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Reaver
QUOTE (Fortune)
QUOTE (Reaver @ Feb 6 2004, 11:08 AM)
when did 1st ed. come out?  1995?

1989! SR2 was released in '92, and SR3 in '98 (IIRC).

If you started playing him in '95, you'd have had to be using old rules to start with to have had the character 'since 1st ed SR'. smile.gif

Gods, was it that long ago? I am getting old. wink.gif

'89-'90 makes more sense thou since I was in college at that time when I started playing.

Delta ware is really only worth the cost if you are playing a magically active character. Mundanes, I'd agree that you should stick with beta. smile.gif
Grey
QUOTE (Reaver)
QUOTE (Grey @ Feb 6 2004, 12:59 AM)
QUOTE (Reaver)
Well, mine isn't broken.

indifferent.gif sarcastic.gif indifferent.gif eek.gif indifferent.gif rotfl.gif indifferent.gif ohplease.gif

Well Grey, what do you consider not broken. A character you only play a few times and never put any work into and never see any improvement over time? ohplease.gif

How about something in the middle? You know... resonable.
Solstice
I have to agree that your char is pretty unreasonable. I don't know what kind of games you play in but in any of my games it would be seriously broken.
Grey
As for grades of cyberware, it only really counts when it comes to the big stuff, like a VCR. Look at Optical Mag for the eyes. Its 0.2 essense + 6000 nuyen.gif at normal grade, 0.16 + 12,000 nuyen.gif at alpha, 0.12 + 24,000 nuyen.gif at beta, and 0.1 + 48,000 nuyen.gif at delta. Thats not that big of a difference in essense, but way too big of a difference in costs.

Now look at the VCR-1. 2.0 essense + 12,000 :nuyen at normal, 1.6 + 24,000 nuyen.gif at alpha, 1.2 + 48,000 :nuyen at beta, and 1.0 + 96,000 nuyen.gif at delta. I'd say that getting alpha is worth it for sure and beta is really nice if you have the money, but the essense difference between beta and delta isn't enough to justify the nuyen.gif costs.

Besides, deltaware is supposed to be so hard to find and so expencive to install that it is next to impossible to get it.
boodah
QUOTE (Solstice)
I have to agree that your char is pretty unreasonable. I don't know what kind of games you play in but in any of my games it would be seriously broken.

that character gets attacked the most, hurt the most, and draws nasty enemies.

when EVERYONE just about dies, its a balanced run. trust me on that.
Glyph
*Sigh* You know, I never can resist these "build a character" threads. I just like building characters. But like any generalist, the riggerdeckersamuraimageadept is spread a bit too thin to be really effective. This is the best I could come up with:

[ Spoiler ]


I put it in spoiler tags, so it wouldn't take up so much space on the thread.
Lilt
As an interesting note: Is a magician's way adept's Spell pool based on his actual magic rating (6 naturally) or his magician's way power rating? It says that you use Sorcery and Conjuring with an effective Magic Attribute equal to your level in Magical Power, but would that also apply to spell pool?

I'd be say it is based on the magical power rating but I'd like to hear other people's oppinions.
GunnerJ
Just a note, Glyph: Shamans of the Sun must have a minimum Charisma of 4.
Lilt
Also: If a character was to take a voluntary geas for the *0.75pp cost on his magical power, can he then take a geas to offset magic loss?
Herald of Verjigorm
Yes, the magic loss prevention geas can be removed by initiation, but until then, all relevant geasa for a power must be met to use that power.
Lilt
OK. Here's my attempt at a rigger/decker/samurai/mage/adept. He uses cyberware above alpha grade, cultured bioware, and used spell points to initiate at character generation. He was also built using the sum-to-ten system. He may not fit some people's descriptions of "sammie" or "adept" but I think he works.

Generation system: Sum-to-ten + Balanced Edges/Flaws
4: magic (Full) (Hermetic Magician's Way Adept)
4: Resources (1M)
1: Race(Dwarf)
1: Attributes (21)
0: Skills (27)
Flaws:
Chronic Ostiocusps (-10)
Dual Natured (-5)
Matrix Addiction (light) (-2)
Edges:
Ambidexterity-Full (cool.gif
Aptitude (edged weapons) (4) (another skill might be better)
Bonus Attribute Point (Int) (2)
Vehicle Empathy (2)
Night Vision for Riggers/Deckers (1)

Name: Jack
Archetype: Yes, most of them
Race: Dwarf Changeling

Attributes
B: 4
Q: 3(6)
S: 3(5)
C: 2
I: 7(9)
W: 7

R: 7 base, 8 physical, 9 rigging, 11 decking
I: 1d6 base. +3d6 from spell, +1d6 from VCR, +1d6 from Deck

Pools:
Combat: 11
Control: 9
Hacking: 8
Spell: 7
Task: 1 (applcable to int-linked skills)

Active Skills:
Centering 6, Sorcery(Spellcasting) 5(7), Conjuring 2, Edged Weapons(Katana) 3(5), Pistols (Browning U.P.) 2(4), Computer(Decking) 4(6), Ettiquette 1.

