Full Version: The art of shadowrunning
| QUOTE (Critias) |
| I've never been a big dracophile (precisely because a guy I used to game with IRL is, up to and including his gay furry dragon netsex that he'd try to tell us all about) so maybe it's somewhere real obvious and I've just never bothered to read it... but where's that written, about Lofwyr and his awakening? I'm a big fan of bastards, and I've been considering one of my characters being a Lofwyr fanboy (so I need to study up). |
I'm pretty sure it was in the shadowspeak in Dragons of the Sixth World, but I don't have it handy for a reference, sorry.
I'm with you on the dislike of dragon worship. They make far more interesting characters if you place them on a more mortal plane, which is after all, what the rules give you. I have a dragon coming up in my game. I can't say whether or not the PCs will kill it, but they have a chance.
It's not really the dragons' fault. In theory and on principle, I'm all for beings whose arrogance is matched only by their power, and yadda yadda yadda. And as an elf fan, and Earthdawn fan, and as such an immortal elf (in moderation) fan, you'd think I'd be all studied up on the dragons and the other connections between the various ages, links between the games, and all that. But...just...no. This guy and his dragon fetish just ruined things for me.
This knucklehead was a creepy enough guy that it's taken me up until my most recent D&D game to make a Wizard, simply because he'd made one in our first 3rd edition game. Every time I considered making an arcane spellcaster, in all the d20 games I'd played since, I just kept thinking about him and feeling dirty sharing a character class. He ruins everything he touches. Even just remembering some of the stories he'd told us -- and some one of his ex-girlfriend's told us -- makes me feel unclean, to this day.
On the bright side, I did get to have him be horribly beaten by military police in the last Shadowrun campaign I ran, table top. He was an unsubtle fellow. The dragon tattoo on his face (and the reptilian cosmetic cybereyes) weren't even what got him into trouble, so much as the fact he was -- when asked -- trying to drive onto an Army base with an AK slung over his shoulder, an Uzi III on each hip, and a pair of Predators under his jacket. Oh, and he's SINless, and mouthed off.
While everyone else took part in a gel-round training session against a few squads of Army guys (for five hundred bucks each, plus a hundred nuyen-a-scalp side bet they'd made with their fixer), he was cuffed to a chair and beaten by a Master Sergeant. They all got paid for their assistance in testing a new urban combat unit, all he got was Deadly stun damage, Light physical, and a stim patch.
Ah, good times. Good times.
So, uh, yeah. Sorry. The art of Shadowrunning. Right. Carry on.
This knucklehead was a creepy enough guy that it's taken me up until my most recent D&D game to make a Wizard, simply because he'd made one in our first 3rd edition game. Every time I considered making an arcane spellcaster, in all the d20 games I'd played since, I just kept thinking about him and feeling dirty sharing a character class. He ruins everything he touches. Even just remembering some of the stories he'd told us -- and some one of his ex-girlfriend's told us -- makes me feel unclean, to this day.
On the bright side, I did get to have him be horribly beaten by military police in the last Shadowrun campaign I ran, table top. He was an unsubtle fellow. The dragon tattoo on his face (and the reptilian cosmetic cybereyes) weren't even what got him into trouble, so much as the fact he was -- when asked -- trying to drive onto an Army base with an AK slung over his shoulder, an Uzi III on each hip, and a pair of Predators under his jacket. Oh, and he's SINless, and mouthed off.
While everyone else took part in a gel-round training session against a few squads of Army guys (for five hundred bucks each, plus a hundred nuyen-a-scalp side bet they'd made with their fixer), he was cuffed to a chair and beaten by a Master Sergeant. They all got paid for their assistance in testing a new urban combat unit, all he got was Deadly stun damage, Light physical, and a stim patch.
Ah, good times. Good times.
So, uh, yeah. Sorry. The art of Shadowrunning. Right. Carry on.
