NightHaunter
Apr 16 2005, 09:58 AM
Critias
Apr 16 2005, 10:28 AM
Elmore's cover for 1/2. Classic stuff.
Hasagwan
Apr 16 2005, 10:46 AM
I gotta go with 1/2 as well. 4 is a good deal better than 3 was but it still looks a bit cartoonish.
RunnerPaul
Apr 16 2005, 11:28 AM
I know. The cartoony covers just really put me off. The cover art for 4 isn't too bad though, and it nicely echos Elmore's.
Personally, of all the SR product I've seen, I love the following covers and would love to see more in the same style:
- Larry Elmore: SR1/SR2 corebook, Native American Nations Vol. 1
- Janet Aulisio's SR2 GM screen
- John Zeleznik: SR3 Shadowrun Companion, Neo A's Guide to Real Life (My all time favorite), Downtown Militarized Zone
- Steve Venters' Sprawl Sites
- Luis Royo's Fields of Fire
- Christopher Moeller's Shadows of North America
Though to be honest, my dream artist for a new SR cover would be Tim Bradstreet.
Grinder
Apr 16 2005, 11:44 AM
Tim Bradstreet doing the cover would be awesome
NightHaunter
Apr 16 2005, 11:57 AM
Luis Royo.
That would be good.
Critias
Apr 16 2005, 12:42 PM
Okay, maybe I'm just missing it, but I can't find a link to the new cover art. I don't see anything for it on shadowrunrpg.com, either.
Austere Emancipator
Apr 16 2005, 12:57 PM
QUOTE (NightHaunter) |
Luis Royo. |
Talk about elf porn...
Pthgar
Apr 16 2005, 02:49 PM
Grinder
Apr 16 2005, 02:59 PM
QUOTE (Austere Emancipator) |
QUOTE (NightHaunter) | Luis Royo. |
Talk about elf porn...
|
Kagetenshi
Apr 16 2005, 03:05 PM
1/2. 3 isn't bad either, but for some reason I really don't like the SR4 cover.
~J
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 03:34 PM
QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
1/2. 3 isn't bad either, but for some reason I really don't like the SR4 cover.
~J |
For me the troll's head looks...like some sort of horror from CoC.
Maybe it's just the angle, or it will look better fullsized when we can see more detail, but it doesn't really look close enough to being human to be called a humanoid.
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 03:36 PM
Better than the massive cockup that SR3's cover, but still very disappointing. Especially with current books using better art.
Demonseed Elite
Apr 16 2005, 03:50 PM
If I had the say on the SR4 cover, I would have gone with someone no one has mentioned yet. Klaus Scherwinski, who did the
Shadows of Europe and
Schockwellen covers. I love his SR covers, and I think he does metahumans without making them look awkward.
hahnsoo
Apr 16 2005, 04:59 PM
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite) |
I think he does metahumans without making them look awkward. |
I agree with this sentiment, although I always thought that he underestimated the sheer destructive power of a Thor shot (at least, that's what I assume he's trying to portray there... maybe it's actually a targeting laser for the Thor Shot).
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 05:14 PM
QUOTE (hahnsoo @ Apr 16 2005, 10:59 AM) |
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite @ Apr 16 2005, 10:50 AM) | I think he does metahumans without making them look awkward. |
I agree with this sentiment, although I always thought that he underestimated the sheer destructive power of a Thor shot (at least, that's what I assume he's trying to portray there... maybe it's actually a targeting laser for the Thor Shot).
|
That would be one bizatch "targeting" laser.
It doesn't look like i'd expect a Thor (projectile) weapon to either, plus there is the second one that hasn't really done any visible destruction yet.
I think he might have been doing some sort of non-canon energy beam. Like the Ares laser pack weapon, only airborne vehicle mounted.
But his metahumans, ya I like those.
