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Cain
QUOTE
If the registration period doesn't count towards an unregistered sprite's lifespan, then you run into the exploit of "wait 7 hours 59 minutes and then start registering."

You could conceivably say that the sprite is in all ways inactive while it's getting registered, but at that point you're blatantly adding something to the RAW that isn't there (IIRC) in any form.

Well, sorta but not really. If you fail a binding test, you basically lose the sprite. And I think it's safe to rule that while a sprite is being bound, it can't be ordered to do other tasks. If we still count it against the 1 unbound sprite limit until it's bound, then you've got a useless-- not inactive, useless-- sprite while you do your process.

QUOTE
It's not a matter of replacement costs, it's a matter of loss of business when Hacker Joe puts your 1,000 nuyen goods up on Ebay for 38 cents.

That happens anyway. That's what copy protection is for. Granted, copy protection in SR4 is so weak as to be unbelieveable, but in theory that's what people use to prevent this sort of thing. If you think about it, there's *nothing* preventing anyone from buying a legitimate copy of any program, cracking the protection, and mass-producing enough copies to hand out with happy meals.

As exploits go, this one isn't so bad. Skillwires have enough inherent limitations in them that I wouldn't have an issue with it. If someone pulls this off in game, let them have it; you can always just strictly enforce the skillwire rules and control it that way.
Ravor
QUOTE (Kremlin KOA)
but as the designers pointed out, it is meant to be based on RL, where some software merchants do offer instant delivery


Now, I'm not sure of the context that the designers made that statement in, but generally speaking when someone mentions that a setting is supposed to be based off Real Life in a non-parody game I assume that they mean that the people will react realistically to any new developments that don't current exist in Real Life.

Remember we aren't talking about 60Y R6 Datasofts, or even 600Y R6 Common Use Programs, we are talking about 12,000Y R4 Activesofts. (And somehow I doubt that even in Real Life, a program worth $12K is going to be held purposely on a server that would be vulnerable, although I could be wrong in my faith in the intelligence of security designers.)

QUOTE (Kremlin KOA)
now nonw of these tricks stop me packet sniffing for a big order that contains softs I want then jamming into the recipient's commlink and making copies for myself


Very true, however the question would then be how often would such an order for R4 Activesofts be held on someone's personal Commlink as opposed to being beamed directly into a Corp's Server? (Although of course, if a Decker was good enough and fast enough then it wouldn't stop him from getting the goods.)

It also allows access to the Activesofts/Ratings to be determined by the Keeper of Fate, I doubt that R4 Activesofts sales are extremely common after all.
Azralon
QUOTE (Edward @ Apr 6 2006, 10:33 PM)
CODE


† † † † † † † † † † † D †D †D † D
† † † † † † † † † † † †\ | /___/ † †___Z
† † † † † † † † † † † † \|/ † † † †/
† † A------B------C------E---------Z---Z
† † † † † † † † † † † † /|\____ † †\___
† † † † † † † † † † † †/ | \ † \ † † † Z
† † † † † † † † † † † D †D †D † D


Aiee, due to our network topology innovations we're back to the old system diagram "decking dungeon crawl" paradigm. Where's the SPU? I have to Sleaze past it.
Rotbart van Dainig
Tree-shaped dungeons are quite rare. wink.gif
sandchigger
Unless they're built by elves. Or possibly gnomes.
Shrike30
The software for that doesn't seem excessive at all... you're talking about your entire profit margin if someone rips your site and undercuts your market by 50%, so that kind of aggressive protection is important.
Edward
I should point out that if some body wants to rip you off and sell your product for 50% off they will pay for your product, take 3 says to crack them all open and sell them, only copy protection helps at all and SR states that copy protection is next to worthless.

As to this being dungeon like hacking SR2. I should point out that the hacker will likely never enter any of those nodes D,

This is the run. Node A is public access. Hack into node B, engage IC, hack into node C, get fraged buy IC, hack into node E, deal with less IC, hack into nod Z. do your business.

Nodes B and E are not strictly necessary but they do help security a lot.

Unfortunately without putting a couple of nodes in the way hackers are supreme on even the most secure systems available. Rating 6 with 6 rating 6 agents, hahahahahahaha.

Iím not suggesting things like this should be on door locks, and security cameras, and you can always physically insert to get past most of the IC. The new rules where supposed to make hackers and matrix worm or in tune with the rest of the run but they VR hacking will get them anything they want so much faster and safer. This at least gives them an incentive to do something else.

Edward
damaleon
You might take a look at the Shadowrun Missions module they just put up, "Best Served Cold", which has a listing for an Ares host node. It's got a Firewall of 10. It would not be out of the realm of possiblilty for a big skill/autosoft company to have a firewall rated over 6, especially if it is affiliated with a AAA corp.
Edward
Strange. The SR4 book said that node ratings couldnít be over 6.

If they can that changes everything. (including what rating i get for my personal COM link)

Edward
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (damaleon)
You might take a look at the Shadowrun Missions module they just put up, "Best Served Cold", which has a listing for an Ares host node.  It's got a Firewall of 10.

