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Flames
In the shadowrun universe everything has ben switched over to the metric system (a system i like but cannot grasp very well).
My problem runs into when we get into fights, having many enemies and several players to keep track of is kind of wierd when nobody is really sure how long a meter is.
So, would it be feasible to play with yards or keep trying to hammer out meters?

how does it work for everyone else?
Toshiaki
Yards are close enough to meters that you shouldn't have a problem with that.

More precisely 1 yard is 0.9144 meters, so it shouldn't throw things off too much.
MYST1C
QUOTE (Flames)
how does it work for everyone else?

Well, living in a country where the metric system is standard I have absolutely no problems with it. biggrin.gif

To me the imperial system is far more alien.
Take distance:
12 inches = 1 foot; 3 feet = 1 yard; 1760 yards = 1 mile
vs.
100 centimeters = 1 meter ; 1,000 meters = 1 kilometer

Or weight:
16 ounces = 1 pound; 32,000 pounds = 1 ton
vs.
1,000 grams = 1 kilogram; 1,000 kilograms = 1 ton

I'm glad the scientific community chose the metric system as standard. Having to keep all these weird conversion factors in my head would drive me mad.
Fortune
QUOTE (M$T1C)
32,000 pounds = 1 ton

Um, a ton (in the States) equals 2,000 pounds.
MYST1C
QUOTE (Fortune)
QUOTE (M$T1C @ Feb 13 2005, 11:50 PM)
32,000 pounds = 1 ton

Um, a ton (in the States) equals 2,000 pounds.

My bad, it's 32,000 ounces not pounds..
But the conversion alone posed a problem for me:
The converter I used offered two different "tons" (long and short).
Which is the right one and what's the purpose of the other?
And do I have to use "troy" ounces or "avoirdupuis" ounces? Why are there only "avoirdupuis" pounds?
Questions over questions...
Fortune
Haven't you heard the expression 'size doesn't matter'?
mfb
divide meters by 3 to get an approximation of the distance in feet. that, or use google.
Crimson Jack
I wish metric was the standard here in the States. Its far easier to understand in concept, despite the fact that I'm inundated with inches/feet/miles/pounds. centimeters/meters/kilometers/kilograms just messes me up when it comes to specifics on how they relate to our standard.

Who's responsible for this mess? smile.gif
Rajaat99
I blame the English. biggrin.gif
Iagree, it would be nice to have the metric system, but I know aprox how far a mile is from my house. A Kilometer, I have no clue. Which I pronunce wrong anyway. I say it like Kill-O-meter.
BishopMcQ
I generally adopt a standard if using a grid layout for combat.

1" square=1 m

This lends itself to fairly large maps, so occasionally I adjust to 1"=2m

If you have D&D damage and are looking for 5' squares, then simply say that each one is 1.5m as that is the approximation used when D&D was translated to French.
Nikoli
as i create my maops in Viso, I draw in Meters but add a grid of 1" = 5' so mesh with the figurines we use.
Zephania
Don't blame the english for the imperial/metric mess, the french rocked the boat with their damnable easy to use metric system.
TheWinningLoser
Metrics. Simple.
Imperial. Not simple.

The only real reason the US doesn't use the metric system is that 98% of the population is too lazy to get up and re-learn how far they have to get off of their fat asses to have to drive to work. Or McDonalds. Or the Fridge. Or anywhere. Let's face it, we just don't want to get off of out fat asses.

Food should come to us. The whole 32.4 decameter long trip.

(figure that one out!) ohplease.gif
Rajaat99
QUOTE (TheWinningLoser)
Metrics. Simple.
Imperial. Not simple.

The only real reason the US doesn't use the metric system is that 98% of the population is too lazy to get up and re-learn how far they have to get off of their fat asses to have to drive to work. Or McDonalds. Or the Fridge. Or anywhere. Let's face it, we just don't want to get off of out fat asses.

Food should come to us. The whole 32.4 decameter long trip.

(figure that one out!) ohplease.gif

Eh, why learn something new when we don't have to. Other countries should learn the imperial way. Why is it us being lazy, I think it's everyone else.
Alright, alright, I'm being an ass, I know. grinbig.gif
Maimer
I take a general rule that 1 yard = 3 feet. In reality, 1 yard equals like 3.??? feet. Not that it would make that much of a difference really. Since I try to keep with the whole numbers, this offers the easiest conversion for on the fly computations of distance between different people in parties that are fighting it out.
Fortune
QUOTE (Maimer)
I take a general rule that 1 yard = 3 feet. In reality, 1 yard equals like 3.??? feet. Not that it would make that much of a difference really.

