So I was building an NPC adept and I can't believe how expensive the powers are.
I wanted:
Spell resistance so mages don't chew him up
Mystic armor so he wouldn't have to run around in a full armor suit.
Some extra actions an IP
Something to boost combat pools

I can't seem to make anything decent for less than double his magic attribute.
How the hell do you make a decent adept on less than 7 magic?

Same way you build any character: make sacrifices. Does he really need spell resistance right out of the gate? Likewise Mystic Armor (what's wrong with body armor?). Improved Reflexes, Body Boost, Agility Boost, and Improved Combat Ability are your core powers. Maybe Combat Sense (which is better than Mystic Armor anyway) if you have a power point or two left over.

Thing about mystic armor: It stacks with other armor. It doesn't preclude wearing a full armor suit, it goes with it and makes it better, and doesnt count towards encumbrance. That's why it costs so much. It'd be really cool if there were a much cheaper mystic armor that did count towards encumbrance limit and didn't stack with armors that are normally nonstackable (ie stack with PPF, Helmet, form fitting suit, and shields, but not stack with an armored jacket or chameleon suit), but was only like .25 magic for 2 points of armor. That way you can get yourself basically the equivalent of an armored jacket (with a bit better impact) at the cost of 1 magic.


Anyway, aside from that tangent, don't be afraid to mix cyber/bioware with an adept. I mean, a synaptic booster is just so much more efficient than the imp reflexes power. Similarly Muscle Toner is way more efficient than Improved Attribute (Agility), especially if you're going above 6. Just as an example, an adept with 5 agility going for +2 agi and +1 reflexes takes 3.75 magic. You can instead give up 1 magic/essence, and get bioware to do the equivalent for 96,000 nuyen. This costs ~30 build points (10 for the lost magic, and 20 for the nuyen to afford the bioware), but saves you 2.75 magic that can be invested elsewhere. You could cut that resource cost down if you want to be cheesy and consider used bioware (ew), or bioware suites (I don't think this is something actually legit by RAW, but you could theoretically make bioware suites like cyberware suites, a pair of organs that are cheaper when implanted together). Doing something like that can get you Synaptic Booster 2 and Muscle Toner 4(restricted gear) for 2 essence/magic, and 86,000 nuyen. So you bump your bp cost up to 43, but now you have 7.75 magic worth of upgrades for 2 magic.

The other thing you may want to consider is the optional geas rule, that lets you cut the cost of any adept power by 25%, effectively turning a 6 magic adept into a 8 magic adept. Or a 5 magic adept into a 6.66 magic adept. It's not quite as effective as using bioware, but it can get you some extra points when grabbing effects that aren't replicated by technology.

If you really want to optimize, use your adept powers to focus on things that can't be done via the mundane, and use Mundane to make up the difference. Don't try to use magic to do everything, it's not feasible unless you want to houserule things a lot, because the adept powers as you noted really are inefficient in a lot of areas. They make up for this by giving access to abilities that are not inefficient, and are impossible for others to recreate.

A bit of 'ware can also go a long way. Muscle toner and/or Synapic boosters are great for adepts, unless you want to have a purist.

IMHO Improved Skill is something you can take later as well. Whether you have 16 or 20 dice in your attack skill should not make that much of a difference in the first couple of runs.

With Magic 5 it often pays to concentrate on a few powers that can be taken at high ratings-- which, frankly, is why I thought the caps put into place on many magical abilities was moronic-- or do not have a non-magical equivalent. And yes, being Adept in part means you're better able to make use of the things that are around you. Mystic Armor is a versatile all-around defensive bonus. It isn't intended as a good reason to run around naked in combat zone.

*sigh*

I always want that too, but at some point you just see that's not how an adept is meant to be. I recognized it, when reading through AH's first version of PACKS (don't know about Runner's Toolkit now), where the Adept Power Packages are really focused towaards one Aspect. An Adept is apparently supposed to be a specialist, I don't like it, either...
With some Karma, you can initiate and use the optional rule for 1 Power Point instead of a metamagic. That's about the third the cost of a Magic Point.
Putting a Geas on your powers frees up another 25%, but makes you an even more specialized specialist. Like being an awesome Investigator (Improved Senses and Social Skills, Enhanced Perception), BUT only during the night.

For Mystic Armor, I recommend this thread: http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=34741

For NPCs, being a specialist is pretty cool, but Shadowrunnners need to be able to do a LOT!

Whenever i build a new character, i start with a concept (infiltrator, face etc), then i list and prioritize the actions that the concept will be expected to perform. The first few chapters of runners companion are good for this. Finally, i build my character to have 12 dice in the important tasks. Thr table i play at has very well rounded characters, but this has always worked for me.

