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Elve
QUOTE (book)
...confers a bonus of +[1-3] to the Body attribute for damage resistance tests.


Is this bonus caped at the augmented Body Maximum, or can you exceed it this way for damage resistance test?
Similar for similar ware.. cyber.gif
Serbitar
I would say the only cap that applies is that you can not roll more dice than double your natural body.
Elve
QUOTE (Serbitar)
I would say the only cap that applies is that you can not roll more dice than double your natural body.

Where did you get that cap?
Serbitar
From the 24 dice min/max thread, havent found it in the rulebook yet.
Elve
so didn't I smile.gif
hahnsoo
All of the augmented attribute caps are 1.5 times the racial maximum (round down), as listed on the table on p73 and in the description of attribute on p62.
Serbitar
Bone lacing does not increase the attribute, it only gives you dice for resitance tests, thats a difference.
hahnsoo
Depends upon your interpretation. This is one of my personal gripes about the SR4 augmentations, in that sometimes it isn't clear what constitutes an augmentation that hits the augmented cap and what doesn't. In the case of Bone Lacing, it specifically says +1 (to +3) to the Body Attribute for damage resistance tests. I'd take that to mean that it directly adds to Body during damage resistance (just like an Increase Body spell directly increases Body while it's sustained), and thus is subject to the cap.
HappyDaze
So, since it's a situational modifier and not a boost to the core stat we can avoid the limits?

In a similar manner, this would mean that an Adept's Combat Sense dice can exceed the Reaction cap for avoiding attacks, right?

Jay
hahnsoo
QUOTE (HappyDaze)
In a similar manner, this would mean that an Adept's Combat Sense dice can exceed the Reaction cap for avoiding attacks, right?

Under my interpretation, no. It says in the description that it adds to the Reaction attribute, and thus it is subject to the cap. Nowhere in the book does it say "augmented attribute bonuses aren't subject to the cap if they are situational", but nowhere does it say anything to the contrary, either.
Elve
A clarifiaction from someone official would be nice...
Autarkis
I reviewed the sample characters, and this is what I came up with:

Combat Sense: Does not appear to add to Reaction. (Gun-Fu has +2 to Reaction but it is from her +2 is from Improved Reflexes and not her Combat Sense 2.)

Bone Lacing: Does not appear to add to Body (Smuggler has no mod to Body but has Aluminum Bone Lacing which should be +2 to Body for resistance tests but isn't in her above stats.)

So if it is a plus to the stat, it goes against the 1.5. If it adds to a stat test (i.e. +1 Body for damage resistance tests) then it does not. In the case of Bone Lacing, it adds to damage tests but no others (toxins, pathogens, fatigue, healing, etc...)
Crusher Bob
If it adds to skill tests for linked skills, it a bonus to the stat, at least that's the way I see it. bone lacing specifically only adds to damage resistance, not 'body'
hahnsoo
QUOTE (Crusher Bob)
If it adds to skill tests for linked skills, it a bonus to the stat, at least that's the way I see it. bone lacing specifically only adds to damage resistance, not 'body'

See, it says specifically " adds +1 to Body", which makes it incredibly vague and confusing. Not "+1 to dice pools for Damage Resistance tests". Same with Combat Sense (spell or adept power)... it says specifically "adds +1 to Reaction" under certain conditions. While you can dussy up the explanation that only non-conditional modifiers add to the augmented max, that's still house ruling and interpretation, until someone official says something (and preferably, adds it as Errata in the books).
Aku
The problem Hahnsoo, is that from autarkis's research on the samples, neither of them seem to be listed as augmented attributes
hobgoblin
bah, who cares about a limit silly.gif
Autarkis
Hansoo...by your logic since it says "+2 dice to Body to resist...." then the Dwarves natural ability may count towards their racial max as well as some positive qualities (Toughness...+1 doce to Body to resist damage...).
hahnsoo
QUOTE (Autarkis)
Hansoo...by your logic since it says "+2 dice to Body to resist...." then the Dwarves natural ability may count towards their racial max as well as some positive qualities (Toughness...+1 doce to Body to resist damage...).

I never said it made total sense (there are lots of things in SR4 that are illogical). I'm just going by what the rules are dictating. There's nothing in the rules that support or deny these conditional modifiers as applying against the augmented max. If the devs show up and say "Well, these particular bonuses don't apply, but these do", I'd be happy. I'd be happier if they posted official Errata that cleaned up the language so that it's similar to First Impression and Focused Concentration (+1 dice pool modifier to a test rather than +1 to an attribute for a test).
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