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Machiavelli
Actually i read the topic about the blood mages and the bounty that is set on a verified blood-mage. This brought back the question to me, where exactly you can draw the line between these two sides of the force. Practically everybody can learn the blood-magic rituals, no matter of his tradition and i admit that the benefits are good, but it is nothing they deserve to be hunted down more than every other shadowrunner. Ok, usually you kill people in self-defense or because you have a corresponding job, but death is death so why is there this extraorbitant bounty? Black mages do everything for their personal power, they deal with every kind of dark spirit to enhance their abilities and this entities also include e.g. draining of essence, karma and the like. Voodoo priests raise the dead and i haven´´t heard about a bounty on neither of these groups. Maybe i am too apathetic to see a problem here, but except that they kill people to reach their goals, i see no reason for that head-money.
InfidelZombie
I think that the bounty on blood magic is more based toward the spirits they can summon. Say they summon a force 6 spirit. Now say that spirit uses essence drain on a person. Now it's force 7 (Or however many essence it drains), say it drains another person, now it's force 8+. This can quickly lead up to a spirit beyond the casters control, and a bloody fun time is had by all.
Machiavelli
A guardian possession spirit with immunity to normal weapons, additonal worn armor, physical attributes at racial max, counterspelling and an assault rifle causes more fear to me than a blood spirit.
The Jopp
I’ve always been torn about that.

In essence it should be about the casters outlook on life basically.

Bloodmagician paramedic that uses scarring of himself to cast magic
Bloodmagician paramedic that sacrifices one victim to save another

Radiation mage that is a nuclear physicist and use it for research
Radiation mage that is a nuclear plant maintenance employee that use it to make sure the reactor stays stable
Radiation toxic mage that use radiation to kill people and want the world to burn in a nuclear fire

I find the magic section to be a bit badly written that puts en elemental effect (radiation) directly into the “evil” category and not as something that “could” be corrupted.

Not to mention, if radiation is evil, who would ever want to get close to any chaotic radiating source…like the sun…And don’t tell me that the sun would NOT be a place for radiation and fire spirits – and would they fight or work together?

New metaplot: Solar Civil Spirit War
Thirty Second Artbomb
QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 03:51 AM) *
Bloodmagician paramedic that sacrifices one victim to save another

Something like this, maybe? grinbig.gif
Ascalaphus
Don't forget: the bounty on blood spirits is a draconic plot.
Machiavelli
It is nothing else than a conspiracy theory. Made from shamans and other ridiculus traditions.^^
InfidelZombie
QUOTE
A guardian possession spirit with immunity to normal weapons, additonal worn armor, physical attributes at racial max, counterspelling and an assault rifle causes more fear to me than a blood spirit.


Sure you may be worried about a possession spirit with racial maximum stats, extra armor, and a AK97. But say a blood spirit gets a hold of some poor un-augmented sap and decides to drain him dry. At 6 essence, that force 6 spirit would elevate to a force 12. Now say a blood mage let the little guy loose in a place like Kwoloon City, or some other over populated Slum where a few missing people won't raise eyebrows and you start to see the issue. The spirits drains and kills 3 people, now you have a force 24 spirit to deal with.
The Jopp
QUOTE (InfidelZombie @ Oct 1 2010, 12:40 PM) *
The spirits drains and kills 3 people, now you have a force 24 spirit to deal with.


And after that the summoning mage is no longer a problem as the F24+ spirit is now a universal force in its own right and have started a small criminal empire and sent out hitmen to kill the mage...
Mooncrow
QUOTE (InfidelZombie @ Oct 1 2010, 06:40 AM) *
Sure you may be worried about a possession spirit with racial maximum stats, extra armor, and a AK97. But say a blood spirit gets a hold of some poor un-augmented sap and decides to drain him dry. At 6 essence, that force 6 spirit would elevate to a force 12. Now say a blood mage let the little guy loose in a place like Kwoloon City, or some other over populated Slum where a few missing people won't raise eyebrows and you start to see the issue. The spirits drains and kills 3 people, now you have a force 24 spirit to deal with.


The spirit is limited to raising it's force to 1.5 times it's original summoned value.
Machiavelli
Good point.^^ My future as a black-blood-mage is going to start....NOW.^^
InfidelZombie
QUOTE
The spirit is limited to raising it's force to 1.5 times it's original summoned value.


