Full Version: Innate spell - broken?
Anti-vehicular rockets, explosives, hiding behind wards.
| QUOTE (Buster) |
| I totally agree with Synner, it makes no sense for APDS and shock weapons to work on spirits (except with the Ghostbusters angle on shock weapons). So iIf APDS ammo and shock weapons have no effect on spirits, is there anything a mundane can do against a force 8+ spirit besides speed-dial his mage friend? |
Having actually written the Street Magic Spirit section, I am unaware of Synner ever having said any of that. I am aware that he said that a Spirit's lack of nervous system should make them immune to the disorientation effect of shock weapons. As far as I know, they still do damage.
And AP rounds work fine against spirits. It's just another way to have a more damaging attack. If it makes you feel any better - AP rounds are probably made out of URanium in the future,a nd Uranium is confirmed to get "all screwy" with spirits.
-Frank
Mmmm..... DUDSAP rounds. (Depleted Uranium Discarding Sabot Armor Piercing.)
Chris
Chris
also, iirc, synner didn't make a ruling on anything, he gave a suggestion of how he would handle things. it wasn't a clarification, errata, and i don't think it's in the FAQ.
synner's words should really only be taken to be official changes when he is acting in his capacity as line developer... and sometimes, he's just another poster on dumpshock giving advice and such. (perhaps he should adopt something similar to the mod's colored posts to let us know when he's making an official statement =P )
synner's words should really only be taken to be official changes when he is acting in his capacity as line developer... and sometimes, he's just another poster on dumpshock giving advice and such. (perhaps he should adopt something similar to the mod's colored posts to let us know when he's making an official statement =P )
@FrankTrollman
My mistake it was Rob Boyle from this thread
http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...topic=17939&hl=
My mistake it was Rob Boyle from this thread
http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...topic=17939&hl=
| QUOTE |
from another post, please correct your Hymnal due the Lord Deity Figure has changed it. rotfl.gif From another thread relating to the one of the issues From Garrowolf's post: |
| QUOTE |
| (Garrowolf) Okay I decided to email Rob Boyle - the line developer for Shadowrun We have a lovely argument going on Dumpshock that I has hoping you could help us with. Can spirits take damage from non magical electrical damage? Can they be stunned at all for one? |
| QUOTE |
| (Rob Boyle) Yes, I would say they can take damage and their Immunity to Normal Weapons would apply. I would not reduce their Impact by half, though, since spirits don't really have armor in that sense -- the Immunity power is because they're magical and mundane attacks don't hurt them. I would also ignore the secondary effects of Electricity damage against them, since they don't have nervous systems. |
| QUOTE |
| (Garrowolf) So there you go. This is the word from the top. |
so, based on rob's ruling, spirits never have their armor reduced, except when it's ignored completely by magical attacks (because apparently normal means nonmagical)...
sounds like an absolutely terrible idea to me. may as well just throw APDS back into the trashcan if we're gonna do that... because hey, it's not regular armor, so why should APDS do anything to them? of course, by the same token, positive AP shouldn't be added in, so now let's bust out the new spirit hunting ammo... flechette!
also, why should spirits even have stun tracks! may as well just make them like vehicles, because how do you stun something that doesn't have a nervous system? how are you gonna punch something into unconsciousness when it doesn't have a normal anatomy, it's just a blob of spirit material
(in case my sarcasm isn't coming through, i'd like to make it clear: that sounds like a spectacularly bad ruling to me, and i wouldn't use it in a million years, because of the implications attached to it. i wouldn't even use it if it *did* make it into the FAQ or even the errata, which it hasn't to my knowledge)
sounds like an absolutely terrible idea to me. may as well just throw APDS back into the trashcan if we're gonna do that... because hey, it's not regular armor, so why should APDS do anything to them? of course, by the same token, positive AP shouldn't be added in, so now let's bust out the new spirit hunting ammo... flechette!
