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Beta
I'd known that the kids would not match AM's negotiate roll (which is why I let the 100k stand as a baseline, although by standard rules it would instead have taken it to something like 30k. Possibly this is my personal "incompetent: negotiations quality showing through?). However I'd not actually rolled their side previously. With some various modifiers Seraphina rolls 9 dice:
S. Negotiate: 9d6t5 5 Pretty good, but nothing like the 9 that AM got. So in the end the teens don't wring any real concessions out of SIS.

There was a handy hand-out for the network on Brent's side of things, and I made a quick drawing in paint of what AM found on her side of things
- Brent side: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_KVOkBzU7k...iew?usp=sharing
- Team side: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZehfLk4EWi...iew?usp=sharing
Gilga
@beta what actions do I need to roll for a trace?

Hack on host and then trace action?
Tecumseh
Off-topic:

Has anyone here played through (or even just read through) Free Seattle?
Jack_Spade
Haven't even heard of it - what's it about?
Tecumseh
6E adventure (or series of runs) about Seattle breaking away from the UCAS.
Gilga
Oh wow, haven't read it but I planned for a similar thing to happen in one of my games.
Beta
Sorry for not responding yesterday: what AM did was fine. There should have been noise from going through the satellite uplink, but with her roll that wouldn't have changed anything!

basic IC up, sorry for the lack of ornament (late/tired). What is AM going to do now that she has a mark? Trace the location of the device?

============================

I've run through most of Free Seattle in my home game, and am running a modified version of one of the runs for Aria over on RPG Crossing (Aria really wanted a chance to play in 6e).

My opinion on it is that the runs are very thin, super short on complications unless the GM adds some. And their priority with words is odd, they seem to spend more time on the meets and background than on the actual runs. But the basic concept and selection of runs is reasonably solid. So basically solid bones, but needs more meat on the bones (especially the third one)
Gilga
Beta,
I was speeding things to keep the flow, but I am uncertain what set of actions are in the cards to find out where Bernt is kept.

My assumption was that the anonymizer somehow prevents the trace action, and that to properly trace Bernt AM would need to get to the other side of the anonymizer, and to do that she'll need a mark on the anonymizer.

Can you explain how you view this issue and what needs to be done to trace Bernt? I never encountered an anonymizer before.
Tecumseh
@Beta
Oh, I was aware of the Free Seattle game on RPG Crossing but I didn't know that you were involved.

I've heard similar things about Free Seattle, in that it could really benefit from some maps and more structure.

Do you have any advice that you would pass along to players running it? Contacts, knowledge skills, obvious things to avoid in terms of builds/backgrounds, etc.? Not spoilers, but hints you would drop?
Beta
Sorry for not getting to the computer yesterday.

Gilga: AM is on the right track. In broad strokes, with a mark she can look through the programming of the machine, find some sort of control file, and edit it. There are possible complications of a data bomb or the file being encrypted. (a data bomb may be improbable as it also destroys the attached file, which would presumably make the anonymizer useless, but AM may choose to be paranoid enough to check). Editing the file is what will do the magic.

--------------------------------------------------------

@Tecumseh not particularly? I think most pretty standard runners would do fine. Maybe the one note if playing 6e is to make sure to have some stealth (it is harder to get good skill coverage in 6e in some ways, so I've seen more 6e characters without the classic one point in stealth). Most of the included runs have some flexibility but there is a fight or two that are hard to avoid. I'd imagine a lot of GMs might add to some of the runs, so hard to know how it will really be.
Gilga
Matrix perception: 15d6t5 5 - look for a data bomb.

if there is a data bomb: 12d6t5 3 I assume there isn't for speed, but please allow me to spend edge if there is.
defuse data bomb edge: 9d6t5 3

Databombs resist if I recall correctly with a 2*bomb rating which is hits on the set databomb action so I am not sure how many dice to give the data bomb if there is one. I'll let you roll.



Alright first let's remove the protection on the file:
Decript file: 15d6t5 4
defense: 14d6t5 3
phew!

Next, let's try to edit the file:
Edit file: 15d6t5 6
defense: 14d6t5 5
Beta
I believe that Gilga was actually tracing Peshtigo, and I'd moved the sprite back to the cafe, so I had to add him returning to Brent.

