Sure, but for all the minor attention that has been paid to those types of locations (Tir being the exception), SR is set in liberal western societies.
My point, at least, wasn't that every spot on the planet was the same. When you start going into specific exceptions to a rule, then you have to recognize that you're doing so, and adjust accordingly.
So if you want to play a spy that's going to be infiltrating Amazonia, then no, you probably don't want him sporting obvious cyberlimbs.
Full Version: Stats on a Spy
| QUOTE (st23am) |
| Just curious, I need a spy for my game of the Burn Notice variety ( for those that don't want .. you need to). Anyone have some good ideas for stats, gear, contacts such. What does a spy in the 6th world look like? |
Before Burn Notice came out (great show, my wife's miffed at me about deleting an episode off the TiVo), one of the first characters I built in SR4 was an undercover DEA operative who got burned by Crash 2.0. He was on his first solo mission, a low-grade white collar crime reported by a whistle blower. Things turned bad, his support got whacked and he was kidnapped when he stumbled onto a drug smuggling operation. He was missing, his immediate chain of command DOA, and then Crash 2.0 nuked all the files while he was out of country.
This is a starting character build. His strength is low b/c as back story he had been tortured (physical & VR) before escaping. Then he essentially walked back to The World from Aztlan and has yet to fully recover.
He has no cyber as it is something of a fingerprint that can be used to identify you and he's young enough to enjoy the fruits of the decent external tech. Lots of external tech, surveillance gear, and disguises. I highly recommend combining a biometric facial recognition system with a nanopaste disguise to get a really accurate facial reconstruction.
Lots of low level business skills, enough to be able to blend into various settings, especially when supported by skillsofts. Speaks multiple languages, mainly to make it easier to eavesdrop. I'd swap out the pharmacology specializations in favor of Explosives; my guy was DEA so it made sense.
b 3 20 stats 200
r 3 20 skills 124
a 4 30 qualities 30/15
s 2 10 edge 40
c 4 30 contacts 8
i 5 40 cash 13
l 4 30
w 3 20
ini 8
edge 6 40
blandness 5
first impression 10
pain tolerance 3 15
addiction(alchohol) -5
sensitive structure -5
allergy- shellfish -5
contacts
3 2/1 fixer
5 2/3 DEA buddy
active skill
firearms 3 30
influence 4 40
stealth 1 10
athletics 1 10
outdoors 1 10
unarmed(def) 2+2 10
dodge 2 8
f.aid(combat) 1+2 4+2
knowledge 27 free
english n
spanish 3+2 speak
sperethiel 1+2 speak
japanese 1+2 speak
aztec 1+2 speak
salish 1+2 speak
accounting 2+2 forensics
chemistry 2+2 pharmaceuticals
business 1+2 biotech
police proc. 2
magic theory 1
ucas politics 1
cas politics 1
aztech politics 1
beer 1
cash 65,000Y
shock glove 5s el 10c 200
pulsar 6s el/half 150
hamerli 620 4p sm v1 650
viper 8p f/+2 500
hk227 5p 800
sm stock supp vent3 400
alpha AR 6p/-1 1700
grenade launcher
vent3 pads (rc6) 500
4900Y
conc holster x2 150
spare clip x8 40
exx hlx30 hk x30 ar x60 300
flech vp x60 600
std hk x60 ar x60 240
gel hlx30 ar x60 270
stick'n shock hl x30 6S(el) 240
taser x20 100
minigrenade 360
6xflashbang
6xsmoke
2300y
clothes 1000
leather jacket 2/2 200
+6 nonconductivity 1200
actioneer suit 5/3 1500
+6 nonconductivity 1200
armor vest 6/6 600
+6 nonconductivity 1200
lined coat 6/4 +2 conc 700
+6 nonconductivity 1200
+ 6 insulation 900
helmet 1/2 trodes 150
fc IL usound vmag 1150
11,000y
comm resp3 sig4 sys3 fw3 2250
encrypt3 scan3 command3 450
stealth3 sniffer3 3000
mapsoft seattle6, ss-seattle4,
NorthAm1(cost R6) 80
Datasoft- accounting6, chemistry6,
magic theory6 180
5,960Y
tag eraser 150
white noise gen 6 300
rfid tags x50 50
rfid stealth tags x10 50
rfid stealth sensor-camera 105
rfid stealth sensor-microphone 55
rfid stealth sensor-biometric facial
recognition scanner r3 200
rfid security sensor-camera 200
rfid security sensor-microphone 150
micro sensor-MAD r3 165
micro sensor-Directional mike 50
micro sensor-biometric facial
recognition scanner r3 200
radio signal scanner 6 150
1825Y
contacts sm fc ilink 625
glasses ve3 llight vmag ilink 550
goggles IR l.light fc ilink 325
earbuds enh3 s.filter1 510
micro transceiver x2 sig3 1200
3210Y
medkit r6x2 supplies x3 1350
trauma patch x2 1000
nanopaste 2xface 1000
disguise kit 500
3850
honda spirit 10,000
lifestyle med 2mo 4000
squatterx2 2mo ea 2000
fake sins r3 x3 9000
minimal comms x2 skin trode 800
15,800
| QUOTE (kigmatzomat) |
| edge 6 40 blandness 5 firearms 3 30 influence 4 40 stealth 1 10 athletics 1 10 outdoors 1 10 |
Edge + Blandness just scream "Spies want this" (-:
I've been working on a face-hybrid character, (having just read the Bourne Identity and reading the second book) and was actually thinking along similar lines, so this thread has been especially enlightening. I do have one question, though.
