Okay first off more or less what magic detect spells can be used with-in the constition, to those that are protected by it.

Ohhh I'm behind the whole, you don't have a SIN you aren't protected.

I've always seen magic as being as illegal as any gun. Is there a place that actually goes over these things.

I also figure if it is against the law to use such things as mind probes spells. Or that they won't hold up in court. That an officer can get a warrant and find stuff that he can get his hands onto because the spell had in directed them to those things being around.

Anything Force 1 or 2 is legal, anything Greater requires a permit. Some people rule that Mindprobe is an Illegal spell, but to my knowledge this is a houserule.

As a note, Force 9 spells/foci/spirits have a negative legality code. Im not really sure what that means.

Oh yeah: Detection spells do not hold up in court - at least, not in the UCAS judicial system. I believe this is mentioned in one of the older sourcebooks, and might be in a 3rd edition one, though I'm not sure which (if any).

It' not a house rule, mindprobe is illegal because it violates the 5th amendment, self incrimination. Any evidence gathered as a result of a mindprobe is inadmissable.

Enforcement varies by spell type, too. If a LS mage notices detection or health magic floating around, he's less likely to pounce than if it's combat or the like.

What do you think all those Banshees underground at the Seattle HQ are for?

Edit: I'm pretty sure the Catalog spell's results would be legal. Admissible? Depends on how good your lawyer is.

To toss in one detail that may not quite be relevant and has not been mentioned, ritual materials for any combat spell are illegal. Even though a force 2 "slay cop" spell is somehow fully legal, it seems that there is no way you can argue self defense when you had to spend hours preparing the attack.

I may be wrong, but I believe that Slay Cop isn't a legal spell rules-wise unless cops have recently become a different kind of critter entirely.

Edit: plus that would open all sorts of restricted-target messes, like "Slaughter Cop" being used to weed out undercover cops in a group of runners, or "Slaughter Guy Who Sold Us Out" for weeding out the more traditional turncoats.

~J

Allright, let's see if I can shed some light on this topic with conjecture and opinion...

force 3+ spells and spirits are officially illegal in the UCAS. On corp property who knows? Heck, if Lofwyr (the corporate owner and CEO...his being a dragon for the purposes of this arguement is irrelevant) decides to he can change the laws of Saeder-Krupp minute by minute and have wildly inconsistant applications of the laws of the moment. In other countries who knows.

Any spell used to break a law may or may not be legal, but the law is still broken. For instance, use a force 2 magic fingers spell to steal something and you have broken the law regarding theft, but not regarding magic. Net result: 1 charge of theft. Use a force 3 magic fingers spell to steal something and you have broken 3 laws. Net result: 1 charge of theft, one charge of illegal use of magic, one charge of illegal magical knowledge without a permit.

Here's a scenario for you:

You cast a force 3 or higher spell in a public place, no one sees you do it on the astral. Can any follow up investigation determine the force of the spell cast? Or what type of spell? Or even the exact spell?

Yes, yes, and yes, because spells leave an Astral Signature for a duration afterwards. Not too long mind you, but the stronger the spell the longer the impression lingers. The metamagic Cleansing can erase such signatures, imprints, and temporary background counts.

How long after the spell is cast does it leave an impression for? Is it force in hours? I need to know in case I need to delay a forensic mage etc

Anothe note : all illegal actions performed using magic are treated as "with premeditation".

I didn't see mentioned yet in the topic, so: most legal information about magic is found in MITS.

Minor hair-splitting question:
I don't have my books with me, can someone give me a quote? I believe the quote is something to the effect of "...anything with an availability higher than 3 is illegal..." (emphasis mine)

The quote is "All spells, foci and spirits of Force 3 or higher are considered illegal"

Y'know, you're sitting there, you've got the book on your lap, you're copying out of it, would it be too much trouble to give a page number?
That's how referencing works.

How do you differentiate between a Force 3 bound spirit and a Force 3 free spirit? If a Force 3 spirit is illegal then wouldn't Buttercup be illegal?

You try telling her that.

~J

She'll make you double-post. Nasty stuff, that.

~J

It should be noted that the Meta discipline Cleansing allows you to clean all your astral signatures MUCH faster and easier but it's still very doable withuot cleansing, just takes 1 action per force and you'll have to clean every effect you've used. SO if you just cast 3 force 5 spells, you'll need 15 actions to clean up after yourself. Cleansing I belive does them all in 1 action.

Sunday

Actually, my reading of Cleansing is that it *only* clears away astral signiatures that are associated with a temporary background count. As such, with a few exceptions, only damaging spells, spells that cause intense emotion, and "extremely high-force spells" can be Cleansed.

Any other signiatures (such as, for example, the signiatures from invisibility or clairvoyance spells) will not be cleansed unless they exist in an area that has a temporary background count for some other reason AND that background count fits in the criteria for erasure using the Cleansing technique.

I dont think thats clear at all. Reread the section on cleansing. What seems pretty clear is that the primary effect of the technique is to remove temporary background count, and that astral signiature erasure is a side effect of that removal.