Gilga may talk with Brent over the matrix. If she looks up the location or sends it back to the team and they look it up, it appears to be pretty much in the middle of nowhere in mountainous territory of the Salish-Sidhe nation, not too far from Seattle. Along a river, however, which would be consistent with Brent hearing water. A matrix search will bring up more information (how much depends on the search result, of course).
Jack_Spade
How far is that as the crow flies - or rather as the peregrine falcon?
Beta
It is roughly 160km ('about a hundred miles') straight line, add about 25% to go through the mountains in a pass at an elevation of only ~1700, instead of over the higher ridges. Call it 3 to 3.5 hours of steady falcon flight (they achieve much faster speeds when diving to strike, but their steady flying is not car-on-an-expressway fast). But note that it is thoroughly dark currently and Bobby would likely struggle to find his way over the wilderness as a diurnal bird. A great horny owl however would not mind the night, and is a fast traveler too, able to keep going at about 50 km/hr.
Gilga
Hi, I am not sure that communication is possible for AM with noise 8. She has 4 noise reduction and an R1 deck.
I think there is a matrix action to temporarily reduce noise with electric warfare?

Any suggestions for getting more noise reduction for the future?


Edit: Anyhow, once AM is back she'll do the computer search if we want to move things forward then:
Matrix search: 17d6t5 6

and three more searches: (5 hits, 5 hits, 6 hits).
Matrix search 2: 16d6t5+15d6t5+14d6t5 16
Jack_Spade
There's a dongle for more noise reduction - everything else is implants
Tecumseh
Wait, is Bobby transforming in the ice cream shop? Is he stripping in front of the kids?

I'm going to have Mato transition the scene outside so that Bobby doesn't become a registered sex offender. Mato also wants to have his say before Bobby flies off.
Tecumseh
Let's also come to an understanding of what's required for Mato and AM to get across the border.

My understanding is that to legally get across the border you need a visa. The SSC depends on a certain degree of tourism from Seattle (hiking in the summer, skiing in the winter, etc.) so these are readily available to those with SINs. I think our R4 fake SINs are good enough to get visas, but ultimately that's Beta's call. A roll could be made if we want to leave it to the dice. Similarly, whether visas would be available at 5pm on a Friday afternoon is a separate question. Also Beta's call.

If visas aren't available, we could smuggle ourselves across the border. The Chulos and/or Cascade Orks could help with that out of Carbonado, as they have mining tunnels that cross the border. But that's a slow process to drive there (at least an hour) and then also slow to drive through snowy mountains to get to the site in question. Bobby would be there long before us.

I'll say some of this ICly.
Jack_Spade
Oh, yeah, I should have probably added that Bobby goes to the toilet to do that.
Gilga
Not sure how security is over these borders but can we just fly over the border in a mountainous location where border patrol is unlikely? We have Troubles with the movement power, and AM has levitation together they get reasonably fast.
F5 levitation is like 6 kilometers per hour, and times 5 for Trouble helping we're at 30 kilometers per hour. Not as fast as Bobby (or as super Bobby) but perhaps fast enough for a magic carpet ride? + some invisibility?
Jack_Spade
Flying a car has historically not been a successful move (unless we encounter giant spiders, than this plan might have merit wink.gif )
In theory, Bobby could turn you both into mice and carry you in flight, while Trouble carries the bag with our cloths after us. But for several reasons, Bobby would not suggest such a plan.
I rather think this the time where you call on a contact to get an emergency visa. Andrew might be reasonably well connected for that (though we'd likely pay through the nose for that)
Mato has Brad Burns, or - if everything else fails - he could ask Chan Wu for a favor in exchange for a rematch.
Tecumseh
Tightness of the security is open to interpretation.

There's a fence for portions of the Seattle-SSC border, but it's a LONG border (relatively speaking) and some of it passes through rough/wilderness terrain. There are almost certainly gaps in it at places.

The fence has camera/sensors, but again these must register a lot of false positives given the tough terrain plus animals (regular critters, not Bobby).

There are probably some spirit patrols, but - again - it's a long border. I'm going to guesstimate it as 200km long, and that's not including the water portion of it. Even if the SSC has a 100 spirits patrolling the border (presuming a bunch of bound spirits, maybe some watchers), that still leaves large gaps between them. Same thing for drones. There will be drones, but how many and how far apart?

There are two large farming concerns cross the official border and are fenced in on both sides: Carnation Farms in Redmond and French W. Ranch in Snohomish. There's an adventure (in Sprawl Wilds?) that talks about one of these having a healthy side-business in smuggling across the border.