It depends on what you want to do with the adept. Some common roles follow. Normally I wouldn't give such specific advice, but if you really want to know how to triage points when making an adept, here's what I consider the more essential stuff:

For a combat-oriented adept, get improved reflexes: 2 for 2.5 points, Attribute Boost: 1 for Agility for 0.25 points (it gives a good boost, and you can reliably soak the Drain. Higher levels are not worth it), and then either mystic armor or combat sense at level 2 or 3. The remaining points, or fractions thereof, can be used for improved senses/perception, or "flavor" powers.

For a social adept, you really only need 3 power points after getting some bioware that stacks with your adept powers (such as tailored pheromones, vocal range enhancer, etc.), although 4 gives you a more lavish assortment of stuff that is not strictly necessary. Get kinesics: 3, commanding voice, and then some mental powers (such as multitasking or eidetic sense memory) and/or improved senses/perception.

For techies, you will only need 2-3 points of magic for a mix similar to a social adept's, with improved ability in tech/matrix skills replacing kinesics and commanding voice. This is good, because things like adept hackers also have a high resource and skill cost.

For sneaks, forget it, there are so many adept powers that boost athletics and/or stealth that you will never start out with more than a fraction of what you want. I would recommend picking one aspect to focus on (parkour-like athletics, or super-stealth, etc.), rather than getting a hodgepodge of powers.

Martial artists are also hard to do. You need high damage, high dice pools, decent damage soaking ability, and multiple initiative passes. Sad to say, but this is one of those roles that usually takes some bioware and/or cyberware added to the character to really pull off. For a pure adept, you could just barely do it with hard-maxed Magic. Let's see now, improved reflexes: 2, attribute boost/Agility: 1, killing hands, critical strike: 6, penetrating strike: 3, and counterstrike: 1. Initiate and get improved ability plus mystic armor and/or combat sense as soon as you can. But martial artists, while fun, tend to be hyper-specialized in a niche role, so be aware of what you are potentially getting in to.

I'd substitute penetrating strike for elemental strike

What he said. Penetrating strike 2 gets you armor penetration 2 for .5 pp, elemental strike can get you half armor ap and an elemental side effect for .5 pp . It's only disadvantage is the simple action to activate.

Mystic armor becomes a strategic option if you start mixing in Elemental Resistance (Digital Grimoire).

You don't.
48 magic or bust.

Right. Playing an adept is fun, but not necessarily as a combat-oriented one. He is simply no match for a well-build sam. He has his niches, but "combat-monster" is not one of them. Martial artist, ok. Sniper, Gunbunny, ok. But gun bunny that also can take some shots? No. Martial Artist that can also shoot? Not really. Cyber outclasses adept-powers until you reach 10 magic or so. Before that, you will alway look stupid in direct comparison.

A bio adept can be incredibly effective, but is expensive as hell & can difficult to pull off correctly.
A pure adept is virtually unplayable outside specialized noncombat roles (hacker, face, etc), but can be pretty damn effective in them.

I assume you are the GM as you said you are making an NPC. As such, I would suggest you take a look at the changes to adept powers in my house rules. Outside of a few relatively minor changes I have not yet had a chance to test, that section should be complete; just keep in mind everything is intended to be used with a hard cap of 7 (natural) Magic & 5 Initiation grades, allowing a Power Point as a metamagic (along with improving most of the adept-only metamagics). Despite that, most or all of the changes should still work fine in an uncapped game.

I would only suggest using house rules if they apply to all adepts. Adept players may otherwise feel cheated, if those rules make the NPCs more powerful.

Big fan of fire fists. It's likely the best way to get martial arts damage in.

Acid Fists are pretty awesome too.

Seems to me sound and smoke are better, since they completely ignore armor. Sound is by far the nastiest since most people will be out of the combat if you just do 3 damage to them, and very few people walk around with sound dampeners turned on. Unfortunately it's also probably going to be fairly loud, but depending on the group it might be no louder than the blasting mage or the gun bunny's firearms.

"High five!"

"..WHAT?!"

I need to make an adept named Dark Smoke Puncher one of these days.

somehow every other adept ends up a ninja

What sane GM allows elemental strike to ignore armor entirely?

those who obey RAW? there are other ways to hassle the PCs, if the GM feels the need.

IIRC RAW is debatable on that point.

enlighten us
because "Armor has no effect, but sound dampers" and "Armor does not protect against this attack, but other protective gear might" sound clear enough for most

Clearly he means that Elemental Strike is supposed to be a high cost way to give your character some extra fluff, that is not actually intended to give any mechanical benefit.

Well I prefer Electricity for that kind of power.
It has none of the drawbacks of fire, acid smoke or sound. And the incapacitation is nice as well.

Those were written for spells. I can't be the only one here who thinks it's crazy to let people ignore armor entirely in melee!

Those are Elemental not Spell Effects. As with those in the BBB the rules are used for spells as well as other sources of this "element".

