Well, my character has the vindictive flaw and the sea madness flaw. Well we were at sea on a research vessel and it became clear that we were dealing with a pissed off water spirit that has killed like 40 people and was attacking us continually. Well character B decided he didn't want to be there anymore and pointed a gun at me and threatened to shoot me numerous times if I didn't fire up the chopper and get him out of there. Being a professional, my character refused until we had finished the job.

I'm trying to decide whether or not my character will bide his time and kill the offending character or just let it slide since Character B is new to running and the player is new to SR and I don't want to do anything to jepardize his playing later on.

How have you handled PC conflicts? Specifically one character plotting to kill another without his knowledge.

If he points a gun at you like that? its just cause for non-criminals to shoot back. do NOT let him do that. warn him ONCE. after that, he does it again, shoot him. its self defense.

I did warn him. I'm concerned about the guidelines under the Vindictive flaw. I'm pretty certain that this was a major slight, not even a percieved slight, I think I may be forced to have my character act accordingly in line with the flaw.

Ok, i'm a bit puzzled here. Your PC is the one with Sea Madness, and your PC is also the one that doesn't want to leave? How long have you been on the platform?

I Try to discourage it, but it kinda depends on the players involved.

If player B decides that he doesn't like this character and wants to bring in another one, then does he not concern if the character is killed?
Does the character constantly try to bully others into getting his way?
Is this something the player thinks is ok to do with most of his characters?
Did Character B actually shoot at you?

If not then later in game tell the character that threating someone who kills as part of thier livelyhood is never a good idea. If he does it again, pretend to go along with him for a bit, then ditch him one way or another.

I'd say a savage beating is in order, a friendly warning afterwards, and leave it be.

I'd also say you claiming your "professionalism" kept you from leaving when YOU were the one with sea madness is pretty lame. It sounds like you're ignoring one flaw (sea madness) to give another flaw (vindictive) the chance to come into play.

Yeah, cap him with a narcojet, THEN dispense said savage beating followed by friendly warning.

I don't know if the vindicitve flaw madates that you have to kill him in a situation like this, plenty of ways for getting even without just shooting him.

I see where you may want to just let it go if the guy is a newbie and you don't wan't to sour him on the game as a whole, or your group in particular. Probably a good idea to discuss any in gaame retribution outside of character ahead of time. If I were the GM in this particular situation I might enforce the vindictive flaw with persistant annoying but non directly lethal behavior towards the character (up to and including the smearing of Eucalyptus leaves on said char's clothes in Australia)

I don't understand how the characters willingness to stay or not comes into play, for his question.

Are these rules on gun safety correct?
Never point a gun at anything that you don't mind putting a hole in.
Always treat a gun as though the safety is off and the gun is loaded.

So character B did not mind putting a hole in character A.
Is someone's willingness to put a hole in you a slight thing?
Why would someone with Vindictive and possibly a gangster style attitude think this is ok? If he lets someone push him around consistantly then he loses face and more people will do it.
Shadowrunners tend to worry about people trying to kill them, why should they put up with it from a teammate?

Meh... I don't know whether we'd do it as players, but in principle, the characters in the games I play would take that rather badly. (unless there were some serious extenuating circumstances, or you and the rest of the team had a very solid history together - then you could do it, once)

Best case scenario:

You won't work with us again after this job is over, and we forget we ever knew you.

Worst case scenario:

Game 1 - You get a thermite facial.

Game 2 - Pusher the 10' troll has a go at pulling your limbs off and we give the twitching leftovers to the ghoul rigger named Scavengers.


As far as the Vindictive flaw goes - the description does state that you're allowed to respond proportionately, so simply letting the person know in harsh terms what you'll do to them if they ever screw with you again is fine... Planning to kill them for it is not disallowed by the flaw description, but it's certainly not required.

Eh.... I'm still for drugging him then beating him half to death. Make sure he knows that if there ever is a next time that one of you will die, and the rest of the team has your back on this one.

This way noob doesn't have to spend time making a new character (since you guys won't run with the old one, or the old one is a corpse) and should get the message loud and clear.

Personnally I prefer attaching him to a drone blimp without a form of long distance comminication.

GM, " and what do you do character B."
B, "Who is playing in the stadium below me, again?"
GM "the Giants"
B, "oh Great. I guess I watch the game."

Nothing like a thinly veiled insult to top off a thread! Yum...

Yeah. A savage beating sounds like the ticket. Either that or you shoot him somewhere non-vital, like a hand or a foot (non-vital as in non-life threatening). Or you could just threaten his life in someway. Or you could hold the grudge and fail to provide life saving assistance next time he needs it.

Maybe I read you wrong. I wouldn't shoot you or anyone I was just playin.