You know, whenever I read stories like this I'm always left wondering if I'm the only one who is picky enough not to allow anyone at my table that I personally wouldn't invite over to dinner with my family.
| QUOTE (Ravor @ Jul 20 2007, 03:52 PM) |
| You know, whenever I read stories like this I'm always left wondering if I'm the only one who is picky enough not to allow anyone at my table that I personally wouldn't invite over to dinner with my family. |
Nope. I have someone who was massively enthusiastic about playing. I said "no." I'm afraid that it was simply that he wouldn't fit in with the rest of us. We all enjoy the game and have no problem with it. And I think we're all pretty outgoing, balanced people too. Whereas he had a fixed, wait, deep-seated, resentment of "popular people" and seemed to be bringing this idea that because we role-played, we had to be some sort of underclass of refugees from society.
Likewise, he would have made things difficult for me as GM because he had all these ideas about what should and shouldn't be topics in the adventure. Really he should have GM'd as it's the only way that he'd be happy with the world and the nature of the game, except that he wanted it done for him and wanted to play his character. Who, incidentally, was a painfully obviously idealised (female) version of himself.
He also talked about his troll. A lot.
If I had let him play, he would have annoyed everyone by assuming it gave him the right to extend his "everybody hates me" comments to include us all. And he likely would have thrown hissy fits when the setting didn't suit his psychological needs. I'm not a violent person at all, but I could see one of the other players standing up and kicking him after a while.
In an apologetic effort to bring this back on topic, the one I can see kicking him good and hard, is a girl (a particularly tough, little one, as it happens).
Ravor, Knasser - I try to do the same thing, but sometimes people get brought whether I like it or not. I live in a small semi-rural town in northwestern Alabama. I currently have two dedicated players, one guy who plays whenever his girlfriend isn't in town, and the girlfriend of one of the dedicated players who flakes out ALOT and attempts to take him with her as much as possible. The problem inherent therein is that I can't seem to find anyone else interested in playing and worthy of spending time with. Now, no less that 5 minutes ago the girlfriend heretofore described calls me and tells me she is bringing her brother(in what I know is a desperate attempt to get him to integrate himself socially in SOME group) to watch us play and "hopefully"(her words) have him fill in the third dedicated player that we desperately need. The problem with this is that the few times I've met the guy he's seemed pretty nice, but he seems like he will fit in less than she does, and I've made her cry no less than 3 times with REMARKS NOT AIMED AT HER. So, maybe this guy is made of sterner stuff(our group has nicknamed itself the Jackals as we have a tendency to smell weakness and rip each other apart) and maybe he'll fit in, but if I reject him, then she'll leave, and if she goes she won't allow her boyfriend to play, and if HE goes, then I have 2 players, one of which only shows up like 3 out of 4 games if that much.
So, I'm as selective as I can be given the situation. Some of us have no real choice other than to stop the game and it's very hard to give up in the flesh playing, at least for me it is.
So, I'm as selective as I can be given the situation. Some of us have no real choice other than to stop the game and it's very hard to give up in the flesh playing, at least for me it is.
Wow, does that ever resonate with times gone by for me, DTFarstar. I feel for you.
I'm thankful in my black, atheistic little heart everyday for the players I have.
I've gamed in groups like what has been mentioned. I've even been the person mentioned - I'm glad I grew out of it. That kind of behavior indicates a deep-seated need that isn't being met.
Some people are dangerous to associate with - but it can be hard to say no, at times.
I've gamed in groups like what has been mentioned. I've even been the person mentioned - I'm glad I grew out of it. That kind of behavior indicates a deep-seated need that isn't being met.
Some people are dangerous to associate with - but it can be hard to say no, at times.
I'm glad that even a small town like the one I live in (25,000 inhabitants) has enough players for several groups - and all of them are nice persons. 
I've never been in the situation you describe, DTFarstar, but I think I would do the same and try to catch every player I can get, even when one of 'em is a jerk.