P.S. Elmore'- stuff always strikes me as...static. Like i'm looking at statues rather than living beings. I think it might have something to do with the very fine detail and exteme Realism bent that he paints with. Of course that ninja-nympho-elf in the SR4 looks really awkward the way she is floating above the ground. Once again when we get to see the fullsized version maybe it'll look better.
Kagetenshi
Apr 16 2005, 05:25 PM
I'm not a fan of the SoE cover either, though the Schockwellen cover looks neat (I'm not a fan of it as a cover, but it'd look great as a full-page inside a book somewhere).
~J
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 05:27 PM
Maybe, but I doubt it. I agree that it lacks dynamism and motion, among many other things. Art was one of the Very Big Things Wrong with SR3, and, at this point, I think we'd better get set for a repeat performance which I find remarkable, given that people like Klaus Scherwinski, Adi Granov, are available, active, and have done damn good Shadowrun (not to mention other) work before.
hahnsoo
Apr 16 2005, 05:29 PM
QUOTE (blakkie) |
That would be one bizatch "targeting" laser. It doesn't look like i'd expect a Thor (projectile) weapon to either, plus there is the second one that hasn't really done any visible destruction yet. |
The only reason I mention Thor shots is because I think that Schockwellen deals with the Proteus/Ares conflict, which involves an Ares Thor shot against a Proteus Aquacology.
DragginSPADE
Apr 16 2005, 05:32 PM
Well, the new cover is a big step up from SR3. Still doesn't equal Larry Elmore's cover though.
Kagetenshi
Apr 16 2005, 05:33 PM
Who did the Queen Euphoria cover? That's far and away one of my favourites.
~J
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 05:35 PM
QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
Who did the Queen Euphoria cover? That's far and away one of my favourites.
~J |
John Zeleznik. The google is weak with this one.
Demonseed Elite
Apr 16 2005, 05:36 PM
QUOTE |
P.S. Elmore'- stuff always strikes me as...static. Like i'm looking at statues rather than living beings. |
Elmore's art is very neo-classical. The reason why you feel like you are looking at statues is because neo-classical art was inspired by the classical sculpture of Ancient Greece and Rome. The sharp perspective lines, subdued statue-like skin tones, and almost "epic" posture are signs of neo-classicism, and are very evident in Elmore's works. The thing about neo-classicism is that it is built on the idea of presenting clearly "idealized" heroes, which is why I never really thought it worked for Shadowrun, but why I think it works so well for Elmore in fantasy RPGs, especially games like Dragonlance.
And can you tell I'm writing a paper on this topic that is due tomorrow?
Kagetenshi
Apr 16 2005, 05:36 PM
The Google is fickle, and every now and then she will abandon one of her followers to their fates.
~J
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 06:38 PM
QUOTE (Demonseed Elite @ Apr 16 2005, 11:36 AM) |
QUOTE | P.S. Elmore'- stuff always strikes me as...static. Like i'm looking at statues rather than living beings. |
Elmore's art is very neo-classical. The reason why you feel like you are looking at statues is because neo-classical art was inspired by the classical sculpture of Ancient Greece and Rome. The sharp perspective lines, subdued statue-like skin tones, and almost "epic" posture are signs of neo-classicism, and are very evident in Elmore's works. The thing about neo-classicism is that it is built on the idea of presenting clearly "idealized" heroes, which is why I never really thought it worked for Shadowrun, but why I think it works so well for Elmore in fantasy RPGs, especially games like Dragonlance. And can you tell I'm writing a paper on this topic that is due tomorrow? |
Thanks for helping me to understand what i could feel all these years.
EDIT: Hmmm, maybe I could have worded that better? It sounds like i'm waiting for someone to call for a group hug.
Demonseed Elite
Apr 16 2005, 07:17 PM
Hehehe, no problem. I'm just psyched that I could apply what I'm writing my paper on (the Neo-classicist art of Jacques-Louis David) to a thread on Shadowrun cover art.
