Hey guys,

I'm trying to build an assault rifle which can be fired one-handed.
I would like to get as much recoil comp as possible.

Does anybody happen to have a good gun build?
The max I can figure out is an Ares Alpha (~7 RC) with gas vent 3, personalized grip and shock pad.
What am I missing?

They can all be fired one-handed, and RC doesn't really affect it.

All the gun builds are basically identical, it's just a question of starting with the magic ones (like the Alpha). I think you left out the Foregrip, maybe, but if you're saying 'one-handed'…

Heavy Barrel & Auto-adjusting Weight

He doesn't really have enough mod slots, after getting GV3 and basically anything else.

Pg 148 of arsenal has all the modifications you can stack for recoil comp and the best i can figure is....

Auto adjusting weight 1pt for fist shot 2 for second shot or 2 for full auto
Some sort of stock either rigid folding or shock for an additional pt
Heavy Barrel for 1 pt
Gas vent 3 for 3 pts
and personalized grip for 1 pt

all in all gives you 7 pts + what comes w/ the gun all usable one handed.

You should give that page a read its really cool.

Also depending on your gm and it is missions compliant if thats important but on pg 163 of arsenal there is an optional rule that you can use your strength as more recoil.

There's also the option of overmodification as well. A heavy barrel with an auto-adjusting weight & gas vent along with the personalized grip & shock pad don't seem too outrageous to me as far as how the weapon is built (other GM's might feel differently, of course).

a Sling

Hough!
Medicineman

I suppose you'd be shooting from the hip, so a hip pad might be better than a stock?

Please check out the example on p.132 AR, it's pretty similar to your problem.
Full modding requires a facility and GM approval for that guy, as you're dealing with overmodification.



Auto adjusting weight and sling don't combine (p.148 AR)

No love for gyromounts? I mean, I know they're bulky and obvious but so is an assault rifle.

You can only have one gyromounted weapon, AFAIK, and I assumed the reason he wanted to one-hand the AR is for some preposterous dual setup.

I never said that they combine
Yesferatu's asking what's missing and a Sling might help with the Recoil
thats all
It might even look Cool (Invasion USA Style )

HokaHey
Medicineman

A machine gun looks a lot better in a gyromount. Gotta love the recoilless M202 right out of chargen. It even compensates running.

Check my sig and some of the automatics users for some premade guns. Here's what you are looking for (it has one mod slot free, actually, because the character I took it from is a troll and needed Metahuman Customization). RC is 2 (base) + 3 (Gas-Vent 3) + 1 (Shock Pad) + 1 (Personalized Grip)+1 (Underbarrel Weight), which is enough for Long/Short, but not Full. If you want to get an extra RC for full bursts, you can drop Chameleon Coating for Heavy Barrel.

Ares Alpha (1700) with Gas Vent 3 Accessory (400), Shock Pad Accessory (50), Underbarrel Weight mod (25), Chameleon Coating mod (1000), Personalized Grip mod (100)

Yup that's the the way to go with ARs. Too bad there isn't an Ares AR without the grenade launcher to be purchased by civilians.

Ares Bravo or Sierra maybe ?

He who dances a foxtrot with Charlie
Medicineman

I thought you are supposed to tango with Charlie

Both are just as forbidden as the Alpha even though the Sierra has an underbarrel that is only restricted and most ARs are only restricted.

Oh, UmaroVI, why are you so helpful?

Is the breakdown below accurate?
2 Ares Alpha (1700)
3 Gas Vent 3 Accessory (400)
1 Shock Pad Accessory (50) (or hip or sling)
1 Underbarrel Weight mod (25)
1 Personalized Grip mod (100)
Chameleon Coating mod (1000)
What's the total on that Alpha...8?

*Recoil compensation from an auto-adjusting weight, bipod, foregrip, gyromount, sling, tripod, or underbarrel weight are not cumulative with each other.*

I have armorer and a shop...so I should be able to add almost any mod or accessory.

Yep, that's correct. I think you can't sub the hip pad bracing system or the sling for the shock pad, though. Hip pad bracing system is only Heavy Weapons (which is...odd, since it means you can benefit when firing the grenade launcher on the ares alpha, but not when firing the alpha itself), and the sling accessory is completely different from the sling mod - the sling accessory doesn't give any RC.

My understanding is that you can not add either underbarrel mods or accessories to a weapon with an under barrel weapon. The reason is that the under barrel weapon mod forbids this and weapons that come with upgrades, like under barrel grenade launchers or gas venting, etc are considered to be modded for the sake of rules governing use and effects, though these mods don't use slots. See pgs 148 and 153 of Arsenal.
This would also mean no gyro mount for an Ares Alpha either as the gyromount attaches to the under barrel mount on the gun.

Yes, that's correct, you have to strip out the underbarrel grenade launcher to attach an underbarrel-mounted accessory like a Gyromount, but none of the mods or accessories on the particular gun in question use the underbarrel slot.

So what's the max on something like that - 8 Recoil comp?

Assuming the Alpha's UBGL can be stripped out. Which is a fair assumption, but not in the rules AFAIK?

What the OP should be worrying about is that you need two hands to properly fire the weapon, regardless.

You can remove it. Arsenal 148 says you treat anything like that as a mod, it just doesn't count towards the mod slot limit. So you can thus take it off like a mod (but you don't get to put 7 modification slots on now). It does fix incompatibilities, and occasionally things come with counterproductive mods you don't want like low-rating Gas Vent.

