Stormdrake
Jul 27 2005, 05:50 PM
Just recently went back to my old highschool. It's in Chicago and not the best part either. The amount of non human security now present combined with the schools normal assets made me think what a shadowrunner team in 2065 could make of such a location. Figured it could make a really cool base. So my question to you all is what do you remeber from your highschools? Just looking for ideas to be included in a write up.
Thanks,
Stormdrake
hermit
Jul 27 2005, 05:55 PM
I suppose they'd have to chase out the local gang first, though.
Nikoli
Jul 27 2005, 06:06 PM
Typicaly schools are built too open for a good base. All those windows, double doors and hatches mean tons of entry points for intruders. Never mind more modern building architecture (most abandoned schools today are from 60 years ago or more) so imagine those all plexiglass walls of windows and trying to secure that in some of hte cafeterias.
Bearclaw
Jul 27 2005, 06:16 PM
If you take the whole thing though, including the grounds, it wouldn't be as big of a deal. The rigger just puts in a couple of the track mounted drones around the outside fence, and after the first person over the fense gets shredded by MMG fire, everyone else gets the idea.
In the Redmond barrens, I'm sure there are at least 20 schools that would work for this. Of course, all of them are currently the squats for dozens of families, or for a local gang, but they're there.
northern lights
Jul 27 2005, 06:17 PM
just ran a group through the mall from my high school town. had a psuedo gang in residence. the pc's never thought to use it themselves. i personally thought it would be pretty cool.
Ancient History
Jul 27 2005, 06:27 PM
It has potential, but you'd need to make some serious modifications. Some notes:
The Good- Plenty of Space
- Personal Gym
- Possible open areas for shamans, back-to-nature-types, and exapnsion.
- Ideal for setting up urban assault drills.
- Possible bonus spaces, such as greenhouse, server room, pool, weight room, garage, machine shop, JROTC armory, theater, library, etc.
- Basic defenses (alarms, closed-circuit TV, barbed-wire fences, concrete roadblocks, locks) likely.
The Bad- Renovations needed, likely expensive (but excellent once complete).
- Vulnerable (although mazelike, serious or prolonged habitation would necessitate massive and expensive improvements to defense: reinforcing walls, bricking up unnecessary windows, adding exterior security cameras and drone [since most schools have a decent lawn, cybered or paranormal dogs may be ideal], adding Awakened ivy or wards, etc. Furthermore, architectural plans are likely matters of public record.)
- Possible toxic zone (all those boring classes are one thing, but who knows what darksome deeds were committed there?) or haunted. Some schoolgrounds tainted by local toxic waste dump, asbestos, etc.
The UglyA school is a
big target, and a serious investment. Once you start renovations, you pretty much have to prepare for a seige if you're ever tracked back there. Furthermore, as a highly visible location, at least one legal SIN would be necessary, and property taxes probably apply.
hyzmarca
Jul 27 2005, 06:29 PM
Exterior doors can be secured or simply welded shut. Windows would be another problem but they can be secured, as well. All you really need is some security bars and possibly some plywood to cover them on the inside just in case the base is attacked by a magician. It would be work, but not much more work than securing any other squatter location.
mmu1
Jul 27 2005, 07:04 PM
Who says you need to rebuild and fortify the whole thing? Blow out non-load bearing walls to create open field of fire, and fortify/reinforce only the sections you intend to live in. Mine the rest.
Shadow
Jul 27 2005, 07:32 PM
I always thought a Firehouse would make an awesome base. Its small, tough, and defendable.
As for the school, you could always setup in one section of it, board or block of the rest. Like you could setup in the gym and close of everything else.
Nikoli
Jul 27 2005, 07:33 PM
Yeah, a firehouse would be nice. just imagine all the spirits running around there...
Trax
Jul 27 2005, 07:49 PM
Plus you get a kickass pole to slide down.
Kyuhan
Jul 27 2005, 07:53 PM
GHOSTBUSTERS!!!
EDIT: Hmmm, that sounded a little too excited...
