So... just write it up that he was a barsark (no Hel...., yet). Then he got turned ("died" of the HMHVV). Then he aligned with Hel.

Or felt he had no other option and is currently trying to prove himself worthy of Valhalla.

In any event, my point remains that with most Charisma-based traditions you can use enough mental gymnastics to validate an Infected practitioner - Aztech and Black Magic are the easiest, with Shinto (follower of evil kami) and a few others following close, with others leading up the rear.

So far while the advice is helpful, I am a bit limited on how things are.

My books are only 20th Core, Runner's Companion, Arsenal, Augmentation, Unwired, Street Magic, and Running Wild.

Mystic Adepts in our version will work like this. If I am magic rating 4, I still get to roll 4 Dice for Spellcasting tests, but my force is limited by how much I put into the Mageside, so if I was a 2/2 split I would be normal cap 2, overcap of 4.

Also, no Nanotech, or the smallest drones are allowed.While wear using wireless technology it is only the mid 2050s.

Lastly while the character has become an infected, they do not fully embrace the fact they are a monster. They are not some cruel and fowl person and before HMVV they were actually (In my version) and Voodoo priestess who spent her time trying to help people.

I wonder how the loa feel about possessing vampires... something to think about

With traditions considering spirits to be entities rather then raw mana formed into expressions of their own will, there's usually a dialogue or relationship between the summoner and the spirit, how does the spirits react to your condition? how do you explain it to them? do you do things differently to please them?

Guys you are truly making me feel my age- which is NOT kind of you. becasue just reading the topic heading here made me think of singing dancing little people run amok, but clearly it is doable with in the rules.

Urm... What the hell?

Indeed.

a pc vampire adept? just make him a CZ and you're pretty much talking about what was used as an example of a munchkin character. but now it seems to be...legal.

It is Optional now. I have never been in a Game where it has been allowed.
And yes, it is a Munchkin's wet dream.

CZ? What am I missing here...? (Clearly too much blood in my caffeine system at the moment...I feel I should know this.)

Cyber Zombie.

right, if you wanted to describe something as over the top you started with a vampire cyberzombie mage/adept, and (for the real old timers) armed with a silvergun. (spelling on purpose)

I think I met that guy... On a RP server

:facepalm:

Yeah, I need a vacation....

See, you two use that as an insult. I don't view it as such. It is this fundamental difference between our opinions that is evidenced in every disagreement we have.

You two seem to view character optimization as some sort of weakness in character (whether personal or roleplaying), whereas I see character optimization as an insurance to have a character survive, even flourish, in a game, and in doing so be a more enjoyable experience. It's no fun playing characters that die frequently.

Munchkin is the dark side of minmaxing, optimising isnt a bad thing on it's own.
It's when consistency, concept and common sense gets superseded by numbers that the munchkin show his ugly face... Never pick up a duck btw

Enjoyable for Whom? I have yet to see any enjoyable Vampire Character. I have seen a few in play, just not at our table, and no, they were not enjoyable to even watch, let alone play with (No, the other players in the game did not like the Vampire, so it is not just my opinion here). *shrug*

There are concepts that should just not be allowed. Any Sentient Critter and Any Infected fall on that List for me. *shrug*

I have many Characters that Survive (and even Flourish) without having to use an Infected or Sentient Critter. If you have characters that are dying frequently, perhaps you should examine your playstyle a bit.

I can see no concept that becomes better by adding Infecte or Sapient Critters to teh Mix. All I see is a broken concept.

Sounds familiar...


And that is your fault.

EDIT: Speaking of which, if you two don't like the concept and can't think of anything constructive to say about it, then you're welcome to leave. This thread was created to get feedback about helping a character concept, and "that's too powerful, I'd never let it in my games," or "I've never seen one played that was fun for anybody," is not helpful. I've played a few Infected that were fun for myself and the group, so your limited experience is not the norm.

An opinion was asked for, and one was given. Get off the High Horse Neraph.

