I agree that the world as described in the books isn't as dystopic as it used to be. Mind you, I remember in 1990, when SR1 was released, there were people showing how the pollution would destroy the world in 2000. And Shadowrun was that future. Now, Shadowrun is still today's future but the world has changed. Some call it post-cyberpunk. It might make a little more sense in some areas to the cost of flavor.

But I still think the GM has enough leeway to interpret what's said in the books in a way that will make the world as dystopic as it used to be. In my alternate Attitude book I'm trying to describe a world that is dystopic but still makes sense and doesn't clash too much with established canon.

I'd rather eat soy than something fungus-infected (ergot poisoning is no joke) grown by an amateur farmer on best Redmond earth

as long as you have a mage near by that can do clean element(earth/water/air) all is good.

I chuckled, thanks.

Non-Soil Based Hydroponics.

It's not just for Mary Jane any longer!

Won't help you against pollutants in the air and water, plus their are a breeding ground for fungi and bacteria
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/coli-outbreak...ory?id=13812166


People tend to forget that "natural" does not equate "healthy", especially if done by amateurs with good intentions.

Dog poop is all natural, but you won't see me eating it.

You show me something that's unnatural and I'm sure someone will be willing to give you a prize for it.
Depleted uranium is just as natural as a beaver dam, after all.
This silly human arrogance of seeing ourselves and what we do as separate from nature confuses me.

Rutherfordium? Dubnium? Seaborgium?

None of them are naturally occurring anywhere in the universe.

Maybe you haven't seen me post too much, but I'm actually smarter than that. I was using the conventional term for everyone else's benefit. "Natural" or "Organic" in this context means that no hard pesticides or chemical treatments have been done to the plants.


Einsteinium?

When we make them, they are created through a part of nature, through a natural process, and are thus natural.

Naturally...

So coca cola is natural by that reasoning?

Anywhere that we have been able to get information from. for all we know "Dark Matter" could contain these and more elements.



Nothing is natural about that drek, no matter how you twist it.

So, I pick up the ball, and throw it to Naturally?

My favourite example for ridiculing the natural=good, "chemical"=bad faith is the chloride-based chemical preservative found in nearly every food

But BTT, I just had an idea concerning the sleazy fixers: Most runners who are just starting out will have some seedy thug as their fixer. And once they have some experience under their belt, who is the guy they can trust from experience?

Rutherfordium specifically has a half life of under 6 hours, so no, Dark Matter can't contain it (the "it emits radioactive particles" kind of precludes it from the "neither emits nor scatters radiation" definition).

Rutherfordium is also really, really dense, being Element #104, so probably hasn't been around since the dark ages of the universe.

Last week?

Except that those chemicals ARE actually bad for you in the long run.

True. Look at Diet Pepsi vs. Pepsi. The sugar replacement in diet pepsi has fewer calories, but the aspertame is more likely to cause cancer after a few (10-20) years.

Exactly.

A few friends of mine worked at a bread factory (NOT bakery!) and the stuff they were dumping into the mixing vats were labeled with so many warnings that they stopped shopping at the big grocery stores and started at the local bakery.

It's also one of the things I love about Winnipeg, a lot of locally-made goods are here. Food prices are a bit more than they were back home, but I'm pretty sure my bread isn't about to give me cancer faster than D20.

Always a nice thing to know. However, I prefer to not throw out my bread every day, as I will never eat a full loaf.

It's largely composed of carbon compounds, so it's "organic".

Arsenic is "Organic" and "All Natural" as well.

About the fixers. No fixer is alone, even the low end sleazy ones. He may not be part of an organization, but he isn't alone, his entire job is about not being alone. That low rent fixer in the barrens knows a guy in Lonestar, he has a friend in the supply depot at the local army base, he knows a chop shop crew, he has friends in doc wagon etc. He knows how to make friends and influence people, he knows how to keep under the radar and keep his lines secure. At the end of the day a fixer is just someone with a big Rolodex and a knack for putting the right people in that Rolodex together. There is nothing in SR4 that implies this would go away. Maybe they do things a bit different in missions but missions isn't all of SR4.

Salt is plain necessary for humans, but as usual dosis facit venenum. And even if our body did not require it, there is a reason why people use salt and other preservatives since millenia...Ironically, a lot of people have forgotten that because preservatives work so well and people no longer have half their neighborhood wiped out from food poisoning.

The thing about doses also applies to Aspartame: I you drank 50 l of diet coke a day, you will indeed have an increased long-term risk of several cancer and some other nasties. So better drink that much water, the water poisoning would kill you on the spot and thereby avoid any long-term effects.
If you drink it in normal doses, however, the few mg of Aspartame are in insignificant contribution to the carcinogenic substances we are exposed to every day from completely natural sources alone - natural radioactivity, the hydrocarbons responsible for the taste of cooked food, fungi and microorganisms on raw food...

He also probably knows a stock boy at the local Kong-Wal-Mart and can get you those bulk crates of ramen really, really cheap (After they've "Fallen" off the truck and aren't presentable)! Perfect for the Squatter-Low Lifestyle!

Last week > 6 hour half-life of rutherfordium.

$1stWeekday, 02:00

That's only 28 half-lives ago.
1 particle in 268,435,456 would still be around.

Such a Geek... Heh.

No, you throw the ball to Who.

As far as the main topic goes, mix to suit your flavor. Even in modern times there are plenty of people too poor to get by, earning minimum wage and living in one step shy of a commune because rent and property costs are too expensive. As somebody who's been in that sort of situation for a while now, I can tell you that concerns such as eating healthy are secondary to the concerns of eating and having a roof over your head. In a poor economy, it can be hard to get a job even at the bottom of the barrel for any length of time.

Take that, and magnify it to get the world of Shadowrun for an equivalent point in the future. There are many new advances, many shiny new gadgets, and some of that bleeds over into second-hand goods, and people who have inside connections, but that doesn't necessarily discount the suffering and despair that many people live in or scrape by with. After all, bad soy or empty carbs are better than hungry to most people. In a world recovering from such disasters and on the cusp of another indefinable and potentially greater calamity, who's to say what people are considering themselves lucky to have?