Ok, new edition, big changes. The topic of the ED crossover has been briefly mentioned. Let's get dirty...

What about the future of the crossover? Will Immortal Elves be suppressed in SR4, or will they continue to prosper? Will Dragons still battle over ancient schemes, or will they turn to more current politics?

Or will the ED crossover be even more obvious? We haven't seen anything of Windlings and Obsidimen in the current information but... who knows?

Having no real info at all, I'm going to go on record as saying that there will be at least the same level of Crossover info if not less. I suspect the trend is to make SR more accessable to new players, all the ED/SR stuff (as much as I personally love it) doesn't help that.

That being said, I think that the metaplot of the GDs and IEs hiding a coming apocalypse will be kept. It's just too good for conspiracy theories.

I recall reading somewhere that no Obsidimen survived the fifth age, and that likely no T'skrang did either. I think that the direct references to ED will be played down (the GDs and IEs will still be around of course, but I think there will be less emphasis on the coming Horrors. The Sixth World is still quite early in the mana cycle).

I rather hope that they don't do anything too radical that might mess up the year 7864 campaign I'm running.

I like the Earthdawn Crossover info in Shadowrun, but I like it used very sparingly in the background, and very vague.

I really hope they drop the whole Earthdawn crossover. It is neat now but when I was a new GM it was the most frusterating thing in the whole world.

These are just my two "monetary units" or do you prefer ?

If they`re gonna take on more ED elements in SR, i would like to see more and more adepts entering the picture since all of the characters in ED we`re Adepts(in a way) or Mages.
This would offcourse make SR more than different, but it would kinda fit.

Although I believe even in ED, adepts (magically actives, all PCs were adepts) only made up 1 percent of the population, just like in SR.

I think that it was slightly higher siince it was jsut past the highpoint of the cycle. But I don't have a reference for that, so I could be wrong. But I don't think it was anymore than 2%. It's just that all PC's were adepts.

I don't think 5 years should have much effect on even this apparently highly-accelerated mana cycle. Unless there's some magical wackiness going on in the 5 years we don't know about yet. The last run-up to the Scourge was like a thousand years.

The mana cycle covers such a long period of time that 5 years is negligable, assuming that the increase in mana is gradual and unifornm and does not have sudden jumps.

And we know from Shadowrun that there can be sudden jumps, there have been two in the last 50 years.

I kind of hope that when the Matrix suddenly goes down, that the IEs experience something akin to Krystal Nacht. Not regular elves, just the IEs. I think the dragons should be concentrating on the moment they're in, the present and work their machinations from that point into the future. The past is the past and honestly, I like the obsidimen as much as I do Immortal Elves, which is to say, not at all. Earthdawn is part of a separate company now, I don't think Fan Pro wants the additional complication of negotiating over copyrights to mar SR4s release. Just my 2 .

Sorry. I like both the IEs and the GDs. Let 'em keep on keepin' on, I say.

I think the amount of crossover is just about at the right level right now.

I agree with Garland. I dion't really like all they have done with IEs, but I don't like some things about other areas of the game either. But without IEs adn GDs, SR would miss somehing. They should not increase it too much, but ... well, they should not simply write them out either.

I never like the whole Immortal Nazi Elf thing, but dragons are kinda cool. They add a real big fantasy feeling to the cyberpunk-world of SR, so they should be kept in.

Sprite Rites Now!

Or the sonic gun from SOTA64...

I really think that the separation between ED and SR is good right now, and they should not be brought back together. When ED was first released everyone was smacked around the head with very broad "go buy Earthdawn to find out more about the magical history of the world" hints.

I read that FanPro (or Wizkids) now own ED again, but that LRGames still write the story etc. I noticed a reference to spell matrices in SOTA: 2064, but it was very light and seemed to be in there for the old school fans of both systems.

Since the mana cycle is supposed to take several thousand years, and the Sixth World is still pretty early on in it, I think it would be ill advised to get too heavy into ED metaplots. I'm hoping that the threat of Horror Shenanigans will be one of the things that kind of gets wrapped up in the intervening five years. Maybe Dunkelzahn gives them a good slap upside the head, and they all stay put in their home plane until another few centuries into the mana cycle.

I do hope that the crossover continues to evolve and strengthen without becoming overt.

~J

i don't mind hints of it. i don't mind it showing up once in a while in the novels. but SR doesn't need another friggin' Harlequinn's Back.

Sorta agreed. I love Harlequin's Back, but it should be at least another half-decade before anything else like it happens.

~J

eh. i read through it, and i honestly don't see what's so great. a few interesting themes, but poorly-planned and muchly railroaded. it should have been a novel.

If you have a good GM running it, and when they run it, you don't know that it's 'Harlequinn's Back,' it's a blast. When I got my hands on a copy and read through it, I was a bit disapointed.

Same with Harlequin [the first] though... actually same with most of the adventures.

s'why i like the adventure tracks. so much easier to adapt. and, added bonus? fewer NPC stats to be mangled.

Tracked can be good, agreed, better than modules for the most part. But at some point I'd rather have YotC style books... Hey, I just realized YotC is a location book (sure, temporal location, but still...).

i'm very pleased with the SotA books, and hope they become the backbone of the SR release schedule with SR4. i mean, nine times out of ten, there's something in there for everybody.

*Hiss* SotA book (singular) is just fine. SotA books (plural) is one of the worst things I can imagine for the system. Instant power creep, just add water.

~J

possibly. however, if you expand the concept to include things like politics, gangs, locations, etcetera, it becomes less scary.

Admittedly two data points is one too few to start building trends from, but neither SotA:2063 nor SotA:2064 are the kinds of things that I would want repeated, much as I liked them (well, '63 at least. I haven't read most of '64 yet.).

~J

Weird. They're two of my favorite books. A chapter for everyone, a chapter for no one in particular, at least as much world-view info and background as rules, all sorts of mini plot hooks and potentials for games, plenty of shadowtalk...what's not to love?

Power creep. Newer, more powerful gear and magic. All well and good in a single book, but in a recurring sourcebook, especially a yearly one?

~J

You call it power creep, I call it the name of the book -- SotA. It's always been a part of Shadowrun, the scramble to keep up with the tech curve. The books just enforce that, in their way; if you want to have the latest toys, you want to have the latest toys. It takes something that's difficult to create IC and creates it OOC, for us. I kinda dig that, actually, as long as there's something for everyone (and I think there has been).

nope. i want the horror thing pretty much ended, all the way. tired of 'em.

Sorry, I like a little nihilistic, otherworldly evil from time to time. It appears we must agree to disagree.