Knowledge skills:
Criticism 6 (Also his centering skill, see below), Physics 6, Chemistry 6, Biology 6, Bushido Philosophy 6, Forensic Science 6, Talismongering 6, Engineering 3.

Language skills: English (Cityspeak) 4(6), Japanese 2, German 2, Speretheil 2, Shalish 2.

Cyberware:
VCR 1 (Used Deltaware), Math SPU 3 (Used Deltaware), Datajack (Used Deltaware)
Essence loss: 1.2
Bioware:
Cerebral Booster 2, Enhanced Articulation, Trauma dampener, Cultured Muscle Aug 2, Muscle Toner 3
Bio Index: 3.6

Magic loss: 1.2 + (3.6/2) = 3
Offset by Gesure geas applied magical power

Adept Powers
Magical Power (6), 3 points geased, gives 36 spell points + magic rating 6 for magical skills.

Spell Points:
3: Join Magical Group
9: Initiate, Oath ordeal, learn Centering
10: Initiate, Thesis Ordeal, Apply centering to Vehicle skills (or technical if you're that way inclined)
1: Increase Reflexes +3
1: ^-Bind Sustaining Focus
1: Improved Invisibility
1: ^-Bind Sustaining Focus
4: Exclusive Heal 6
4: Exclusive Stunball 6
1: Exclusive Levitate 3
1: Oxygenate

Deck & Programs:
Novatech Hyperdeck 6
Analyse, Browse, Commlink, Deception, Decrypt, Read/Write, Relocate, Spoof, Validate, Sleaze, Deadly attack, Cloak, and Medic all at rating 6
Scanner rating 4
1000MP active storage upgrade (not installed yet)
1000MP off-line storage

BMW Blitzen
Dikoted Katana & Wakasashi
2*Browning UP
General Clips, Ammo, Armor, Stuff

1 month Medium Lifestyle
1 month 20-member Luxury Resourced Magical Group Dues (5k)
Microtronics Kit
Vehicle kit
Talismongering kit
Rating 4 Conjuring Library
Chalk

Hmm. I've probably forgotten something, but you get the general idea. He centers through picking holes in and criticising his opponent's actions/the world in general. It's a form of meditation.

PS: Can anyone see anything rules-wise against adepts centering on technical skills (IE: Computer) whilst decking? What avout vehicle skills whilst rigging? I had a quick look but didn't see anything. That would be really quite powerful if it was possible.
Glyph
D'oh. Forgot about the Charisma requirement. I suppose you could change his Totem to Sky Father.

I don't think there's anything in the book saying you can't take a Magic loss-offsetting geas on a power you've geased for lower cost, although keeping that many geasa could be problematic. In Tom's case, it's only the geas for Magic loss that he's taken.

He didn't turn out that bad, actually. If he joined a team of runners, he could be useful to them. Point build system characters, it would depend on how many points. For 120 points, such a character would be spread far too thin to be effective at more than one or two of his/her many roles. But for the 140+ point builds, you could make such a character pretty darn effective. For comparison, I think Tom translates to about 130 build points.
Lilt
Jack (Short for Samurai Jack of all trades BTW) is effectively 134 BPs, I think the max possible with the priorities sytsem is 135BPs if you take resources, magic, atts, race, and skills respectively from A to E.

Hey: When you're trying to squeeze *that* much out of a character then it seems perfectly reasonable to choose the standard system that does it best. That said, I've not tried Becks but I think it might be good. I hear becks is good for rounded characters with middle-level skills.

[edit=Yup] Becks 425 comes-out around even with sum to 10, I piped some exta karma in from the flaws (the aptitude is kinda unnessecary) and it has 6 general-purpose karma to spare. It also has slightly fewer knowledge skills (45 points in knowledge skills was slightly OTT anyway). [/edit]
Austere Emancipator
QUOTE (Lilt)
Becks 425 comes-out around even with sum to 10

Kagetenshi and BlackSmith take note... nyahnyah.gif
Lilt
I think I remember hearing before that Becks was good for adepts. I'm sorely tempted to try and make a centering adept at some point with it. Centering adepts: Extremely high attributes, an extremely high centering skill (8-10), an extremely high initiate rating, and centering every time applied to many different skill areas.
Jason Farlander
For even more fun, make a houserule such that your centering adept can apply centering to his centering skill.
Lilt
A quickened Analyse Device spell would be invaluable to a jack-of-all trades character such-as this one. It's unlikely to help much for big armoured vehicles but for work on electronics or computers (OR ~8 to 10+) and the like you could get some good bonuses (+3 to +6) to B/R and background knowledge skills on anything within 36m, maybe even 360m if you go with the extended version.

IE: as you walk into a building you instantly accquire background knowledge and B/R skills at rating 6 (or increase your own skills by 6) relating to the security systems, the guard's weapons, the drinks machines, the cleaning robots, the VCR in the guard post, and the manager's chair!
Kagetenshi
QUOTE (Austere Emancipator)
QUOTE (Lilt)
Becks 425 comes-out around even with sum to 10

Kagetenshi and BlackSmith take note... nyahnyah.gif

Eww... sum-to-10... almost as bad as BeCKS...

~J
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