To be clear:

Someone threatens you and when you still don't do what they demand they don't carry through on the threat. Killing someone for that already is at the upper end, if not beyond the Vindictive flaw. You are trying to play the character as even more vindictive than that? The solution seems pretty clear to me, and it doesn't involve your PC cacking the other PC and hoping the other player gets over it.

We had something like that come up...character resolved it by pissing in the offending character's coffee later down the road.

Come to think of it, it's come up twice: The second time a third guy stepped in between the two to break it up and ended up getting his head blown off...if only I could find that thread now.

No I think it will be suffcient for me to hire someone to Narc him then drop him off in Redmond preferably near Glow City.

Plant some cocaine on him and then rat him out...that'd be hilarious.

lol, actually I could rat him out for alot of other things. He has about 12 lbs of C12 at his flat.

Well it depends on how you use it. I would probably get him busted for the cocaine and then make sure some people he cares about (wife, kids, girlfriend, contacts) find out about his "drug problem".

Knock him out (with anything you want), and dump him on the edge of town with nothing but his pants. Make sure he's aware that it was his only warning-- and next time, you're tossing him off a boat with cement shoes, or in glow city, or ghoultown, or the Ancient's territory with anti-elf slogans tattooed on his chest and face...

I Strongly recommend that you speak with the offending player and the GM before you do this. If the new player knows he pointed a gun at a twitchy, vindictive character he may chock it up to a mistake and even enjoy going out. If he doesn't he could feel like he's being picked on and quit.

Warning the new kid like this could lead to said new kid trying to metagame his way out of it -- but I trust Solstice is sharp enough to find some method of putting a hole in his head. Everyone needs a rigger now and then.

Hmm, actually this reminds me of the time we had a "liability" shadowrunner with us... he was prone to talking too much to the wrong people and such. So we had our mage totally mind-wipe anything that could incriminate us, then tied him in a car, cast control action on him and made him drive into a police station. And I mean into.

We were kinda loose on rules and stuff there, but it was in good fun and everyone had a good laugh, the PC who got killed off included. I think that's ok.

Vindictive doesn't always mean violent.

If you do discuss it with the player, discuss it cooperatively. "Wow, crazy move! Gonna be wicked to RP the fallout from that one." Or some such drek. Make it clear that there will be some sort of rivalry or whatever between the characters, but not necessarily the players.
The scene you described could've happened in any buddy cop movie. If you want your character to be vindictive, play it creatively. Use it like the role-playing opportunity it's supposed to be.

One of my favourite RP scenes occured when my orc merc hijacked a truck full of poison gas and threatened to drive it into the Aztech compound because they "disappeard" his S/O. My buddy's elf samurai snuck in and held him at gunpoint in a tense standoff. Years later, they were still ribbing each other over who would've won that.

Your orc was an idiot.

You use a VCR to drive the suicide truck! DUH!

I don't know whether to point out that my orc was not a rigger, or that a VCR is not an RC deck.

But you're right, he was an idiot. A gruff lovable idiot with a shotgun in his cyberleg.

The vindictive flaw is clear, you owe him a cumupins. However it need not be fatal or even involve physical harm.

Edward

As for all the people who have noted that the responce of the Vindictive flaw is proportional to the offense:

It's so good to know that your stereotypical office bitch has the Vindictive flaw.

To get back at him for holding the gun at you, you could also get an unloaded handgun, and thenext time he's prone, go up to him, and hold the gun to the side of his head, and pull the trigger, and after, tell them that next time it will be loaded.

If anyone knows what movie this is from, they get a cookie.

Mock Executions are always good for teaching lessons.

Or you can tell the DM you get a clip of blanks (if you can get any where you are,) go into full SGL mode, walk up to him and draw on him, roll out the dice, and have the DM describe the horrific wound he would have had, had the gun been loaded with lead.

And then get shot. Because, well, that's what happens when you wave a gun at someone and pull the trigger -- by the time they realize they aren't dead, they've likely already reflexively responded to the gun being pointed at them, the sound, the flash, etc, etc; responded by drawing and firing.

I believe the soap was called "Double Jeopardy" or something like that. (I'm old enough)

Back in the thread I would recommend a player-to player friendly conversation to keep clear that the Vindictive asshole is your character, not yourself.

After that you could do whatever you want. I do prefer non-deadly (and funny) forms of revenge. But be careful, in my experience, sometimes it is dangerous to leave somebody alive after he/she has been horribly humilliated (spelling?).

Cheers.

Max

Actually I was refering to Blow, when the main character is backstabbed by his best friend, but it is in Die Hard II, so you get an oatmeal raison cookie, check your mail soon.

And for the blanks, there was also the actor Brandon Lee, from the Crow (original). While refilming part of movie, one of the other actors pointed the gun to close to his head, with the result being a section of his temple caving in.