Your initiative score changes immediately, up or down.

Your IPs immediately drop to the lower of the two IPs (new vs old) for the rest of the combat turn and the next combat turn you get your new IPs.

Ex: 2 meat IP, 3 matrix IP

Switching from meat to matrix in IP 1, you'd still get your second IP this turn and next turn you would get all three.

Now, if go from matrix to meat in IP 1, you'd still get your second IP, but you'd lose your 3rd. Next turn, you'd only have two.

Ryu is saying the same thing.

No problem.

There was a debate about this awhile ago, and I believe the "general" consensus was: yes. Although how a TM "does it" when they code things, then end result is a functional program. Someone who is not a TM looking at code that a TM wrote would find it totally convoluted and would probably be amazed that it does anything at all. TM's just "see" the machine differently. It has been sort of implied that the corp Microdeck in SR is heavily using TM's for their software development.

This is not totally clear in the rules, but my take is yes and no, respectively. You can't have your cake and eat it too. If the Sprite takes over the Drone's Pilot program then it takes total control and suppresses all aspects of the Pilot program. This also gets back to the "CFs are not programs" thing. Sprites use CF's, not programs nor can they ever use programs. They are different. End of story. A Machine Sprite can be compiled with a CF that emulates the functionality of an Autosoft but, if given access to an autosoft, it won't know how to use it.

I'm pretty certain the answer to this one is no. The technomancer version of the Software skill is about how complex forms interact with the Matrix, not how to write programs. As a result, you can use it to thread a complex form, but not to write a program. For that, you'd need the mundane version of the skill.


I believe yes and no, in that order.


I'm positive this one's a no. Tutor sprites teach skills, not activesofts. Emulation works on activesofts, not skills.



Er ... the expert system is hardware, ne? It costs Essence? So it's not software, and so not a program, and so can't be copied as a complex form. I also highly doubt that a Resonance echo could be compatible with electronic technology.

Tutor sprites explicitly get skillsoft CFs. The question is if they can hand them out directly.

It doesn't seem unreasonable.

I think it might have been a mistake to define it as a CF rather than a power.

In the original debate about this (I wish I could find the thread) the counter-question was: then what does the TM version of Software do besides Thread CFs?

IMO, it is fluff-consistent to say that TM's can write "mundane" programs with their Software skill they just do it in a way that is totally wacky, but produces the same result. That's just like what they do with their Hacking skill: they do it really weird (from a "regular user" perspective) but still achieve the same result which is gaining access to a system. If the TM version of Software doesn't even produce code (not the same result) than there should be a new skill created called Threading for TM's.

Sorry, I was unclear. On the face of the rules, there's no way of doing this. But Smartlinks and Simrigs are also cyberware that can be duplicated by complex forms. The question was less 'does this exist?' (it doesn't) and more 'should this exist?'. But the DIMAP program option obviates any real need for it.

Thanks again everyone for the answers. Even the contradictory ones

I always had the impression that the SR4 Smartlink actually WAS just a software addon to your viewing device. Which - for some reason i couldn't understand - was unable to be just a darn program on my darn commlink.

Yeah, the Smartlink device is a hold-over from when non-Deckers didn't have any sort of computer on them. In SR4 technology, there's no "real" reason it couldn't just be a Commlink program that communciates with your Smartgun and your Display Link. However, we have it as a vision mod as a legacy thing *shrug*. Just hand-wave and say there's some particular reason that a vision device needs to be modified to accept Smartgun signals. They're special signals or something.

In SR3, Smartlink had to be linked to the user because it was based on simsense, not image processing. The movements of the gun were derived from the movements of the gunner's arm, not on a guncam. There was also no real reason either for the smartlink processor to have to be implanted, but anyway it was only 1 component of the system.

One can always say that the processor has to be a special hardware chip to achieve ultra fast response (that works for both SR3 and SR4), but that still doesn't tell why you should keep it in your body.

All attribute advancement is based on the current value. You see this with the adept power that raises physical attributes. It clearly indicates that increasing the value via karma is based on the total value, not the base value.

There is no RAW reason that minuses to attributes (Essence / Resonance loss due to implants) should NOT work the same way.

If I get what you want to say (not sure), then the difference is merely that the new resonance/magic rating after loosing essence becomes the new "base value". IE: Resonance 5 / Essence 6 -->Resonance 4 / Essence 5. Cost of raising Resonance: 25 karma.

That's how I play it.

sorry to wake the dead... but I have a question that is not worth another thread... wow that rhymed...

anyway, As a technomancer with resonance 5 I can thread a program up to 5 and only take stun damage... but if I enhance a program past 5 I would take physical damage...

With 5 Logic and 5 resonance could I wield a program that's rating is 5, threaded to 10, aided by a sprite to 15 or is the max just my resonance? Also, Can I compile a Sprite with a Rating higher than my resonance as long as I produce enough Hits and take the necessary time, in addition could I keep trying to re-register him until I acclimated a desired number of tasks?

As I understand it, I would have to deal with a fading test of 10P for the threading and a 2xRating of the sprite test for physical damage...