Can I get a page reference on that, I can't seem to find it in Street magic under Energy Drain, or Blood Spirits.
Smokeskin
QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
Actually i read the topic about the blood mages and the bounty that is set on a verified blood-mage. [...] Maybe i am too apathetic to see a problem here, but except that they kill people to reach their goals, i see no reason for that head-money.


Most people who kill others only do so when it is directly related to their goals. They kill competitors, threats, snitches, etc., but if there's no reason to kill someone, they don't.

Blood mages kill people in the pursuit of any goal. Anything blood mages do, they do better if they gut a few bystanders on the way.

It is like the difference between the fast food corp that will kill when there's a solid profit to be made from it, and the fast food corp that sells baby burgers.
Aerospider
QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 10:51 AM) *
Black mages do everything for their personal power, they deal with every kind of dark spirit to enhance their abilities and this entities also include e.g. draining of essence, karma and the like.

Making deals with dark spirits to increase one's own power is not in itself illegal or immoral. In these circumstances the spirit is free and therefore its own entity, whilst blood mages are responsible for blood spirits in their service.

QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 10:51 AM) *
Voodoo priests raise the dead

No they don't, they just think they do. The Big D would certainly have known better.
Aerospider
QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
Radiation mage that is a nuclear physicist and use it for research
Radiation mage that is a nuclear plant maintenance employee that use it to make sure the reactor stays stable
Radiation toxic mage that use radiation to kill people and want the world to burn in a nuclear fire

Radiation isn't a tradition, it's a toxic mentor spirit which is right and proper. What sanemagician could follow its warping and carcinogenic principles?
Also, I don't think the book does draw a good/evil line in magic (much) – it's more a case of not-twisted vs twisted.

QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
Not to mention, if radiation is evil, who would ever want to get close to any chaotic radiating source…like the sun

Um, the same people who want to get close to it in RL? I.e. nobody?

QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
…And don’t tell me that the sun would NOT be a place for radiation and fire spirits – and would they fight or work together?

Check out the rules for mana voids and you'll conclude that they'll just simply die together. It's many millions of miles from the closest life forms (unless there's some very strange fluff I've not read) and you need life to create a mana field, without which anything magical suffers immensely.
Mooncrow
QUOTE (InfidelZombie @ Oct 1 2010, 08:04 AM) *
Can I get a page reference on that, I can't seem to find it in Street magic under Energy Drain, or Blood Spirits.


Street Magic, page 140

I have the second printing, so there may have been errata if you have an earlier version.
InfidelZombie
Much appreciated thanks! Still though, if a blood mage killed enough people theoretically he could summon a high level spirit. force 9-12 is nothing to sneeze at.
The Jopp
QUOTE (Aerospider @ Oct 1 2010, 01:27 PM) *
Radiation isn't a tradition, it's a toxic mentor spirit which is right and proper. What sanemagician could follow its warping and carcinogenic principles?


You misunderstand me, very few GM's would allow a magician to have spells witha radiation elemental effect as it by RAW is mostly connected to a toxic mentor spirit.

By it's definition in the book the very elemental effect of radiation have been classified as something "evil" and not a natural element.

And I would also call the sun a "limited" life generating field or a "living" metaplane for fire and radiation spirits

Yes, i know, RAW doesnt really cover that but it's not entirely unreasonable.
Machiavelli
QUOTE (Aerospider @ Oct 1 2010, 01:14 PM) *
Making deals with dark spirits to increase one's own power is not in itself illegal or immoral. In these circumstances the spirit is free and therefore its own entity, whilst blood mages are responsible for blood spirits in their service.


No they don't, they just think they do. The Big D would certainly have known better.


That is not the point. The point is that people die because of the mage practicing their tradition. Does it really matter if you die because the mage wants to reduce drain (which separates him from all other common person if she sees it) or if you die because of a spell etc.
Brazilian_Shinobi
While most shadowrunners might not know the reason, and many Magician can even say they get VERY frightened when they enter an aspected background of Blood Magicians, the main reason Big D put the bounty was because he knows that Blood Magic is related to the Horrors.
Game2BHappy
QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 05:51 AM) *
Bloodmagician paramedic that uses scarring of himself to cast magic
Bloodmagician paramedic that sacrifices one victim to save another

Radiation mage that is a nuclear physicist and use it for research
Radiation mage that is a nuclear plant maintenance employee that use it to make sure the reactor stays stable
Radiation toxic mage that use radiation to kill people and want the world to burn in a nuclear fire

This is great material! My favorite villains are those that start out with the best intentions.
Nifft
QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 07:51 AM) *
That is not the point. The point is that people die because of the mage practicing their tradition. Does it really matter if you die because the mage wants to reduce drain (which separates him from all other common person if she sees it) or if you die because of a spell etc.

