I'm pressed for time right now, so I will have to get back with a better answer than this-but I wanted everyone to know I have read what has been posted.

what are the incentives for game stores to register as firebases? i'm assuming the main one will be that running events at the game store probably means more customers. anything other benefits that the stores get from the commando program?

There's a commando here? Holy hell!

I think everyone misses the point for joining the ranks of the Shadowrun Commandos. Stores want to you to come to they’re establishments Stores like to sell product, if they have game space that you can use then they'll like you running a game at they're store that pushes our product.

Basically if you want to be a commando writing a game up isn't that bad. Maybe five hours tops. If that's too much time out of your schedule then you probably don't have time to be a commando. If you can't run one game every two months then most likely being a commando isn't for you. If you have the free time and like running Shadowrun then it's a great program if you want to spread the fan base and promote the game. If that's not what you’re interested in doing don't do it. It's a great program. If you like running games with new folks then go for it. If you’re a fairly extroverted person I would suggest looking into the program. I've enjoyed my time so far as a Commando. It's a lot of fun. I've had good and bad experiences just like anything else. The good experiences have paid back in spades. It's a great program. If you don't have the time and you’re not extroverted then this isn't for you. If you like meeting new folks and showing off your Game Mastering / painting skills. (I love using mini's in my games. It give my games a visual aspect.) You can have lots of fun. (FANPRO Commando's get excellent benefits from third party distributors.) The program isn't for everyone but the chances are if you’re a GM you'll like the program.

Bonuses:
1. FAN Pro compensates you with products for the time you spend running a game.
2. You get to meet new people and possibly introduce them into the game.
3. You can write adventures for the Shadowrun campaign that Bitrunner heads and earn compensation. (This is totally voluntary and is not a requirement. Bitrunner has to authorize your scenario but after that it’s up to you.)
4. You can run games at conventions earning credit for those games. (Totally voluntary)
5. You can suggest plots and ideas and coordinate with other commandos.
6. You get to get involved directly with promoting something you enjoy.
7. You get access to lots of folks "in the Know" who have been with SR and have published with Fasa.
8. You get access to all Campaign games before public release.
9. Internal Third Party Discounts available to only Fanpro Commando’s. (I can’t openly discuss it but you’ll have to join to find out more about it.)
10. You can participate in an official manner for Fanpro/Shadowrun at conventions locally and nationally like Gencon and Origins.

Negatives:
1. You have to write one scenario/game no more than say five to ten pages tops if even that.
2. Run at least 6 scenarios a year but you get compensated for those adventures. (If you’re shy you can always write some adventures for Bitrunner with his authorization and a plot synopsis.)

I must admit, this is also my first time knowledge of such a program.
Unfortunately in our country this is still not possible.
I am looking forward to promote RPG's in general and Shadowrun especially, and only thing that really bogs us down is lack of good place where we could play.

I'll check commandos 3 or 4 years later, when we will have place for such things...

see, i don't understand this hostility, here. someone starts a program where you can run games in exchange for game products, and everybody freaks out with, "YOU CAN'T MAKE ME WRITE A GAME IF I DON'T WANT TO!" and "OMG YOU CAN'T FORCE YOUR RULES ON ME!"

paul, this site has a code of conduct. the commandos don't want some jerkoff to give them a bad (or, i guess, worse) name; i don't see a real issue there.

I don't understand the hostility and condescending attitude from some on the opposing side of the issue either. People have concerns and/or questions, and they get crap thrown back in their face. Maybe the Commandos deserve their so-called bad reputation if this is how they act in real life.

Please note that this does not necessarily apply to every Commando, nor to bitrunner or Clutch9800.

I have to chime in here, too.

There seems to be a lot of people coming down hard on the program for very little reason as far as I can tell. When there is going to be a quid pro quo there have to be rules and regulations. It is pure graciousness on the part of FanPro that they are willing to compensate people for spending a little time developing a one-shot run and spending 24 hours (more or less) out of a year doing something they enjoy anyway.

I have also had a very good experience with a local Commando in Minnesota. When I was investigating whether or not I would be able to make the commitment to being a Commando I asked for and was given information in a timely and polite manner.

Also, they are not asking you to write a campaign for the program, just a one-shot run that can be played in about 4 hours. I prefer longer games, but the purpose of the program is to introduce Shadowrun to people who are curious, not test your campaign development skills.