Arsenal 162 indicates that you can indeed fire that thing one-handed, you just take a -2 penalty (-1 if you are a troll). This probably isn't realistic but neither is anything else in the firearms system so meh.

Yesferatu - you can get way more than 8 recoil comp, but it requires that you either be using very particular guns (generally the HV ones), be willing to wear a Gyromount, or have inherent recoil compensation (high STR, foot anchors, cyberarm gyromount). Of course, more than 8 is not as useful unless you are using HV guns anyways (although it does cancel movement modifiers so there is that).

Cyberarm gyromounts.

Or the gyromount bracer that appeared in one of the NYC SRMs...

Truth be told...it's for a pintle/ring-mounted cycle. (core 171)
It needs to be one handed because I need to spend 1 complex action per turn (and presumably 1 hand) piloting the bike.
It's pintle/ring-mounted so I can remove it and run around with a gun (and also use automatics and not gunnery).
It needs to be an assault rifle for the increased range over subs and other pistols.

I'm honestly not even sure the concept is possible.

If it's mounted then either there's gonna be no recoil at all, or the cycle's body will be additional recoil comp.

AFAIK, Arsenal's weapon mount rules supersede the core book's. IIRC, this would fall to an External, Flexible, Manual weapon mount; regardless of mount type it takes 2 minutes to mount or unmount a weapon, though honestly I can't see why a special quick release option couldn't be possible with what you're trying to do (manual control & not a belt fed weapon). The weapon mount would be your 'second hand' in holding the weapon, so nothing special I think in using the assault rifle one handed then.

Unless you've got 2 IPs a turn, you're gonna be alternating between Piloting and Gunnery checks. Quite doable with magic, drugs, or cyber/bioware. Youcan even install a Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization mod and the cycle can then drive itself while you shoot.

Also, if range is of a major concern, and you've got the mod slots in the rifle available, take a look at the Barrel Extension; +10% to all weapon ranges.

A pintle mount on the front of the bike? Good times.

One problem, though - when a weapon is mounted, it always uses Gunnery. There's no getting around that.

Crap! I think you're right!
MOOT!

Don't forget about the humble "Gun Port" (Arsenal p.137) - gives 4 points of RC and doesn't require Gunnery.

On a bike? :/ I guess "it doesn't say you can't".

True, a gun port isn't disallowed to a bike by RAW, but it sure as hell doesn't make sense to me.

But even then you're still limited to two standard actions or a single complex action per IP, and the typical [N]PC as 1 base. Still going to either need to get a 2nd IP somehow, modify the bike to drive itself, or alternate turns shooting & driving to minimize your crash risk.

Go all out. Mount a Vindicator.




-k

Or use a Monocycle. That could totally have a gun port.

I see what yesferatu's getting at. He wants to be able to drop the gun into a swiveling mount on or just in front of his bike's handlebars, and reach forward, grab the handle, and rock and roll if need be, then yank it off for some handheld run-and-gun action.

The rules don't support it, but I can totally see this working - drop the gun into the mount and a clasp holds it tight. The bike itself is your recoil compensation - there's no way the recoil from an assault rifle's going to affect a motorbike and its rider. If I was feeling generous I'd say "no recoil, just like a mounted machine gun," but even if not, I'd say that you can use the bike's body as Recoil.

And of course, to pull it off should just be a complex action - push in the clasp release, yank the gun off.

Now, reloading while using it on a bike is gonna be a stone-cold bitch unless it's a bullpup, but that's for you to figure out. Might I suggest the multi-magazine mod?

My Solution: Add a Gyro to the bike. Use no hands to pilot it (and use Command to steer). Fire assault rifle 2 handed while sitting on the bike. Or standing if you prefer. This way looks cooler

Seconded, sort of.

Put a gyro and decent pilot on the bike, and just use both hands regulary, or a cyberarm gyromount. The advantage is that commanding your bike to move is now just a simple action.

If you decide your bike has a big windshield a firing port is now also prossible - just make it a hole in the windshield.

All it is a hole in the body of the vehicle to stick a gun in. In it's basic form it's just a metal square that you can jam a gun through and move about roughly 90 degrees.

So on the top of the handle bars you mount this metal box and ram your rifle through it.

Now, I would argue that there is nothing stoping the rifle from going flying during a crash or glitched driving test...

When I first read that, "All it is a hole in the body...", my first thought was of a hole someone would be jamming a gun barrel into the body of the motorcycle and firing.

That's it exactly, ShadowDragon8685.

I'm looking for a way of using an assault rifle on a bike without suffering the -3 from moving vehicle and reducing the recoil enough so I don't fall off.

I have wired II, so the extra IPs aren't a problem.
I don't mind it taking an action or two to mount/remove the gun.
I also don't want it to default to gunnery because I tied my gun to my handlebars.

Mr.__Joshua...the gyro stabilization won't work because of the -3 moving vehicle penalty. if the gun is "mounted" that is negated.
I just don't want it to be a hard mount.

I don't know of any way to specifically negate that -3 that doesn't involve needing Gunnery. Something like Heightened Concentration or Adept Centering would do it but you aren't an adept. My suggestions are:

1) Suck it up and learn Gunnery. Then mount something even nastier than an AR on the bike.
2) Just deal with the -3, and invest whatever resources to being better at shooting in general.
3) Instead of shooting a gun while the bike drives itself, drive the bike while the gun shoots itself ie mount a weapon and get a pilot program to be your gunner.

Nonsense; everyone knows installing ammo bins magically turns any weapon into a belt-fed model.

*dives for cover*

Only on weapon mounts. Then you wouldhave to use gunnery.

Even muskets!




-k