I believe you are correct on both counts, except that the Fading damage for Compiling and Registering the Sprite is 2xhits (not net hits) that the Sprite gets when Opposing you on the test. Yes, you can continue to Re-register a Sprite as long as you have the time and survive the Fading.

Sooo I can boost a program with threading by a number no greater than my resonance?

No.

To a number no greater than twice your Resonance.

edit

Fading is Physical if the CF is Threaded to a number greater than your Resonance.

Fading is equal to the number of hits used.

You could Thread a CF to 10 from 0 if you had a Resonance of 5.

The Fading would be 10P which would likely hurt like hell...

Threading can improve a CF up to 2*resonance, anything beyond resonance causes physical fading.

Thanks... Now I can go and be a super cracker...

Ps: I reread the Fading paragraph and my jaw dropped... If I Compile and Register a 5 rating sprite I would have to suffer 2, 10S Fading test with only my WillPower+Resonance to protect me... is there anything besides not compile or thread higher than my resonance, that I could do to resist more of the Fading damage...

Do you have access to Runner's Companion?

Advanced Lifestyles are your friend here. Both the 'In Tune' and 'Resonance Well' Lifestyle Qualities will supply 2 Dice each for all Resonance tests.

If you can afford the Homeground Quality from the main rulebook that will give you another 2.

Resonance Bond (Allocation Bond) is in Unwired and will net you several more dice for Fading, between 3 and 5 depending on how nice your GM is.

you don't have that quite right.

the sprite rolls it's rating (for compiling) or ratingx2 (for registering) and you resist fading equal to 2 x the number of hits (not net hits) the sprite gets.

so a rating 5 sprite is likely to generate usually 2 hits or thereabouts (i would say 1-3 is a fairly reasonable expectation) meaning 2-6 boxes while being compiled, and probably 2-5 hits for registering, which equates to 4-10 boxes. you do get to resist, of course, and you can also spend some time recovering in between (first aid and rest, for example) so it's not completely horrible. still, the fact that the sprite is going to occasionally dish out 10 (and will very rarely dish out 20)is a definite risk, and it can absolutely backfire on you in a big way.

Androcomputus:
And I think you misunderstood compiling and registering fading. When you compile, the sprite rolls force dice to resist. Not only do these hits reduce your net hits (and hence, services) but also these hits get multiplied by two to calculate your fading for compiling the sprite. You might compile a rating 5 sprite and get zero fading, you might get 10S fading (assuming you have resonance of 5 or more, otherwise P damage). When you register, it is the same except the sprite roles 2 x rating dice. If it is not already registered, you need one net hit to register the sprite, and the rest get added to services owed. When you register a rating 5 sprite, you could, theoretically, get anywhere from zero to 20S fading. Ouch! Registering a sprite whose rating is higher than your resonance is a good way to risk instant bloody death, but the same is true for binding spirits with force higher than your magic. This is one reason I like the optional Fading=force/2+hits rule. Slightly less chance of instant bloody death, and no chance of zero fading.

Also ditto crizh.

edit: Damn you Ninja Jaid!

I just finished my first game and the Gm is allowing us to tweak our characters a little bit... I am thinking about dropping etiquette (corporate), decompiling (found out I still Fade from it) so I can raise by one point and specialize in Compiling and Registering...

I know you can specialize in a certain sprite... What Sprites is the most optimal to specialize for Compiling? Registering?

Again the Gm only has the 4e book he does not have Arsenal, Unwired, Runner's Companion... Just the Core 4e book...

Thanks guys for the explanation of the Fading... I am now less worried that it will kill me but I will remain cautious as it can hurt me...

Gonna throw in a quick question. The Runner Companion Advanced Lifestyle Quality "Resonance Well" grants your home access to a Resonance Well as described on page 172 of Unwired. What the Quality doesnt seem to specify is the Rating of the Well. Is it a decision I should throw at my GM, or is it noted somewhere (I.E By Errata or something) and I just cant see it?

I ask because I am building my Technomancer Lair of Awesome. The qualities that look like they would be best for me so far are:

Feng Shui - Helps me with my Technical Skills when I am at home. As far as I am aware this includes things like Computer/Hacking skills and lets my teams Rigger use my garage to fix up his drones... for a price. I also think it helps me with my Threading rolls. Software is a Technical Skill, right?
In Tune - For the most obvious of reasons. Yay, more dice to throw at my Compiling/Registering.

I am also considering picking up, but these might not get in depending on costs.

Free Access - Reduces the chance of someone being able to Trace me back to my home, something I would be worried about as a Stay At Home Hacker. I have actually been trying to think of ways of getting around this. One of them is to buy myself a Router Drone that I route all my Matrix traffic through. Whenever I am doing something that could get me a Trace on me I use the Drone, and then turn it off as soon as I have finished my hack. Lets see you Trace me when my datatrail suddenly stops at some random StufferShack node!
Workplace - To let me expand my home in the future to include a Facility (Which my Rigger teammate would probably be paying for...).