PBTHHHHT
Jul 27 2005, 08:01 PM
What about buying a hotel and then casting a mojo illusion spell that makes it so the building is not there anymore and the lot is deserted. Plus, going to all the people associated with building and the city planners and implanting into their mind via spell or even psychotropic BTL's to make them believe the building was demolished...
Yeah, yeah, I caught 'The Shadow' on cable recently.
Stormdrake
Jul 27 2005, 08:19 PM
One reason I thought a high school would be appropriate is that many of the older ones did double duty as civil fallout shelters. Meaning the school has its own genarator and water supply and much of the structure is already re-enforced. As for open windows and too many access points a lot of older city highschools were multi level with no windows on the ground floor. Built like semi fortresses or mini prisons if the truth be told.
Nikoli
Jul 27 2005, 08:22 PM
But many of those types have been ground under the wave of urban sprawl long before your characters took their first mewling breaths. Not saying that there aren't any still left around, but if they are still around and that good for defense, likely someone else has already moved in and made the necessary arrangements to keep you out.
Stormdrake
Jul 27 2005, 08:23 PM
PBTHHHHT, Just because an idea has been used by hollywood does not make it a bad one. Was actually thinking a ancored spirit with the power of "hide" or "fear" would at least keep the local gang bangers away. A few accidental deaths or disappearances would also go a long way to keeping the locals away. IF you wanted to be evil that is.
RangerJoe
Jul 27 2005, 08:25 PM
Provided the school is in the Barrens in a Z-zone, you don't even need to kick out the local gang/squatters. Having "normal" people around helps keep a runner HQ low profile. If the runners don't mind spending a little bit of time as landlords (the devil rats are swarming in the gym again...), their local squatters and gangers will provide an excellent shielf to unwanted scrutiny.
Just make sure that some areas of the school are off-limits (e.g., the heavily protected runners only zone). If one of the locals acts up, they get "sent to the principle's office."
Nikoli
Jul 27 2005, 08:25 PM
that or every time one of them wanders in, the gang gets an unmarked package with the unbroken skin (sans the rest of them) of their missing friend. sooner or later, they'll find a cave and bury themselves to hide and take up macrame...
Stormdrake
Jul 27 2005, 08:30 PM
Ok true such a structure would in real life probably have occupents already. However as we are talking a game were the characters are the main point I think there could be ways around this. The story plot I am working on has a school having been modified by a corporation to be used as a deniable asset. That corp gets gobled up by a larger corporation before the base can be put to its use and in the restructuring it is "lost". A surviving member of managment of the little corps knows about it and uses it to pay off runners to help him escape from the corporation that took over and get some pay back. Obviously a very rough outline but you get the idea.
RangerJoe
Jul 27 2005, 08:37 PM
I think folks have considerably different ideas of what a "typical school" campus is going to look like in game. A rolling, green acres high school, with a sprawling gym, one or two stories, and grassy fields around it is one thing. A compact urban school in a multistory building with athletic facilities on the roof and a pool in the basement (like many schools in NYC, for example) is going to be a completely different kettle of SR fish. I'd be sure your players are clear on exactly what the layout of the grounds and/or building is.
Shadow
Jul 27 2005, 08:43 PM
And then theres high schools that look like
this and are in Tacoma to boot.
Stormdrake
Jul 27 2005, 08:52 PM
Shadow, ok that one looks like it could be fun. Something else for people to keep in mind is that according to cannon there are lots of ghost towns scattered across North America. Which means lots of old highschools sitting in ghost towns. Granted that means traveling to work but if your running teams that do smuggeling or other globe bouncing the possibilities are not too far fetched.
Trax
Jul 27 2005, 08:54 PM
An entire town to call your own.
