i keep hunting for ways to give the hacker something to do in a fight, besides being a spotter for incoming trouble.

and one idea that came to mind is the unplug virus. This especially as it can be delivered by way of a trojan. And said trojan can be virtually anything.

so it got me thinking, the hacker readies a trojan that looks like some kind of update or urgent message or something. Then at time of break in, he sneaks a matrix perception glance at the security node so to have a access id to spoof. Then when trouble shows up, he uses spoof to trigger a download of the trojan readied earlier, that then infects the target with the unplug virus.

the only potential problem with the virus is the typical problem i have with hacking during combat, and thats the time aspect. The virus have a extended test with a time between roll of 1 minute. Thats far to long for a combat scenario. So i was thinking, how about a combat variant, maybe unplug+, that cuts the time between tests down to 1 round.

its just to bad that a agent or cybercombat cant be used to infect a node with unplug, as it would make for a nice weapon against AR using hackers that one cant touch with black attacks. Sure, one can force a node to crash, but that puts the hacker out of the game for only the number of rounds it takes to get the node back up and running, and then he is right back.

Have you ever looked at Frank Trollman's house rules for the matrix? He came up with lots of good ways to make hackers more useful -- in and out of combat.

See http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...amp;hl=trollman

frank's rules go a bit beyond most house rules, he rewrote the entire matrix rule set.

if that's an option, and you like his rewrite, no problem. if that isn't an option, or you don't like the rewrite, then have you considered having the trojan download *before* the fight and remain dormant until it receives a signal from you? if it looks like something that should be downloaded anyways by the security, then you don't have to worry about the guards going all crazy over the download (assuming it even shows up to them, the system might not even bother letting them know it's downloading).

then, when the fight starts, you can just use a simple action to issue a command, and the virus is no longer dormant. of course, that means you still have the rest of the combat to look for things to do, but if you're playing a hacker there's no reason you can't be prepared to at least spray suppressing fire at your enemies. or manage a few recon drones, or work on manipulating the environment (taking over the facility's security cameras, turrets, doors, etc).

Indeed. Virus insertion is a great slow-hack option. Hack-on-the-Fly is just one (often last-ditch) way to do things.

thanks but no thanks.

Hacker is like Face; they are very useful, but generally speaking, there is almost nothing that Hacker/Face skills can contribute. Both archetypes have actions that are either isolated (VR) or operate on minute intervals, so there's not a whole lot either can do within their primary focus.

Of course, building a character with several secondary focuses is easy and generally encouraged by the rules, and there are several low-cost options. Has the Hacker looked into the First Aid skill? Or picking up flash-paks, smoke grenades, etc and throwing them? Or basic rigging with a doberman or roto-drone?

Besides, do you really want to play a game where the building you are sneaking into can detect your cyberware and turn it off within a few seconds? It goes both ways.

Uh, what? In 2070, there's almost nothing the Hacker *can't* do. From your explanation, I guess you meant 'in combat'?

Agreed. Skillwires are a hacker's best friend, and his commlink is his wife.

Hobgoblin: Another possibility would be to have security employe drones much more often that they currently do in your campaign. Taking care of the drones would be the hacker's schtick.

Oh, SNAP, the commlink is hooking up with the skillwires! That bitch!

Honestly, I think skillsofts are waaaaay too expensive to be worth it.

Pirate them, duh. You're a hacker.

Yeah, but with degradation they are expensive to maintain.

So wait you mean to tell me I've been doing this wrong the whole time?

That's true: it's not like they're a null-cost. But, not prohibitive, depending on your group's karma-to-nuyen award ratio.

No, Hack-on-the-Fly is a perfectly good option. I just meant that it's not the only option. Burglars case the joint before the heist, right? You *could* just smash-n-grab, but you could also bribe the guard, sleep with the receptionist, pre-plant gear, etc.

What are you guys smoking? I think you are thinking of the Corrupt program, which does indeed take a minute to delete stuff(but gets the backups)

Hackers can shove down peoples throats in combat. Its an entirely valid tactic for an AR-hacker. See Viral Warfare on unwired 121, and keep in mind that Viruses and Trojans are different types of programs.

