The other day I caught part of a movie on TV-A Bridge Too Far i think and as british soldiers marched into a city having gotten through the wood, Anthony Hopkins looks at one of his officers with twigs stuck in his helmet and says "I've just realized we're waering the wrong camoflague. I don't think this will fool anyone."

How often do you dress for a run in a camo, urban or enviromentally correct? Like woodland in the SS area, desert in PCC? I know it's been available since Fields of Fire but how often do you use it? We're city creatures mainly so going outside our comfort range is going to catch our attnetion. a run to Flagstaff? OK I'll dress for it, but what about in the city? Usually you waer a leather coat and in a city for armor, armored camo and armored fatiiges woul give a better armor rating that an armored jacket but does anyone dress like that?

Well, some of my characters do. My Troll basically only wears camo. Usually urban camo and a coat.
I don't think he stands out because of that, it isn't that unpractical in the rougher areas and there is so much security, military and DesertWar fans running around dressing in that style all the time.

Most players in my group go for the chameleon suit, set to static mode for downtown use.

I prefer the camo suits, so my chars will usually own urban and woodland camo. I have managed to wear normal woodland camo in the winter, so that "Dude, look!" moment came up, with me as the guilty party. My chars usually own quite a selection of armored clothing, so going civilian is easy.

With "preprogrammed colour schemes" adding a few hundred nuyen to clothes, I generally think it's okay for armour to be modded the same way with several (maybe even *lots* of) preprogrammed camo schemes for various/all occasions. Plus some "fashion" schema too. Means you can switch from the woodland-at-night type to the urban once you've penetrated the buildings.

Depends on the character. Some characters I've had have had very distinctive styles of dress and others have been more stealthy.

urban camo? isnt that basically to dress like joe wageslave?

IRL?
i wear it from time to time, mostly night-camo though . .
in character?
every character has at least urban and woods as full camo suit . .
ok, the cat-shaman was miffed when he actually HAD to wear it *g*

They haven't started making Tres-Chic Camo, yet.

What about the various fashion colors? Pink woodland for the vixon on the run, or blue tigerstripe for the wageslave heading to the club. Not really practical but it is still out there.

I heard of one "Special Forces" unit had a "Dress Uniform" that was Purple Battle Dress Uniforms. Can't remember who.

Lots of folks buy Army Surplus, so it's not that out there for outfits on the street, even Downtown, but don't try going to a party in it.

never really did the camo thing. now a tutu on the other hand...

Never except for one character's crazy chameleon-fiber ninja suit. Of course, he's the one who got killed that mission so I have taken that as indicative.

Depending on the run and violence spectrum. During legwork no way, but in case we're out on the proll our team is basically forming an urban special tactics team with a scout adept and 2x backup heavies in the urban/woodlands camo full suit + tactical vests etc., the works basically. Helmets work great in this setup as well since impact armor is usually highly overlooked by most sr teams (but then again we're suckers for the knock-out rules).

Again it depends on the pink mohawk versus 'black' playing style of your party. We're basically in the pitch black corner of hte argument.

Every day.

My characters? Rarely.

The point of "camouflage" is to blend in, but most of the runs I've ever played on involved a fast transition from heavily populated areas to deserted, seedy areas and back. Which meant a generic black jumpsuit (damn what the Army says - it may not occur naturally, but the sun does go away every 12 hours) and generic civvies.

-Siege

In SR3 my characters had full body urban camo or a camouflaged form fit suit whenever they went on an infiltration. They'd keep a coat over that if they had to pass through a public area, but I emphasized stealth, so most of my characters geared up for infiltration and then snuck to the target or got dropped off.

In SR4 however I've found my characters try to blend in to public a lot better, so I have some form fit under a nice jacket, and camouflage I almost exclusively use ruthenium coated armour, because it's just so cheap with the edition change.

The other problem - thermo.

-Siege

Thermal Dampening on your chameleon suit? Cheap enough. I usually get Thermal Dampening and/or nonconductivity on my form-fit as a matter of necessity.

At charachter generation max rating 4..., works wonders yes... iamgine the poor troll with his +4 target numbers to about everything he's aiming at you.

I prefer all black. It's slimming.

The issue now, from the US Army's standpoint anyway, is that all black stands out like a neon light in 3rd-gen night vision devices as well as not occurring naturally. With these devices being available to basically anyone with $300 to spend, all-black combat gear for spec ops and the like has gone the way of the do-do just to keep from getting ganked while trying to look like a ninjer.

I fail to see why this wouldn't continue to be an issue with SR image enhancement technology being even more prevalent.

Besides, have you seen non-closeup video of the new camo patterns being used? You can see it fine up close but you get any real distance away and it's like they blend into just about any terrain they might be in, even with full-tilt NVGs.

I wear it to bed every night. No it is not combat dress. Camo comes in pink nowadays.



-Chrysalis

Guess again

http://www.amazon.com/Commando-Camouflage-...y/dp/B000NT4888

Giving new meaning to "Going Commando".

Her crotch would be completely invisible in woodland terrain! What a useful skill.



Modern camoflage isn't so much a matter of looking like your surroundings ("I put twigs on my head to look like a tree!") as creating a digitized, visual white-noise that makes the viewer's eye slide past you. At least that's what the US Army's newer Army Combat Uniform fatigues are supposed to do. I don't know what the stats are on its success rate.

My Characters usually have at least one suit of photovoltaic cameleon paint-coated suit, to wear on tuns ... that can switch camo as nescessary. Pretty useful.

