Just what it says on the tin. Is it possible to create a foci in the form of a tattoo? I'd imagine this wouldn't be a very popular choice as you couldn't ever sell it off or anything, but given all the mysticism surrounding tattoos (and the fact that you can't drop or misplace them) it might fit some characters very well.

I tried looking for anything about it in the books and couldn't really find anything specific (No surprises, it is kind of left field). The closest I could come up with as an argument against it is that the book mentions creating an object/item as part of the process, which a tattoo may not technically be (though I suppose the ink could be what carries the enchantment). There is however mention of it being able to take any form based on tradition.

Anyone else have any thoughts about the RAW or opinions about if it would be too strong or anything? I figure that 99% of the time dropping a focus doesn't come up anyway and in that light the inability to lose it is more than made up for by the inability to trade it up.

Not sure about foci but they could certainly be used as a fetish for certain mages.

Actually, there is a mention in Vice about Yakuza Tattoo artists being mages who weave a spell into tattoos they place on the Yak members. Not sure exactly how it works, or if it's something like an Anchored spell intended to go off when the tattoo reciever needs it or what, but it is certainly possible.

I think there was a sidebar about making cyberware into foci, or fetishes, as well. But the process needs to be done before the ware is installed.

where are the SR3 cracks? I remember reading tattoo magic in these days

Doesn't that entirely ruin the point of a fetish? If you can't loose it, whats the disadvantage.

In any case, I would treat tattoos as unique magic items, they may have various magical effects, but a foci is by it's nature it's own object with it's own astral form.

Sure, that just needed quickening and then you needed to learn it as a meta magic.
Tattoo-Focus is completely canon and doable.
And versatile too. Because who says you can't make it a tattoo on your fists for weapon focus?

Also: IT IS FOCUS DAMN IT!
THE SINGULAR OF FOCI IS FOCUS!

Well, it would have it's own astral form, it would just be located on your astral form at all times (unless that part of your body was generously removed for you)

Now this is complete house rule territory, but I would personally rule it thus:

Yes a tattoo, assuming it is tradition appropriate, could be used as a focus. In addition to the other rules regarding focus creation, at least one person involved in creating the tattoo must have rating 3 or above in an appropriate skill. This additional requirement adds 5-10% to the total focus cost (depending on focus type). Also, while the focus may be activated and deactivated as normal, it always qualifies as active for the purposes of passing through wards. I see this as a fair trade-off for the complete inability of that focus to be stolen/lost for any reason.


Thoughts?


~R~

Also, remember about foci getting destroyed if their physical form was changed?
Scars tend to mess up tattoos. As do cuts. And bullet holes.

That would be a really jerk move on the part of the GM.


I like it.


~R~

http://ancientfiles.dumpshock.com/Meta.htm#2


And uncle Drake is still the best source!

And now we come to the REALLY difficult part:
DOES IT WORK WITH NANO-TATS TOO?

Good to know.

Shame, I was thinking that it might be very appropriate for a particular character of mine.

Now you know.

And knowing is half the battle.

The other half being glorious carnage in all it's incarnation.

So... if I ever GM for you, you want the carnage spirits?

No, i want to play carnage incarnate

There is no reason why a tattoo can't be a foci. The telesma is acquired before the enchanting starts. The only problem is getting the character to endure days worth of enchanting.

Except for tricksy game balance and mechanics question.

FOCUS! You're making me twitch inside. It's bad enough that sometimes people in my group refer to a single "dice" *shudder*

Tattoos as Quickened Spells is totally different from tattoos as *foci*. I wouldn't allow it, I think. It makes perfect sense as Quickening: permanent and pre-set. A focus, on the other hand… and what kind of foci? Weapon? Power? Sustaining?

You'd also have to allow the tattoo to be targeted separately, and all of that. Unless, of course, it's a special (new) kind of focus, specifically intended to avoid certain weaknesses like that. In that case, we're making up more rules, so it's 'be careful'. Require a specific metamagic, possibly a special karma cost?

There are certain obvious drawbacks. Like you get captured and the belt sander appears. "Now this might be bit painful. ..."

Heh. And advantages. As long as it's balanced.

Hmm. I did forget that you can implant foci these days, so that's roughly the same.

you always could implant foci.
what does it matter wether or not you wear the focus ring on your finger or under the skin of your arm?
hell, you can even have cyber ware act as your focus, but this is a bit more tricky than the other kind.
And oh hey, skin-pocket/marsupial pouch!
Best of both worlds! hard to see/lose, but able to replace/change the focus at moments notice . .

A weapon focus knuckle tattoo for that extra special killing hand moment?

Yep, an unarmed weapon focus . .

That seems to be a change, though. Unarmed weapon foci, that you can't drop or lose, and 100% concealed. Other kinds of foci already work as implanted, but that one is different.

