Short answer: cuz there ain't many Injuns to begin with.

Long answer: Back in the days of the Pilgrims and the Spanish Conquistadors, Europeans found a new land far to the West of Europe known as The New World, later named the Americas. In this land, they found a bunch of natives. You know, Native Americans. The Europeans brought many wonderous items with them in their journeys of exploration, not the least of which was some of the most effective biological warfare plagues ever seen by humanity. A couple of centuries later, there weren't a whole lot of Native Americans left; something like 10% of those who were around when Columbus arrived in 1492. By 2000AD, there might be about 2 million Native Americans in North America. By 2020AD, the Native Americans had turned the tables on the Europeans and formed the Native American Nations. One of the founding concepts of NAN was to boot the Anglos back to Europe and have a purely Native American NAN. This didn't work so well in practice, because there STILL weren't a lot of Native Americans, so the NAN opened their borders to anyone vaguely suspected of having Native American blood, or at least anyone who rooted for the Native Americans in Western films. Even this wasn't really enough to get the population up very high because, let's face it, the Europeans were REALLY thorough about depopulating the Natives.

You don't have to be advanced to win a war. See: Vietnam, aka, David vs. Nuclear Goliath. Also, it doesn't take more than one or two PCC nukes to wreck Aztlan aggressions, and the PCC can do all sorts of other bad things to Aztlan - wreck Aztech's stocks, maybe enlist the Great Ghost Dance from other NANs, etc.

Also - and you'll want to remember this one - sometimes the little nation (like the PCC) will loose to the bigger one, but not every other nation will approve of it. See: Kuwait, Iraq, Desert Storm. Invading the PCC might earn Aztlan a war with the Confederate States, UCAS, and rest of the NAN, all of whom would have an axe to grind with Aztlan.

Yeah, well, the whole Great Ghost Dance nonsense was blessed by artistic license. NAN is an integral part to the "feel" of Shadowrun, so it stays, nevermind logic. Battletech has that problem with the Clans, too.

I when I said LA city,I meant LA county.My mistake,as wile LA city is only ~3.7 million people,LA county is way more.Now,as for my mistake the cities in LA county are so tightly bunched together that it may as well be one city.

LA county is ~9,6 million
Source
Saito controls one of the five largest cities/counties in the "US". And San fran ain't small either.

India also is poor, CAS,Aztlan,UCAS,Quebec aren't.One thing you should remember is militaries are largely based on how much a nation can pay.You know why India has so many movies made?It is because not everyone in India has power.People in India don't have enough money for TV's and even if they had them, large part of the country wouldn't have power for them.So people make movies, movies come out everyday, in the same way people have TV shows.India lack the infrsturcture to take care of civil engineering problems, what the hell kind of army do you think they could feild?

SO an wealthily nation like CAS, even if each person makes less money than the PPC, has the resource to feild an army larger than the NAN.Fallowing human history nations feild armies as large they can,based on the threats of war.CAS has three hostile borders.I think they would have as large as an armed force per-person as the US has now.Witch would be ~3,000,000.This number may be a bit low as CAS has real hostile nations near by.I wouldn't be shocked if the number was ~1,000,000.

Four words: The Great Ghost Dance.

Its kinda hard to crush a rebellion when tornadoes spring into existance to wipe out your air strike, spirits and armor-spell-enhanced native americans impervious to small arms fire engage your infantry, when those same spirits use their accident power on your tanks, and when, most importantly, you dont have a fragging clue whats going on because you don't believe in magic.

The fact that they're basically peaceful nations? It's been 45 years since the treaty was signed, after all. Why go re-opening old wounds?

Why did we take that land from the natives in the first place?Greed, baby.Pure,lovely greed....

Yes, but that was the point.The NAN have nothing on either the CAS or the UCAS anymore.They lack,the man power, and their mojo is not so big of a deadl anymore.

Foolish American belief in not slaughtering people who haven't messed with you in a generation. A few CAS politicians campaigned on retaking some of the lost land, but that was mostly in reference to Aztlan.

That'll last. See my last comments. It shouldn't have taken the USA that long to wise up to magic.

First, the degree of cohesivity in the SAIM rebels was ludicrous. It wouldn't have taken much to lure some shamans over to the government side. It also wouldn't have taken much to capture some shamans - it doesn't take people well informed of magic to capture shamans, not when they're very rare like in the early years of the 6th World, and not when their body guards are lightly armed irregulars. All you need is a one-page set of guidelines for the Native Americans to basically loose their magical edge, and you only need one captured shaman to deliver that info. A few tips like "Spells are mostly line of sight" would make a huge difference.

Second, the Native Americans weren't the only ones to develop magic early; they just demonstrated a knack for it and "guidance from the spirits." An edge, not inconquerable.