I am considering asking my GM to let me have my AI Contact be an irritating live in, thus letting me take the AI in Residence negative quality. Lets me bump up my homes node stats up a fair bit, and could explain why there is a Resonance Well about. I would also probably be taking Sprite Magnet, those Resonance Wells tend to attract the little buggers. Now if only I could capture a few of them to feed to a local Free Sprite in return for Submersion help...

Erm, yeah, right. The Question was Resonance Wells, what rating are they?

I go with 2 because that is what the Aspected Domain Quality gives.

But that is pure speculation on my part. It's up to the GM.

well, what kind of sprite do you want to have around most? just decide what kind of sprite you think you're going to need to have more than one available, that's the sprite you pick for registering. for compiling, well, same basic logic; figure out what kind of sprite you're going to want to be able to compile on the fly with more services (or just at high ratings/more reliably, whichever), and choose that one. i can't really answer the question for you, because i can see definite advantages to having a broad selection of sprites in general.

that said, i have to ask... you have decompiling at rating 1 or something? and likewise with etiquette? i'm trying to figure out how dropping those skills only lets you raise your other skills by 1. as far as BP/karma efficiency goes, specialising is not your best choice (although it can certainly help in other ways, it just isn't as efficient, which is not necessarily a horrible thing). i personally would be more tempted to just boost the whole skills, if possible, and maybe some CFs if possible and if your GM will allow it.

Different sprites have different uses. For example, if you don't want to bother with a Data Search skill (or Browse CF), Courier/Sleuth sprites are pretty handy. If you're going to be going into lots of combat, Machine sprites are nice (diagnostics on both guns and medkits makes a TM every Street Sam's best friend). If you're doing lots of matrix combat, a Paladin sprite will make your life easier (and last longer).

Just for some clarification:

Can Tutor Sprite assist (+ skill rating/2) to a person who already have the skill?

I know they can instruct a person who doesn't have the skill as if they did have the skill at (skill rating / 2)

Threadmancy! I know, I know, but instead of creating a new thread, I needed a question answered...


How is Castling (and Hardening for that matter) a sustainable power? I'm currently catching flak for trying to get my sprite to do as such.

Since this is up, I might as well ask this;

Using a Satlink reduces your IPs (going off memory here) because of the lag back to your commlink.

Does a Technomancer get to ignore this since he doesn't have a commlink, and effectively takes his entire "system" with him?

A TM effectively does have a commlink, his own body.

I feel that this is indeed a correct assumption. The TM would still be limited in init passes, just as if he/she were a hacker.

I feel that this is indeed a correct assumption. The TM would still be limited in init passes, just as if he/she were a hacker.

in point of fact, all it does is reduce your effective response rating.

If you use the Sat Link to connect to geostationary satellites then the Response of the hacker is halved (min 1), but it has the advantage of becoming untraceable (or more precisely traceable only to within a range of a few hundred of kilometers). Low-Earth Orbit satellites can track you as normal but don't lower your Response (No data lag).
--Unwired 50-51

Gah, I KN-EW I had read that somewhere concerning Low-Earth Orbit satellites. That's what I get for not cracking open the books and re-researching about using Sat Links. Thanks for the info, Tsuul.

I disagree with this. I had a group here fall apart and I think part of it had to do with just how overpowering my Technomancer was, even starting out. Granted, these weren't the most dedicated of players (2 or 3 in the group just used the basic templates in the core book), and we were just running the On The Run book, and aside from the initial combat in the stuffer shack, I ended up dominating a lot of aspects of the run. As both an elf and a TM, I had high charisma so I ended up being our face (even with only 1 point in Negotiation), I could just compile Data Sprites to do all the investigation for me, I had a Machine Sprite in a Doberman Drone (equiped with a White Knight LMG) so he dominated combat while I still stayed in meatspace with my 1 IP and a shotgun, or summoned Fault sprites to mess with the cyberware of the enemies. The only areas I lacked in were magic, really. And this was a started TM. Threading and Sprites make up a lot of the power of a TM.

Allow me to quote this section you're describing.

"Aside from the Resonance skills that technomancers use to handle sprites (see p. 119), technomancers use the same skills common to hackers - Computer, Cybercombat, Data Search, Electronic Warfare, Hacking, Hardware, and Software. The way technomancers use these skills, however, is vastly different from the way non-technomancers use them. Technomancers, after all, exercise these skills through mental gymnastics and an intuitive feel for the functioning of the machine world - they don't learn to use electronics so much as they learn to make devices do what they want.
This means that the technomancer versions of these skills are fundamentally different from the standard versions. In game terms, technomancers may never teach these skills to non-technomancers, nor are any technomancer versions available as skillsofts. Technomancers may learn the normal versions of these skills separately (or use normal skillsofts), but they inevitably find the normal way of doing things to be hopelessly clumsy and backward."

What does this mean? It means they do things differently, it doesn't mean they can't program with their understanding of how things work. It just means that non-technomancers might have a hard time using those programs, or not understand the fundamental code beneath the program. Heck, one of the Paragons has the disadvantage that even TM's have a hard time understanding the stuff you tweak if they don't also follow that Paragon.

Yeah, that post was from almost a year ago and I thought that I had amended my stance since then... sorry for making you have to correct me... AGAIN... but no worries... its all good...

Keep the Faith