Yeah, and if the runners feature more than 250 karma, Missions tells you to issue a commlink with a Device Rating of 7 to Joe Average. sarcastic.gif
As great as it may be, Missions does not correspond to canon SR.

QUOTE (damaleon)
It would not be out of the realm of possiblilty for a big skill/autosoft company to have a firewall rated over 6, especially if it is affiliated with a AAA corp.

By the RAW, it would.
Rating 6 already isn't used normally, and anything above that is only rumored to be at R&D.
Edward
Based on the SR4 main book I would use rating 7 nodes where I previously would have used UV hosts. And rating 6 where I would have used red hard, red average or orang hard, and thatís being mean to the players.

Edward
blakkie
QUOTE (Edward @ Apr 8 2006, 07:38 PM)
Strange. The SR4 book said that node ratings couldnít be over 6.

If they can that changes everything. (including what rating i get for my personal COM link)

Edward

Where does it say that a node rating can't exceed 6?
blakkie
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
QUOTE (damaleon)
You might take a look at the Shadowrun Missions module they just put up, "Best Served Cold", which has a listing for an Ares host node.† It's got a Firewall of 10.

Yeah, and if the runners feature more than 250 karma, Missions tells you to issue a commlink with a Device Rating of 7 to Joe Average. sarcastic.gif
As great as it may be, Missions does not correspond to canon SR.

The main book wasn't explicit about it, but apparently Commlink rating 7 is fine. It just has to be custom made from bits, not even available off the shelf as a whole plug-in upgrade. Unwired is going to give better details, which should be out by the time any Missions PCs reach 250 karma.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (blakkie)
The main book wasn't explicit about it, but apparently Commlink rating 7 is fine.

Only if Joe has a nasty habit of either stealing prototypes or carrying a technomancers brain around in a jar - which makes him not so Average anymore.

QUOTE (blakkie)
It just has to be custom made from bits, not even available off the shelf as a whole plug-in upgrade.

Which does not compute to Joe Average having it, does it?

QUOTE (blakkie)
Unwired is going to give better details, which should be out by the time any Missions PCs reach 250 karma.

Your ability as a fortuneteller is astonishing... as it won't throw away the main rules, Joe Average will still walk around with his Commlink Rating 3 at best, no matter what amount of experience the characters will have.
blakkie
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig @ Apr 10 2006, 11:30 AM)
QUOTE (blakkie)
The main book wasn't explicit about it, but apparently Commlink rating 7 is fine.

Only if Joe has a nasty habit of either stealing prototypes or carrying a technomancers brain around in a jar - which makes him not so Average anymore.

Proto-types or "cutting-edge" models.

QUOTE
QUOTE (blakkie)
It just has to be custom made from bits, not even available off the shelf as a whole plug-in upgrade.

Which does not compute to Joe Average having it, does it?


How does "Joe Average" having a rating 7 commlink relate to Missions? From what I've seen in Missions commlinks that aren't speced, which I assume include Joe Average, are suppose to be given a rating of TR/2 + 1. So for the 250+ Karma, TR 6, that works out to rating 4.

QUOTE
QUOTE (blakkie)
Unwired is going to give better details, which should be out by the time any Missions PCs reach 250 karma.

Your ability as a fortuneteller is astonishing...


I wish I was a fortuneteller. I came by it via the much more mundane skill of reading the amazing Keskin's posts here. He uses the handle Synner.

EDIT: Or do you mean the part about Unwired being out before someone has a character rack up 50 successful, full karma missions? Even characters that have been running since Missions started in SR3 are only about 1/3 of the way there.

QUOTE
keep in mind that it won't revite the main rules.


What do you mean by "revite"? I'm not familiar with that word, and my dictionary doesn't have it. Do you mean revet? Because this isn't a contradiction of the core book at all.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (blakkie)
Proto-types or "cutting-edge" models.

Sorry, "cutting-edge" is 6 as per device rating table. wink.gif

QUOTE (blakkie)
So for the 250+ Karma, TR 6, that works out to rating 4.

What a relief, there's the mistake.

QUOTE (blakkie)
Or do you mean the part about Unwired being out before someone has a character rack up 50 successful, full karma missions?

grinbig.gif

QUOTE (blakkie)
What do you mean by "revite"?

'revite'? Oh, that may have looked like 'rewrite' some time ago. wink.gif
James McMurray
I believe he meant "rewrite."
blakkie
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
QUOTE (blakkie)
Proto-types or "cutting-edge" models.

Sorry, "cutting-edge" is 6 as per device rating table. wink.gif

Some cut more edge than others. wink.gif

QUOTE (page 212)
Some cutting-edge and prototype models may exceed rating 6 attributes,
but these are exceptionally rare and hard to come by.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (blakkie)
Some cut more edge than others.

..that sounds like a very bad pun used in an ad:

"..sharper than cutting edge."
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