Um ... One Yard does equal three Feet in reality. You might be thinking of a Meter, which is equal to 3.28 Feet, or 39.37 Inches.
Link
QUOTE
A Kilometer, I have no clue. Which I pronunce wrong anyway. I say it like Kill-O-meter.


It is kil-o-metre.You pronounce it properly, but can't spell it. biggrin.gif

I learned the complexities of imperial to play AD&D. I knew the basics (for a metric nation, we still use a lot of imperial here.)

QUOTE
when D&D was translated to French.


I doubt there is an english version of D&D in metric, which is sort of funny - there must be a few english-metric countries?
Fortune
QUOTE (Link)
It is kil-o-metre.You pronounce it properly, but can't spell it.

It varies according to where you are. Most places I've been pronounce it as kil-OM-etre. wink.gif
creepwood
the problem is probably the accentuation on the word kilometer. en english it's on the second syllable. en swedish it's almost always on the first syllable. making it very funny when swedes try ti prenounce indianapolis and equilibrium nyahnyah.gif

anyway, if you're more fluent in the imperial system, instead of on the fly conversions, convert everything else to the imperial, like weapon ranges and and movement, then you won't need to recalculate during game play.
LordFarlander
Just my $0.02 on the whole "US dosn't use metric" problem (being someone in the US)...

Imperial system confuses me to no end. I still don't understand the liquid measurements, and I grew up here, my parents are from here, etc. I have no idea how many pints are in a gallon or however the stupid system goes. Milliliters to Liters? Easy.

What gets me is when people here say the metric system is "too hard." Where they paying attention AT ALL in school? How is converting centimeters to meters hard, when you compare it to how many inches to yards (and remember, inches has FRACTIONS, not decimals...)

My rant is over. Long live metric (I wish this stupid country would wise up and get with the program. The military uses metric, a lot of government work is done in it, why can't the populace get with the program? Is the country really filled with idiots? Maybe I need to move...)

I guess my rant wasn't quite over... biggrin.gif
Fortune
QUOTE (LordFarlander)
... and remember, inches has FRACTIONS, not decimals...

Where did you get this from?
SirBedevere
M nuyen.gif$T1C, the short (US) ton is 2000 pounds, the long (British) ton is 2240 pounds. That's pretty close to the metric tonne of 1000 kgs, that's about 2200 pounds.

I grew up with the Imperial system and it was hell to learn. I still remember chanting tables of measurements. Does anyone know that a 'rod, pole or perch' is 10 yards long? Does anyone care? Even at the time that I was learning it the measurement was completely obsolete. grinbig.gif

I use the metric system but I have trouble thinking in it. I know what distance a mile is but I don't 'know' deep down what a killometre is even though I can calculate in them. wobble.gif
Aardvark892
QUOTE (LordFarlander @ Mar 28 2005, 09:13 PM)
Just my $0.02 on the whole "US dosn't use metric" problem (being someone in the US)...

Imperial system confuses me to no end.  I still don't understand the liquid measurements, and I grew up here, my parents are from here, etc.  I have no idea how many pints are in a gallon or however the stupid system goes.  Milliliters to Liters?  Easy.

What gets me is when people here say the metric system is "too hard."  Where they paying attention AT ALL in school?  How is converting centimeters to meters hard, when you compare it to how many inches to yards (and remember, inches has FRACTIONS, not decimals...)

My rant is over.  Long live metric (I wish this stupid country would wise up and get with the program.  The military uses metric, a lot of government work is done in it, why can't the populace get with the program?  Is the country really filled with idiots?  Maybe I need to move...)

I guess my rant wasn't quite over...  biggrin.gif

"The military uses metric, a lot of government work is done in it, why can't the populace get with the program?"

Actually, we here in the US Military do not use the metric system. All of our measurements (at least in the U.S. Air Force aircraft maintenance field) are English measurements and SAE (Standard of Automotive Engineers) such as 3/4", etc.
Nikoli
The metric system is the tool of the devil!
My car gets 40 rods to teh hog's head and that's the way I likes it.

Seriously though, just most folks have issues whenever they try and switch to teaching the metric system in the schools
Edward
[Quote = Rajaat99] A Kilometer, I have no clue. Which I pronounce wrong anyway. I say it like Kill-O-meter.[/quote]

Considering the history of the word, Kilo meaning thousand and meter being the basic unit its quite understandable.

