Would like to hear what people think, havent asked my GM yet

STR+1 or STR+2 Stun, depending on the pistol maybe?

I thought it didn't, but it does actually appear on the Improvised Melee Weapons table on p. 11 of Cannon Companion. Pistol-whipping has a Reach of 0, Damage is (STR + 1)M Stun, and the skill used is Clubs.

While those figures seem rather sensible, as rules for SR melee weapons go, allowing defaulting to Unarmed at a very low TN mod isn't out of the question, or even allowing the use of Unarmed Combat directly.

And don't forget melee hardening (a gun design option in CC) or dikote. It'll add +1 power and help keep those skull thumps from knocking your gun out of alignment.

d0h, i forgot to add in M At least AE broke out the CC and looked up the right damage codes.

Thanks Austere Emancipator, I missed that.

Yer welcome. Anything I can do not to read more Rigger 3. I've got MIJI running out of my ears.

I'm just kind of curious: anyone considered allowing them to do physical damage at (Str-1)M, (Str)M with hardening? Perhaps Light, instead? Or, for that matter, allowing full sized weapons to get an additional +1 or +2 power?

(Before you start screaming about how guns aren't lethal in melee, let me just say you have no idea what a solid rifle butt smack can do to a person.)

Just tossing ideas out, in any case. Don't expect solid numbers.

Personally I couldn't agree more about the effects of a good butt stroke(hold the sodomy jokes thanks) but iirc virtually every blunt object does stun doesn't it? I suppose there is some game balance thing happening there, rather then real life physics. Just my thoughts however.

Yeah, there ought to be a way to do physical damage with blunt weapons, but I have yet to hear a house rule for it that I like.

I typically will let people choose to have a stun weapon do physical at half power. (just like bone lacing) It's not realistic, but I've always found it pretty balanced, gameplaywise.

For house rules, I still like mine, which simply extends Bone Lacing's ability to do Physical instead of Stun at half power. STR 4 guy with a pistol might not crush your skull and kill you easily (5/2 = 2M Physical), but a STR 10 troll with a 5kg modified Warhawk might (6M Physical).

Luke Hardison is a great guy. This message has not been edited.

Wow, I'd never noticed that about bone lacing. Sounds good to me.

Well, holy crap. That gets my vote.

Getting hit by a pistol should do physical damage. After all, while bullets wouldn't hurt him, a thrown gun would still make Superman dodge.

prehaps the power of the damage has to be greater than body + 1/2 impact armor to do damage code physical
and for those who love equations
(power> body +1/2 impact armor) if true damage is physical, if false damage is stun

just an idea, hit a normal human in the head with pistol and they probably take a M physical wound, hit an average troll in the head with a pistol and the troll will laugh at you, then kill you.

You know, the sad thing is this is one of the more broken things in the game.

Anyone, particularly and adept, with ambidexterity and 2 pistols, the pistols skill, and the clubs skill doesnt ever have to let go of their weapons to be a whirling blur of death.

Now coming to a game near you... anime characters.

A troll will also have no trouble resisting your, at best, 3M physical attack. That is a uselessly complicated mechanic for something already handled elsewhere in the rules.

Anyone think full size weapons should get an additional +2 power?

[edit]

Ain't my fault magic's broken.

I think the (STR + 2)M Stun they're currently at is enough. Although, even a fricken potted plant gets (STR + 1)M Stun, as good as an Extendable Baton.

I think with blunt weapons you are just required to hit them a few more times after they stop moving.

This post has been edited 'cause I can't read...

Thanks, AE.

Apart from Zazen in the fourth message, you're right.