Hmm, yeah, I suppose for the argument of balance there is the fact that you can make implants into foci, so there really isn't much balance reason you shouldn't be able to have a tattoo focus. Granted implants are harder and cost essence, but it could also be an RFID chip planted in the skin, or possibly some other very small piece of metal.

And as I said earlier, 99% of the time losing your foci doesn't come up anyway.

I think most foci are pretty concealable anyway, at least from a mundane perspective. Unless it glows when the holder is casting a spell. And if you are able to percieve astrally, you can still identify the foci normally. It doesn't meld into the person's aura, it will just aways be located there.

No, I'm specifically talking about weapon foci there.

You could as well enchant a cyberhand as a focus, so I don't see a big problem here. It would also be more resistant to damage than a tattoo.
A cyber spur weapon focus would deal more damage anyway.

I'm not sure you can, strictly speaking. But a cyberhand is a much bigger deal for anyone who'd use a weapon focus (adepts), because that's a point of Magic gone. See?

what is stopping you from having a weapon focus be a glove? nothing.
what is stopping you from ritually putting metal stuff under the skin of your hand for no essence cost and using that as your focus? nothing.
why should it be any different for tattoos?

Technically, the rules are, in both cases. Especially in the second one. That's precisely why I'm asking these questions.

Obviously, a tattoo weapon focus and a no-Essence 'metal in your skin' weapon focus would be the same thing. That doesn't exist.

As it stands, there is no existing equivalent to a tattoo weapon focus. Yes, you could house rule something in, but that's what we're discussing here.

Piercings and brandings and insertions of metal shapes under the skin so your skin has these shapes does not cost essence, because it's not really ware . .
It's purely cosmetic stuff . . like a tattoo . . there is nothing replaced, there is nothing connected to your central nerve system or anything else really . .
There is, technically, simply no reason for any essence loss to occur what so ever . . And believe me, as a magic hater, it pains me immensely to say this <.<

If such stuff starts taking up essence, then so do piercings and tattoos . . And bullets that have pierced your skin. And anything else that pierces your skin.

Right, no one said anything against that. What I said is that there's no precedent for things like cosmetic implants *being weapon foci*, and I'm pretty sure it's illegal by the rules.

So again: you can enchant most anything as a focus and stick it in your skin, so that's the same as a tattoo. Except weapon foci.

Which is why I'm asking: would *adding* this *new* feature be an issue? Maybe so.

Well, what are the limitations for what can be used as a weapon focus?
If it's stuff that can be used as a weapon, then everything goes. Including loafs of Dwarf-Bread.
If it's stuff that is intended to be used as a weapon . . Well, everything you use as a weapon with the intent to do damage is intended to be used as a weapon right?

I'd like to point out that that doesn't even remotely fit the definition of 'intended to be used as a weapon'. Something intended to be used as a weapon is something which is designed and/or built with the purpose of being used as a weapon, not anything that you happen to be hitting someone with.

Of course, if you implanted metal bits in your hand and made them a weapon focus, you'd be using the Exotic Melee Weapon (Metal Bits) to hit with them, and they'd likely do something like Str/2-5 or so damage. Same goes with a weapon focus tattoo. You'd be using Exotic Melee Weapon (Tattoo) and do Str/2-6 or so damage. And gloves could perhaps use the unarmed skill, but they'd do the damage of gloves, which would be quite low, as opposed to the damage of the fist they are on (Just like how shock gloves do the damage of shock gloves, not of punching someone with them)

Seems like tattoos as foci will be a very case by case basis. Thanks for the input people

Stahlseele, there *are* rules for what can be a weapon focus (vague one, yes ), and using anything that's not a normal weapon (chainsaw) gets you an unwieldy Club focus. The question of glove weapon foci has never really been laid to rest, and the argument of basically enchanted *bits of crap* inside the skin of your hands is much weaker. That's what I'm saying: it'd be a stretch to call a magic earring inside your hand a 'weapon focus', so it's also a stretch to do the same with tattoos.

Oh? Cool, well, that's double settled then.

Makes me think of the Rood Inverse in Vagrant Story.

Um, there is precedent for an exotic weapon inteded for use as a punching object being used with the unarmed combat skill. Unless some errata removed Hardliner Gloves.

Yeah, and it is spesifically designed to be a weapon and specifically says that it uses the unarmed skill. That doesn't mean anything else besides your body uses the unarmed skill to hurt people with.

So enchant some hardliners?

Indeed

Personally while i'm aware there is some wonky rules precedent i'm against implanted foci of any type.

I wonder if you could make bone replacement a weapon focus...

Frosty has something like that i think . .
And i think i just figured out why a tattoo weapon combat would not be too OP . .
The only people who would get something like that are adepts anyway right? O.o
And they can do everything such a focus would do better with their own adept powers, right?

Except that they'd be able to use that in addition to their own adept powers.