For a really staggering example of Elmore's neo-classicist inspiration, compare Elmore's painting,
Teamwork, to Jacques-Louis David's famous neo-classicist painting of Napoleon,
Bonaparte Crossing the Saint-Bernard Pass, done in 1800.
Anyway, no more procrastinating, back to my paper.
TimeKeeper
Apr 16 2005, 08:07 PM
If "Teamwork" is the offical name for the SR1/2 cover (I'm getting some wierd russian? 403 error) then it looks like he ripped the styling of Dodger right from Napoleon. Just remove the horse, put a jack in his hand and get him to look a little to the right.
But the style of the colors... I definately see a similarity there.
Maybe I'm partial, but I still prefer 1/2 over 3, but at least 4 is a step up (for me anyway).
I think Royo needs to stick with Heavy Metal. That way you can expect the fully armed/armored guys and chicks with no clothing and feel normal about it. He's a great artist in all aspects but what he draws doesn't fit with the theme.
Personally, Presscot is one artist I really don't care for. I thought his work was ok for Hunter, but for SR it just makes it feel too cartoony.
Who did the peices inside the SSG? The ones with the wierd angles (Like to two chicks fighting in the back alley. One just hit the other with a bottle and it's contents are in mid flight.) or the whole calm after the storm (another piece where a group is standing over a body. One is holding a smoking gun, and the body's head has a new hole in it.). I kinda liked those.
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 08:12 PM
No, this is Teamwork. His SR work isn't up on that site.
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 08:25 PM
Here is a tiny image of his SR cover. Could you get any more Eighties without putting Pat Benatar, Duran Duran, and Tubs & Crocket in the background?
P.S. I have a confession to make, I never really liked the skull with horns logo. It just always made me think of spagetti westerns or something.
Wounded Ronin
Apr 16 2005, 08:33 PM
The only thing that is important with cover art is punk rockers with uzis.
blakkie
Apr 16 2005, 08:42 PM
QUOTE (Wounded Ronin) |
The only thing that is important with cover art is punk rockers with uzis. |
With that SR4 cover the dorf looks suspisiously "phat", and while the guy with the uber machine pistol guarding rear is wearing army surplus boots his long coat looks more like a
paisley print, insulated smoking jacket than something a punker would wear.
Patrick Goodman
Apr 16 2005, 08:46 PM
QUOTE (TimeKeeper) |
Who did the peices inside the SSG? The ones with the wierd angles (Like to two chicks fighting in the back alley. One just hit the other with a bottle and it's contents are in mid flight.) or the whole calm after the storm (another piece where a group is standing over a body. One is holding a smoking gun, and the body's head has a new hole in it.). I kinda liked those. |
The former appears on p 119, and appears to be a Karl Waller piece. If the latter is the piece on p 103, that one appears to be by Kjell Eriksson (if I'm reading the initials right).
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 08:49 PM
Who did the piece with the troll (or orc?) and elf holding eachother in the section on gender, race, and sexuality? Was a small picture. Around page 50, maybe?
Patrick Goodman
Apr 16 2005, 10:12 PM
Dunno; the pic's cropped, and it looks like it took the signature with it. And I imagine it's an ork, just by the general size.
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 10:36 PM
Damn. Been wondering that for a while. If you ever run across a full size version and/or who the author was, let me know?
Patrick Goodman
Apr 16 2005, 10:55 PM
Y'know, there are only about half a dozen artists in the book's credits. You could conceivably Google each artist's name and check out their websites, if such exist.
Arethusa
Apr 16 2005, 11:15 PM
Tried that. Only two have pages, and a third with a page going up in a year. Narrowed it down, but I couldn't find much beyond that.
Sepherim
Apr 17 2005, 12:29 AM
Well, I must admit I haven't been able to see the SR 4 cover (computer problems), but SR 1/2 have always been way superior to SR 3 in the cover art. Still, I'd say that the best cover for any book that I own is SOTA: 2063, with the guy waiting just outside the fence, ready to go in. It has tons of details, but it doesn't look so static, it's just, like, ready to bounce. And SoE's cover is great too, but I like better some of the inside artwork, though.