I've never been in the situation you describe, DTFarstar, but I think I would do the same and try to catch every player I can get, even when one of 'em is a jerk.
This particular guy was the roommate of our long-standing and reliable GM. Which meant if we wanted Rich to run games for us (on the occasions I wasn't running Shadowrun), we sort of had to let this guy play. He was "in the loop" simply by virture of dorm assignments, and for two years or so there just wasn't much we could do about it.
Some of the more disturbing aspects of his dragon fetish didn't come to light until after he was no longer a member of our social circle, too, in our defense. If I'd known he used to call up his then-girlfriend in the middle of the night, roaring and snarling into the phone and demanding his "mate" come over to his "lair" for sex, I'd've been more likely to just say "Okay, fuck these games, I'm outta here" whenever he showed up.
Some of the more disturbing aspects of his dragon fetish didn't come to light until after he was no longer a member of our social circle, too, in our defense. If I'd known he used to call up his then-girlfriend in the middle of the night, roaring and snarling into the phone and demanding his "mate" come over to his "lair" for sex, I'd've been more likely to just say "Okay, fuck these games, I'm outta here" whenever he showed up.
wow... it's like one of those horridly awful D&D groups you hear stories about but never actually see...
do you think you could do me a favor and never bring this up again?
do you think you could do me a favor and never bring this up again?
| QUOTE (Critias) |
| Some of the more disturbing aspects of his dragon fetish didn't come to light until after he was no longer a member of our social circle, too, in our defense. If I'd known he used to call up his then-girlfriend in the middle of the night, roaring and snarling into the phone and demanding his "mate" come over to his "lair" for sex, I'd've been more likely to just say "Okay, fuck these games, I'm outta here" whenever he showed up. |
Awesome, simply awesome!
Well, thank you Critias, you have officially made me feel better about my situation.
most if not all of this is already covered but here is my 2 cents worth
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]1 - how do Dragons in SR compare to Dragons in D&D, it seems to me that they're more prominent in everyday life, and they have more of a hand in political and corporate affairs, but would you consider them to be as dangerous as their D&D counterparts, and what would be involved in negotiating with one.
[/QUOTE]
dragons can be killed (very difficult but can be done). Dragons are next to impossible. Bring tac-nukes and you might be able to kill it along with yourself.
dragons/Dragons (the later is even more so) is sly, crafty, sneaky. Negioating with them is possible but your chances of of winning the contest is next to impossible (and the Dragons it is impossible).
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]2 - The Players guide and GM Screen are obviously a vital part of a GM's arsenal, but I'm having difficulty in deciding which other guides would be good to read and have around as a major resource, Mr. Johnson's little black book has been recommended a few times I've noticed, but the pickings for 4th edition seem to be pretty slim right now and I'm not sure what else I need now, and what can wait. [/QUOTE]
everyone at the table should have the SR4 core book. Players that have magical characters should also have Street Magic (including the GM). The GM screen (with book) is a good resource for GMs. Augmentation (for people with bioware/cyberware) and Arsenal (for anyone with weapons/gear) should be used once they are released.
And of the location sourcebooks from SR2/SR3 (think of SR2 as DNDv3 and SR3 as DNDv3.5) are good background and give you great info. The NPCs dont translate over but you can see what they are like and look at the various NPCs in SR4 and make an estimated new version of them. I use them for information about the various locations. The "havens" books (Smugglers Havens, Runners Havens, etc) are newer versions of the location books and are good.
And of the plot/run books (as someone pointed out they are like modules) are nice extras but I wouldnt go out and get them specifically. If you need help with missions/runs, read through them or even use one. I dont use them since I have yet to find a gaming group that they work with right out of the book. You have to hack them up to meet the characters at the table. If I am going to do that much work I might as well just write my own.
The Survival Guides to * and ShadowBeat have nice backstory also.