As an aside, Paul, I would love to play in one of your games. It sounds like you have a great commitment to providing a lot of interesting detail in your campaign worlds. It is a lot of work and I hope your players appreciate your efforts.

yeah, i'm pondering doing it as well, come fall when i get back to college. there's not a whole lot of objections i, personally, can raise to the idea of running games in exchange for books.

the fighting that you're seeing here is typical of human nature, that's all...those that are members of the program and have responded here have an emotional investment in the program, and therefore feel they must defend themselves - i try to stay nonjudgmental and (as well as Clutch) simply provide the facts so that we can clear up previous misconceptions about the program and also to just raise the issue because as has been relatively clear, there is still a limited amount of people that have heard of the program.

I believe that was Clutch's original goals for this thread -
1) let people know that FanPro has an "outrider" program
2) clear up misconceptions (on both sides) about the program
3) receive feedback from the community why the program is/isn't working

This is not some secret society here - and there are a few that have joined the program, wisely waited around for a couple of months and read the boards, participated in the program, etc, before presenting a diatribe as to what needs to be changed and overthrowing the program. with that said, Clutch is always looking to improve the program, and works hard to change things - although there is still a lot of work to do, most conspicuously, as has been mentioned, the connection between the program and Shadowrun - there is little or no mention or cross promotion on the Shadowrun website concerning the program, and that is an area that needs work.

so, with all that in mind, i think we can stop the personal attacks and just focus on the original topics of the thread - if you feel strongly enough that the program is not for you, then fine, we're not twisting your arm to join. Fellow Commandos on this thread should see that the person is entitled to their opinion and not be forced to read about your experiences in the program - every person is different, and there will be emotional pleas on both sides to try to swing those on the fence. The Commandos are supposed to support the game and the other goals that i've mentioned. I would only hope that those against the program, for whatever reason, recognize this fact and either make suggestions for making our job easier, or for improving your game, or just Shadowrun as a whole.

finally, i hate to resort to cliches, but "can't we all just get along??"

I'm sorry if anyone thinks I'm attacking them personally, its not my goal. I speak strongly about what I feel strongly about.

All I’m saying is that it’s a fun way to introduce folks to the game. If you like meeting new folks and showing them how the game works go for it. I personally enjoy two aspects of the organization: 1. Painting up SR demo mini’s and showing off a bit. 2. Setting up fun scenarios and letting folks go at it. I just don’t see the reason that folks are so hostile. If you don’t like being a Commando you can leave. It’s not like your selling your soul to Satan or becoming a Fan Pro zombie. It’s just a fun way to meet folks and introduce them to the game. Nothing more and nothing less. It’s a fun little organization that’s open to anyone who has the time and enjoys the hobby. I’m just afraid folks are reading too much into it. It’s just something fun to do once every two months. For some folks with restrictive schedules then that’s out of the question. Other organizations such as a certain “Fantasy company that was formally TSR” are far more rigid. They require tests and have certifications and names and all that stuff. That seems a bit extreme. This simply an organization where you run one game every two months and can organize official Fanpro Campaigns (this is totally optional). You can bounce ideas off of other commando’s and can discuss “issues” with rules and other parts of the game with folks who have lots of experience with the game and organization. This thread is simply a post saying, “Hey if you really like Shadowrun we have a fun little organization you might be interested in”. Unless you’ve got personal experience with the group there’s no reason to slam the organization. Ultimately all we are is a group who likes to run and promote Shadowrun. That doesn’t seem like such a bad thing?

If you don't wanna see football, don't go to a football game.


-karma

We were asked for our opinion, and have given it. Clutch9800 specifically wrote ...

I don't understand why writing a three page maybe 1000 or so worded write up is a bad thing?

If you don't have time to do that then I can understand that. It makes sense.

Most folks here (18+ only) are probably in college or at least have graduated high school. You had to have written a paper or an essay or something. I can understand apprehension because English is a second language but if you’re posting regularly to this board then you have the minimal linguistic skills needed to write a scenario. Basically can you complete a sentence and do you understand basic punctuation. The commando's aren't looking for a great work of art or anything. Just a little game sketched out possibly with some NPC's and a plot.

It just seems that the complaints about writing a short adventure are a bit excessive.

If you don't like writing short one shot adventures then this program isn't going to meet your needs. The question that everyone needs to ask isn't "are you right for the program" but rather "Is the program right for you?" Having to write a small scenario doesn't seem like that major a chore. Trust me it's more of a formality than a restriction. Now if you up to your nose in work I can understand your apprehension. I'm just afraid the writing requirement is scarring folks off needlessly. I believe Clutch reviews the scenarios’. It’s just so he can get a gauge that you’ll represent the company in a manner that is coherent with the “style & genre”. I just want folks to feel confident that they’re ideas and skills are adequate. I think folks are fearful of having someone review they’re work. All I’m trying to say is don’t. The person who reviews it, is VERY easy going. Clutch is a really nice guy and is primarily a Battle Tech guy (but is a SR GM as well). He’s by no means a hard core editor. All he wants is a plot that looks fun. You have nothing to fear. We are representatives of Fanpro so he just wants to make sure you know how to run a game and have a level understanding of the genre. He’s a really lax though from what I can tell so please don’t let the writing part stop you. Just “be yourself” when you write a scenario/ run. If your worried your idea might be out of the norm then email him, I’m sure he’d love to give you feed back. Clutch is a really nice guy, don’t fret.