I found myself wanting some points in each of three major groups:
- influence (con his way into situations, persuade people to help him, etc)
- stealth (following people, sneaking where one shouldn't be, disguises, etc)
- firearms (doesn't help much if he can't be semi-competent in a firefight)
What I'm curious about is the general focus on them. Do you (and others in the forum, of course) consider a stealthy / quick-talking person a more viable spy than one that's a good shot? (and, given the low number of build points I seem to have left, I'm wondering if it's better to buy a knowsoft link or somesuch to fake my way by in office environs and such... but worry that that's a bit of a cop-out.)
Don't forget to give him knowledge skills of Social Psychology and Social Engineering. That would benefit his abilities to blend in and acquire codekeys, passwords and various other secrets.
Nice build. Thanks kigmatzomat.
Thinks I'd change to make it more Michael Westin:
-Change the Chemistry specialization to Explosives
-Replace Accounting with either Underworld knowledge or Profession:Spycraft to know how to run an op, use inside knowledge as a code, identify locations for an ambush, etc.
-Swap out the flaws for Criminal SIN 10pts (he's a wanted man) and Dependant 5pt (mother+brother)
-I'd reduce the gear quota down in favor of contacts. He has Fiona, Sam, Barry the Money Launderer and probably a few more that he's only leaned on once or twice.
-Michael doesn't have the skills to make up a fake ID so you could probably crank the Comm down a few notches. Fact is, Sam is more of a rigger/techie so Mike probably doesn't need much in the way of high end electronics, assuming he uses lots of skinlinked hardware.
-Change the Chemistry specialization to Explosives
-Replace Accounting with either Underworld knowledge or Profession:Spycraft to know how to run an op, use inside knowledge as a code, identify locations for an ambush, etc.
-Swap out the flaws for Criminal SIN 10pts (he's a wanted man) and Dependant 5pt (mother+brother)
-I'd reduce the gear quota down in favor of contacts. He has Fiona, Sam, Barry the Money Launderer and probably a few more that he's only leaned on once or twice.
-Michael doesn't have the skills to make up a fake ID so you could probably crank the Comm down a few notches. Fact is, Sam is more of a rigger/techie so Mike probably doesn't need much in the way of high end electronics, assuming he uses lots of skinlinked hardware.
| QUOTE (gknoy) |
| I do have one question, though. I found myself wanting some points in each of three major groups: - influence (con his way into situations, persuade people to help him, etc) - stealth (following people, sneaking where one shouldn't be, disguises, etc) - firearms (doesn't help much if he can't be semi-competent in a firefight) What I'm curious about is the general focus on them. Do you (and others in the forum, of course) consider a stealthy / quick-talking person a more viable spy than one that's a good shot? (and, given the low number of build points I seem to have left, I'm wondering if it's better to buy a knowsoft link or somesuch to fake my way by in office environs and such... but worry that that's a bit of a cop-out.) |
Depends on the character role. I built mine in a Westin-esque fashion. You rarely see him sneaking around in the dark like a ninja. Most of the time he walks up to his targets in the open. First Impression does a great job of helping get your foot in the door.
When he does need to sneak, he sets up a distraction (Go team) to give situational modifiers. Mostly stealth is there to be a tail or lose one. Blandness is good for losing a tail since it lets you disappear into a crowd.