also, why should spirits even have stun tracks! may as well just make them like vehicles, because how do you stun something that doesn't have a nervous system? how are you gonna punch something into unconsciousness when it doesn't have a normal anatomy, it's just a blob of spirit material
(in case my sarcasm isn't coming through, i'd like to make it clear: that sounds like a spectacularly bad ruling to me, and i wouldn't use it in a million years, because of the implications attached to it. i wouldn't even use it if it *did* make it into the FAQ or even the errata, which it hasn't to my knowledge)
@Jaid
In that thread it was mentioned until it makes it way into a FAQ or Errata, no matter what a Freelancer or Developer says in forums or in email, it is still not official
WMS
In that thread it was mentioned until it makes it way into a FAQ or Errata, no matter what a Freelancer or Developer says in forums or in email, it is still not official
WMS
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| Mmmm..... DUDSAP rounds. (Depleted Uranium Discarding Sabot Armor Piercing.) Chris |
Erhh... you mean APDSDU used today with tank guns?
As for the electrical thingy, I don't see why spirits should be more vulnerable to nonmagical electrical attacks than anything else. Ruling out ALL kinds of armor piercing might be overkill, even though they may not make sense.
And I don't like the "oh no a super powerful spirit! Let's dump our assault cannons for a minute and pull out our 100 nuyen handheld tasers, only they are powerful enough to take on a force 12 spirit!"
I don't see why flechette shouldn't work as good on spirits as normal bullets though. Well, at least not if they actually have a magical reistance to weapons and not just extremely tough skin (like an armored truck has).
And I'm not certain that out of the box starting character SHOULD be able to handle a force 12 spirit with only mundane weapons. Without armor piercing they could still beat off force 6 at least. And a GM that sends a force 12 spirit on a fresh group might as well send a bunch of Tir Ghost backed by snipers and call it a day.
And you're forgetting an option: Attack of will. Suddenly the pornomancer becomes useful in fighting spirits!
Wow, according to that ruling, a Force 8 guardian spirit is an incredible threat to a party no matter what. INW - 8, Willpower - 8, Counterspelling - 8. Have fun getting your stunbolt resisted by 16 dice.
Chris
EDIT: The only time I've read about them, they were referred to as DUDSAP and used in anti-vehicle rifles, but I don't have a reference anywhere for that. I just remembered the DUDSAP because I thought it sounded cool.
Chris
EDIT: The only time I've read about them, they were referred to as DUDSAP and used in anti-vehicle rifles, but I don't have a reference anywhere for that. I just remembered the DUDSAP because I thought it sounded cool.
Rob's ruling doesn't seem to be very considered or thought out in this case.
| QUOTE (Fortune) |
| Rob's ruling doesn't seem to be very considered or thought out in this case. |
And considering that it didn't even get into the optional rules of Street Magic, I think it's pretty clear that he subsequently reconsidered.
-Frank
Regardless, I'm at least making tasers not halve armor on spirits (unless worn armor on flesh forms of course). I'm still not sure about stick'n shock, after all they are expensive and probably deliver their current without penetrating.
But to you technical people, what really happens of you fire a y2k taser at a Bradley IFV? Or a typical sedan? If a normal car can endure being hit be lightening, why not tasers or stun batons?
But to you technical people, what really happens of you fire a y2k taser at a Bradley IFV? Or a typical sedan? If a normal car can endure being hit be lightening, why not tasers or stun batons?
Depends on if you deliver the charge to the frame which would then ground out through the tires - worst case scenario melting your tires - or if you deliver the charge close enough to the on board computer to actually fry it and shut down the car, you would need a direct hit to the engine or something close to that.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| Depends on if you deliver the charge to the frame which would then ground out through the tires - worst case scenario melting your tires - or if you deliver the charge close enough to the on board computer to actually fry it and shut down the car, you would need a direct hit to the engine or something close to that. Chris |
Sounds like a case of "hit right and it might work." Which basically is like shooting someone with a light pistol.
Thus I think I don't want to halve armor before seeing if it penetrates hardened armor, but afterwards I can let it halve it.
To be fair I'd have to do the same to Lightning bolt/ball as well though!