Viruses are Hacking+Edit(virus ratingx2, 1 pass) test to force-feed someone your code.
Worms are special agents with the Replicate autosoft
Trojans can be installed manually with a Hacking+Edit(10, 1 pass) test if you already have access to a node. (page 123)
They're all Malware, but they have different rules for using each type.

So, uh. Yeah. Rules as written don't need any changing.

no, i am talking about the unplug virus, page 122 of unwired.

the corrupt program is not able to take down the whole os of a device, but the unplug virus can.

and the infection test your referring to is to infect a program inside a node the hacker have already penetrated via some kind of hack. and even after infection there is still a need to run the program that got infected before the virus starts to do anything. and if you have hacked in anyways, it will be quicker to use a attack program to force a system crash (not that something like a smartgun will stay crashed for long as its low stats mean a quick reboot). What i am looking for is a fire and forget way of trying to take down the equipment of a enemy, basically the hacker equivalent of firing a pistol, or maybe even a stun/power-ball kind of mass gadget attack.

this without having to spend several passes hacking each individual target while the sammie or mage is busy laying down hurt.

but at the same time i dont want to deploy the nuclear option of replacing the whole rule set, unlike some former freelancer did...

Well, I would think a matrix powerball would be pretty unbalancing.

Really, is there anything stopping you from pirating another more updated copy of the program once the one you have degrade to a point where you're unhappy with it? Like most people do with photoshop, windows, any other expensive prgram that you can update.

Well, it's still expensive. You're paying 10% of the retail, so after 20 months, you've paid full retail. Personally, that's worth it for me.

For almost any active skill... yes. Oh no! The Troll ganger's coming at me with a parking meter! -clicks on blades:6 autosoft and whips out a switchblade- "Bring it tiny!"

Indeed. "Tank, I need to fly a Huey." "I know Kung Fu." Awesome.

I do like the idea of pretending to be a newbie by leaving your smartlinks and weapons apparently accessible to outside hacking, but with nasty viruses and databombs and stuff lurking for anyone trying to hack it, all the while you're actually skinlinking or fiberconnecting to the gun. It shouldn't be too hard right? Your Smartgun is actually hidden or slavelinked, but you add a module that would seem like the smartgun access, since how easily could you tell the signal opening is coming from my gun, or that piece that kinda looks like a laser sight or conventional light on my gun?

The question, the real question, isn't "what can hackers do in combat", but "what are hacker type actions that could be theoretically be done in combat without breaking the game?" Answer that, and you know what hackers can do in combat.

Letting a hacker take out someone's cybernetics or turn off their guns or whatever is more-or-less within the hacker theme, but it's horribly horribly broken, and unfair to players with 'ware - now adepts get even more of an advantage, and hackers wind up needing a "counterhacking" skill that works like counterspelling.

Speaking generally: in combat, a character can deal damage, heal/prevent damage, apply bonuses to himself or others, apply penalties to enemies, remove bonuses from enemies, and remove penalties from allies.

So, of these options, what could hackers do that fits easily within the system, isn't overpowered, and doesn't create mechanical/setting/logical loopholes?

Deal damage? no, not really. If the hacker can get into their PAN and muck around enough to "create dangerous feedback", or the like, he can do far worse just as easily, which is game-breaking. Also, hacking a commlink is an extended action, so no-go in a fight.

Heal/Prevent damage? again, not really. I mean, yes, hackers do make very good medics, but if they are being medics then they aren't being hackers, which is the point. Preventing damage is also kinda iffy.

Grant bonuses to Allies? Well, he could try coordinating group actions, but that's more of Leader/Face thing, plus there's Tactsoft, which is really the same thing. Hackers can write such programs, sure, but there's not much in terms of real-time benefits they can provide.

Remove Penalties from Allies? to do this, an enemy hacker would first have to apply penalties, but in theory yes.