Vuron
Apr 17 2005, 12:34 AM
For me Elmore has really dropped of in quality in recent years his art for DnD3.0 was pretty awful for the most part.
Personally Royo art just bores the hell out of me.
Of people who've done SR before I really like Andy Brase and Prescott
Thinking outside the box there are a variety of artists that I think could do some very interesting near future/fantasy style work.
Kieran Yanner has done some interesting realistic yet fantastic work
http://www.kieranyanner.com/Atilla Adorjany
http://www.600poundgorilla.com/Talon Dunning
http://www.talonart.com/Kalman Androfsky
http://www.horhaus.com/weblogs/kalmangalle...lery/index.htmlOf course he's tainted by being anime influenced but Hyung Tae Kim could really do some unusual stuff.
http://hyung-taekim.org/index.phpSam Liu is more of a concept artist but he could be fun too.
http://www.itchstudios.com/itch/index.html
Fortune
Apr 17 2005, 01:13 AM
No contest. Elmore's Shadowrun covers rock!
Arethusa
Apr 17 2005, 01:18 AM
I would contest that. Sure, he may be better than the crap that found its way into and on the core SR3 book (not that difficult), but I still don't really like anything he's done.
Young Freud
Apr 17 2005, 04:25 AM
I'd include Alex Ross, especially since his art in the first book was his first paid gig and he's now become a rather famous artist since. It would be extremely expensive but it would look awesome.
Like some of Elmore's stuff on SR, just not the first and second books. The characters look too stiff and the background tries too hard to be a cyberpunk urban enviroment. I felt the third book's cover had more life in it, but the figures were too cartoony to be serious.
I need to see a larger pic of the cover of the new book, but, outside of the homage to the first two books, it seems way too bright and cluttered.
NightHaunter
Apr 18 2005, 09:42 AM
Its a pity that my fav artists style isn't good for Shadowrun.
Oh yeah thats Ron Spencer by the way.
ElFenrir
Apr 18 2005, 11:35 AM
Cover art wise, I like SR 1/2, but maybe it's nostalgia. I like the sample character art in SR3 much more however. The 80s comment made me think of why all the drawings of elves INSIDE the SR2 made them look like one of David Bowie's grandchildren.
Fortune
Apr 18 2005, 03:17 PM
QUOTE (ElFenrir) |
I like the sample character art in SR3 much more however. |
I definitely agree there. The Weapon Specialist was excellent!
Pthgar
Apr 18 2005, 03:19 PM
Yes! But the background makes me wince.
mintcar
Apr 18 2005, 04:34 PM
I havenīt seen a good quality shot of the SR4 cover, but I suspect itīs better than previous covers if itīs done by Mark Zug. (By the way. The FAQ says itīs him, so if the picture weīve seen isnīt done by him weīll propably see another cover.) Mark Zug is the one who did the SR3 archetype pictures and GM screen. Despite being a bit exagerated, I think some of those are the best artwork ever done for Shadowrun. (weapon specialist, drone rigger, dwarf shaman and combat decker being my favourites. I also really like the decker on the GM screen.)
<edit> I just discovered he also made the New Seattle cover. (Maybe thatīs why weīre seing lots of flying things in the SR4 cover.) That doesnīt bode well.
Fortune
Apr 18 2005, 10:20 PM
Mark Zug did some of the SR3 archetypes, but not all of them (at least according to the credits in that book). Did he actually do the Weapon Specialist?
mintcar
Apr 20 2005, 09:23 PM
That one, and all the others I mentioned, has his "MZ" signature. But I didnīt mean to imply that he did them all.
hahnsoo
Apr 20 2005, 09:33 PM
QUOTE (Young Freud) |
I'd include Alex Ross, especially since his art in the first book was his first paid gig and he's now become a rather famous artist since. It would be extremely expensive but it would look awesome. |
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