Not if you think about it, the jolt from your average taser is nothing even remotely close to the jolt from lightning. One might fry your nerves enough to knock you down, the other might not kill you. Lightning has enough energy to cleave O2 into free radicals and create ozone. It is CRAZY powerful no matter whether it kills you or not. People survive getting hit by lightning, people ignore getting hit by a taser.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| Not if you think about it, the jolt from your average taser is nothing even remotely close to the jolt from lightning. One might fry your nerves enough to knock you down, the other might not kill you. Lightning has enough energy to cleave O2 into free radicals and create ozone. It is CRAZY powerful no matter whether it kills you or not. People survive getting hit by lightning, people ignore getting hit by a taser. Chris |
I haven't heard of many people who are able to ignore getting hit by tasers. They're able to walk away 30 seconds after the juice is cut off, but when hit they generally go down.
Ok, well, you know what I meant, and the one time I got hit by a police taser in class it hurt like hell but didn't drop me, but I am a complete freak of nature(literally, several one in a million genetic mutations) so I guess we can't go by me. Civilian legal tasers don't even bother me, neither does pepper spray... huh, I would be a really good mugger/rapist..... Anyway, ok, So, people survive lightning, and people are staggered by tasers.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| Ok, well, you know what I meant, and the one time I got hit by a police taser in class it hurt like hell but didn't drop me, but I am a complete freak of nature(literally, several one in a million genetic mutations) so I guess we can't go by me. Civilian legal tasers don't even bother me, neither does pepper spray... huh, I would be a really good mugger/rapist..... Anyway, ok, So, people survive lightning, and people are staggered by tasers. Chris |
I know lightning is alot more powerful than a mere tasers in electrical energy, but as you said most cars are designed to simply divert the current into the their tires/ground. Which is why I said vehicles and drones could be completely unharmed by being hit by a magical lightening bolt. (drones might work completely different, but let's call it abstract - most drones doesen't have that much armor to begin with, and a normal taser (DV8) could easily penetrate armor 9 (a lynx) without halving anything. As could a Magic 5 mage casting lightening bolt.
And don't you think a 150 nuyen taser should have a hard time taking on a 2.3 million nuyen thunderbird? If you let it halve hardened armor then only 2-3 normal grunts with tasers and SS could take it down in one round!
Cars are not designed to, but the skin effect typically means the current doesn't travel through the passenger compartment. But any electrical charge that can cross miles of air can go damn near anywhere if it feels like it.
A taser won't do squat, way too little energy.
A taser won't do squat, way too little energy.
| QUOTE (Jaid @ Oct 8 2007, 04:25 PM) |
| so, based on rob's ruling, spirits never have their armor reduced, except when it's ignored completely by magical attacks (because apparently normal means nonmagical)... sounds like an absolutely terrible idea to me. may as well just throw APDS back into the trashcan if we're gonna do that... because hey, it's not regular armor, so why should APDS do anything to them? of course, by the same token, positive AP shouldn't be added in, so now let's bust out the new spirit hunting ammo... flechette! also, why should spirits even have stun tracks! may as well just make them like vehicles, because how do you stun something that doesn't have a nervous system? how are you gonna punch something into unconsciousness when it doesn't have a normal anatomy, it's just a blob of spirit material (in case my sarcasm isn't coming through, i'd like to make it clear: that sounds like a spectacularly bad ruling to me, and i wouldn't use it in a million years, because of the implications attached to it. i wouldn't even use it if it *did* make it into the FAQ or even the errata, which it hasn't to my knowledge) |
You're thinking of the Hardened Armor power, not the Immunity to Normal Weapons power. Those two powers are distinct for a reason.
APDS and shock weapons do NOT affect creatures with Immunity to Normal Weapons.
For people who haven't read the book in a while, here's the rule:
| QUOTE (SR4 p.288) |
| Immunity to Normal Weapons: This immunity applies to all weapons that are not magical (weapon foci, spells, adept or critter powers). |
Now if you wanted to go Ghostbusters, you can houserule that you tweak your shock weapons to resonate with the psychoelectric ectoplasmic form of the spirit, thereby disrupting it. You can also houserule that your ammo is made from orichalcum or lunargent or some other exotic material that affects Immunity to Normal Weapons.