PBTHHHHT
Jul 27 2005, 09:44 PM
QUOTE (Stormdrake) |
PBTHHHHT, Just because an idea has been used by hollywood does not make it a bad one. Was actually thinking a ancored spirit with the power of "hide" or "fear" would at least keep the local gang bangers away. A few accidental deaths or disappearances would also go a long way to keeping the locals away. IF you wanted to be evil that is. |
I wasn't saying it was a bad idea. Just how feasible it is for this particular one. It works in the movie, 'The Shadow', because it wasn't magic but more like hypnosis, and still, in the srun world, to make something like that would likely radiate on the astral plane. So any opposition who even has a rudimentary of astral perception would likely find it. Unless I'm incorrectly remembering my astral stuff wrong...
Yeah, yeah, I know, I know, there's also stuff about warding and masking that could be involved.

Though, I guess there's masking and all that other such, I don't know, but just on a feasibility issue. C'mon, we're talking about making at least a 20 story building in the middle of downtown invisible.
Now, the anchored spirit with hide and fear for something smaller and unobtrusive, that'll actually work. Especially in a less visited spot of the city.
ShieldT
Jul 28 2005, 02:13 PM
20-story high school? What kind of town did you live in?
Joking
mmu1
Jul 28 2005, 02:16 PM
QUOTE (ShieldT @ Jul 28 2005, 09:13 AM) |
20-story high school? What kind of town did you live in?
Joking |
Heh... My HS was 11 stories, and I often pass by another school in Manhattan that, while not taking up a whole 20+ story building, is located in one.
Stormdrake
Jul 28 2005, 03:20 PM
So back to my original question: what would be in a “regular” high school circa 2020?
The basics of course:
Cafeteria
Kitchen
Security office
Administrative offices
Maintenance Office
Physical Plant
Teacher Lounge
Library
Gym
Weight room
Locker rooms
Bathrooms
Computer Lab
Plus at least a couple dozen class rooms suited for forty students a piece
Other Possibilities:
Science Labs
Electronics Labs
Green house
Swimming Pool
Automotive Lab
Anyone else think of anything else?
Shadow
Jul 28 2005, 03:44 PM
Counselors office. Maybe an arboretum?
hyzmarca
Jul 28 2005, 04:13 PM
QUOTE (PBTHHHHT) |
QUOTE (Stormdrake @ Jul 27 2005, 03:23 PM) | PBTHHHHT, Just because an idea has been used by hollywood does not make it a bad one. Was actually thinking a ancored spirit with the power of "hide" or "fear" would at least keep the local gang bangers away. A few accidental deaths or disappearances would also go a long way to keeping the locals away. IF you wanted to be evil that is. |
I wasn't saying it was a bad idea. Just how feasible it is for this particular one. It works in the movie, 'The Shadow', because it wasn't magic but more like hypnosis, and still, in the srun world, to make something like that would likely radiate on the astral plane. So any opposition who even has a rudimentary of astral perception would likely find it. Unless I'm incorrectly remembering my astral stuff wrong... Yeah, yeah, I know, I know, there's also stuff about warding and masking that could be involved.  Though, I guess there's masking and all that other such, I don't know, but just on a feasibility issue. C'mon, we're talking about making at least a 20 story building in the middle of downtown invisible. |
A large initiate group could do it. The real challange is creating a masking ward that is large enough to cover the building. If one of your PCs leads his own large-scale initiate group then you can do much better than an abandoned high school.
There would be the problem of thunderbirds and helicopters occasionally crashing into it, however. People will notice that.
PBTHHHHT
Jul 28 2005, 04:14 PM
My HS had a classroom or two dedicated to JROTC, and they had a mini target range in there for their air rifles.
don't forget the band/orchestra room, they have a backroom where you stick all the instruments in these cubbyholes. Also there is the art room, and also the chorus room.
later on they built a theater to the school from what I hear is rather nice.
ShieldT
Jul 28 2005, 04:31 PM
QUOTE (mmu1) |
Heh... My HS was 11 stories, and I often pass by another school in Manhattan that, while not taking up a whole 20+ story building, is located in one. |
Dude!