Perversely I find in Australia that both methods are used, although an imperial ruler is getting hard to come buy when somebody over the age of about 30 estimates a distance they do so in feet and inches, cups, tea spoons, or kilograms, as appropriate. This can quite confuse some of the younger individuals.

Australia speaks English and uses the metric system, as dose England itself but we just get the American copies of D&D shipped over with imperial measurements. For some reason star wars D20 was set in metric however.

Edward
Grinder
QUOTE (Nikoli)
The metric system is the tool of the devil!
My car gets 40 rods to teh hog's head and that's the way I likes it.

rotfl.gif

Abe, right? Love that guy smile.gif
Nikoli
Just a quick nerd note.
40 rods to the Hogshead would equate to roughly 0.001984127 MPG

(Rod is 16.5 feet, Hogshead is 63 gallons)

My car, at roughly 29 MPG
gets around 584640 RPH (Rods per Hogshead)
Birdy
QUOTE (Fortune)
Haven't you heard the expression 'size doesn't matter'?

Yea, there was a guy who claime that. But his girlfriend disagreed smile.gif


Now back to the MKS-System. It is actually very simple. Basics are Meters, Kilograms and seconds.


Kilo = x 1000 so a Kilo Meter is 1000x1 Meter
Dezi = / 10 so a Dezi Meter is 1Meter / 10
Centi = / 100 so a Centi Meter is 1Meter / 100

1 Liter is 1000cm^3 (1000 Quibic-Centimenter) and 1 Liter of Water = 1 Kilo Gramm (1000 gram)
1 metric ton = 1000kg

The system is actually quite nice and straight forward. Makes scientific stuff easy since everything is based on MKS be it electrical resistance, be it burn values of food.

Now lets confuse the stuff:

+ The public still uses old measurements like the pound (1/2 kg = 500grams)

+ The public still works with kilokalories instead of kilojoule (and drops the kilo)

+ In-House Pipes still have an inch measurement but are right-fastening. Outdoor pipes are metric


Birdy




Bullet Raven
QUOTE (Fortune)
QUOTE (LordFarlander @ Mar 29 2005, 12:13 PM)
... and remember, inches has FRACTIONS, not decimals...


Where did you get this from?

Inches are divided up into Sixteenths of an Inch rather than 'milliinches' or whatever they would be called nuyen.gif
nezumi
QUOTE (Nikoli)
My car, at roughly 29 MPG
gets around 584640 RPH (Rods per Hogshead)

Really, that's a little clunky there. I'd go with 36 HKRPH, where HK is Hexakilowhatever (16,000). Sure, the math is a little ungainly, but a lot fewer decimal places and none of that damn liberal metric trash.
Fortune
QUOTE (Bullet Raven)
Inches are divided up into Sixteenths of an Inch rather than 'milliinches' or whatever they would be called

I never said anything about milli-inches. I do contend that inches can be stated as a decimal though, and not just as a fraction. 1.5 inches is as valid a way of describing a specific measurement as 1 1/2 inches.
Bullet Raven
QUOTE (Fortune)
QUOTE (Bullet Raven @ Apr 28 2005, 12:52 AM)
Inches are divided up into Sixteenths of an Inch rather than 'milliinches' or whatever they would be called

I never said anything about milli-inches. I do contend that inches can be stated as a decimal though, and not just as a fraction. 1.5 inches is as valid a way of describing a specific measurement as 1 1/2 inches.

I didn't try to imply that you did smile.gif It was a vague guess at what we could call the unit which makes up an inch.

and of course, 1.5 inches is correct, but check out most rulers; the inch is divided by fractions, the hint is in the fact that you used a decimal point, what with it not being decimal and all. smile.gif
Crimsondude 2.0
QUOTE (TheWinningLoser)
Metrics. Simple.
Imperial. Not simple.

The only real reason the US doesn't use the metric system is that 98% of the population is too lazy to get up and re-learn how far they have to get off of their fat asses to have to drive to work. Or McDonalds. Or the Fridge. Or anywhere. Let's face it, we just don't want to get off of out fat asses.

Food should come to us. The whole 32.4 decameter long trip.