Why is ignoring armor any more crazy than hands bursting into flames and not burning the user? I see no reason why this should be allowed for spells but not for an adpet power. Magic is Magic.

@No armor but other stuff: That other stuff only goes up to 6 (except for the Chem seal) thus it is still a good optiuon.

Probably balance issue, ignoring armor is scary on that front.

Still fails to explain how it's scarier coming from an adept who has to be in melee range, than coming from a spell that can be used from half a mile away and affect multiple people at once, all while having a much lower total investment.


At least the effects that ignore 100% of armor are nonlethal, and in the case of smoke a chemical seal can stop it completely.

No, that doesn't explain it, and if you have a good answer I'd like to know. I'm just saying that ignoring armor is always scary.

You're right, magic is scary. You should just ban it like this guy

I'm not going to, I'm just saying that it's some scary powers. I feel the same way about the armies of drones riggers can get, but it's in the game. I I just think that fists of fire is cooler than SONIC BOOM!

Though I now want to make an adept from the UCAS with ridiculous hair.

Oh. Sonic boom is cooler. You'll see.

I had to break the rules in two places for this character, but it's for the lulz anyway.

On a related note: it's a free action to run.

That's why I stay away from elemental strike - because I strongly disagree with the interpretation most people have of RAW, and find that interpretation incredibly cheesy when implemented. I have always interpreted it as being the normal damage with an elemental effect (glare modifier for light, etc.), not the normal damage completely transformed into an elemental effect, doing things like halving or ignoring armor and such. Considering it only costs 0.5 points, I would argue that is making it a bit too powerful for the cost, but then again, there is other stuff like empathy software that is just as overpowered. Bleh.

If your GM uses the more common interpretation and has it do all that stuff, then yeah, no point bothering with penetrating strike.

Penetrating Strike is still useful for those times where you do not not need a Light Show, Sonic Booms, Flaming Debris, Choking Skoke, Arcing Electrcity (with its own attendant electrical/sonic noise), or whatever other Elemenatl Effect you would so desire. In fact, I usually purchase the Penetrating Strike long before I ever consider the Elemental Strike Ability.

Their is also the mystic adpet + [element] aura path. For 1 pp, a small investment in skills, and a sustaining foci you can skip killing hands and elemental strike, you get bonus hth damage, access to spell casting, and access to counter spelling (which at 2*level is soooo much cheaper then spell resistance for a more powerful effect). You do have to deal with drain (1/2 + 3) but you only have to cast it at f1. Oh and if you're willing to being a walking pillar of fire then you can leave it on permanently .

On a related not I know its not RAW but that all elements for aura do 1/2 impact is why in my games I'ld say 1/2 at best.

OK for a 5 MA Adept here is what I did:

1 PP burned out for Bioware:

Synaptic Boost 1
Clean Metabolism (trust me, it came in very handy)
Cosmetic Biosculpting (Based on character's backstory)
Muscle Toner 1

Adept Powers (4PP)

Improved Ability 2: (Athletics)
Killing Hands
Elemental Strike: (Electricity)
Improved Ability 1: Pistols
Atrribute Boost 2: Strength
Mystic Armour: 2
Critical Strike 2

These are starting character values.

This was a version of Kyoto Kid for an SR4 campaign (the original retired as a 350 Karma character).

She was a hybrid of a gunslinger/martial adept built using only the BBB and Street Magic.

While the powers were not as 'uber" as a sammy out of the box, she had an amazing resiliency.

Some of this came from her Positive Qualities: High Pain Tolerance 2, Ambidextrous, and Rapid Healer.

Her thee modes of attack were:

Twin Ruger Super Warhawks with EXEX. As she was able to use two, the GM ruled that she could fire them in alternating fashion, allowing her two shots per action in old "wild west" style. Of course this really chewed through the ammo.

Unamed using Killing hands and/or her elemental strike. As the rules were hazy on this early on, the GM determined it would be have the effect of a "built in" shock glove. The added bonus was she could also use it to disrupt micro electronics.

Finally for opponents she didn't want to get that close to, she had her Force 2 Weapon Focus Katana.

Wearing an Armoured Jacket, she was 10/8 and with her biker's helmet, 11/10.

KK proved to be surprisingly tough compared to what the GM and I expected. After taking down about a half dozen ghouls during a fight without incurring a single DP modifier for wounds, the GM finally waved his hand and said she Cuisinarted the lot of them (2 points of Mystic Armour can go a long way).

True the Sammy would have just walked in with his Alpha and hosed 'em all down, maybe popping a grenade or two in the mix. But where's the fun in that?

Correct. This sounds much more like fun (and is a legendary story in a pub) than a sammy or a mage that say " i threw a grenade/fireball". Bah...it´s all for the style baby.^^