Of course it does. Accidental deaths are not as morally terrible as cold-blooded murder.
LurkerOutThere
Ok we're getting into a mechanical vs setting disconnect.

Only a very small number of people in the world are capable of teaching blood magic, most are fourth age remnants. Of the fourth age remnants there are those who understand the consequences of blood magic (it hastens the coming of the horrors) and those who don't understand or don't care aboout the consequences. That's latter camp is primarily affiliated witht he upper echelons of Aztechnology/Atzlan, the servants of the smoking mirror. That's why there is the bounty because every blood mage neutralized pushes the world an inch further from the brink.

This next part is a bit more conjecture:
The pro blood magic traditions don't spread it around more because if it did escape their control it could cause a backlash and people might better develop counters.
Hagga
QUOTE (InfidelZombie @ Oct 1 2010, 11:10 AM) *
I think that the bounty on blood magic is more based toward the spirits they can summon. Say they summon a force 6 spirit. Now say that spirit uses essence drain on a person. Now it's force 7 (Or however many essence it drains), say it drains another person, now it's force 8+. This can quickly lead up to a spirit beyond the casters control, and a bloody fun time is had by all.

Bloody being the operative term.

QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
I’ve always been torn about that.

In essence it should be about the casters outlook on life basically.

Bloodmagician paramedic that uses scarring of himself to cast magic

There's an interesting fictionette (thing) in Street Magic on someone who doesn't quite do that, but goes all the way into dark magic because he can't save one of his patients (his wife).


Also remember that when that force 24 blood spirit is getting it's hopes up, and trying to get to force 24, there is every chance Arleesh or some other GD/IE with a vested interest in that NOT happening will notice and turn up for a brief and friendly conversation on the merits of not being a force 24 blood spirit.
Neraph
Meh, the ED/SR crossover things are all conjecture. Possibly based on stuff, but conjecture nonetheless. You have no idea that the SR team will continue that metaplot.

In any event - the bounty on blood mages is not just for the ones that Invoke Blood Spirits: it is on all blood mages that have put themselves on the radar. One may simply be an adept with Cannibalize/Power Bleed, another could be a Mystic Adept with Sacrifice, and another just a mage that extensively uses the Calling rules to summon blood spirits. One could simply be a magician that has no "blood" metamagics but uses a whole ton of blood fetishes.

The thing is that their magic taints them to some degree, and as such the Draco Foundation (IIRC) has a bount out to study the effects of blood magic on the metahuman and the Astral around them.

It does not matter what intent the blood mage has, or what his MO is - the only thing that matters is that the Awakened is a blood mage.
Dumori
QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 10:51 AM) *
Actually i read the topic about the blood mages and the bounty that is set on a verified blood-mage. This brought back the question to me, where exactly you can draw the line between these two sides of the force. Practically everybody can learn the blood-magic rituals, no matter of his tradition and i admit that the benefits are good, but it is nothing they deserve to be hunted down more than every other shadowrunner. Ok, usually you kill people in self-defense or because you have a corresponding job, but death is death so why is there this extraorbitant bounty? Black mages do everything for their personal power, they deal with every kind of dark spirit to enhance their abilities and this entities also include e.g. draining of essence, karma and the like. Voodoo priests raise the dead and i haven´´t heard about a bounty on neither of these groups. Maybe i am too apathetic to see a problem here, but except that they kill people to reach their goals, i see no reason for that head-money.