Really, the car is the hard part. Getting people across is easy; getting the car across is much tougher.

Sedans weigh about 1,300 kg. Add Mato and we're up to 1,400. Add AM and some gear and contents (like gas) and we're probably at 1,500. AM would need 8 hits on a levitation test to get the car over.

This stings a bit because I almost always take a Council Island contact for my PCs. I didn't for this game because I figured it wouldn't fit as well for a game about the Barrens. Naturally it's the one contact I need.

I think Captain Razak could be a possibility. He could probably call in some SDF/SSC favors.
Beta
A quick note that it is a holiday here (Happy Canada Day -- the 8th last one in the Shadowrun timeline!) and I'm taking tomorrow as vacation, resulting in my schedule usual schedule messed up. I might squeeze in a response later today yet, but a good chance it will be some time Friday.
Jack_Spade
I just realized, there is a much easier solution: Bobby can drive the car across the border - legally.
He has a regular SIN from the Sioux Nation. So he should be able to cross the border to Salish territory without a visa. He is a registered private detective, so he can say that he is on a business trip.
AM he could hide in the glove compartment as a mouse.

After crossing he can go off as an owl, letting you drive.

But for obvious reasons one of you would have to suggest that to Bobby, as he hasn't crossed any kind of border in human form for a while.
Tecumseh
Mato has a Sioux SIN too.

Whether there's visa-free transportation within the NAN is up to the GM. I don't think the books say. The nations are individual entities but are governed by the Sovereign Tribal Council so it's possible there are some reciprocal relationships.

Found the relevant section from the Seattle Sourcebook (p.12):

QUOTE
The Visitor Center also has representatives of the Salish-Shidhe Council to answer questions and assist those who wish to visit their nation. To do so requires a current passport file on your credstick and a transit pass, called a "blue ticket." The Council representatives at the Visitor Center can supply application forms to obtain a blue ticket, but application must be made in person at the Passport Lodge on Council Island. The island is in the southern portion of Lake Washington and is the center of the Salish-Shidhe representation in Seattle. A cab will take you to Council Island and drop you off in front of the proper lodge.

Countil officials on the island will take your picture, run an identity check, and ask what you intend to do while in their nation. You will receive your transit pass one day later. Blue tickets are good for a limited time only. Tickets for tourists are valid for one to three days, depending on the visitor's itinerary. You must display your transit pass prominently while in the Salish-Shidhe lands. Failure to wear the pass or to leave the Council lands when required can result in severe fines and even imprisonment.

But that's all from 2050, so 30 years prior. The process may have changed.

Here's the relevant section from Native American Nations, Volume I (p. 89):

QUOTE
In fact, certain tribes - most notably the Salish and Sinsearach - depend on tourism as a major source of income for their economy. Tourists who want to travel into the nation must have a valid passport file on their credstick. In addition, they must apply for a tourist visa and a travel permit. The visa is loaded onto the credstick. The travel permit is a blue badge that must be worn prominently at all times. Failure to wear the permit is punishable by fines. Illegal entry into the nation - in other words, being within the borders without a valid passport, visa, or travel permit - is a serious felony, punishable by heavy fines or imprisonment.
Jack_Spade
Atleast the "display on credstick" should be outdated - now it's running your persona visible, showing your SIN.

Shadows in Focus: Cheyenne has lots of mentions for needing visa crossing over from Sioux territory to UCAS and to a lesser degree to Pueblo. By its absense, I'd think that crossing to SSC is therefore not problematic (and considering that it's an important transit route to Seattle/the coast) I'd expect some bilateral agreements for free movement - IDK I'm used to Europe's freedom of movement between countries wink.gif )
Beta
I'm going to go with no visa needed between Salish-Sidhe and Sioux. UCAS still needing a visa.

PS. Still might want to do a matrix search on the location.
Tecumseh
I think Gilga already did:

QUOTE (Gilga @ Jun 30 2021, 09:07 PM) *
Edit: Anyhow, once AM is back she'll do the computer search if we want to move things forward then:
Matrix search: 17d6t5 6

and three more searches: (5 hits, 5 hits, 6 hits).
Matrix search 2: 16d6t5+15d6t5+14d6t5 16

Beta
Thanks Tecumseh, I'd totally missed those rolls (maybe I'd read before the edit? Not sure)

In the IC I'll refer to a map which you should be able to access here (let me know if permissions are not correct).

