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Mx
QUOTE (Karoline @ May 14 2010, 04:50 PM) *
See, now that's the hanger. I don't think anyone will argue that using SR4a costs is balanced with BP gen (though plenty will complain that you should still use them because they want to be munchkins). It is the 5x attribute cost and paying karma for race that keeps it balanced.

I dont know whether you quoted the wrong post or just completdly missunderstood me , but my point was that for most character builds converting them from the old costs to the new ones is only conna affect the parts of the sheet that make it a living breathing character not the parts that contribute dises to their character role.
With the new costs and the old karma limit the karmagen becomes the same as BP-gen, you have to spent all your points at making your character good at what he does and cant spent a biggish amount of points in fluff thinks like you could with the old costs. Ofcource if you played with a bucnh of fraging power gamers, then those extra points availebul might have became a problem.
Karoline
QUOTE (Mäx @ May 14 2010, 02:49 PM) *
I dont know whether you quoted the wrong post or just completdly missunderstood me , but my point was that for most character builds converting them from the old costs to the new ones is only conna affect the parts of the sheet that make it a living breathing character not the parts that contribute dises to their character role.
With the new costs and the old karma limit the karmagen becomes the same as BP-gen, you have to spent all your points at making your character good at what he does and cant spent a biggish amount of points in fluff thinks like you could with the old costs. Ofcource if you played with a bucnh of fraging power gamers, then those extra points availebul might have became a problem.

No, I just miswrote. I meant the SR4 not 'a' rules, in which it is only 3x cost on the attributes and no cost for race.
Glyph
I get what Mäx is saying. Under the old karmagen, with its lavish allotment of points, you could shore up your main specialty, then spend points in being more than simply good at your job. Maybe you would get artisan/woodcarving and armorer/edged weapons for your knife fighter, or give your ex-merc some outdoor survival and navigation skills.

The revised karmagen still comes out a bit ahead, but it is close enough to BP that it encourages the same kind of mentality - be good at your character's main schtick, and acceptable at the "must-have" skills, then see if there are some points left to play with.
Karoline
QUOTE (Glyph @ May 14 2010, 10:12 PM) *
I get what Mäx is saying. Under the old karmagen, with its lavish allotment of points, you could shore up your main specialty, then spend points in being more than simply good at your job. Maybe you would get artisan/woodcarving and armorer/edged weapons for your knife fighter, or give your ex-merc some outdoor survival and navigation skills.

The revised karmagen still comes out a bit ahead, but it is close enough to BP that it encourages the same kind of mentality - be good at your character's main schtick, and acceptable at the "must-have" skills, then see if there are some points left to play with.


No, the old karmagen system let you get 4s or 5s in all your stats, 4s in every skill you really care about, and a huge smattering of 1s and 2s for flavor. The new karmagen system lets you get a couple of stats at 5 or maybe even 6, everything else at 3 fairly easily. You can get your main skill at 6, then a fair number of skills at 4, and still have a smattering of 1s and 2s for the sake of RP.

Edit: I do agree though, 'updated' karmagen is much closer to BP as far as power level goes.
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