(figure that one out!) ohplease.gif

I don't think the brush you're using to paint an entire country with is big enough.
mfb
you sound suspiciously like you're not bashing the US, crimson.
Crimsondude 2.0
Yeah, I'm stupid like that.
The Other DSE
Actually, I'm sure that you will see the US switching to metric. It's just going to take a few people of vision...

i.e:

A couple of corporate CEOs who realize that they can make a bundle on
a) replacing all of our road signs at taxpayer expense
b) creating all of the "Your New Metric System" Propaganda/Teaching material (at taxpayer expense of course)
c) fleecing consumers by charging the same $1.00 for a 500ml drink (the current 20 fl. oz drink is something like 540ml I think )

Once these visionary people understand this concept they will get some brilliant corrupt, err... crusading politicians to point out that the lack of the metric system has in fact been the reason that all of the US jobs being outsourced to India and other places.

Once Americans truly understand that learning the metric system is our patriotic duty so that we can show up all of those darned furriners, we will rise up and go the extra mile.... er... kilometer.

And if that doesn't work they'll just announce that the French really don't want us to use the metric system....

So, uhm, was that cynical enough for everyone?

The Other DSE
Nikoli
Sad thing is, they tried most of that the first go around. You still see a few road signs in both Km and M, at least here in Georgia. There used to be a lot of propaganda in the 70's about the Metric system, it just never caught on.

Pthgar
I heard (from my father-in-law, so it is probably suspect) that one reason the U.S. was resistant to the metric system in the 60's and 70's was the Cold War. Some in the government thought that if the Soviet Union invaded, it would confuse the foot soldiers if our road signs and directions were in Standard Units instead of Metric.

-Russian paratroopers in an Illinois corn field-
"Where is Chicago?"
"200 km North-East."
"Wait, that sign says 200 em - eye, not kilometers."
"What's an em-eye?"
"Hell if I know"
"We'll just wait for our Lieutenant to tell us where to go."
"Hey, why are those peasants pointing guns at us?"
"What are you talking about? Those aren't guns. Civilians can't own..."
BLAM
"Ivan?"
BLAM

Thus the US wins the Cold War.
Austere Emancipator
QUOTE (Yeah)
Thus the US wins the Cold War.

That's without doubt the best war strategy I've ever seen.
Aku
haha i'm still laughing at that

What the hell's an M-I?!
The Other DSE
I'm not positive, but I believe that the signs in Georgia that are in both miles and kilometers are left over from the Olympics in Atlanta.

There's actually one as far north as Tennessee since there were some events held up in Bristol.

Nikoli
Oh yeah. Problem is, they weren't very complete on the task. A lot of stuff is still in SAE.
Pthgar
Really, I'm ambivilant on the issue. I grok Standard and Metric so I can live with both. I think the schools around here (Detroit) might stress Metrics alittle more because of all the back and forth with Windsor. We have the busyiest border crossing with Canada.
With the US and Canada forming the UCAS, I find it totally believable that the new country would go over to Metric.
Crimsondude 2.0
Yes, we should acquiesce to the unit of measurement used by a country with 10% of our population. Riiight.
Pthgar
I'm coming from the point of view that most Americans recieve education in Metrics in the 4th-10th grades, more if they do college prep science. How much instruction do Canadians get in Standard Measurment Units? Probably not that much. I could be wrong, as I said, I think we may have got more Metrics in the Detroit area.
Crimsondude 2.0
I'm not denying that we had to learn metrics, specifically for HS chemistry and physics, but hubris outweighs all logic and common sense.
mfb
QUOTE (Austere Emancipator)
That's without doubt the best war strategy I've ever seen.

you dare belittle the sacrifices made by such heroes as Jennifer Grey and Charlie Sheen? blasphemer !!
Crimsondude 2.0
That movie never existed. You're hallucinating.
Pthgar
QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0)
I'm not denying that we had to learn metrics, specifically for HS chemistry and physics, but hubris outweighs all logic and common sense.

oh, now that you put it that way, yeah frell the metric system. I like inscrutable units of measurement.

I'm not the only one, nor is it limited to Americans.
Here and here.
Bullet Raven
QUOTE (Pthgar)
QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0 @ May 7 2005, 12:06 AM)
I'm not denying that we had to learn metrics, specifically for HS chemistry and physics, but hubris outweighs all logic and common sense.

oh, now that you put it that way, yeah frell the metric system. I like inscrutable units of measurement.

I'm not the only one, nor is it limited to Americans.
Here and here.

Nooo!!! at least use a SHADOWRUN swearword!

frell.......... sarcastic.gif
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