+ to rating" is heavily limited, while the very common "+ to test/DP" is not only (mostly) unlimited, but also allows for those split-pool abuses. :/

D2F never believes me.

Weapon foci only add dice to melee attacks. They don't help with defense. Sad but true. Personalized Grip though adds +1 to all melee combat rolls.

I don't quite get that calculation. Reflex recorders and the adept power both create a augmented skill rating. This is capped at 9 (1.5*maximum natural skill) or 10(augmented rating +1) from Aptitude.

Considering that there are hard limits for that and you can reach those easily at chargen, so thats not true.


See the skills chapter of the BBB, its there at the beginning.

I never said I don't believe you. I even think I read it myself. I just can't find the rule that limits rating modifiers anymore, other than the one for the improved ability adept power. That's why I was asking for the quote, to put myself at rest =)


Awesome, thanks! P.118 SR4A. Finally found ti again. No clue, how I was able to miss it about a dozen times in a row, though.
Anyways, thanks Chummer!

For your convenience:

Interestingly this rule does not talk about maxima but actual skill ratings. This would make the limitation the same as for the adept power.

Much obliged =)

Yes skills unlike attributes are limited to current rating*1,5.

someone please fit this inside a 400bp package for me.