Thanks, kzt. Yeah, cars are not designed to ground out through the tires, that is just what happens because it's a big metal shell with rubber on the bottom. Yeah, a taser in today's world would have no chance against a car unless you actually attached it TO a part of the computer or directly next to it. However, I've got to assume that tasers become alot more lethal in 2070 because it does double the damage of a light pistol. Now, I've never worn kevlar and then gotten shot with like a Colt 1911 or any other light-ish pistol but I've seen the bruising that results from it and heard stories of it penetrating anything. I've seen taser burns and taken a taser hit myself and several civilian legal taser hits. Not even remotely comparable. The only damage from the taser was a tiny burn spot and one guy bruised his knee when he fell down. No so with the whole getting shot in the vest thing so I'm assuming that to bring the tasers charge up to triple shock = fatal they ramp the power up on them a ton so I dunno.
Anyway, with todays cars and so many of them being plastic alloys and composites that don't conduct electricity, lightning would probably just melt a hole in a newer car till it hit a still metal part then ground out, but it would have a much better chance messing a new car up than an old one.
Actually, come to think of it, can vehicles take stun damage? They don't have a stun damage track so shouldn't gel rounds, tasers, etc. bounce off no matter what? It doesn't make sense for them to convert up. Especially gel rounds, designed not to penetrate human skin they won't have a chance on even your average car window.
Huh....
Chris
Anyway, with todays cars and so many of them being plastic alloys and composites that don't conduct electricity, lightning would probably just melt a hole in a newer car till it hit a still metal part then ground out, but it would have a much better chance messing a new car up than an old one.
Actually, come to think of it, can vehicles take stun damage? They don't have a stun damage track so shouldn't gel rounds, tasers, etc. bounce off no matter what? It doesn't make sense for them to convert up. Especially gel rounds, designed not to penetrate human skin they won't have a chance on even your average car window.
Huh....
Chris
| QUOTE |
| However, I've got to assume that tasers become alot more lethal in 2070 because it does double the damage of a light pistol. |
If tasers have become more lethal then they are certainly less useful. Increasignt their intensity to compensate for a troll's mass is understandable (and may, as an unavoidable side-effect, harm human-sized targets more), but a taser is a very inefficient way of inflicting lethal attacks compared to a bullet.
| QUOTE |
| Now, I've never worn kevlar and then gotten shot with like a Colt 1911 or any other light-ish pistol |
You have an interesting idea of rating weapons if a .45 is a 'light-ish pistol.
| QUOTE (Buster) | ||||
You're thinking of the Hardened Armor power, not the Immunity to Normal Weapons power. Those two powers are distinct for a reason. APDS and shock weapons do NOT affect creatures with Immunity to Normal Weapons. For people who haven't read the book in a while, here's the rule:
Now if you wanted to go Ghostbusters, you can houserule that you tweak your shock weapons to resonate with the psychoelectric ectoplasmic form of the spirit, thereby disrupting it. You can also houserule that your ammo is made from orichalcum or lunargent or some other exotic material that affects Immunity to Normal Weapons. |
i'm thinking of both. if your definition of 'distinct' is that 'one explicitly uses the rules from the other', then i suppose you could call them distinct. i wouldn't.
and like i said, i'm not advocating the removal of immunity to normal weapons from applying to electrical and other elemental based attacks, i'm just advocating that the AP modification from those attacks applies towards immunity to normal weapons.
| QUOTE (Buster) | ||
| You're thinking of the Hardened Armor power, not the Immunity to Normal Weapons power. Those two powers are distinct for a reason. APDS and shock weapons do NOT affect creatures with Immunity to Normal Weapons. For people who haven't read the book in a while, here's the rule:
|
...so basically, nothing mundane, not even a Thor Shot™ can take out a spirit because it is not magically powered?
Now that does make spirits a helluva lot nastier in relation to the mundane world, since only a very small segment of the population can deal with them.
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) | ||||
...so basically, nothing mundane, not even a Thor Shot™ can take out a spirit because it is not magically powered? Now that does make spirits a helluva lot nastier in relation to the mundane world, since only a very small segment of the population can deal with them. |
see, the thing is, mundane weapons *can* hurt them. it's not really immunity, it's just extreme resistance =P
a thor shot most likely does at *least* 50P damage, i'm sure (probably more likely in the 100s) which means that it can damage any spirit of force 25 or less, presumably =P
I've always thoughts that ItNW was in fact a level of resistance against mundane damage.
