Sometimes, even shell companies don't provide the denialability desired.
Not that it matters: The people making the decisions on that scale are the best clients of tax havens.
QUOTE (Mordinvan @ Feb 27 2010, 05:34 PM) 
Ever heard of corporate courts?
If the company you buy your cheese from engaged in mad cow disease spreading to all their compeditors, and you can actually trace it back to them, they can in fact be sued, and their employee's dealt with by the court.
If the company you buy your cheese from engaged in mad cow disease spreading to all their compeditors, and you can actually trace it back to them, they can in fact be sued, and their employee's dealt with by the court.
And it is run by the megas themselves. Who all have secrets to hide. It's odd how lots of proposals never get any votes.... It's about as effective at controlling the megas as the UN has been at stopping warfare, and corruption, and for the same reasons.
The corporate court has far more teeth than the former UN :
- it has only 10 members, which means they have an easier time to agree with each other
- there's no veto : Aztechnology was a member when they got an Omega Order in their face (they had to compromise to wriggle their way out of it), which they would certainly have vetoed if they could.
- eventhe AAA need to pay heed to them : it's the lynchpin of the world trade. Kick it out and you're back to a feudla system where a contract doesn't mean squat. Which means no stock market and asset property rules, you 'reign' only as far as your gun reach. Definitively a bad thing dor business
One can also note that the corporate court doesn't bother with the small fry. I'd be surprised if they ever had to rule on a situation involving less than a few billions nuyens.
- it has only 10 members, which means they have an easier time to agree with each other
- there's no veto : Aztechnology was a member when they got an Omega Order in their face (they had to compromise to wriggle their way out of it), which they would certainly have vetoed if they could.
- eventhe AAA need to pay heed to them : it's the lynchpin of the world trade. Kick it out and you're back to a feudla system where a contract doesn't mean squat. Which means no stock market and asset property rules, you 'reign' only as far as your gun reach. Definitively a bad thing dor business
One can also note that the corporate court doesn't bother with the small fry. I'd be surprised if they ever had to rule on a situation involving less than a few billions nuyens.
If you anger a lot of the other megas it's a problem. But if Ares is just annoyed at S-K they are going to find it really hard to get any of the other megas to agree to do anything serious. " One in favor, one opposed, 8 abstain - motion fails without majority." It might be them next time and setting precedents that allows interference in their internal operations doesn't seem like a good idea.
And if your business is largely based on selling weapons, maintaining large and effective military units and you have orbital strike systems able to cover the globe I would tend to expect that "only as far as your gun reach" might be pretty darn far.
And if your business is largely based on selling weapons, maintaining large and effective military units and you have orbital strike systems able to cover the globe I would tend to expect that "only as far as your gun reach" might be pretty darn far.
QUOTE (kzt @ Feb 28 2010, 08:06 AM)
And if your business is largely based on selling weapons, maintaining large and effective military units and you have orbital strike systems able to cover the globe I would tend to expect that "only as far as your gun reach" might be pretty darn far.
But would you be able to retain that global reach in a world where property laws can be ditched at a whim ? What's to prevent say a CEO to frag a board od shareholders meeting and say 'oup though muck, now I'm the boos' - or even to just say 'screws the shares, I'm the one giving orders and I won't take any from anyone'.
and I doubt the 'one for, one agaisnt, 8 abstains' will happen very often. Those parties not directly involved still have a stake in it, that of setting and enforcing the ground rules which enable the system to function and let them keep and expand their assets and power.
Probably even AAA corps have sometimes some money to hide - even from other megacorps or goverments - "so it was SK who sold that nasty weapons to terrorists, huh? Give it to media! Let's see what they will do to rescue their PR. And other members of Corporate Court will be happy."
Oh, and don't forget all that A-rated corps - they aren't extraterritorial, so tax havens are very useful for them. And there are syndicates - they probably don't want to pay the taxes .
Oh, and don't forget all that A-rated corps - they aren't extraterritorial, so tax havens are very useful for them. And there are syndicates - they probably don't want to pay the taxes .
With as fragmented as the Sixth World is, there will be a thriving shadow economy.
Remember that the Megas are not National governments. They don't choose to be and they need to be able to move untraceable cred around more than any one. They are after all playing for the highest of stakes.
And that the World Court mostly deals with the Mega Corps....
Japan is Mega Corp central, the UCAS is the same and much smaller than it used to be, China is fragmented too, and Russian is not much better.
So what you are looking at is a doubling of the number of national governments with no superpowers to try to enforce a world wide standard.
Also don't forget all the National governments have their own black ops that they need to be untraceable.
Plus the crime syndicates needing a way to launder their ill gotten gains and putting cred in the right pockets.
Plus the smugglers.
Plus all the A through triple A Corps for secret research projects, payoffs, and shadow runs.
Plus all the recipients of bribes from all of the above.
Plus all the run of the mill tax evaders.
Remember that the Megas are not National governments. They don't choose to be and they need to be able to move untraceable cred around more than any one. They are after all playing for the highest of stakes.
And that the World Court mostly deals with the Mega Corps....
Japan is Mega Corp central, the UCAS is the same and much smaller than it used to be, China is fragmented too, and Russian is not much better.
So what you are looking at is a doubling of the number of national governments with no superpowers to try to enforce a world wide standard.
Also don't forget all the National governments have their own black ops that they need to be untraceable.
Plus the crime syndicates needing a way to launder their ill gotten gains and putting cred in the right pockets.
Plus the smugglers.
Plus all the A through triple A Corps for secret research projects, payoffs, and shadow runs.
Plus all the recipients of bribes from all of the above.
Plus all the run of the mill tax evaders.
QUOTE (cndblank @ Feb 26 2010, 05:03 PM)
A Runner knows that he is a criminal and he never know when he is going to have to get a new face and a new number.
So you never have all your cred under one ID.
So you never have all your cred under one ID.
Yeah, pretty much.
"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."
To the runners: Money's gone, dude. If you're smart you keep multiple accounts not linked to each other.
-karma
For that matter, if you are a runner starting to hit the big time, and you have a Sin that you keep for being in the light, it would look pretty funny if Jack Smith, freelance accountant and tax preparer, who pulls in 50K a year suddenly had a brand new Westwind, 150 K in bank cred, stocks, and bonds, and just bought a brand new condo for 120K free and clear of any mortgage.
The point is a runner is never going to attach more assets to that any Sin (real or otherwise) than it would reasonably be expected to have.
If the Sin is used while on the job or just a throw away sin to prevent the runner from being tracked then it won't have any thing on it but spending cred.
So a runner is going to be forced to keep most of his assets off the books.
And if they are off the books (like in a shadow account or a certified cred stick) then it is near impossible for a corp part the runner from them.
The point is a runner is never going to attach more assets to that any Sin (real or otherwise) than it would reasonably be expected to have.
If the Sin is used while on the job or just a throw away sin to prevent the runner from being tracked then it won't have any thing on it but spending cred.
So a runner is going to be forced to keep most of his assets off the books.
And if they are off the books (like in a shadow account or a certified cred stick) then it is near impossible for a corp part the runner from them.
QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ Mar 2 2010, 05:18 PM)
Yeah, pretty much.
"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."
To the runners: Money's gone, dude. If you're smart you keep multiple accounts not linked to each other.
-karma
"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."
To the runners: Money's gone, dude. If you're smart you keep multiple accounts not linked to each other.
-karma
otherwise you might get some unwanted Heat?
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.