On the nutty side. Louis Sachar had a lot of cool stories back in the day (ya youngsters probably know him as the author of Holes, and those over 25 [20 here]probably have no idea who I'm talking about) about Wayside School. It was built by a guy who was supposed to build a school 30 classrooms per story, one story high. He had the plans sideways and built it one classroom per story, 30 stories high. He said he was sorry. Miss Zarves teaches class on the nineteenth story. There is no nineteenth story, the eighteenth leads directly to the twentieth. There is no Miss Zarves. He apologized for this too, her being a nice lady and all. The Superintendent got sick of all the running up and down stairs and had two elevators installed. The left one only went down and the right one only went up, just like the stairs. They both worked once. I digress
Seriously, though I may be overstating the immediacy of this, Can you imagine sitting in a classroom and having not only three of your classmates fall over goblinizing but some of your pets as well? Maybe something like that happened over Easter break and the custodian comes back only to be eaten by a newly Awakened class snake or devil rats? Cast a bad palour on that school, wot?
Heh, a futuristic private high school might just have one or two chimpanzees on the grounds making an abandoned one a good home for a troup of Dour or your pick of Awakened primates

Who also could be using the squatters for camoflauge
BitBasher
Jul 28 2005, 04:50 PM
Is it just me, or is it about the worst idea ever for a group of felons to invest a pile of cash and time into a permanent, non movable base of operations? I would think that's just asking for trouble.
Birdy
Jul 28 2005, 05:02 PM
Them Americans build them schools pretty strange!
Typical German high school (900-1200 pupils depending on exact date)
+ Around 50-60 Classrooms (Class size 20-30)
+ 1-3 special "lab" rooms each for physics, biology, chemistry
- Some lab equipment
- Gas on each table for bunsen burners
- Hardened (ceramic) teachers table
* Sooth marks on ceiling above teachers table in chemical room
* Sorchmarks on teachers table in chemical room
+ A gymnasium seperated from the school by about 100m (covert walkway)
- Seperate locker rooms (no lockers!) and showers (around 6) for the sexes
+ A training field
- Football field with a track, jumping installations (long and high)
- Hammer / Ball throwing pad
+ 1-3 computer rooms
- If you are lucke a single low speed (64-768KBit) line
+ Teachers office, principals office, teachers library, 1-3 secretarial offices
+2-4 special rooms for the arts and music each [Only 2-4, we are a technical HS]
- Some art / work supplies (no heavy machinery)
- Lots of instruments
+ Media room (Film projectors etc)
+ School library stocking books that are loaned to pupils
+ Large gathering room
+ Some free space for taking breaks
+ Janitors Storage room and repair shop, maybe janitors appartment
+ Central heating, water supply, oil tanks (or remote heating)
+ Chair storage etc
+ At least three toilet installations plus a set in the gymnasium
No swimming pools (Use a communal one), no cafeteria (maybe the janitor has a small shop to sell something)
This is a two - four story building, 1960s style (Framework with few load-bearing structures, mostly outer walls and sheetrock or even wood-panel walls)
Aside from one large glass front, the access was through four sets of doors, all leading into a heat-trap (so it was doors, a small room, doors), metal frame with security glass inserts. All windows where at least 1.5m above ground.
=====================
Now if you want secure, take my old basic school:
+ Build in the 1950s from massiv slabs of sandstone (We are talking 50cm+ thickness here plus an interior insulating wall 1 cinderblock thick, more on the basement) with small, high windows
+ Raised cellar (because below the cellar is an air raid shelter) so the first windows are at 2m above ground
+ Only two access doors, again with a heat trap and actualle sprung back into the building, flanked by windows (Principals office, teachers room)
+ Small stairways, always ending in doors
+ L-formed building with only one way to cross between the parts
+ Massiv (double layer cinderblock) interior walls
+ Small gymnasium about 100m away (actually the crawlway endpoint of the bunkes emergency exit)
===================
What about a former Police station? Somethink like "Fort Apache" / The Bronx
Birdy
Stormdrake
Jul 28 2005, 07:09 PM
Actually watched "assault on precinct 13" last night. So the idea of a old police station had occurred to me. The only complaint I had was the lack of open space for the conjuring crowd. Other than that pretty useable. As for the arguability of a criminal team having a base of operations. Depends on what kind of game your running I guess. Will say even street gangs have bases and there alot more detectable than a shadowrun team.