Third, you don't need air strikes to crush a rebellion in the middle of a hostile population that outnumbers the rebels at least 150:1.

Heh. Not all the SAIM bands had spell-tossers. Particularly right at the beginning of the 6th World, they were rarer than honest politicians.

So the bands that had them: good for them. The others should've been screwed 6 ways from Sunday.

What were the Natives going to do in the long run when they had the gov't troops on the run? If the Anglos refused to leave cities, Native Americans had very few options. They could cut off water supplies to squeeze the Anglos - nice, kill a few million people of thirst (with associated loss of the moral high ground and backing - what a PR disaster strangling a city would be). They could cut off food supplies - nice, kill a few million people of hunger. They could try to storm a city - stupid, urban assaults by small groups of irregular troops.

Yeah, see, that's one of those implausibilities. That ignorance shouldn't have lasted more than a year or two.

*The stupidity of that whole "final solution" thing by the US goverment was only artistic license.
*The stupidity of the government troops trying to fight the Native Americans could only be artistic license.
*The inability of the government to grapple with magic could only be artistic license.
*The ability of the Native Americans to achieve so much with so little is only artistic license. They simply lacked the manpower to occupy and hold the land they did.

The Native Americans should never have been given a reason to rebel like the re-education camps; if they were, they should've lost.

Waitaminute.... you'd take Long Duk Dong over Tom Cruise???

...oops... that was Gedde Watanabe... nevermind...

Like LA, Las Vagas,Denver,San fransico,San Jose.Portland,Santa fe,Salt Lake City... Then add minor cities

L.A. only recently fell into Native hands.
Denver is divided into sections, and is not wholely in Native hands.
San Francisco has never belonged to the Natives in Shadowrun.
Salt Lake City has a special arrangement whereby most, if not all of it belongs to the Mormons.
Portland is in Tir Tairngire, which IIRC succceeded from the NAN a while ago.

Whilst they might have more mages, do they know how to pull off something akin to the Great Ghost Dance? The only reason the natives did was that Thais- Aina the IE's son- had told them previously. The blood mage faction of Aztechnology knows how to do magic on that scale, but no-one likes them so the Native Americans cancel out the magic and everyone else would probably chip in militarily to slauhter them.

San Francisco wouldn't be an easier goal if the the NAN wasn't in the way, and we know how much UCAS likes Saito....And the UCAS just is buddy-buddy with the elves...

But the only logical reason UCAS wouldn't want any major CFS city is that the NAN would be in the middle of them.Seeing as those CFS could be worth the the grass lands in the middle of the cities....

Um, isn't the VP of the UCAS also an IE.Isn't she also the head of the DF,witch is a will of Big d.Didn't Big D,want to remake the US of f***ing A?

Um, no! Daviar is not in any way described as an IE, or even an elf for that matter.

Considering the UCAS let California go without a fight, I don't see their number 1 priority being getting it back.

Other than that, I'm not sure I understand what point you are trying to make.

My point is this the only semi valid reason the UCAS let the CFS go,is because they had other things to deal with,mainly the idea that the south would go to war,and it was hard to maintain any supplies, too or from there.The NAN being in the way and all.

Now the NAN aren't the only people with powerful mojo,as at least one IE is working with the DF.Big D,had plans of reforming the US,and funny how the Leader of the UCAS is said to be in the "draco party",also the largest UCAS company has military assists in CFS.THe point,being?UCAS has means and motives to invading the NAN.The NAN,doesn't have the man,or magical power to stop them.

As for the elves in power in the UCAS,look at Do6W.

"Many in DeeCee Believe that Daviar will be both the first woman and the first elf to become president..."

Aina Dupree is at least a spike baby.

Frank Hardy is of unknow age.

Grace Freil could maybe a free-spirit.

Most of the shamans that knew the GGD died, in the casting,or died in the many years after it,and until now.

So,the NAN has lost most of their best shamans, and the UCAS gains many friends in high places.

And I left out the IE's who like UCAS, until somone brought in the IE thingie the NAN had.

Yeah, because that really affected their ownership of Seattle. Seriously, California threatened to leave, the UCAS said "ok, bye", and that was that.

What IE is this?
As for Ares having interests in CFS, well, they are a AAA multinational company. What they are not is a puppet of the UCAS.
As to your assertation that the NAN hasn't got the mojo to stop the UCAS, I think that's just not true. But then again, it's pretty much speculation on both of our parts, because there are no UCAS plans to actually invade the NAN as of yet.

And she probably will be. So?

Aina is an IE who is the mother to a half-Horror. She is not in the UCAS' pocket, but she does presently sit on the board of the Dunky Institute, along with a couple of other IEs.

Considering that another version of the GGD was performed in the 2050s, it's not likely that the knowledge of this ritual is as lost as you think.