Ok. I've got some questions.
1) Can you only write scenarios? Living in sweden with no game store that apply and preciously few conventions makes that 'outrider' part hard to accomplish for me (And I guess some others here ought to be in the same situation)

2) I found out about this commando program just now, by reading this thread. There was some mention of 'SR missions', that I've never heard of either. Mind giving me a short explanation?

3) Would my living outside the US pose a problem for joining commandos?

EDIT: Found the answer to question 3 on the website. It would not pose a problem it seems.

The answer to #2 can be found both on the official Shadowrun website and in the Missions subforum of the Welcome to the Shadows section of this forum.

I can't answer 1, Clutch and Bitrunner have the authority there.

As for 2, check out Shadowrun Missions It's a campaign that Bitrunner organizes that covers an official "Fanpro/Wizkids" campaign. You don't have to be a Commando to run it, as anyone can run a missions campaign. If your a commando you can get credit for writing missions, although I think they may (I'm not able to give an answer) like you to run if not at a store at a convention or something. Usually conventions and stores make up most of the venues. Don't confuse the missions with the commando's directly they're totally separate. Anyone can run a Mission campaign. If you’re a commando and want to get credit for running you have to run some games at either a convention or a game store/venue of some sort. (Book store, maybe a large fan club with lots of participants? All venues are authorized by clutch).

3) As far as you not being in North America or the US that's not an issue. Technically I think we have commandos in Europe (England for sure) and possibly Australia. I think they would though like your submission in English but since your running in Sweden if your English is so so you'll probably be fine. Your post read very well, far better than my Swedish so I wouldn't worry about it.

I hope that clarifies your question. Message me if you’re still confused. I'd be glad to go into a more detailed discussion on the SR Missions.

As for writing just adventures, well, to be honest, we really haven't decided that far yet - this is a new change to the organization. My guess, though, and Clutch would have to confirm or deny this, is that you can't - you have to have some kind of public presence to try to promote the game to your fellow countrymen.

BTW, we need a "pin" in Sweden - we currently have SR Commandos in Spain and England, and a few hopefuls in Germany right now...the more Euros the better...

Also, I believe that the main FanPro unit in Germany is working on translating the SR Missions adventures into German, if that helps anyone out there...

Ok, thanks for the answers. Too bad about the writer-only idea, but I can see why you'd want it that way. I'll just have to look into doing some promotional work around here...
*Off to start up some game stores*

Well, Doggbert, I'm happy to give you an alternate answer.

I'll call you an "OurTeam Premium Commando" and give you one Shadowrun adventure or setting book for each adventure you write and get published in bitrunner's Shadowrun Missions campaign, with a maximum of 12 per year. You only have to write 3 per year to maintain your status as an "OurTeam Premium Commando".

How's that? After 6, I'll also throw in an 'I see fragged people' T-shirt from thinkgeek.com.

I think this is more recognition than FanPro gives Commandos who write adventures for Shadowrun Missions.

I coordinate a Shadowrun gaming group in the Seattle Area which regularly has about 20 people show up to play Shadowrun Missions. I'm worried that we'll be out of adventures to play by March, and am doing this on my own to promote Shadowrun Missions.

Good luck. Let me know if you're interested in the status (be the first one in your country to claim the title "OurTeam Premium Commando") and the benefits.

You're like an SR Pimp.

yeah, but he's the good SR pimp. treats his ho's with the respect they deserve.

I don't handle the money, sweetie. Talk to OurTeam.

~J

I didn't realize things were so bad. I'll see what I can come up with for Bit.

i have authors that are writing things, but as always, they are taking longer than expected due to RL commitments, etc.

but that's fodder for another thread...

What, you mean you let RL interfere with people's Commando duties. A real Commando pimp would slap that stuff down!

OurTeam
OurTeam Premium Commando sounds awesome. Or rather, what it entails sounds awesome.
I'd like 'Überninja from the Deep' to be my actual title
The general idea rocks though, but you might want to wait with appointing me til I've actually written at least one adventure...

If I want to make this a reality, how exactly would I go about it...?

And I see no problem 'working fo da pimp' if it entails new SR material on my part..

It sounds like a side deal is being forged here, with nothing to do with the Commandos. Am I right? OurTeam is not affiliated with the program, correct?

