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Solstice
I was bored and making some chars the other day. I made an Orc with a modified body of 13 (I think). Just got me curious as to how much of a tank could you build? Post your scariest battle monters here, and discuss how you could build the toughest character to walk the mean streets.
Kagetenshi
I believe I've got a friend who has managed Trolls at about 21 dice for damage resistance, 18 or so actual Body.

Starting characters, or just how high can it go period?

~J
Slamm-O
just .
Zazen
There's no maximum given infinite karma and luck, because magic can go on forever.

But yeah, I made a character for a new player in my last campaign with 21 damage resistance dice. I could've done more but he really wanted certain other things like rhino horns and kid stealth legs.
Solstice
basically starting chars is what i was thinking.
simonw2000
I'm creating a absolutely dangerous cyberzombie. Thank God for NSRCG! biggrin.gif
Kagetenshi
Which has apparently forgotten to let you know that cyberzombies aren't legal starting characters, even if their gear is all under 8 avail...

~J
Zazen
QUOTE (Kagetenshi)
Which has apparently forgotten to let you know that cyberzombies aren't legal starting characters, even if their gear is all under 8 avail...

You got a book quote to back that up? wink.gif
Kagetenshi
QUOTE (Man and Machine p54)
For those gamemasters who choose to incorporate cybermancy, note that characters cannot start the game with an Essence rating of 0 or less.


~J
toturi
Edit: Damn, Kage beat me to it.
Kagetenshi
Fear my speed. *Flexes*

wink.gif

~J
John Campbell
A Resources, B Magic (Adept), C Race (Troll), D Attributes, E Skills.

6 base Attribute points in Body
+5 for Troll
+1 natural dermal armor
+1 Bonus Attribute (Body)
+0 Exceptional Attribute (Body) (doesn't increase rating, but provides a higher cap for this next one)
+5 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (5 Power Points, with 5 geasa to offset Magic loss from...)
+2 alpha Titanium Bone Lacing (1.8 Essence)
+3 alpha Dermal Plating 3 (1.2 Essence)
+4 alpha Dermal Sheathing 3 (1.68 Essence) (does it say anywhere that you can't stack these?)
+1 Toughness
28 Body for damage resistance purposes!

Using betaware, you can squeeze in a pair of cyberlegs, too, bringing it up to 30.

edit: Forgot Toughness. How could I forget Toughness?
Shadow
Wow, John, you have some |33t munchkin skills

notworthy.gif
The White Dwarf
He also forgot calcitonin and to make the adept magician's way, so he could take crab totem, and Dermal Plating and Sheathing do not stack. Im sure theres more too but once you pass 20 who cares, armor is what gives you the edge not raw body.
Kagetenshi
Doesn't matter how much armor you have if that naval shell hits and you don't have the body to stage it down a box at a time.

~J
John Campbell
QUOTE (The White Dwarf)
He also forgot calcitonin

That a SURGE thing? I don't have any of the SURGE-related supplements.

QUOTE
and to make the adept magician's way, so he could take crab totem,

The cyber costs more than 400kĄ, so you can't go Priority A for Magic. Maybe with the point system.

QUOTE
and Dermal Plating and Sheathing do not stack.

Do you have a page reference for this? I looked for a rule against it and couldn't find one.
krishcane
Wow.... 10 years ago I made a character with the highest Body I could muster, and all I got to was 18. That character sucks by these standards! smile.gif SOTA takes everyone down, I guess.

--K

Edit: Just out of curiosity, what's the highest Intelligence the rules can muster? That's a little harder, since there is less cyber out there to help it, and no race bonuses.
Kagetenshi
10 at chargen with an Otaku, I believe. That gives an overall ceiling of 15.

~J
Catsnightmare
Currently playing a human Physad with a body of 10.
toturi
QUOTE (John Campbell)
QUOTE (The White Dwarf)
He also forgot calcitonin

That a SURGE thing? I don't have any of the SURGE-related supplements.

No, SOTA 2063. Geneware.
John Campbell
Ah, I found calcitonin. Genetech, from SOTA:2063. It's not actually useful... genetech is considered bioware, which is considered "natural", so it can't exceed the Attribute Max. This troll's "natural" Body is already pegged at 18 by his adept powers (also considered "natural"). If it weren't, I'd've given him the sixth point of Improved Physical Attribute.

However... phenotypic alteration, also from the genetech section of SOTA:2063, can raise the Racial Modified Limit to 13 and Attribute Max to 20. Also, as I read the new Bio Index rules, as long as he keeps his actual Essence above 1, he won't burn out, and can now geas away the virtual loss from bioware. That means we can get the phenotypic alteration, add another geas to offset the effects, then get that calcitonin and spend the sixth Power Point on more Improved Attribute...

So....
A Resources, B Magic (Adept), C Race (Troll), D Attributes, E Skills.