If it matters on the 'getting there' front, use the location of "Orion River Rafting" in Washington State. But the river map I've provided above doesn't match the river at Orion, so for anything more detailed than general location use the player hand-out map.
Tecumseh
Hopefully it's not premature, but I pushed things forward by driving us near the border.

I was going to have Mato show AM his Walther P118, but on her sheet she already has one. I thought Mato got one for being a Chasseur. Did AM get one too and I forgot about it? I won't have Mato explain it if AM is already familiar with it.

This "getting there" map cracks me up. It starts at Molly Moon, but the one in Seattle instead of the one in Bellevue (where we are ICly). I'm amused because the one in Seattle is five blocks from my place and is where I take my son to get ice cream. Just go a few blocks up Pine Street and you'll find me.

As for the routes, the southern one probably makes more sense in the winter so I went with that narratively.
Beta
I was just coming to maybe nudge the group towards the border and Tecumseh had already dealt with it -- thanks!

Just to make sure I'm reading this right, you are going with the gear that you brought the meet (no swing by SIS headquarters to change things up)? (not a problem, just want to make sure I have it straight)
Gilga
AM has the Walter since day 1, she bought the Ares Sigma along the line feeling like it would make more of an impression on the inhabitants of Redmond.
Jack_Spade
Bobby has his go-bag with all his gear (the only gun he has is a legal taser).
In it is his critter armor when he wants to go in as a mountain lion or as a black bear.
Turning AM and into a small calico
Enhance Body: 8d6t5 4
Shape change F4: 15d6t5 4
Drain resist: 14d6t5 3
No drain
Tecumseh
QUOTE (Jack_Spade @ Jul 4 2021, 11:44 PM) *
especially if you, as Bobby liked to do took the form of a chinchilla to chill on the main sofa.


This might be a throwaway line but I love it. It's evocative and makes me wonder about other "day-in-the-life-of" experiences at SIS: Bobby watching the trid as a chinchilla, Bobby bathing as an otter, Bobby hanging from the ceiling as a bat, Bobby curled up as a snake in a sunbeam, Bobby sleeping on the pillow as a hedgehog.

I think we have everything we want for crossing the border. We're probably not taking much for the same reason we didn't take much to Bellevue: to avoid security/scrutiny.
Tecumseh
Charisma 4 + Etiquette 2: 6d6t5 3 hits
Jack_Spade
Etiquette: 6d6t5 2

@Tecumseh
Yeah, everything except sleeping as a hedgehog. Still have to sustain my spell.
But I'm working on a solution for that too wink.gif

I think the greatest experience would be buying snacks and eating them as a small animal (being a mouse, sitting in a popcorn bucket and enjoying a movie)
Gilga
Composure for AM:
Composure: 10d6t5 3
Beta
I have a work crunch that is likely going to have me working the next few evenings, but I'll try to keep things moving somewhat.

You can drive to the general vicinity in a couple of hours easily enough, but I'll need some idea of your approach plans beyond that.
Tecumseh
Juggling work myself. Gilga got a post in while I was writing one so I didn't respond to her directly. I'll try to do that later.
Beta
Jack: not a problem to fly in, but Bobby won't get to the general area any faster flying than driving -- straighter route, but likely flying under 50km/h, and except for the second pass the Americar can do 80km/h+, so it balances out. I have no problem with him heading out early, just giving some flexibility if you want to be in on conversation, etc.
Jack_Spade
I'll accept that judgement if you say so, but by the rules, Bobby can move quite a bit faster:
Body 5 Agility 9 Reaction 7 Strength 2, Flying multiplication of 7
Translates to a fast movement speed of 9x7=63 m/round or 31 m/s or 112 km/h
A bit of love from Trouble with Movement brings that up to 672 km/h
Tecumseh
Well I would take the book's statistics as an abstraction. In real life, owls max out around 65kph and their cruising speed is more like 48kph. I think that's where Beta's numbers are coming from.

Trouble could of course boost that. I've always found Movement to be a bit of a tricky power as far as its implications are concerned. Just because you can fly at Mach 0.5 doesn't mean you should.

