Ah ok. I presume that is pretty expensive too, I will check that out.

Which is death by stoning.

Change that, now, so you don't actually see the cat, you see a vaguely cat shaped blur.

No details, you can't tell if it's facing towards or away from you, it's difficult to make out what's body parts and what's background.


-k

I think you meant bonus.

Every time you kill a kitten, God masturbates.

1k , 1 slot, 12R IIRC.

It might also be an Israeli Shooter.

Treat it the same as Adaptive Coloration (aka Predator) and move on:

Note the -2 is if you pass the perception test. Failed Perception = Blind Fire

Next question should be "Can you turn a Chameleon suit off or is it always invisible?"

That's not a question. Ruthenium is totally under PAN control. You could run movies on your suit if you wanted.

Huh. Not bad. I may use that in my home game.



-k

and a note to the SR4 editors:

"Because this power effects the depth perception"

That should be "affects"... an "effect" is a noun unless being used to signify the creation of something (effect change), "affect" is a verb.

Unless they intended to imply Adaptive Coloration gives onlookers "the depth perception"...

To be pedantic, affect can also be a noun.

Only in rare situations

Faraday is only Pedantic in Rare Situations? Hmmmmm..... Good to know...

Yeah I really like this way to handle it. Nice one.

Thermo Optic Camoflage

"This video contains content from Starz Media LLC, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds."



-k

GitS.
Major Makoto Kousanagi doing her dynamic entry and exit in the first 5 minutes of the first movie.

You know, I don't think Corporations get the whole "International Network" thing...

Yes you can.


Says who? And before you reply, here's the description of what the Chameleon Suit is: "A full body suit made from ruthenium polymers supported by a sensor suite that scans the surroundings and replicates the images at the proper perspectives, providing the wearer with chameleon abilities."

There's no mention whatsoever of it having a face mask either. It does, however, describe itself as a "full body" suit. You know what else describes itself as a full body suit? The full body variety of Form-Fitting Body Armor. Which, incidentally, has exactly the same armor rating, but which costs quite a bit more when you include the Ruthenium Polymer coating. And what you're getting for that cost is the ability to wear it under your normal clothing with a bit more ease, at the cost of losing one point of modification over the Chameleon Suit and a bigger price tag.

Actually the FFBA has 2 less Impact than the Chameleon... You can however wear your FFBA under your Chameleon and stack the protection - or save your money and get a UEJ and a Motorcycle Helmet and slap an RPC on those and still wear your FFBA underneath. You'll need 5 Bod to avoid the encumbrance penalty though.

But I agree - technically neither armor is described as having a face mask but both are described as "full body" - obviously for the Chameleon suit to work it would have to have a face mask and, while the FFBA specifies "a hood", I don't see any reason why that couldn't be extended into a mask.

Actaully, the Weapon Modification for Chameleon Coating never got errata'd down to 1 slot like the Vehicle Mod was. It SHOULD be 1 for consistency's sake, but it its actually 2 slots.

–verb (used with object)
10. to produce as an effect; bring about; accomplish; make happen: The new machines finally effected the transition to computerized accounting last spring.

Also see http://xkcd.com/326/


Eh, as I said, IIRC.

I think I see that exact definition mentioned extensively in the Stalag quote.

You can actually get a helmet for your FFBA, and enjoy the benefits of reduced encumbrance.
Here's why: (4a 327)Helmets and shields do not count as separate pieces of armor; instead, they modify the rating of worn armor by their rating.

If a player wanted an FFBA helmet, I would likely replace the availability code with that of the FFBA, to represent getting a matching helmet for the suit instead of an off-the-rack whatever. Its worth noting that the securetech PPP helmet works the same way, but doesn't modify ballistic, only impact, so can thus be useful for not going over your limit.


I really DO like the 'adaptive coloration for stealthsuits house rule', but I would like to point out that a reuthinium polymer suit wouldn't protect against thermal vision without the Thermal Dampening armor mod.

Don't encourage your hax. Next you'll say that 'logically' there are special FFBA shields.

Ah well that is another opportunity cost for going the chameleon suit tactic, making it a little more balanced. That's cool.

Debatable that even adaptive coloration should have it.

Debatable? Obviously it shouldn't.

Hey! Thats a good idea.

Maybe I'll try it with a nartaki!

Form fitting body wall, go!

Don't forget, you can wear as many helmets as you want!

Not again! Read the whole encumbrance rules, please.
The quote above only says that helmets and shields add their armor rating to any armor, not just FFBA which has special rules.
Unless you try to claim that a helmet is not an "armor item", it adds to encumbrance normally, no matter how the armor rating is calculated for the ensemble.
As to multiple shields, don't forget the additional -1 for being a shield.

@Coverage of FFBA: OK, you are right, I looked up the word hood again and it seems you can use it for garments that cover the face as well.
I still don't get why you would coat anything other than the outermost layer of clothing with ruthenium polymers. Coated cyberlimbs/dermalsheath seems even more silly to me.