The bonty on blood mages and toxics is due to EVIL its due to possible magically dangerous(to the users or the world) or hard to explane thus the draco foundation and its saves from the horrors line wants to research and understand the effect of this magic on people and the world.
Dumori
QUOTE (InfidelZombie @ Oct 1 2010, 12:40 PM) *
Sure you may be worried about a possession spirit with racial maximum stats, extra armor, and a AK97. But say a blood spirit gets a hold of some poor un-augmented sap and decides to drain him dry. At 6 essence, that force 6 spirit would elevate to a force 12. Now say a blood mage let the little guy loose in a place like Kwoloon City, or some other over populated Slum where a few missing people won't raise eyebrows and you start to see the issue. The spirits drains and kills 3 people, now you have a force 24 spirit to deal with.

LIES! They fixed bloodzilla the max force is now just x2 base.
Marcus
QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 3 2010, 01:44 AM) *
The thing is that their magic taints them to some degree, and as such the Draco Foundation (IIRC) has a bount out to study the effects of blood magic on the metahuman and the Astral around them.

It does not matter what intent the blood mage has, or what his MO is - the only thing that matters is that the Awakened is a blood mage.


I maybe wrong on this, but as I understood it, the "confirmed" blood mages were all wanted b/c they had done some seriously bad things. Many of those things were related to blood magic and some were not. Most were Big A related. I don't recall much mention of the other open users of Blood magic in the list (ie the IDF).
I'll go find my copy of his will and re-read it i guess.
Dumori
QUOTE (Marcus @ Oct 3 2010, 09:11 AM) *
I maybe wrong on this, but as I understood it, the "confirmed" blood mages were all wanted b/c they had done some seriously bad things. Many of those things were related to blood magic and some were not. Most were Big A related. I don't recall much mention of the other open users of Blood magic in the list (ie the IDF).
I'll go find my copy of his will and re-read it i guess.

No it defiantly a research thing. The fact the some of Aztech bloodmages are trying to summon the horrors/enemy with it is an added bonus as they are also being targeted by those in the know any way.
Neraph
We could also get into a really fuzzy area of the mages actually believing what they're doing is right and good, if you want. You'd be surprised what people can convince themselves of. Hitler honestly believed what he was doing would be the absolute best thing for humanity, for example. I can imagine blood mages being similarly convinced of their own actions' correctness, if that makes sense.
Randomonioum
QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 3 2010, 04:10 PM) *
We could also get into a really fuzzy area of the mages actually believing what they're doing is right and good, if you want. You'd be surprised what people can convince themselves of. Hitler honestly believed what he was doing would be the absolute best thing for humanity, for example. I can imagine blood mages being similarly convinced of their own actions' correctness, if that makes sense.


The greater good and all that.
Marcus
QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 3 2010, 11:10 AM) *
We could also get into a really fuzzy area of the mages actually believing what they're doing is right and good, if you want. You'd be surprised what people can convince themselves of. Hitler honestly believed what he was doing would be the absolute best thing for humanity, for example. I can imagine blood mages being similarly convinced of their own actions' correctness, if that makes sense.


Thats for sure no one wakes up one morning and goes, oh heck ya, I'm gonna be evil, evil, evil, today. Moral justification is slippery slope, (see earthfirst). So far this thread seems mostly to be centered around blood mage i think there was some replies concerning toxics, but the line in SR morality usually comes in a nice palliate of grays. Its fairly easy to tell when something has a threat rating that it has gone to far, but what about the lesser evils? Those Dark magic users who summoned up there Dark Master (While throwing up their hard rock hand sign!), or perhaps that christian theurgy who decided that ALL witch all need to burn in fire!!! What about them I ask you?
Neraph
QUOTE (Marcus @ Oct 3 2010, 10:21 AM) *
...or perhaps that christian theurgy who decided that ALL witch all need to burn in fire!!!

To be perfectly honest, the line you're referring to says nothing about fire. They just are supposed to die.

In fact, since it says "Suffer not a witch to live," you could theoretically have a christian (crazy Christian - he obviously doesn't read his book very well if he does this) go around capturing Awakened, Slab-ing them, and giving them medical OD's to kill them, emphasizing the "suffer not" part to mean "kill them as painlessly as possible."

Could make for a creepy 'run.
Marcus
QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 3 2010, 11:31 AM) *
To be perfectly honest, the line you're referring to says nothing about fire. They just are supposed to die.

In fact, since it says "Suffer not a witch to live," you could theoretically have a christian (crazy Christian - he obviously doesn't read his book very well if he does this) go around capturing Awakened, Slab-ing them, and giving them medical OD's to kill them, emphasizing the "suffer not" part to mean "kill them as painlessly as possible."