And it isn't my fault that I think Infected and Sapient Critters are Broken, because they are (as are many of the Playable Options from Runners Companion). See how many Topics are started about such things here on Dumpshock. From your Point of View, any Concept is better with an Infected. From my viewpoint, Infected are NPC races and should never have been allowed to be playable. *shrug*

Just becasue they are Different Opinions does not make anyone at FAULT (except for maybe those who thought that they were an option that should be added to the game as PC's).

You first.


It is your fault that you keep commenting on it, instead of just ignoring the threads (and there aren't that many on the subject)


When the premise was "can it be done" (implied 'is it too weak under these constraints?'), not "should it be done", going into the thread saying that the OP shouldn't play an infected is pointless. It is worse than that, not only does it not contribute to helping the OP, but it actually subtracts from the discussion by pulling it away from "how can I make a good character like this?" over to "Infected PCs, yes or no?"


It makes you at fault when you choose to attack the stated premise of the thread, when that was a thing set in stone. If I made a "how can I make the best Free Spirit character with 400 BP" thread, a reply that said "Free Spirit rules are stupid and shouldn't have been added. They should all be NPCs." is not helping, and it will likely pull people who would otherwise have helped into a discussion about the merits of FSPCs, making it harder to gain the wanted information.

FWIW, my crew currently runs with a Nosferatu Mage, & the character is not that powerful, he's probably the 3rd strongest person in the group. I'm not sure if thats because the player is toning down the abilities or what, but he is actually relatively weaker than my straight Elf character.

Not at fault, a fault.


He's toning it down, more than likely. I was in a game playing a nosferatu mysad and I was a support rigger. I only paid cash for the ability also - a good comm with sim module, a R6 Command program, a centralized TacNet, and a few aerial drones; the one I was jumped into providing command/control/oversight, and two equipped with Ares Alphas, one loaded nonlethal, the other lethal. When required I'd just remote command and be done with it.

My drones got broked and so I had to start showing up in person to the 'runs (GM wouldn't really let me have downtime required to replace the drones...) and I had to really take a back seat so I wouldn't outshine everyone else. That happens when you're tossing 20+ dice for Compulsion and Influence and you designed the character as a crowd control character.

EDIT: About the fault thing, here's a fault of mine - I cannot play anything that's short. I can't play dwarves or gnomes. I can't play kobold or poisondusk lizardfolk or halflings. I just can't bring myself to do it. It kind of stinks because in SR, dwarves have a=freakin'-mazing stats. I just can't do it.

Are you kids still having this discussion? Really? How about you both carry the argument somewhere else, where the rest of us don't have to watch? It's embarrassing.

How can somebody be at fault if he says X does (not) fit into my game...

Thats like saying: You are wrong, chocolate ice cream tastes great.

Well, if someone did say that chocolate ice cream tasted bad, they would be wrong.

/sigh. First definition, not second.


I agree.

@Neraph
So you are calling Tymeaus Jalynsfein "flaw"... Well, getting personal makes everything better, I guess...

No, I said that his inability to see a concept that uses the Infected or sapient critters as anything but broken is a flaw. As is my inability to play anything short. It's a flaw.

The word you are looking for is opinion...

That is a flaw, I love playing short characters! They're often underestimated.

Opinion works also, but it is a failing of someone if they cannot at least consider a concept. Aristotle said, "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."


I know! It's actually quite frustrating for me because I have a character concept for a Kobold Rage-Mage using Sorcerer and Barbarian in The Other Game, and in SR dwarves are just so stat-sexy.

In any event, does the OP have any other questions about being a Vampire MysAd?

Agree with you to 87%, accuracy of internet communication 75%...
I think I stop now, would only getting worse.

Heh... Not that I cannot entertain such a Concept, I just think it is Broken (Thus I do not accept it).
Sounds educated to me.

Can you accept the possibility that infected builds exist that are not broken?