For a hard entry my characters usually have a camou suit in dark blue w/ helmet and space for velcro unit patches. That way when shit hits the fan the team looks alot like a [corp/police/federal] rapid response team. Although my characters usually go for ALICE harnesses over MOLLE because I think they look cooler.

I honestly don't think I've ever met anyone in the US military who's ever worn urban camo. Even force recon tended to just wear flight suits (Nomex= the good stuff).

As for functionality... is black and white and gray really going to help you blend in with the urban environment? I agree with a previous poster that dressing normally is the best urban camo.

That's the Syrians I think.

quoted for the double pun.

I remember a Punisher War Zone where he used those white chem suits painted with various "trash and litter" all over including a partial metal trash can. It folded up small enough to fit in his pocket yet could be dawned quickly and blended well with all the alley trash lying around. He kept several different suits painted up to match different environments in that handy utility belt of his.

heh, batman with guns. lots of guns

sounds a bit like a urban gillie suit btw

or would that just be dressing as a hobo?

Partially off subject, I remember when Punisher 2099 came out. He had this club that he could set the impact from that of a feather to several tons. �Hum, do I want to hit this ganger with a sack of feathers of a sack of Chevy V8 engine blocks?� It was a pretty large club not like an Asp so the chance of concealing it was nil. He also had this device running that when a video camera picked him up it blurred out his head in white noise. He had several other goodies that would fit right in SR but I, alas do not have the books in front of me, if I still have them that is. “When a boy becomes a man, he must give up boyish things.� Or something like that.

I Conrinthians 13.

Could you use nanotech to create a small emp field around a person so that he tends to avoid being captured on camera? I can't think of how else you could justify a device that obscured your face without actually obscuring the face. Plasma?

Thanks Vaga, I found the verse:

1Cr 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

I found this: The Punisher also wears a cybernetic suit capable of uploading various martial arts techniques for hand-to-hand combat. His suit is also equipped with multiple technological devices, such as a face-scramble to avoid detection by the many security cameras on the city streets.

I'll tell you this for free - it sucks major @$$.

-Siege

I suppose you are refering to a hard entery and not the dark blue camo suit. Because we all know blue looks good on anybody. OS, when do you deploy?

ARG! MY SOUL!

I was talking about wearing LBE suspenders and pistol belt strapped to IBA.

For the MOLLE system, they make vests covered in PALS straps.

More carrying options, easier to configure and definitely easier to pull on and off between loads.

-Siege

this is dumpshock, you signed of on your soul at the door...

Tangentially related, there was a post (I think on here) comparing different camo's effectiveness when used outside of its intended locale. Their 'urban setting' looked like it might be some Iraqi village, but aside from that, pretty interesting. Urban camo fared the worst, standing out the most in the most settings. Desert camo fared the best, and was in fact comparable to urban camo in an urban setting. But again, I think this may have been related to their choice of urban sites. Probably worth rereading for people who do like their camo lots.

Actually, trolls have "normal" photosensitive vision too, so you'd use only the lowest dp modifier, either the +4 for thermo, but probably the +2 for low-light and other visual mods. Dwarves and Trolls would not be able to function with JUST thermosensitive vision.

Maybe I just watch too much A-Team. But Hannibal rocks. Anybody think the velcro patches thing is a good idea?

Better than having to rip off unit insignia with a knife.

I can't think of anyone who loves them.

The patches tend to wrinkle and roll at the edges, so you have a sloppy look to the name tape. If the gear you're pulling on has any velcro, it'll snag on the velcro on your uniform.

The pen holders is a wonderful idea for garrison - if you don't empty the damn things out before you start trying to shrug into IBA or anything else, the pens get tangled in the straps or in the gear itself and you waste time trying to get untangled. And if you forget to pull the pens out before you wash your uniform, you just destroyed your top.

The name and branch tapes are always just a little too short, so you have velcro fluff showing around the tape. Because it's velcro, you have to do a double check to make sure everything is on straight and even.

Conceptually, it's a great idea - but you can tell where the whole testing phase was spent mostly on a drawing board.

Just my two bits, anyway.

The LBE may look cool - opinions differ on that, but the ALICE clips just aren't that great for keeping your crap in place. The MOLLE/PALs arrangement takes a little longer to put on and take off, but you're also reasonably certain nothing will come off accidentally.

With LBE, your available load space is limited to the belt and the front part of the suspenders; with a MOLLE/PALs vest, you can use the entire front, back and sides for your load requirements.

-Siege

Edit: Also, new velcro is amazingly loud. Old velcro is very quiet, but doesn't stick all that well. Buttons might take a second, but they never made much noise either.

Just pick them up in the gift shop before going on a run and you're all set.

I guess that's why MARPAT went without the velcro and the pen holder... or was it just that the marine corps didn't want to pay for extras? Hmmmmm. I wonder.

Here's a quickie blurb about the Air crewmember uniform and the improved vehicle crewmember uniform:

http://www.armytimes.com/legacy/new/0-ARMYPAPER-2313646.php

The ACU pattern was designed, as I understand it, to defeat digital imaging technology. Never mind our current and foreseeable crop of hostiles won't be using such high end tech.

If you want an idea about the next set of camo patterns to be adopted (maybe): http://www.multicampattern.com/

-Siege

Edit: For the wits designing the latest toys around: http://peosoldier.army.mil/soldierscorner/acu.asp

iirc, "Urban Camo" is actually a snow camo pattern.

I would hope that the next generation of camo would be programmable to some extent.

Heh.

I'm sure it's on the drawing board, but I don't see it happening in the immediate future.

-Siege