Could make for a creepy 'run.

lol, fair enough, mana spells are more effective anyway, Stupify!!! For our local game we were putting together a crazy wizkid gang rolling around on broomsticks with air elementals bound in them. I don't think they really qualify as evil, but more like 80's skateboard kids buzzing the mall, but their signature line was gonna be, "Potters! I hate these Guys." lol
Shinobi Killfist
Well Blood Magic isn't always evil in the murder innocents sense. Though personally I don't buy into paramedic blood mages, blood magic would not be taught to a person like that IMO. Only evil bastards would be taught it. But anyways it is inherently evil in the magical arena due to the obvious aura corruption and background count issues it creates. Sure any other tradition can have evil people in it, but the very act of using blood magic has a automatically evil effect that you can assence as a mage. You can see the evil, sense the wrongness of it, smell the corruption, however you want to describe assensing to the player.
Dumori
QUOTE (Marcus @ Oct 3 2010, 04:39 PM) *
lol, fair enough, mana spells are more effective anyway, Stupify!!! For our local game we were putting together a crazy wizkid gang rolling around on broomsticks with air elementals bound in them. I don't think they really qualify as evil, but more like 80's skateboard kids buzzing the mall, but their signature line was gonna be, "Potters! I hate these Guys." lol

Man that's on retro fiction refrance it would likely be more obscure than say a gang now using clockwork orange slang.
Marcus
QUOTE (Dumori @ Oct 3 2010, 01:04 PM) *
Man that's on retro fiction refrance it would likely be more obscure than say a gang now using clockwork orange slang.


We did discuss that point, and concluded that HP would probably end up being as classic as the Lord of the Rings, which is of course referenced in the game, so we decided it could very well fit, and we weren't concerned about copyright in our home game.
Dumori
QUOTE (Marcus @ Oct 3 2010, 06:45 PM) *
We did discuss that point, and concluded that HP would probably end up being as classic as the Lord of the Rings, which is of course referenced in the game, so we decided it could very well fit, and we weren't concerned about copyright in our home game.

True I guess it is already a kids classic. Still would be "retro"/alternative in 207-
Marcus
QUOTE (Dumori @ Oct 3 2010, 01:56 PM) *
True I guess it is already a kids classic. Still would be "retro"/alternative in 207-

Certainly probably having gone through a couple cycles of being retro by then.
Neraph
Hehe, I can see (most of) the original cast going through Leonization and Physical Vigor in order to change the Harry Potter movies from original, outdated media files to simsense/trideo.

They'd be in their 80-90s. Still theoretically alive.
Dumori
QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 4 2010, 04:32 PM) *
Hehe, I can see (most of) the original cast going through Leonization and Physical Vigor in order to change the Harry Potter movies from original, outdated media files to simsense/trideo.

They'd be in their 80-90s. Still theoretically alive.

OH God! I think they'd redo um all as the original actors wouldn't have the simsense traing ect.
Mäx
QUOTE (Machiavelli @ Oct 1 2010, 11:51 AM) *
Actually i read the topic about the blood mages and the bounty that is set on a verified blood-mage. This brought back the question to me, where exactly you can draw the line between these two sides of the force. Practically everybody can learn the blood-magic rituals, no matter of his tradition and i admit that the benefits are good, but it is nothing they deserve to be hunted down more than every other shadowrunner. Ok, usually you kill people in self-defense or because you have a corresponding job, but death is death so why is there this extraorbitant bounty? Black mages do everything for their personal power, they deal with every kind of dark spirit to enhance their abilities and this entities also include e.g. draining of essence, karma and the like. Voodoo priests raise the dead and i haven´´t heard about a bounty on neither of these groups. Maybe i am too apathetic to see a problem here, but except that they kill people to reach their goals, i see no reason for that head-money.

You do know that the bounty is only for bringing in live blood mages from a specific list provided by the Foundation, to me that sounds much more like a recruiting an army of blood mages then head-money.
Dumori
It's not just from a list but if you bring some one not on the list they need to be proven a blood Mage in some way. Same goes for toxics.
Brazilian_Shinobi
QUOTE (Dumori @ Oct 5 2010, 08:45 AM) *
It's not just from a list but if you bring some one not on the list they need to be proven a blood Mage in some way. Same goes for toxics.