Birdy
Jul 29 2005, 09:59 AM
QUOTE (Stormdrake) |
Actually watched "assault on precinct 13" last night. So the idea of a old police station had occurred to me. The only complaint I had was the lack of open space for the conjuring crowd. Other than that pretty useable. As for the arguability of a criminal team having a base of operations. Depends on what kind of game your running I guess. Will say even street gangs have bases and there alot more detectable than a shadowrun team. |
Don't know about the States but here in germany:
+ Some newer police stations have a basement garage (Think RoboCop)
+ Some old ones have large cellar vaults that doubled as an armory for the militia and/or rather large prisoner holding areas. They may have added walls later but those are not as thick/rugged as the original stuff and definitly not loadbearing.
Old firestations (new ones are basically a garage) have already been mentionend.
Old Bunkers are more for us Europeans but do you have some Victoria-Style houses in the states? Those Mansions are "solid"
Maybe an old missile Silo (there have been some sold in the US IRL) or missile installation (Old Nike-Site or so, some are quite close to cities)
You can always go "Old Detroid" and use an abandoned industrial complex. Again this may be a European thing but most 19th century industrial plants had at least one rugged main building with thick walls and small windows (glass = costly) And quite a few survived until today to "show the tradition". Even if this is uncommon in the US, industrial structures are quite rugged and often use massiv concrete walls / foundations to enclose large open areas. The heavier the maschinery used, the thicker the concrete. Just stay clear of the industrial waste storage tank
Birdy
Nikoli
Jul 29 2005, 12:55 PM
Or strategically place charges on it...
Sicarius
Jul 29 2005, 01:00 PM
QUOTE (ShieldT) |
QUOTE (mmu1 @ Jul 28 2005, 02:16 PM) | Heh... My HS was 11 stories, and I often pass by another school in Manhattan that, while not taking up a whole 20+ story building, is located in one. |
Dude!
On the nutty side. Louis Sachar had a lot of cool stories back in the day (ya youngsters probably know him as the author of Holes, and those over 25 [20 here]probably have no idea who I'm talking about) about Wayside School. It was built by a guy who was supposed to build a school 30 classrooms per story, one story high. He had the plans sideways and built it one classroom per story, 30 stories high. He said he was sorry. Miss Zarves teaches class on the nineteenth story. There is no nineteenth story, the eighteenth leads directly to the twentieth. There is no Miss Zarves. He apologized for this too, her being a nice lady and all. The Superintendent got sick of all the running up and down stairs and had two elevators installed. The left one only went down and the right one only went up, just like the stairs. They both worked once. I digress
|
Those books were the BEST!
Lindt
Jul 29 2005, 02:11 PM
Hmm, yeah, an old ICBM silo would make a wicked place to hole up and cower for a while. Those things are deceptivly large, and in some cases have been turned into schools, houses, all sorts of interesting things.
An abandoned underground complexAlso look for a tag by one of our own=p
ShadowDragon8685
Jul 29 2005, 03:00 PM
Lindt: First, which tag was by one of our own?
Second: Why do I have the most awesome visions of "Half-Life meets Shadowrun" while looking around that VTour? Think about it... Deep darkness, Runners with more money than sense move in, start taking over. Clean up the upper levels, drop large, drone-ended 'swimming' pipes down where there's water to suck the water out.
Everything goes good for weeks, when Johnson approaches the Runners with a tasty offer. He'll pitch in big-time for the repairs and stuff, if they clean up a mere one silo, and let him store a missile in it, in the unlikely event he may need to use it.
The clinch? The Missile is a nuke.
The frag-up? While they're sifting stuff and cleaning the place up, they disturb The Thing from Under, some kind of tentacled eaty-beast, like the one from out of Half-Life. (Remember, the one that was also in a missle silo?)