Weapon skill is a good thing but shooting usually means you screwed up at an earlier step. My guy was a bit better at social than weapons but with smartlink & sensor gear was still throwing 8 dice. Against cops, gangers, most thugs this character will hold his own, especially if he uses his gear to have a plan. However an unaugmented special forces type or assassin makes it a 50/50 chance of success. (e.g. the deskjockey assassin and the fight on the boat in the season finale)
That's when that fistful of Edge comes in handy.
Fiona's a different kettle of fish. Her social guile is much lower, more dependent on sex appeal and confusion than actual infiltration. Again, not a ninja, but can disappear into crowds. However she is the extra concentrated can of whoop ass.
Sam replaces Mike's social skills with tech, he'd be the decker/rigger of the bunch. Still good in a fight and some stealthing abilities.
| QUOTE (kigmatzomat) |
| I built mine in a Westin-esque fashion. You rarely see him sneaking around in the dark like a ninja. Most of the time he walks up to his targets in the open. First Impression does a great job of helping get your foot in the door. When he does need to sneak, he sets up a distraction (Go team) to give situational modifiers. Mostly stealth is there to be a tail or lose one. Blandness is good for losing a tail since it lets you disappear into a crowd. |
I disagree. He uses Etiquette to fit into the crowd, sure, but also a fair amount of Shadowing (he spots the people tailing him very easily). Its unorthodox in SR since most stealth people are infiltrators but I'd say he uses Intuition based skills a ton and little of the agility based ones.
I'm not sure we are disagreeing on the concept. I said I used the Stealth group to be or lose a tail (Shadowing -intuition) but not to be a ninja (infiltration -agility). This character has a higher intuition than agility (5 vs 4).
Spotting a tail is a function of Perception, while hiding in a crowd, such as when following people, is actually Shadowing.
He probably does need some Perception skill but I figured the Intuition 5, the earbuds with enhanced hearing 3 & select sound filters and the glasses with vision enhancement 3 would cover that for the immediate future. 8 dice for most perception tests means he'll catch many shadows.
This character is a decent tail, having 6 dice to follow but effectively 8 dice to avoid being noticed (Blandness -2 to opposed perception in a crowd) so he's competent.
This is more Michael Westin from 3-4 years ago rather than today. I'd say that the "Burned" character would have racked up several dozen karma to boost stats and skills (particularly perception, the stealth group, and unarmed combat).
Spotting a tail is a function of Perception, while hiding in a crowd, such as when following people, is actually Shadowing.
He probably does need some Perception skill but I figured the Intuition 5, the earbuds with enhanced hearing 3 & select sound filters and the glasses with vision enhancement 3 would cover that for the immediate future. 8 dice for most perception tests means he'll catch many shadows.
This character is a decent tail, having 6 dice to follow but effectively 8 dice to avoid being noticed (Blandness -2 to opposed perception in a crowd) so he's competent.
This is more Michael Westin from 3-4 years ago rather than today. I'd say that the "Burned" character would have racked up several dozen karma to boost stats and skills (particularly perception, the stealth group, and unarmed combat).
Spotting a person in a crowd is perception but does not necessarily mean you notice they are watching you. The whole point of the shadowing skill is that even though the watcher may be seen it wont be noticed he's spying on people. 
Not exactly. Per the RAW, Perception can always be used to spot a tail.
Also by RAW, sometimes Shadowing can be used to spot a tail, but sometimes it can't. And it all comes down to the GM and their momentary whims.
Also by RAW, sometimes Shadowing can be used to spot a tail, but sometimes it can't. And it all comes down to the GM and their momentary whims.
| QUOTE (SR4 p.118) |
When using most of the skills in the Stealth skill group— Infiltration, Palming, and Shadowing—the character makes an Opposed Test against the target’s Perception + Intuition. Apply any appropriate Perception modifiers (see p. 117) to the target. At the gamemaster’s discretion, the target may use an appropriate Stealth skill in place of Perception. A character skilled in Shadowing, for example, could use Intuition + Shadowing to notice someone tailing him. |
If the GM feels like it, you might be able to use Shadowing. Or, if they feel like it, you can't. But Perception works all the time and in more situations.
Unless, of course, the GM is a poor reader and interprets "may use" as "must use" or "will use" but that's a different issue.
Gotcha... yeah, the RAW leaves it to GM discretion...
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