6 base Attribute points in Body
+5 for Troll
+1 natural dermal armor
+1 Bonus Attribute (Body)
+0 Exceptional Attribute (Body) (RML/AM 12/18)
+0 Phenotypic Alteration (0.5 BI) (raise Body limits) (RML/AM 13/20)
+1 Calcitonin (0.4 BI)
+6 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (6 Power Points, with 6 geasa to offset Magic loss)
+2 alpha Titanium Bone Lacing (1.8 Essence)
+3 alpha Dermal Plating 3 (1.2 Essence)
+4 alpha Dermal Sheathing 3 (1.68 Essence)
+1 Toughness
... for an effective 30 Body for damage resistance purposes.
Kagetenshi
How much passenger space can you fit in, though?

~J
toturi
QUOTE (John Campbell @ Mar 7 2004, 12:38 PM)
Ah, I found calcitonin. Genetech, from SOTA:2063. It's not actually useful... genetech is considered bioware, which is considered "natural", so it can't exceed the Attribute Max. This troll's "natural" Body is already pegged at 18 by his adept powers (also considered "natural"). If it weren't, I'd've given him the sixth point of Improved Physical Attribute.

However... phenotypic alteration, also from the genetech section of SOTA:2063, can raise the Racial Modified Limit to 13 and Attribute Max to 20. Also, as I read the new Bio Index rules, as long as he keeps his actual Essence above 1, he won't burn out, and can now geas away the virtual loss from bioware. That means we can get the phenotypic alteration, add another geas to offset the effects, then get that calcitonin and spend the sixth Power Point on more Improved Attribute...

So....
A Resources, B Magic (Adept), C Race (Troll), D Attributes, E Skills.

6 base Attribute points in Body
+5 for Troll
+1 natural dermal armor
+1 Bonus Attribute (Body)
+0 Exceptional Attribute (Body) (RML/AM 12/18)
+0 Phenotypic Alteration (0.5 BI) (raise Body limits) (RML/AM 13/20)
+1 Calcitonin (0.4 BI)
+6 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (6 Power Points, with 6 geasa to offset Magic loss)
+2 alpha Titanium Bone Lacing (1.8 Essence)
+3 alpha Dermal Plating 3 (1.2 Essence)
+4 alpha Dermal Sheathing 3 (1.68 Essence)
+1 Toughness
... for an effective 30 Body for damage resistance purposes.

You forgot something, bub. Use 120 BP. Add SURGE: Dermal Deposits.

*sigh* Do I have to teach you how to munch too? Really, munchkins these days... weak they are. biggrin.gif
John Campbell
SURGE is for wannabe furries. And, as I already mentioned, I don't have the books, anyway.
Kagetenshi
QUOTE (John Campbell)
SURGE is for wannabe furries.

And AVSs are for munchkins, and Predators are for people too lazy to be original, and FFBA is for twinks, and, and, and...

ohplease.gif

~J
Nikoli
QUOTE (toturi)
QUOTE (John Campbell @ Mar 7 2004, 12:38 PM)
Ah, I found calcitonin. Genetech, from SOTA:2063. It's not actually useful... genetech is considered bioware, which is considered "natural", so it can't exceed the Attribute Max. This troll's "natural" Body is already pegged at 18 by his adept powers (also considered "natural"). If it weren't, I'd've given him the sixth point of Improved Physical Attribute.

However... phenotypic alteration, also from the genetech section of SOTA:2063, can raise the Racial Modified Limit to 13 and Attribute Max to 20. Also, as I read the new Bio Index rules, as long as he keeps his actual Essence above 1, he won't burn out, and can now geas away the virtual loss from bioware. That means we can get the phenotypic alteration, add another geas to offset the effects, then get that calcitonin and spend the sixth Power Point on more Improved Attribute...

So....
A Resources, B Magic (Adept), C Race (Troll), D Attributes, E Skills.

6 base Attribute points in Body
+5 for Troll
+1 natural dermal armor
+1 Bonus Attribute (Body)
+0 Exceptional Attribute (Body) (RML/AM 12/18)
+0 Phenotypic Alteration (0.5 BI) (raise Body limits) (RML/AM 13/20)
+1 Calcitonin (0.4 BI)
+6 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (6 Power Points, with 6 geasa to offset Magic loss)
+2 alpha Titanium Bone Lacing (1.8 Essence)
+3 alpha Dermal Plating 3 (1.2 Essence)
+4 alpha Dermal Sheathing 3 (1.68 Essence)
+1 Toughness
... for an effective 30 Body for damage resistance purposes.

You forgot something, bub. Use 120 BP. Add SURGE: Dermal Deposits.

*sigh* Do I have to teach you how to munch too? Really, munchkins these days... weak they are. biggrin.gif

Umm, Dermal Plating and Sheathing are mutually exclusive Cyber, you cannot have both.
toturi
QUOTE (Nikoli)
Umm, Dermal Plating and Sheathing are mutually exclusive Cyber, you cannot have both.

Quote your source please. I haven't found anything that says otherwise yet.
cykotek
Admittedly, it's for second ed, but pg 48 of Cybertechnology states "A character cannot gain the benefits of both dermal plating and dermal sheathing. Sheathing is a superior form of plating and can only be fitted if pre-existing plating over the same area is removed."