So it turns into a survival horror, running from tentacles in the dark and other... Things... That chase and try to kill them. The Runners (who survive) have to make it to the partially cleaned-up silo, fuel and program the missile, and then get the Hell out of Dodge before it goes.
Stormdrake
Jul 29 2005, 03:16 PM
Ya, missile silo's have been sold over here and turned into all sorts of things. Craziest one I ever saw was a old missile silo that was deliberately filled with water and used to teach cave diving.
Have always enjoyed shadowrun games heavy on the horror aspects, tentacled beasties running amok are always fun. However thats another thread.
Nikoli
Jul 29 2005, 03:17 PM
hrmm, cave dive training facility, that gives me an idea for a run...
Birdy
Jul 29 2005, 05:16 PM
QUOTE (Lindt) |
Hmm, yeah, an old ICBM silo would make a wicked place to hole up and cower for a while. Those things are deceptivly large, and in some cases have been turned into schools, houses, all sorts of interesting things.
An abandoned underground complex Also look for a tag by one of our own=p |
You mean a certain gun-nut :=)
That whole thing looks like an old SAM-Installation rather than an ICBM unit. One of the NIKE Systems.
Birdy
Lindt
Jul 29 2005, 06:34 PM
Turns out its a Titan 1 launch facility. Total of 9 ICBMs once lived in there... Its also 1 of 6 or 7 of that type of complex built.
The Titan 2 lived in much smaller blocks, and after that they where either unmanned silos, or silo fields. The Titan needed to live with people (which I find rather entertaining, that an atomic device needed to 'live' with people) because it was based on an LOX and kerosene propellent. Scary stuff.
LinaInverse
Jul 29 2005, 07:20 PM
While not as nice as a missile silo, my char is/was in the process of turning a small farm (located in the middle of a wooded area) into her hideaway. The land gives more defensive depth than your typical apartment and more than amply opportunities to conceal a lot of firepower like bales of hay hiding machine-gun turrets, not to mention plenty of land to lay land mines and punji pits.
This idea came about when my GM had one of our hunteds ambush our team one-by-one literally in our own apartments; that is, they were able to get close enough, carrying heavy weapons, to enter the apartments unchallenged. In other words, no defensive depth between the streets/curbs where they parked to the front door. I figured that the next group that came after me, I wanted them to have to go through a decent amount of distance before they could reach me. Even if they overpowered the obstacles, I would most likely get some advanced warning.
Mr. Unpronounceable
Jul 29 2005, 08:35 PM
QUOTE (Birdy) |
...missile installation (Old Nike-Site or so, some are quite close to cities)... |
That's something I've used before...not many people nowadays know about the old Nike missile installations along Lake Michigan in Chicago...they used to house point-defense nukes for city defense (how friggin' stupid does that sound?) but have been presumably empty and sealed for the last 30 years or so.
In 60 years...they'd pretty much be completely forgotten.
And then of course, there's old mining installations...some of which can be surprisingly roomy - if you've ever seen the one used for US national archives you'll know what I mean.
Birdy
Jul 29 2005, 08:55 PM
QUOTE (Mr. Unpronounceable @ Jul 29 2005, 08:35 PM) |
QUOTE (Birdy) | ...missile installation (Old Nike-Site or so, some are quite close to cities)... |
That's something I've used before...not many people nowadays know about the old Nike missile installations along Lake Michigan in Chicago...they used to house point-defense nukes for city defense (how friggin' stupid does that sound?) but have been presumably empty and sealed for the last 30 years or so.
In 60 years...they'd pretty much be completely forgotten.
And then of course, there's old mining installations...some of which can be surprisingly roomy - if you've ever seen the one used for US national archives you'll know what I mean.
|
Ask the Ruskis, they still think nuclear-based missile defence is the way to go! It's based on the "an airburst at 20km is better than a groundburst at -20m" idea. Heck, there are nuclear tipped AA missiles (AA-4 Falcon IIRC)
And it solves the problem of seperating the decoys from the real thing :=)
There is a reason those MIG-25 and MIG-31 use tubes in their radars. And it's not lack of transistors...
Birdy
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