The point of ruthenium-coated Form-Fitting Full Body Armor is that it's effectively a Chameleon Suit that you can easily wear all the time, providing a bit of extra oomph to your normal armor, and letting you slip out of said armor when you need to go full on stealth mode. (Rather than having to carry another suit with you at all times, strip down completely, and put that extra outfit on.) Coating only other types of common body armor, like an Armored Jacket or the Synergist Business Line, suffers from the problem you were trying to fault Form-Fitting Body Armor with; lack of total coverage.

The added versatility and convenience more than makes up for the lack of two points of Impact Armor. Especially with all the new (and mostly silly) armor treatments that have been added to the game.

My point is that in situations where you do not want to be detected most likely are situations where you want the maximum protection, if you are detected, as well. So stripping down to FFBA is not the best option. So you better either wear a chameleon suit over FFBA or, if the the GM permits, get an unarmored jumpsuit with hood to wear over whatever armor you prefer. I would consider neither 6/4 nor 6/2 as good armor.

If you plan on using ruthenium coated FFBA under your other clothing, I suggest you simply buy the coating for the rest as well. Like that you can make the surface look whatever you like when not hiding and don hood and gloves and switch all items to stealth mode for infiltration. If no public appearance is needed use the coating on your MilSpec Armor.

You mean like exactly what I said in the first post you started complaining about?

I'm a fan of coating a UEJ, face covering helmet, shock gloves, and combat boots with it - good level of protection and just as invisible

You could also use a camouflage suit that is also a full body suit and apply the ruthenium on it. Of course the penalties to perception wouldn't stack but you would have a 8/6 armor instead of 6/4.

Heh. And you can use the simple pattern-creation abilities of the coating to make it look like... regular clothing.




-k

Yes, and you can walk around in Heavy MilSpec armor coated with Ruthenium Polymers, too, for an ungodly amount of protection. None of that is really relevant to the original point, though. Walking around with a Chameleon Suit all the time is pretty silly. Having one hidden under your normal clothing that you can use when you need it, without having to change into another suit of clothing (let alone carrying it around in a backpack or whatever, just in case), is much more practical and reasonable.

"He simply started stripping! And with every piece of Clothing he removed, a Part of his body simply vanished!"

Eh, I just throw the Ruthenium coating on every damn thing and don't bother with the chameleon suit.

Yes, including the machine gun.

It works great for the club scene, too. Why carry glowsticks when your entire body can strobe with vibrant color?



-k

Which really means that, by adding it as an option for any piece of gear, they've made the chameleon suit obsolete

Ruthenium Coating is not the same as Chameleon Suit.

Huh.





Coulda fooled me.



-k

Gee, you quoted the Armor Mod, which is JUST LIKE A CHAMELEON SUIT... DUH. However, Rutheniuum Fibers are used in a lot more applications than just ARMOR. Lets see what a quick look can give you...

Chameleon Coating Vehicle Modification: Page 134, Arsenal: For Moving Billboards and whatnot...
Pimpede Ride Vehicle Modification: Page 141, Arsenal: For designs and whatnot...
Second Skin Line of Cliothing: Page 48, Arsenal: For Signs, SLogans, or altering Colors, and whatnot...
Standard Clothing Options: Page 326 of SR4A: For Clothes...
Option for Dermal Sheath: Page 340 of Augmentation: Change Colors and whatnot...
(As a Note: Chameleon Modification requires an ADDITIONAL Modification, In addition to the Basic Ruthenium Mod))...

I could probably locate more options if I really wanted to do so. Ruthenium DOES NOT EQUAL Chameleon Suit. It never has.
Yes, A Chameleon Suit Uses Ruthenium Polymer Technology, But a Chameleon Suit is not the End-All, Be-All of Ruthenium Polymer Technology.

I just re-read it and it seems a some people in this thread (like me) have been unconsciously misreading it:

That's pretty clear you can't just slap it on any old thing (so much for my inviso-jumpsuit of doom) - FFBA states it has a "full body" variation, so that qualifies - though strangely that means the Camoflage Suit does also (says "full body"). So other than Milspec, and the Full Body Armor listed in SR4, what else counts as "covers the wearer's whole body"...

• Bike Racing Armor? picture doesn't look like it covers the whole body (actually kind of looks similar to how PPP sounnds)
• Bunker Gear? It doesn't explicitly say but it sounds like it would
• Riot Control Armor? Says you can give it a chemical seal so it must cover the whole body
• Swat Armor? Doesn't say one way or the other
• The survival suits? These all seem to be full body
• Spacesuits? By definition have to be full body

This seems like an incredibly useless quibble. Everyone knows what we're talking about, and the fact is that there's a coating that exactly mimics the effect of the suit. I don't think it's a problem, but it is a simple fact.

Yes, you can apply it to anything full-body; that's pretty easy to find. I don't think most people were misreading, given there was a discussion of full-body options earlier in the thread.

In the context of your previous post, it appeared that you were saying that a Chameleon Suit was somehow superior to other types of armor coated in Ruthenium Polymers.

Oh - it was just me then

If you are wanting to apply it for its Chameleon Capabilities (ala the Chameleon Suit), then yes, it only applies to Armor or clothing that is full body. However, you can apply Ruthenium to anything that you want the ability to control color for. Patches of clothing, a scarf, A mobile Bilboard on a Vehicle or Drone, whatever. It is far more versatile than just as an armor modification.