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Udoshi
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Apr 24 2011, 07:25 PM) *
A mage can already get 4 IP's without Magic Loss. What is the big deal?


Whats the BP cost on that, for comparison purposes, anyway?
Yerameyahu
It all depends. No need for sustaining is an issue. It alters the game balance, so you want to consider all the angles.
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Udoshi @ Apr 24 2011, 07:35 PM) *
Whats the BP cost on that, for comparison purposes, anyway?


Um.... 5 BP for the Spell?
If you wanted to Sustain it with no penalty, another 4 BP at Character Generation, or 8 Karma to Bond in Play... smile.gif
Yerameyahu
And 16R, 40kĄ, unless you use the Edge cheat. So, 5 (spell) +4 (focus) + 8 (focus nuyen) + 5 precious Quality BP (restricted gear) = 22? Hmm.
Seerow
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Apr 25 2011, 03:25 AM) *
A mage can already get 4 IP's without Magic Loss. What is the big deal?


5 BP - Restricted Gear (Force 4 sustaining Focus)
4 BP - Focus Binding
3 BP - Learn Spell (Increased Reflexes)
8 BP - 40,000 nuyen resources for force 4 sustaining focus
------
20 BP total for 4 initiative passes. Yes, you could throw in the cost of magic and spellcasting pool, but a magician should be raising those regardless, so I don't consider those.



vs:
32 BP - 160,000 nuyen. resources for rank 2 synaptic booster
20 BP - Quality Naturally Wired
-----
52 BP




Yeah, this quality is totally op.
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Seerow @ Apr 24 2011, 07:40 PM) *
5 BP - Restricted Gear (Force 4 sustaining Focus)
4 BP - Focus Binding
3 BP - Learn Spell (Increased Reflexes)
8 BP - 40,000 nuyen resources for force 4 sustaining focus
------
20 BP total for 4 initiative passes. Yes, you could throw in the cost of magic and spellcasting pool, but a magician should be raising those regardless, so I don't consider those.



vs:
32 BP - 160,000 nuyen. resources for rank 2 synaptic booster
20 BP - Quality Naturally Wired
-----
52 BP


Yeah, this quality is totally op.


52 BP is overpowered against 20 BP? In which/what Universe exactly?



Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Apr 24 2011, 07:38 PM) *
And 16R, 40kĄ, unless you use the Edge cheat. So, 5 (spell) +4 (focus) + 8 (focus nuyen) + 5 precious Quality BP (restricted gear) = 22? Hmm.


Ooops, Forgot about Restricted Gear, AND costed the spell at 2BP to many. wobble.gif
Yerameyahu
It's called sarcasm. smile.gif Jesus.

I dunno if chargen/BP is the best way to compare, but it's interesting. I, for one, thought it was slightly harder to max out the Increase Reflexes spell (high force).
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Apr 24 2011, 07:44 PM) *
It's called sarcasm. smile.gif Jesus.

I dunno if chargen/BP is the best way to compare, but it's interesting. I, for one, thought it was slightly harder to max out the Increase Reflexes spell (high force).


Again, it appears that we have once again proven the need for a /Sarcasm Smiley... Would clear up a lot of confusion. wobble.gif
Not all that Hard, Really. It is just subsumed into the costs of a regular mage most of the time. I have seen few mages that do not have access to Increase Reflexes.
Seerow
To clarify, yes my commentary was sarcasm that I assumed would be obvious given the disparity there.
Yerameyahu
Haha! No, it's the need for you to be better, Tymeaus. wink.gif Specifically, to not assume people are insane, hehe.

That's my point: I thought it was a fair bit harder. Mages are even more OP. smile.gif
TheOOB
Problem with the increase initiative spell is the first time you hit a ward you have to either drop the spell or drop stealth, also background count.
KCKitsune
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Apr 24 2011, 09:48 PM) *
Again, it appears that we have once again proven the need for a /Sarcasm Smiley... Would clear up a lot of confusion. wobble.gif
Not all that Hard, Really. It is just subsumed into the costs of a regular mage most of the time. I have seen few mages that do not have access to Increase Reflexes.


QUOTE (TheOOB @ Apr 24 2011, 11:20 PM) *
Problem with the increase initiative spell is the first time you hit a ward you have to either drop the spell or drop stealth, also background count.



You know with all the problems with Astral Barriers, Wards, Watcher Spirits, and the whole variability and Karma cost of Increased Reflexes, I am doubly glad that my Combat Medic Mage has a Synaptic Booster!

It will also make hiding the fact that my Medic is a mage when I get masking. I mean who honestly thinks that a guy with two cyber hands, cyber lower leg, cyber eyes, cyber ears, and Synaptic Booster to be a mage? Much more likely to be a hacker or a wimpy street sam.
Yerameyahu
Well, if you *have* Masking, it won't matter. Bioware is pretty hard to detect in the first place, and Masking would hide the focus, right? *shrug* It's nice to have various options.
Udoshi
Actaully, you need Extended Masking to hide active foci and spells.

On the plus side, with a little legwork(finding the creator's aura to mimic in order to pass unhindered), you can now use it to sneak foci through wards without turning them off.
Yerameyahu
Neat. smile.gif I always forget.
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