Draco Foundation employee: "What makes you think he is a blood mage?"
Shadowrunner: "He turned me into a newt!"
Draco Foundation employee: "A newt?"
Shadowrunner: [meekly after a long pause] ... "I got better."
Dumori
QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Oct 5 2010, 03:41 PM) *
Draco Foundation employee: "What makes you think he is a blood mage?"
Shadowrunner: "He turned me into a newt!"
Draco Foundation employee: "A newt?"
Shadowrunner: [meekly after a long pause] ... "I got better."

Must have had a low body score to pull that on you wink.gif
Garou
Actually Shinobi's shifter HAS a low body score... smile.gif
Dumori
QUOTE (Garou @ Oct 5 2010, 06:31 PM) *
Actually Shinobi's shifter HAS a low body score... smile.gif

Now you just need an ecuse to turn them into a newt. Just some aquaitc infultration I guess.
Hound
was too lazy to read the whole thread, so I apologize if this has been mentioned before.

While all magicians have the potential to do great harm, and many magic traditions may be seen to encourage things that society finds repulsive (i.e. raising the dead) the rules say that all Blood magicians are certifiably insane. If you have a completely insane and sufficiently powerful voodoo/black magic magician you can bet he'll have a bounty on his head too.

Some quotes from street magic: pg 138, Playing the Twisted sidebar "While many shadowrunners might qualify as borderline sociopaths and psychotics, roleplaying a truly demented individual with Awakened power at his fingertips... "

pg 137, under Twisted Agendas "Given the madness that characterizes twisted magicians, (twisted seeming to include blood magic, toxic magic, and some others) the twisted paths are not normally available to player characters."


See you seem to be assuming that it is something about the things that blood magic lets you do that makes them put a bounty out. But in fact, I believe, it's more about the fact that all blood magicians (and toxic magicians) are completely insane and basically always a huge danger to the public.

As for that guy who mentioned a blood mage paramedic and a radiation mage nuclear physicist, I don't think that's possible based on the book saying that they'd be nuts. Or at least, if they were doing those jobs, they would be doing them in an evil way (i.e. paramedic secretly killing all of their patients, physicist allowing significant amounts of radiation to leak out and/or plotting a meltdown.)
Dumori
QUOTE (Hound @ Oct 5 2010, 07:42 PM) *
was too lazy to read the whole thread, so I apologize if this has been mentioned before.

While all magicians have the potential to do great harm, and many magic traditions may be seen to encourage things that society finds repulsive (i.e. raising the dead) the rules say that all Blood magicians are certifiably insane. If you have a completely insane and sufficiently powerful voodoo/black magic magician you can bet he'll have a bounty on his head too.

Some quotes from street magic: pg 138, Playing the Twisted sidebar "While many shadowrunners might qualify as borderline sociopaths and psychotics, roleplaying a truly demented individual with Awakened power at his fingertips... "

pg 137, under Twisted Agendas "Given the madness that characterizes twisted magicians, (twisted seeming to include blood magic, toxic magic, and some others) the twisted paths are not normally available to player characters."


See you seem to be assuming that it is something about the things that blood magic lets you do that makes them put a bounty out. But in fact, I believe, it's more about the fact that all blood magicians (and toxic magicians) are completely insane and basically always a huge danger to the public.

As for that guy who mentioned a blood mage paramedic and a radiation mage nuclear physicist, I don't think that's possible based on the book saying that they'd be nuts. Or at least, if they were doing those jobs, they would be doing them in an evil way (i.e. paramedic secretly killing all of their patients, physicist allowing significant amounts of radiation to leak out and/or plotting a meltdown.)

You don't have to be nut's to be a bloodmage just use blood magic. These metamagics and tradtions have effects on metahumans other life and the astral. Thats cannon the DF is after them for research and likely to put a hole in Aztechs plans to bring around the horrors faster. Seeing as IIRC the list they publish is almost exculively bloodmages linked to Azetech.
Brazilian_Shinobi
QUOTE (Garou @ Oct 5 2010, 02:31 PM) *
Actually Shinobi's shifter HAS a low body score... smile.gif


My BOD is 4, thank you very much, although not incredibly high, it is not so low either (it just so happens I don't wear armor nor I have Mystical Armor adept power).
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