*Shakes Head*

And I knew a character who survived a suicide bomber (mook ran up, popped the pin on a 'nade, and hugged him). Took 0 boxes of damage (no Edge).

Core Rules (325 4A) says "When attached directly to a target, the targets armor is halved, otherwise the explosive has an AP of 0" If that mook hugged him with the grenade between the two of em.. (grenade sammich!) well.. that must have been one awesome roll.

Core Rules (325 4A) says "When attached directly to a target, the targets armor is halved, otherwise the explosive has an AP of 0" If that mook hugged him with the grenade between the two of em.. (grenade sammich!) well.. that must have been one awesome roll.

<--The GM.

No softweave

<--The GM.

No softweave

Get a quickened armor spell.

I dispute that. Not that it's a huge "shoot me first" sign, but that it matters too much once you start rocking that kinda stuff.

Cuz if you play by raw, FFBA + Armor + Armored Jacket = Happy Times. 18 ballistic armor is a GIANT middle finger to most anything that comes your way. It's not subtle, but I figure if it's time for all the armor you can slam on, subtlety isn't on your list of top priorities.

Hmm which opponent would appear to be the bigger threat? The one wearing an armor jacket, gloves and a hood or the one with an armor jacket and a "glowing field of magical energy around" (BBB p. 210)
Unless someone else starts casting obvious magic the force field will indicate the mage. Everybody knows that mages are the biggest threat and need to be dealt with first. Even if there is another possible mage, fire may still be concentrated on the guy in the glowing force field.

The other options for quickened spells I mentioned do not have this drawback.

Which raises the obvious temptation of putting quickened armor on the CQC specialist.

Why quicken it?

Has anyone mentioned ffba + heavy armored clothing?

Heavy armored clothing?

Yeah, in arsenal. Globetrotter victory or something (dont have the book handy)

Oh okay. I know there's a lot of armored suits and stuff in arsenal, I thought you were referring to an item with the name 'heavy armored clothing', which I had never heard of.

You wouldn't want to do that. It is a huge "shoot me first, I'm a mage" sign. If you want to go the route of quickened spells, get Increase BOD and/or Combat Sense. They still have their own problems though.

The rules problem lies in the fact that in order to resist damage you roll body + armor and body limits armor (each point of body gives 2.5 dice worth of damage resistance dice, not counting extra cheese, which makes it closer to 1 point of body is 4 dice: the more damage resistance you have, the more you get!).

Segway Terrier or a Horseman with a Rigger Coccoon. There's 20 armor right there.

EDIT: I'm sorry - 24 for the Horseman and 21 for the Terrier.

Daihatsu-Caterpillar Horseman with advanced cargo module converted mech military version {6 Slots}
Light recon and support verhicle for urban environments

Handling: 3
Accel: 6 / 13
Speed: 48
Pilot: 2
Body: 6
Armor: 12
Sensor: 4

- Full Mechanical Arm {1} [15 Slots]
- Submachine Gun [10] (6 Slots)
- Firing Selection Change to FA (1)
- Gas-Vent System 2 (1)
- Electronic Firing (2)
- Smartlink (1)
- Improved Range Finder (1)
- Sound Suppressor [3]
- External Clip Port [1]

- Full Mechanical Arm {1} [16 Slots]
- Increased Capacity 1
- Grenade Launcher [15] (6 Slots)
- Firing Selection Change to SA (1)
- Electronic Firing (2)
- Smartlink (1)
- Improved Range Finder (1)
- Camera Upgrade Ultrasound (1)
- Airburst Link (-)
- External Clip Port [1]

- Rigger Adaptation {1}
- Chameleon Coating {1}
- Armor 12 {1}
- ECM 6 {1}
- Smoke Projector {1} overmodified in cargo space