Remove Bonuses from Enemies? well, what are bonuses? Reach, Terrain, cybernetics/adept/magic, etc are all bonuses, and there's not much a hacker can do to those. But there's also tactsoft, smartlinks, and anything else that's coming in wireless - and yes, those are wireless.
If your shadowrunner is wearing gloves (for AR and to not leave fingerprints), your smartlink is wireless. Unless you've got a "laser ball" on your head and shoulders that constantly maintains laser-link with all teammates (and through walls no less), your tactsoft is wireless.
But so what, right? They are also encrypted, so it's not like an enemy hacker can break into them. Which is true - but they don't have to break in. They don't need to understand the signal, they just need to stop it. Basic Denial of Service attack. They take months to set up now, but that's for going after A-list websites. Shutting down a small cluster of wireless nodes seems like it would be easy.
It seems to me that figuring out what wavelength "that set of nodes" (group of enemy PANs)is broadcasting to each other on would be a fairly quick check, maybe 1 complex action. Flooding that bandwidth with noise is another complex action. After that they're down; enemy hacker has to switch the range of the tactsoft, and people would link up one at a time as their initiative came around. Smartlink is just boned; your team would of course operate on a different frequency.

Apply Penalties to Enemies? this is another thing hackers could do. For instance, point a "generate lots of AR spam" program at a wireless node (like someone's PAN) and fire. They can turn it off pretty easily, but not without opting out of AR altogether.

Well, things like hacking devices and ware *are* balanced by how slow it is. If it takes 2-3 Complex Actions, that's not abusive.

I'd imagine that most gangers will not have much 'ware, and anybody that does will have at least some modicum of matrix defense, be it IC or hardwiring to a datajack. It's real easy to nerf hackers that way. All you need to do is say that their wired reflexes are hardwired, but oh lookee their cyberears are connected to their PAN. Bombard them with Goblin Punk and all of a sudden they have a -2 distraction modifier.

Also Adepts are good specialists but not great at most everything else. They're nerfed enough as is in my mind. The cyber is a trade off, they have phenomenal utility, but without proper security they actually pose a risk to the character.

The building's own security is the Hacker's weapon.

If you didn't bring Drones to the fight, Johnny Corpsec sure as hell did.

sadly, most of the really interesting stuff takes longer then that, and in the same time the sammie or mage may have forcibly defused the situation.

Yeah. I'm saying that's something to shoot for, if your goal is to make hackers more combat-involved.

I enjoy playing a hacker because they have so much to do *outside* combat, and then I just shoot people in combat.

again, the hacker should be doing everything he can to gain access *before the fight begins* in my opinion. if at all possible, see what you can do about getting into the target facility's nodes with a slow hack before you ever start to infiltrate people. at the very least, *find* an exploit, which cannot be detected, and then when you start the infiltration you just need to logon to host (which is when they have a chance of detecting you).

if at all possible, do your best to compromise the security force's commlinks as well. most likely, this may require at least some degree of infiltration before the main run begins, so make sure your hacker is extremely good at getting drones into a facility. on the other hand, any place that has on-call spiders must therefore have their security nodes connected to the matrix (otherwise you couldn't very well just have a spider show up in your system from wherever else they are). find out who the corp contracts their security to, and see if you can get access to some of their employees AIDs. maybe even try to hack the security company's node, although presumably a security company is not going to be an easy target.

but really, think ahead, plan ahead, and prepare ahead of time. if you have to hack into their system before doing anything, and they already have a gun pointed at your head, it's not time to start hacking; you already missed the time when you should have started hacking. even hacking on the fly won't get you in fast enough at that rate.

ideally, by the time you're ready to go in, you should have already bypassed some, if not all or most, of the matrix security, and you should have already subverted some, if not all or most, of the physical security (the ideal situation would be that they use a spider who telecommutes, so that you would have bypassed all matrix security and any physical security that is connected to the matrix, such as maglocks, turrets, drones, cameras, motion sensors, etc).

the key to being an effective hacker is getting into the system *before* you need access, not starting to hack when you need access.

But why why why would anyone hook their combat ware to a comm? Why hook a smartlink into a computer that also has a comm on it? WHY?! So hackers can have something to do in combat? threads like this seem to come up every now and then but why it is even slightly possible never gets answered other than "oh gee I assume everyone is too dumb to think about that" or even worse for someone expecting combat or preparing for possible combat "oh but that's not something that many can do so no one prepares".

Because the whole point about data is sharing it. Were you using that TacNet? Oh, maybe you should link in your smartgun. Etc.

And lets not forget... A person may indeed be smart about data security, but people as a whole are dumb about it... if that were not the case, the current proliferation of Data Crimes would not be as booming of an industry (Multiple Billions of Dollars per year) as it is today...