Speculation!

As I previously asked....these are?

The NAGNA did state the CAS might have the best field forces in North America. IIRC, SoNA only states the CAS have the largest armed forces in North America and that their linbe troops are better trained. For the poeple willing to count, they have 6 active Army divisions, 2 Marine expeditionary forces, 16 combat squadrons in the Air Force, the "largest submarines force in the world", but only two 50ktons carriers and a brow-water navy centered on the Guld and overall seemingly weaker than the UCAS. I wouldn't also be surprised if Texas had an over-inflated National Guard.

Just googling ! In 2001, 1.4 million in the active forces, and 875,000 more in the reserve, counting the Coast Guard. Global Security have a lot more of info regarding numbers of soldiers, divisions and so on, but you have to collect it through several pages. They also link toward a full OB.

To compare to the CAS numbers given above, the US have nowadays something like 10-12 active Army divisions and 3 MEF. So the CAS has between a half and a third of what the US had, which is equivalent when related to population (CAS 105 millions, US 275 millions).

And I seem to recall something about the thinking they the last chance to reform the US.They call the UCAS sellouts.

What kind of PR would CAS get for retaking stolen land,both by NAN and rouge militants?

Some points to ponder:

Back to nature does not mean absolutely no technology. It means they try to have less of a negative environmental impact on what they do us. It means citizens of the NAN will likely drive diesel (is it me, or anyone else find it odd that you can’t get or build a diesel car in SR when diesel cars have been around for years and there are even kits to run them off used vegetable oil?) or electric cars. They will hold on to them for 10 to 20 years instead of trading them out ever year or two. It means they are more likely to eat whole foods, practice forms of holistic medicine along side conventional, avoid the use of pesticides, practice crop rotation instead of over fertilization, build houses out of materials that will decay quickly when abandoned, recycle and reuse when ever possible, the list goes on. Does anyone happen remember the quote from the Tribal Warrior character archetype from one of the earlier versions?

I think it is likely the NAN have both nuclear capabilities as well as the means to launch them. Most of the US missile silos are in what would be NAN lands.

Any sort of aggression from any side would likely end up with a five way war between the nations the North America, four *if* (big if here) the CAS and UCAS ally. In other words a real cluster frag, and likely a scorched earth victory (in other word, you win, but end up either destroying your target objective, or damaging it to such a degree to make it unusable). With the fact the food from the NAN will likely cut off from the aggressors, can any nation afford to rely on its own supplies to feed its population? You can't just drop ship farmers in the middle of a combat zone, the farmers there are not going to work at gun point, and most people in the CAS, UCAS, Aztlan, and CFS do not know enough about farming in that region to get large scale food production going soon enough to make a difference. In other words, if push came to shove, the NAN could just leave their farms and engage in a large scale reverse siege and starve the aggressors out.

We also have a similar situation to look at that occurred in our own (relatively) recent past, the seven days war. Here we have a whole group of Middle East nations with lots of money and manpower teaming up against Israel, a nations with some money, yes but not as much, and not nearly as much manpower. And the Israelis kicked butt. One reason for this was because the Israelis knew and utilized the land much better, an advantage I think the NAN would likely share. Also, I would not put it past the most of the NAN to support compulsory military service.

Since most resources are not even owned my governments at all, by the most powerful and influential forces in the Shadowrun world, I think most of you are forgetting to think about how they would feel about World War III. Namely the Megacorps. War to that degree is not profitable for the majority of Megacorps. Sure, most have some holdings in arms manufacture, but that is not the bulk of where their income is derived from. It comes from sales of general consumer goods, which rely on strong consumer confidence. Consumers tend to get edgy around war and don’t make a many big purchases. Finally, most countries tend to nationalize their private industry when they go to major war. Or at least nationalize what are seen as most vital. They do not do nice things like buy up companies stocks or processing plants, but do so by fiat, if the industries in question do not want to play ball the way the government in question wants to play it. These are not conditions the Megacorporations are interested in condoning. It’s bad for business.

But it seems like Playing Games is wanting to see the NAN invaded and feels they deserve to be and no argument to going to persuade hir otherwise. PG, if you want an invasion in your game then I say go for it. No one has ever said that the state of the continent has to stay static. I’m sure it would make for an interesting campaign. The players could be mercs, special ops, or spies. Or you could set the game in a post war era, and the players could be vets, trying to make their way in a dramatically changed world. A world where their services are no longer needed and many of the population look on them with a mix of fear, disgust, and anger, especially the overly wired and augmented ones. If you do take that route, I would strongly suggest searching out and acquiring a copy of Underground if you can. Has a very cyberpunk meets 1960s Vietnam vet meets 1940s imagry and patriotism meets 1950s "land of tomorrow and opportunity" feel to it. Great stuff