@Beta
Referring this this map, which direction does the river flow? The IC post suggests that it's flowing south and that the facility/zone/island are all downstream from the recreation ranch (hence the complaints about no going ashore, although that assumes that the ranch is their starting point and not their destination) but I wanted to confirm.
Gilga
@jack any reason to cross between the facilities? (and approach from another angel?) I have no problem Bobby doing it just asking (because AM want to avoid them altogether).
Jack_Spade
Basically: if either side spots an awakened aura in that general direction, they'll assume it's from the other one - and as long as that aura doesn't come closer to them, they have no reason to get alerted.
Jack_Spade
QUOTE (Tecumseh @ Jul 8 2021, 07:00 AM) *
Well I would take the book's statistics as an abstraction. In real life, owls max out around 65kph and their cruising speed is more like 48kph. I think that's where Beta's numbers are coming from.

Trouble could of course boost that. I've always found Movement to be a bit of a tricky power as far as its implications are concerned. Just because you can fly at Mach 0.5 doesn't mean you should


The fastest owl I know is the barn owl with 80 km/h. Sustained flight is tricky with hunting birds as they seldomly fly for such extended periods without rest.
Though I want to add, we aren't talking about normal birds, but magical optimized specimens (more body and maxed out agility)
The movement power must contain some effect to mitigate air resistance, otherwise a lot of it couldn't be used as it was in SR canon.
Tecumseh
I personally don't run Movement that way. It's a power, yes, but it has consequences. These consequences can be mitigated - my opinion is that the Guard power is helpful in this regard - but they still exist.

I actually don't know of any uses of Movement within the canon. There was once a panel of SR writers/novelists and I asked them if they use the rules at all while writing, i.e. to determine whether something would be possible or not given the game mechanics. They all said no, they just write what they want. I was disappointed in this because I like the fluff and mechanics to support and reinforce each other instead of contradicting each other, but their only rule was the "rule of cool". I actually got the sense that most of them didn't play the game at all; they were just familiar enough with the setting to bang out a short story or a novel. (I'm pretty sure Russell Zimmerman plays, but he wasn't on that panel.)
Jack_Spade
Yeah, a common problem with RPG writers - even the guys who make the rules don't read the other rules. Which is incredibly annoying if you read a story and it isn't internally consistent.

I'm of the school of thought that having a consistent rule system that you apply consistently will also improve the writing and cause fewer plot holes. Rule of cool is all fine for a scene, but rule of consistency creates great worlds.

That said, one use of movement was explaining how a dragon could teleport a bunch of runners out of harms way (ultra high force spirit used movement to carry them away - I think that was in a Denver adventure or something). Back then I thought, cool, but wouldn't that basically just be like being hit by fast moving truck.

Anyway, long speech short essence: I'm fine with Bobby not arriving much sooner than Mato and AM, but would like to retain the option for Bobby to move faster than a RL specimen based on the stats we get from Howling Shadows.

Beta
I'd forgotten that Trouble was using movement on Bobby. Yah, he will beat them by an hour if he wants (wildly hand waving the mix of Movement, limits of aerodynamics, altitude, cold combined with speed, and saying "eh, he gets there twice as fast" )

And yes, tactically he can move faster. I was assuming that he was traveling in a manner to avoid fatigue rolls, so assuming something closer to species mean travel speeds rather than looking up game stats.
Tecumseh
QUOTE (Tecumseh @ Jul 7 2021, 10:00 PM) *
@Beta
Referring this this map, which direction does the river flow? The IC post suggests that it's flowing south and that the facility/zone/island are all downstream from the recreation ranch (hence the complaints about no going ashore, although that assumes that the ranch is their starting point and not their destination) but I wanted to confirm.

Bumping this question.

QUOTE (Jack_Spade @ Jul 8 2021, 10:10 AM) *
That said, one use of movement was explaining how a dragon could teleport a bunch of runners out of harms way (ultra high force spirit used movement to carry them away - I think that was in a Denver adventure or something). Back then I thought, cool, but wouldn't that basically just be like being hit by fast moving truck.

It's funny you mention that because I think that was one of the explicit examples used in the forum I referenced. People were asking, "Isn't that teleportation? Teleportation doesn't exist in Shadowrun." And the writer's response was basically a shrug and, "Eh, dragon magic." Which, again, I thought was lame.
Beta
@Tecumseh sorry I missed answering that one. Yes, the river flows from The Wild Orc Ranch (none of the publicity photos show any orcs ...) downstream towards the island and beyond. The pick up point for rafters is a bit beyond the bottom of the map -- there is a calm stretch of the river near the bottom of the map, then one more set of white water and then another calm area with a beach where the rafts land. In the calmer area near the bottom of the map there are roads that come close to the river, but they are in Az or military land.
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