I would check out ebay and buy some of these books (SR2/3) in bundles. I just picked up some SR1 and SR2 books (6 total) for $10 + shipping. YMWV. Also check out the local gaming store's used bin or discount bin. They might have some of them.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]3 - In comparing Earth, the Matrix, and the Astral World, could they best be seen as 3 dimensional layers? In that, each layer represents a different view of a simultanious reality. for example, within the astral world, would the world you see bear any resemblance to the world your physical form resides in? As for the Matrix if you subscribed to a node and went full VR, then from that node connected to a node inside a building nearby, would your Icon be considered as traveling to that node to read its information and having to travel back to your originating node in order to read the originating node's information, or would it be more akin to making a copy and you could access the information on both nodes simultaiously? [/QUOTE]
they are parallel but not 100% the same. But close. Astral and real world are the basic same. Matrix is just another layer for AR, but in VR is goes different. Various other people have given good examples.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]4 - In a typical legal battle, which would take presidence, corporate laws or national laws? does it depend on the location, who your SIN was registered with, or is it a simple tiered ladder? [/QUOTE]
When you are on a AAA and most AA corp properties, they are their own government/country. Their rules rule. When not on their property then you are whatever the local government is, is the ruling rule.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]5 - In what way does religion exist in SR, I have seen few, if any references to Christianity, Judaism, or Muslim beliefs, do these religions still exist, and how powerful would their presence be? [/QUOTE]
Yes oh yes they do. I down play religion in my games since I have issues with religion in games and how it effects certain people. What I feel about _____ religion and the people at the table thing may or may not be the same. I do not discourage people playing religious characters nor using the religious parts of the books. I just dont encourage it either.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]6 - In 4th edition, would cyberdecks and equivelant 3rd edition gear be usable with the current matrix? I would assume it would require a hardware connection, but would it be effective in combatting current IC and traversing the wireless web with hardware access to a wireless node?[/QUOTE]
In my games the old cyberdecks are nice antics but are not really usable. Commlinks are cheap (for a not so good one) and a really good one is much cheaper than the old cyberdecks. the software is what is costly.
[QUOTE id=Fix-it]my 64-bit dual core pc (2006 tech) can read 3.5 inch floppy disks (early 1980s) with no problem.[/QUOTE]
yeah but none of the machines I have bought in the last 3-4 years have had a 3.5 disk drive in them and it has been mucher longer since I have had a 5.25 floppy drive. So it is hard to read those disks when you dont have the drive. And most machines dont come with them. Can you find a drive and hook it up and use it? yeah sure. But you got to find it. I have 11 running computers in my house right now and 1 has a 3.5 drive in it. But that machine is from 2000. And I can not tell you if the drive still works or not since I dont own any more 3.5 media.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]1 - how do Dragons in SR compare to Dragons in D&D, it seems to me that they're more prominent in everyday life, and they have more of a hand in political and corporate affairs, but would you consider them to be as dangerous as their D&D counterparts, and what would be involved in negotiating with one.
[/QUOTE]
dragons can be killed (very difficult but can be done). Dragons are next to impossible. Bring tac-nukes and you might be able to kill it along with yourself.
dragons/Dragons (the later is even more so) is sly, crafty, sneaky. Negioating with them is possible but your chances of of winning the contest is next to impossible (and the Dragons it is impossible).
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]2 - The Players guide and GM Screen are obviously a vital part of a GM's arsenal, but I'm having difficulty in deciding which other guides would be good to read and have around as a major resource, Mr. Johnson's little black book has been recommended a few times I've noticed, but the pickings for 4th edition seem to be pretty slim right now and I'm not sure what else I need now, and what can wait. [/QUOTE]
everyone at the table should have the SR4 core book. Players that have magical characters should also have Street Magic (including the GM). The GM screen (with book) is a good resource for GMs. Augmentation (for people with bioware/cyberware) and Arsenal (for anyone with weapons/gear) should be used once they are released.