It has everything to do with the Commandos… with the OurTeam Premium Commandos, that is. It is unrelated to the FanPro Commandos.

~J

Ok, point taken. We'll handle this somewhere else, and let this thread get back to the regular scheduling...
OutTeam, we can work the rest out by PM, perhaps?

Aww, the rest of us can't try?

~J, mercenary to the last

Kagetenshi, contact me after you've become a FanPro Command, run 3 commando events at game stores, and published your first Shadowrun Missions adventure. We'll talk about whether you've received enough compensation for your work.

I see. Misunderstood

~J

OurTeam is doing a great job, but remember that he's doing this out of his own pocket for the love of the game...

i used to do stuff like that too - but i've recently married (Feb will be 1 year) and somehow all my extra money is disappearing....

Imagine what will happen when you have 3 kids...

Start organlegging now. Eighteen years of spine theft might let you get through college tuitions unscathed.

~J

Mmmmmm, organlegging. I was hoping my lottery investment would pay off, but this option is much more solidly grounded in probability and economics.

why can't i just sell the kids???

did we get off topic again???

Yeah but hey that's what boards are for, If you stayed on topic it just wouldn't be fun.....Although the only problem with selling "your" kids are that the wife tends to nag and moan.....So you have to sell kids, sell someone elses kids......


The moral of the story is: Fanpro Commano's are your friends....Friends.....Can you say F.R.I.E.N.D....I know you could.....Seriously though I think folks who enjoy the game should consider joining simply because it's a fun program. I lived in Boston for 3 years before I started running games and I've started hanging with the different shop owerns and patrons. Some of them scare me, others have turned out to be good friends.

I'll chime in with my perspective as a FanPro Commando for Shadowrun.

Application Scenarios
I was one of the first people to sign up for the programme (I'm Commando 21) and back then there was even less guidance on what was expected in the scenario. I ended up going OTT, doing far more than was needed and spending a few weeks worth of lunch hours to write my scenario and a playtest session. Still, it got me in and I have run it a couple of times so it wasn't wasted effort.

SUGGESTION: Perhaps a sample application scenario could be posted on the COmmando HQ site so people could see what was expected - i.e. a simple write up not a 50 page novel.

Firebases
To sign up you need to have a sponsoring game store to be nominated as your Firebase (at least this was the case when I joined). I managed to do this, but to be honest, a roleplaying game is not the best type of game to run as demos in store - people are unlikely to commit 3 hours to try out a game.

Classic Battletech likely works better for store games as it is more visually appealing and may allow for small skirmishs that can be wrapped up in 30 minutes.

I have now purchased some SR minis and had them painted - I might dig out some old DMZ maps and try and write some basic "scenaios" that can be played in a short amount of time. These would be better for a store game. However, I woudl still have to convince my FLGS owner to allow me to usurp the one gaming table from the card players - something that might annoy those players and if I don't get the interest might annoy the owner as well. (It doesn't help that since I joined the Commandos I have ceased buying SR books from him!).

SUGGESTION: Remove the restriction to have a local store as a Firebase to join the Commandos - some people will be happy demoing at conventions, but may not be able to convince their LGS to sponsor them.

SUGGESTION: Provide some printable paper miniatures, maps, character sheets / cards and scenarios so SR can be run like a wargame. I know this may go against the idea of a roleplaying game, but it can be a good intro. For example play through the infiltration of a small corp compound to retrieve a prototype - have a map of the compound, miniatures of the guards and runners and a basic set of objectives. Maybe you could even convert the old DMZ missions directly.

The Compensation
FanPro Commandos are compensated well - since joining I have not had to buy a SR book and I collect every book! I have even earned enough credits to replace my tired old copies of SR3 and MITS. And this is not through running loads of events, I just do the average each year or maybe a bit more.

SUGGESTION: Make it extremely clear what can be used to gain credits - either I had forgotten or had not been aware that writing Missions earned you credits (this could be me though )

The Shadowrun / Classic Battletech focus
The Commando Programme also covers CBT - it is not a game I know personally so I have no issues with it either way, however the support and general feel of the Commando programme seems to be more centred around CBT than SR.

This is changing, especially with Missions and bitrunner on board, but for example I got some CBT posters to provide to my firebase and one to keep, however I never got any SR posters (which I would love!). Also there seem to be great organised tournaments for CBT but nothing on that scale for SR - as bitrunner has stated Missions is separate from the Commando programme.

SUGGESTION: Pay more attention to the SR side of the Commando Programme. Have some special tournaments or scenarios that can only be run by Commandos and / or can only be played by those players who have signed up at Commando HQ. Give me something that I can take to my firebase and get them excited about.

Overall the programme is good, you can network with new players and other Commandos, promote SR and get free gear!