Such that one could take a gun and if one shot well enough, one *might* hurt a spirit.
But if one were to physically attack said spirit with the same level of effort and success as was put into shooting the spirit, the spirit would be a world of hurt due to the "Attack of Will" that negates ItNW.
Such that one could take a gun and if one shot well enough, one *might* hurt a spirit.
But if one were to physically attack said spirit with the same level of effort and success as was put into shooting the spirit, the spirit would be a world of hurt due to the "Attack of Will" that negates ItNW.
I said light-ish. The one 1911 I ever fired had significantly less penetrating power than most of the other .45's we had available, maybe ours was faulty, I don't know. I'm not a gun expert, I just live in the southern US. I just assumed it had something to do with the modeling of the gun itself.
Anyway
Anyway
| QUOTE (HappyDaze) |
| but a taser is a very inefficient way of inflicting lethal attacks compared to a bullet. |
The thing is, in Shadowrun, it isn't. The only reason I can think of for that is that they significantly ramp up the voltage/amperage on them to the point where it is near lethal.
Take this example - Average Joe Ganger in an Armor Jacket, Body 3, Armor 8/6.
Shoot him 4 times with a Predator, we'll assume minimum skill needed to hit so 1 net success. Pred 6P AP -1 so Joe has to resist 6S(Armor 7 converts it down) with 10 dice, so average soak of 3, Joe takes 3 S 4 times and with a stun track of 10(willpower 3) takes 2 physical as he falls unconscious.
Shoot him 4 times with a Defiance EX-Shocker, minimum skill. Defiance 8S AP -half so Joe has to resist 8S with 6 dice. So average soak of 2, Joe takes 24S damage, with overflows his stun track by 14, with a body of three it also overflows his physical track and kills him.
This goes in the other direction with less armor, but the more armored a target is, the better a taser is than a bullet for killing it. So, since this is NOT the case in real life... They have done something in the next 63 years to change tasers from what we know.
Chris
Well if a shooter is shooting a Ares SuperSquirt loaded with Narcojet 10S. Unless the target has chemical protection or chemical seal, he has to reduce the 10 stun, at best a average person can reduce it to 7 stun. Targets armor does not figure into the reduction on his resistance on the toxin test.
I seem to recall in previous edition of SR squirt guns that could fire in burst or FA, now that would be nice.
To me electro stun devices/bullets etc will have no effect on a manifesting spirit, the same for APDS rounds. Yes a spell lightening bolt would effect them but none of the secondary effects would.
What does that mean, you had better have a mage or two, in your part when a enemy spirit manifests to kick your hoop, or some serious firepower.
WMS
I seem to recall in previous edition of SR squirt guns that could fire in burst or FA, now that would be nice.
To me electro stun devices/bullets etc will have no effect on a manifesting spirit, the same for APDS rounds. Yes a spell lightening bolt would effect them but none of the secondary effects would.
What does that mean, you had better have a mage or two, in your part when a enemy spirit manifests to kick your hoop, or some serious firepower.
WMS
| QUOTE (Jaid) | ||||||
see, the thing is, mundane weapons *can* hurt them. it's not really immunity, it's just extreme resistance =P a thor shot most likely does at *least* 50P damage, i'm sure (probably more likely in the 100s) which means that it can damage any spirit of force 25 or less, presumably =P |
...well taking "the letter" of the rule quote above into account, unless it there is some kind of magical component to the attack it would just bounce no matter how powerful it is.
On the other hand Hardened armour is affected by APDS, EXEX and weapon AP.
Just playing the "DA" on this to get a better understanding for I see two different theories at work here.
@WMS: That would be the Ares Cascade Rifle 3rd Ed CC.
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) |
| ...well taking "the letter" of the rule quote above into account, unless it there is some kind of magical component to the attack it would just bounce no matter how powerful it is. |
Of course, the quote is taken out of context and is only a tiny subset of the Immunity power. Immunity as a whole covers a lot of things, and gives Hardened Armor vs. the thing the critter is immune to. Two specific types of immunity receive special mention. Immunity to Age gets mentioned because you can't give armor vs time. Immunity to Normal Weapons gets mentioned not because it fails to follow the standard hardened armor rules for Immunity, but because they needed to clarify what is meant by "Normal." That is the part being addressed by the Immunity to Normal Weapons subheading, not the "Immunity" part, that part is made quite clear by the general description of the Immunity power.