- Sensors (12 Slots)
- Microphone 3 (Audio Enhancement 3, Select Sound Filter 3, Spatial Recognizer) (1)
- Front Camera 6 (Low-Light Vision, Thermographic Vision, Flare Compensation, Smartlink, Vision Magnification, Image Link) (1)
- Back Camera 6 (Low-Light Vision, Thermographic Vision, Flare Compensation, Smartlink, Vision Magnification, Image Link) (1)
- Front Laser Range Finder (1)
- Back Laser Range Finder (1)
- Front Motion Sensor (1)
- Back Motion Sensor (1)
- Radar 6 (5)

- Equipment
- Pilot upgrade to 2
- Smart Tires


Costs: 72.600


>>> http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=27149

One of SR4's core rules problems, IMO. Can be fixed by making encumbrance dependent on, say, Strength and Agility, for instance. And no, Body does nto need to be upped in value in compensation; it's valuable enough as is, especially for orks and trolls. And no, armor should be a way to somewhat even the odds for characters, enabling the body 2 hacker to survive any damage dealt, not to turn trolls into walking MBTs.

-->

I just want to point out that the advanced cargo module got erratad to have only a grapple arm. If you want full mechanical arms you need to spend the two slots on them, which means more overmodding.

What? How do you figure Body is valuable enough? Its ONLY value is in damage resistance and encumbrance. You're taking away half of its point of existence. Body is far and away the least valuable attribute if you take away encumberence, you may as well just remove body and make damage boxes/damage resistance based on strength.

It gives you damage boxes and is your soak attribute. I don't quite see how that isn't enough (Willpower is even less useful).

And basing Encumbrance on Body devalues armour for anyone not wanting to be a walking tank. This pretty much forces every character who has an interest in survival to max out body (and even then, it heavily biases the game towards orks and trolls). Bad design choice if ever one was made.

If it's Quickened, you wear that sign all the time, not only when you need the armor.

So now the difference between the 'tank' and your regular guy is 2 boxes of health and 3 extra dice (1 success) on a soak roll. He might survive one extra hit. That's a really big might given how little that difference actually is.

I was taking Quickened to mean "also in a Sustaining Focus".

Tank to regular guy is more like 10 dice.

+4 body (= +2 boxes of health) is +6 armor. 4 + 6 = 10.

And that's before armor cheesing.

I was referring specifically to a scenario where body no longer gives you extra armor, as hermit suggested.

"Quickened" is a pretty specific thing in SR.

I was referring specifically to a scenario where body no longer gives you extra armor, as hermit suggested. And I just remembered that health boxes round up. So a 3 body char vs a 6 body character has +1 health box, and 3 extra damage resistance dice. At the cost of 35 build points, or god forbid, 75 karma, that is in no way worth it.


Yes, by the rules Body lets you get extra armor so that 3 extra body gets you 6 extra armor so you end up with 9 total extra soak dice, plus your increased health track, plus you frequently take stun instead of physical damage. But TJ is talking about removing the majority of that benefit, with no compensation, and saying Body is still a great stat. I say BS.

Yes, but it's rare for players to use the term that way.

I think that you have me confused with Hermit... I know, it happens a lot.

I don't think so, since only people with Astral sight will actually see the spell. And those will figure out that you're not the mage (unless of course the character in question actually is.

The Armour spell produces a visible glow when cast.

Emphasis mine. At the time of casting, it is visible, yes. After it has been cast, there's no way you can tell someone has a quickened armor spell on him, unless you have access to astral sight.

Emphasis mine. At the time of casting, it is visible, yes. After it has been cast, there's no way you can tell someone has a quickened armor spell on him, unless you have access to astral sight.

This spell creates a glowing field of magical energy around the subject that
protects against Physical damage. It provides both Ballistic and Impact
armor (cumulative with worn armor) to the subject equal to the hits scored.

It gives you damage boxes and is your soak attribute. I don't quite see how that isn't enough (Willpower is even less useful).

Don't forget it makes you tougher to knock down.

You cast it on someone, and they have a glowy field around them as long as the spell's in effect.

People actually use the knock down rules?

I only enforce them when someone uses Gel packs.

People actually use the knock down rules?

Yeah, it's the avatar. Sorry TJ


I did notice the mistake and edited one post, didnt realize I had done it more than once.