Just Sayin'

i would expect most security forces to have their smartguns (if present) tied into the main security system because smartguns are also cameras, and if someone takes the guard's gun it would be very useful to have video coming from it. after all, many criminals will also not be very smart about wireless security.

likewise a biomonitor (if applicable), and any other sensory 'ware or equipment the guard has.

Why on earth would anyones smartlink be wireless thats what the skinlink is for.

That's not the point: it has to connect to the commlink, regardless of method, if you want to share that data in any way.

Different groups will be different levels of smart when it comes to hardwiring 'ware. Most people won't hardwire a a smartlink to their eyes, since it requires an actual cable to work. Cables during combat are bad business, things get wrapped around harms, people trip over them, etc. IF it's a group of gangers, they probably won't even think about matrix security. There aren't THAT many wiz hackers out there. If it's an Ares Firewatch team, they will probably have a matrix overwatch specialist, who set up his systems spesifically to keep you out.

Not everybody is going to be the same level of smart.

Skinlink is like putting a lazer sight on your gun. Is it a good idea? Yes. Will it improve your accuracy? Probably. Does everybody do it? Nope.

I actually went into some detail on this. A shadowrunner can EITHER have their gun skinlinked OR wear gloves to prevent leaving fingerprints. The gun isn't touching anything besides your hand, and gloves aren't going to transmit the skinlink - it's a skinlink, not a "everything touching my body is magically working just like wireless but not actually wireless" device.

There are lots of gloves a shadowrunner (or CorpSec guy) might be wearing, and none of them are going to conduct. AR gloves? send/receive data along the skin, but inside they have important hardware, so they are somewhat insulated. Rappelling Gloves? made out of special materials to prevent damage to the hands, almost certainly not conductive enough. Gecko-tape? Using a gun while wearing those is a bad idea; sure, you can fire it, but how do you put it down? Insulted Gloves? of course not. Leather/Handyman gloves? Designed to protect the hand and specially treated to block moisture; not completely non-conductive, but not conductive enough. Latex Gloves? well, maybe. probably not though.

Want to wear nothing at all on your hands, go right ahead. You'll leave fingerprints (and skin cells / DNA) all over the place, but you can configure your gun's smartlink to be skinlinked instead of wireless. Of course, this also means you can't check the ammo/status/etc without touching it, too.

It's just easier to make it wireless. Unlike your cyber/bio ware, commlink, SIM module, and other gear, you aren't exposing yourself all that much with a wireless smartlink - all a hacker can do is take away a +2 bonus. Unless he hacks it beforehand, which is a separate topic, he can't fiddle or control or change anything, just jam it. Of course, losing that +2 bonus could be the difference between a hit and a miss, but that's the point.

You're forgetting the spoof command. If you have the poor sod's access ID, you can make the smartlink do whatever you want. Turn off, display a wrong image, mis-calibrate so that it actually makes him worse at shooting, or make his clip eject.

Thats why you skinlink the gloves your wearing, in my Sashas case hardliner gloves incirporating AR gloves technology.
There's no limit on what you can skinlink.

Or why you read skinlink, and find that it says that it actually operates a couple of inches away from your skin and isn't blocked by clothing, allowing you to wear regular gloves and still be skinlinked to your gun.

Edit: Hmm, actually it doesn't Could have sworn I'd seen something about it working through clothing and such...

Well that works too, but she "needs" the skinlink for the AR gloves anyway.

It *should* require direct skin contact. That's kind of the whole point. …And it should cause cancer.

Nobody's lived long enough to verify that claim.

Everything does that.

Edit: Actually, is cancer even still a problem in SR? I would imagine with all the gene therapy they can do and such, they could cure cancer. Maybe not everyone could afford it, but it could be done I'd think.

AR gloves! They have a device rating.
Skinlink accessory! Compatable with any electronic device!
Match made in heaven! Yes!

Karoline, there are rules for cancer in the cybermancy stuff, I think? Otherwise, no clue. Hehe.

Bleh, who uses AR gloves? That's why god made trodes.

There is some sort of tumor/cancer thing that is specifically kept alive by the 'brain in jar' technology. That would seem to suggest that it could be otherwise cured.

Easy way to avoid Skinlinking the gloves as well (Wearing gloves with skinlink and smartlink)... have the palm cut out... there... skin to gun contact, and your fingerprints will not compromise you in any way...... perfect, and I even save 50 nuyen or so doing it that way...