I can't find any 3rd edition references to a similar rule. However, pg 28 of M&M describes sheathing as "Dermal sheathing combines the latest advances in dermal plating technology with a semi-synthetic skin sheath." That description is what makes me, as a GM, disallow stacking of the two systems.
Teulisch
Well, theres diffferent ways to do things.
base attribute 6
Dwarf +1, ork +3, or Troll +6.
edges: bonus/exceptional attribute, toughness(+1) [+7 edges]
surge: dermal deposits (+1)
Dermal sheath 3 + titanium bone lacing is +6 bod
may 2 cyberlegs w/out bonus loss; +2 more
Superthyroid galnd (+1, counts as natural),

so a troll w/ surge, edges, cyber and bio could have a 24.
with experience, that raises to a 29.
for a human w/out edges or surge, those numbers are 15 and 17.

bio index 1.4, essence is 5.08 alpha. cost is 740,000 (with no upgrades for the legs).

you could get an extra +1 from a cybertorso, but then you would need at least beta-ware or else be a cyberzombie.

with build points: 30 resources, 10 race, 7 edges, 7 surge; 54 plus attributes and skills.

So, you could have an experienced troll changeling sporting betaware with 30 dice to soak with, and an actual body of 18.
Moonstone Spider
Does anybody else find it strange that Metahumans with the right munching out can routinely throw more dice to survive an attack than great dragons or any vehicle short of a battleship?
Tziluthi
QUOTE
Does anybody else find it strange that Metahumans with the right munching out can routinely throw more dice to survive an attack than great dragons or any vehicle short of a battleship?


Hmmm, that gets me to thinking: A troll with a hull rating...
Zazen
QUOTE (John Campbell)
+6 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (6 Power Points, with 6 geasa to offset Magic loss)

I'd just like to point out that this character is mundane; you can't offset a magic rating of zero with geasa nyahnyah.gif
John Campbell
QUOTE (Zazen)
QUOTE (John Campbell @ Mar 6 2004, 11:38 PM)
+6 Improved Physical Attribute (Body) (6 Power Points, with 6 geasa to offset Magic loss)

I'd just like to point out that this character is mundane; you can't offset a magic rating of zero with geasa nyahnyah.gif

Nope. He's got an Essence of 1.32 and a base Magic rating of 1. On top of that, he's got 0.9 Bio Index, which reduces his effective Essence for purposes of calculating effective Magic to 0.87. This gives him a virtual Magic rating of 0, but does not make him permanently mundane... and can be offset by geasa (or increased by initiation). Which he has out the wazoo, bringing him back up to Magic 6 for all practical purposes. If he loses another 0.33 Essence, he's SOL, but as long as it's only a virtual loss, he can just load up on the geasa and be good to go.

The new bioware errata are very nice to the Awakened.
Glav
QUOTE ("Moonstone Spider")
  Does anybody else find it strange that Metahumans with the right munching out can routinely throw more dice to survive an attack than great dragons or any vehicle short of a battleship?
A regular battleship, yes. I'd hate to see what a dragon or battleship equally munchkined out would do grinbig.gif
Zazen
QUOTE (John Campbell)
This gives him a virtual Magic rating of 0, but does not make him permanently mundane... and can be offset by geasa (or increased by initiation).

... The new bioware errata are very nice to the Awakened.

Since you're using the errata, you've surely noticed that the kinder, gentler "virtual Magic" has been done away with. Loss from bioware is just as bad as loss from cyber, and you've got magic 0, fo' real. smile.gif
L.D
"Virtual magic" is till there (emphasis mine):

QUOTE
Using the example above, the mage's datajack would reduce his Magic rating from 6 to 5.8, and the virtual reduction from the bioware would effectively make the Magic rating 5.6. For all game purposes, the mage would have an effective Magic rating of 5.
toturi
QUOTE (L.D)
"Virtual magic" is till there (emphasis mine):

QUOTE
Using the example above, the mage's datajack would reduce his Magic rating from 6 to 5.8, and the virtual reduction from the bioware would effectively make the Magic rating 5.6. For all game purposes, the mage would have an effective Magic rating of 5.

Although the vitual reduction is still there, but for for all intents and purposes of game mechanics, it is no longer there.
Phaeton
EDIT: Accidentally replied to wrong post. dead.gif
L.D
He's got an effective magic rating of 0, but since it's only the virtual reduction that brings him below 1, then he can still initiate and gain magic rating. Now if his essence was below 1, it wouldn't matter, but it isn't.

Nothing in the FAQ says that they've removed the virtual magic stuff, and besides bioware is still supposed to be more magic friendly. This is however an optional rule.

Lets go back to the main rules.
1.32 essence = 1 magic
0.9 bio index = 0 magic

But the last point lost is a virtual loss and therefor the person is still magically active, he just hasn't got the mojo. Initiate a couple of times and voila, magic rating 6 again.
Zazen
Guys, we're not talking about the faq. The errata has replaced the section in M&M that says that bioware doesn't cause permanent irreparable magic loss.

The errata is pretty clear that it does work like other forms of magic loss.
L.D
Oh... yeah... in that case ignore my latest posts. smile.gif
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