And of the location sourcebooks from SR2/SR3 (think of SR2 as DNDv3 and SR3 as DNDv3.5) are good background and give you great info. The NPCs dont translate over but you can see what they are like and look at the various NPCs in SR4 and make an estimated new version of them. I use them for information about the various locations. The "havens" books (Smugglers Havens, Runners Havens, etc) are newer versions of the location books and are good.
And of the plot/run books (as someone pointed out they are like modules) are nice extras but I wouldnt go out and get them specifically. If you need help with missions/runs, read through them or even use one. I dont use them since I have yet to find a gaming group that they work with right out of the book. You have to hack them up to meet the characters at the table. If I am going to do that much work I might as well just write my own.
The Survival Guides to * and ShadowBeat have nice backstory also.
I would check out ebay and buy some of these books (SR2/3) in bundles. I just picked up some SR1 and SR2 books (6 total) for $10 + shipping. YMWV. Also check out the local gaming store's used bin or discount bin. They might have some of them.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]3 - In comparing Earth, the Matrix, and the Astral World, could they best be seen as 3 dimensional layers? In that, each layer represents a different view of a simultanious reality. for example, within the astral world, would the world you see bear any resemblance to the world your physical form resides in? As for the Matrix if you subscribed to a node and went full VR, then from that node connected to a node inside a building nearby, would your Icon be considered as traveling to that node to read its information and having to travel back to your originating node in order to read the originating node's information, or would it be more akin to making a copy and you could access the information on both nodes simultaiously? [/QUOTE]
they are parallel but not 100% the same. But close. Astral and real world are the basic same. Matrix is just another layer for AR, but in VR is goes different. Various other people have given good examples.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]4 - In a typical legal battle, which would take presidence, corporate laws or national laws? does it depend on the location, who your SIN was registered with, or is it a simple tiered ladder? [/QUOTE]
When you are on a AAA and most AA corp properties, they are their own government/country. Their rules rule. When not on their property then you are whatever the local government is, is the ruling rule.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]5 - In what way does religion exist in SR, I have seen few, if any references to Christianity, Judaism, or Muslim beliefs, do these religions still exist, and how powerful would their presence be? [/QUOTE]
Yes oh yes they do. I down play religion in my games since I have issues with religion in games and how it effects certain people. What I feel about _____ religion and the people at the table thing may or may not be the same. I do not discourage people playing religious characters nor using the religious parts of the books. I just dont encourage it either.
[QUOTE id=fatal2ty]6 - In 4th edition, would cyberdecks and equivelant 3rd edition gear be usable with the current matrix? I would assume it would require a hardware connection, but would it be effective in combatting current IC and traversing the wireless web with hardware access to a wireless node?[/QUOTE]
In my games the old cyberdecks are nice antics but are not really usable. Commlinks are cheap (for a not so good one) and a really good one is much cheaper than the old cyberdecks. the software is what is costly.
[QUOTE id=Fix-it]my 64-bit dual core pc (2006 tech) can read 3.5 inch floppy disks (early 1980s) with no problem.[/QUOTE]
yeah but none of the machines I have bought in the last 3-4 years have had a 3.5 disk drive in them and it has been mucher longer since I have had a 5.25 floppy drive. So it is hard to read those disks when you dont have the drive. And most machines dont come with them. Can you find a drive and hook it up and use it? yeah sure. But you got to find it. I have 11 running computers in my house right now and 1 has a 3.5 drive in it. But that machine is from 2000. And I can not tell you if the drive still works or not since I dont own any more 3.5 media.
I agree with basically everything dog_xinu just said. However, I would like to ask him what he and his group DO that they can afford to purchase all those books? I envy him the ability, but we only have two BBB's with 5 people and no other books yet. I hope to combo SM and Augmentation on Amazon or something, but I might not be able to afford that. Stupid college.
Chris
Chris
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