It's all on pg 288, and all relevant powers are on the same page, no flipping required.
...so, if it in effect only grants a spirit hardened armour, then my Dwarf hunter can tag a manifested force 7 spirit with his EXEX loaded PJSS while making a called shot? Yes? No? Perhaps? Not in a million billion zillion years?
...put a lot of time & thought into the character concept.
...put a lot of time & thought into the character concept.
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) |
| ...so, if it in effect only grants a spirit hardened armour, then my Dwarf hunter can tag a manifested force 7 spirit with his EXEX loaded PJSS while making a called shot? Yes? No? Perhaps? Not in a million billion zillion years? ...put a lot of time & thought into the character concept. |
Assuming you meant materialized, then yeah sure why not? Even if AP modifiers from the weapon and ammo does not count, your base damage with 1 net hit is 13 (both barrels, thus you need 2 net hits to damage (or destroy) it.
If you allow AP, then you'd only need a single net hit. Heck, pre errata you could take on a force 8 spirit this way.
I'm still undecided wether to allow AP modifiers to apply to Immunity at all. Then again Spirits are tough enough already, and letting APDS etc. work will give even security guards a chance against spirits (well mid-force ones at least).
I would definitely say yes. Apparently a few people disagree with me. It gives immunity against all non-magical weapon, and immunity gives you hardened armor = to 2*magic
So, if it works against armor I would say it works against spirits with the exception of electrical secondary effects.
Chris
So, if it works against armor I would say it works against spirits with the exception of electrical secondary effects.
Chris
...I just want to be sure that my GM is on the same page (or at least know where that "page" is) before I introduce the character.
@FriendoftheDork: BTW I would think that using both barrels would count as burst fire since it is the additional round that ups the DV by +1 (which is why I never brought it up it in my posts). So with EXEX the DV would be 10, not 12. Without AP & the called shot modifier ("hit him in his mojo centre") , that would be sufficient to take down anything up to only a force 4.
The one advantage the character may have for being able to using the called shot are his Knowledge: Spirits 4 and Magic Background 4 skill.
@FriendoftheDork: BTW I would think that using both barrels would count as burst fire since it is the additional round that ups the DV by +1 (which is why I never brought it up it in my posts). So with EXEX the DV would be 10, not 12. Without AP & the called shot modifier ("hit him in his mojo centre") , that would be sufficient to take down anything up to only a force 4.
The one advantage the character may have for being able to using the called shot are his Knowledge: Spirits 4 and Magic Background 4 skill.
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) |
| ...I just want to be sure that my GM is on the same page (or at least know where that "page" is) before I introduce the character. @FriendoftheDork: BTW I would think that using both barrels would count as burst fire since it is the additional round that ups the DV by +1 (which is why I never brought it up it in my posts). So with EXEX the DV would be 10, not 12. Without AP & the called shot modifier ("hit him in his mojo centre") , that would be sufficient to take down anything up to only a force 4. The one advantage the character may have for being able to using the called shot are his Knowledge: Spirits 4 and Magic Background 4 skill. |
base DV of 10 is enough to damage a rating 5 spirit, because one net hit (required for you to actually be checking armor in the first place) brings the DV up to 11.
burst-based DV is not added, but net hit-based DV is.
...so, with his pool of 16 in Longarms (Sporting Rifles), he would effectively be able to tag a materialised force 6 spirit with some regularity (based on an average of 4 hits which would give him 3 net hits making it a 13DV).
Okay, I guess can live with that even without the -AP and called shot mod coming into play.
...just have to roll real good for those occasional force 7s that might pop up.
Okay, I guess can live with that even without the -AP and called shot mod coming into play.
...just have to roll real good for those occasional force 7s that might pop up.
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| The thing is, in Shadowrun, it isn't. The only reason I can think of for that is that they significantly ramp up the voltage/amperage on them to the point where it is near lethal. |
Occam's razor suggest to me that it's most likely because the designers hadn't a clue. Lots of things in SR make a lot more sense when you assume that they were idiocies that you should fix rather than features you should treasure.