I have yet to see one; Like Neraph has stated on more than one occasion, If the Infected is not dominating, it is becasue the Player chooses not to do so, not because the Infected is not capable of doing so. *shrug*

I might be interested in seeing one, though. Not that it will ever see play in a game that I run, however.

Any character can be 'dominating' if the player behind it wants to do that, even the most pathetic and weak character. Power is not necessarily a gauge of that. Personally, I'm not fond of most Infected being available as PCs, but I will readily admit that that is a holdover from knowing that Ghouls were the only Infected available for play in third. I'm getting over that though. Would be a good idea for you to try to as well.

Why? I don't even allow Ghouls, let alone any other Infected. *shrug*

While the discussion is nice, this thread is not about if ones group allows or disallowed infected. And Myself making an infected character is probably not going to be all that crazy compared to some of the PCs...two of the other runners currently terrify me with how powerful they are.

If not, we can declare this thread complete.

I would say that is is complete when it disappears from the front page, wouldn't you?
If people have something to say about the topic, whether or not the OP consents, it is not done.

Right, but for the last page + they haven't been talking about the topic, which is Help Me With My Vamp MysAd; the discussion has been about random, un-related things for quite some time now.

Which is quite okay.

Using only the sources you've cited, there's one modification that needs to be done to the build I've posted: Getting rid of Heightened Concentration. Which means that you'll have negative modifiers while sustaining spells, but Psyche helps with that. Limit yourself to ~2 sustained spells at a time, and you're golden.

For summoning/binding:
-Sustain Improved Charisma and bind away! If you really need to bind a high level spirit (which shouldn't be the case most of the time), sustain both spells, use Psyche, and burn Essence for a magic boost. Only do this if you're really being overshadowed by the other characters!

In combat, this usually means a combination of the following:
-Increased Reflexes (IP are just that necessary). You do start with a non-stacking base of 2 IP, which may suffice vs unaugmented mundane opposition.
-Physical Camouflage: The spell of choice vs numerically superior opponents. Remember that due do the cumulative negative dodge modifier vs multiple attackers, a flat penalty on the attacker's DP usually defeats Combat Sense. So swap out Combat Sense for Physical Camouflage.

For social situations:
-Improved Charisma + Physical Mask/Alleviate Allergy (if necessary)

TL;DR changes: Swap out Combat Sense for Physical Camouflage and exchange Heightened Concentration for 1 PP worth of powers of your choice. Good choices include Enhanced Perception 4 (bringing your DP up to 14 for hearing/vision and 11 for everything else), Kinesics 2 (a stacking +2 to all social skills), 3D Memory + Eidetic Memory (you're like an autistic savant without the drawbacks of being autistic). Or just use all points for spellcasting/summoning.

As for fear of the other runners outshadowing you: The build I've provided allows you to fight like yoda on crack with an IV of Red Bull, talk like the greatest of con artists, and be generally useful in all situations. You're Batman; with enough preparation (just follow the guidelines I've posted ), you can take on anyone. And I mean anyone.

I wish you the best of luck with your character. Please let us know how your sessions go.

Thank you again for the help Elfenlied. While I have done many characters that are non-magical, stepping into the magical side of Shadowrun was a little troublesome and having some good help is always nice.

So as far as I can tell, getting someone addicted to Renfield is the only way to really have a source of Essence without going around and permanently draining people of there essence. I will keep working at it because this character concept is getting a little harder to pull off but not impossible and I do think it would be a real enjoyment if I can get it to work right. I am probably dropping the voodoo tradition and the guns aspect of it since it is not really needed. I will probably be more focuses on magic and not waste points elsewhere.

What happens if you try to drain a CZ?
In theory that is... assuming you survive meeting him..

Chances are, he'll taste like really good beer?

Like I said, a 1/6 contact in addition to the Dependancy negative quality should work wonders.


They need Essence to drain. It wouldn't work, and you'd be in BC on top of that.