OK, well, the only reason BESIDES assuming the designers are idiots where guns are concerned. KK is FotD your GM? I just ask because I'm curious. You seem to weight his answers heavier than most others and I was wondering if you just respected him or if he actually held some power over you.
Chris
Chris
Nope, nobody in my gaming group hangs out here. Though one or two looks around from time to time. It's probably just more of "great minds think alike". 
Well, I meant Kyoto Kid(Hence the KK) but that is good to know. I am also the only one from my gaming group to hang around here. One is too busy on movie and video game forums, another is too busy writing english papers(english major that takes like 6 days to write a damn paper- poor bastard) and the other two are in Europe right now.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (DTFarstar) |
| KK is FotD your GM? I just ask because I'm curious. You seem to weight his answers heavier than most others and I was wondering if you just respected him or if he actually held some power over you. Chris |
...only if I had billions of Frequent Flier miles. I believe he lives in Europe (judging by the location on his profile) and I'm half a world away here in Portland TT...er...Orygun (didn't see a response on the Demographics thread to confirm this).
As to weighting his answers, I didn't realise I was doing so. He has made some pretty good points in the past, some of which have led me to rethink and research things more, and yes, I do respect that.
K, just wondering since I had no idea where exactly your location was and you mentioned asking your GM then seemed to agree with him when he responded. Just wondering, thanks for the information.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid @ Oct 10 2007, 11:12 PM) |
| ...I just want to be sure that my GM is on the same page (or at least know where that "page" is) before I introduce the character. @FriendoftheDork: BTW I would think that using both barrels would count as burst fire since it is the additional round that ups the DV by +1 (which is why I never brought it up it in my posts). So with EXEX the DV would be 10, not 12. Without AP & the called shot modifier ("hit him in his mojo centre") , that would be sufficient to take down anything up to only a force 4. The one advantage the character may have for being able to using the called shot are his Knowledge: Spirits 4 and Magic Background 4 skill. |
Could point about the secondary shot, I agree it should count as "burst fire" for the purpose of armor penetration.
And BTW thanks for the respect
Yeah I live in Norway, so unless you guys want to spend 2k dollars to come here to play....
My players don't frequent these forums, and only one of them has recently become aware of it. And since I've banned him from reading my AAR (because of potential spoilers), there is not so much of interest for him here.
Me, well I love discussing RPG rules, get ideas to my campaign and learn the rules better. This place is great, and I find the posters here alot more intelligent and mature than players on other RPG forums I used to hang out on (notably WotC).
| QUOTE (FriendoftheDork) |
| Yeah I love in Norway ... |
I used to love in Norway, but it got too cold.
| QUOTE (Fortune) | ||
I used to love in Norway, but it got too cold. |
Actually loving keeps you warm over here
True enough, but since I'm not nearly good-looking enough to make a living out of it, there are times when the cold still applies.
...will be in Europe next summer, but alas, Scandinavia is not on the itinerary.
...would be kinda cool to drop in on a session though as I have pretty much everything in PDF format.
...would be kinda cool to drop in on a session though as I have pretty much everything in PDF format.
Exchanges like that are why I am glad I found this place. You guys amuse the hell out of me.
Chris
Chris
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) |
| ...will be in Europe next summer, but alas, Scandinavia is not on the itinerary. ...would be kinda cool to drop in on a session though as I have pretty much everything in PDF format. |
Hey cool. Hmm, I think it's weird that you guys think of going to europe as if going to a bunch of homogenous nations
Which country are you going to? There's a vast difference between say, Greece and Norway.
Oh and it's not so cold here in the summer anyway, at least not in Oslo.
| QUOTE (FriendoftheDork @ Oct 11 2007, 11:44 AM) |
| Hey cool. Hmm, I think it's weird that you guys think of going to europe as if going to a bunch of homogenous nations |
Hey, the majority of Americans can't even find their own country on a map, much less the continent of Europe. *weeps for the education system*
Hmm... new topic time, methinks. How well educated is the average citizen in the Sixth World?
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