Do the GMs out there allow shapeshifters in their games and campaigns?
If a shapeshifter is a spell caster they can cast some powerful mojo provided they do not take deadly drain and all of the damage will be gone at the beginning of the next combat round. The only limit to this extreme power is if the drain is physical because the shapeshifter learned a spell greater than his magic rating, something that is very unlikely given the rules for leaning new spells. If the drain is physical it takes them one minute per box of damage to recover.
How do the GMs handle their regeneration?
Shapeshifting is a magical transformation so why do the stats of a shapeshifter not transfer between human and animal form? Given their impressive ability to sling major mojo and the fact that their respective physical stat lines must be raised separately, why would anyone make a shapeshifter that wasn't a spell caster? For my campaign I am tempted to say that shapeshifters don't have to raise their stats separately but they do have to learn all physical skills for the two forms i.e. unarmed combat skills. What do you all think, how would you handle the power in your campaign?
Full Version: Shapeshifters / Shapechangers
| QUOTE |
| If a shapeshifter is a spell caster they can cast some powerful mojo provided they do not take deadly drain and all of the damage will be gone at the beginning of the next combat round. The only limit to this extreme power is if the drain is physical because the shapeshifter learned a spell greater than his magic rating, something that is very unlikely given the rules for leaning new spells. If the drain is physical it takes them one minute per box of damage to recover. |
Actually, damage caused by drain heals as it would if they did not have regeneration. It's right there in the explanation of the power.
The stats don't transfer because that would make for some very tough hombre's indeed when compared to non shifting chracters. It serves to balance the regeneration.
Also, i don't think you can cast in animal form, by Canon as you can't use adept abilities in animal form.
Shapeshifters are pretty weak at character creation. The high cost of playing a shifter and the extra three extra Physical attributes that you have to purchases seperately for the animal form really hurt. I believe it makes up for the power of regeneration easily.
Add some karma into the mix and they do a bit better.
I'd let someone play one in my game.
Add some karma into the mix and they do a bit better.
I'd let someone play one in my game.
| QUOTE (Nikoli) |
| Also, i don't think you can cast in animal form, by Canon as you can't use adept abilities in animal form. |
That's an interesting point...
| QUOTE (Nikoli) | ||||
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I double checked the rules in the 3rd edition companion to make sure I wasn't crazy in thinking shapeshifters have awesome power.
On page 35 of the companion (bottom right corner) it says that shapeshifters in animal form can cast spells and summon spirits.
On page 36 in the last paragraph it says that a shapeshifter suffering physical damage from drain recovers damage at one box per minute (crazy fast). It says nothing about recovering stun damage from drain so I am forced to conclude that they recover all stun damage from drain as normal.
Except for their regeneration they are kinda wimpy so I hesitate to limit their regeneration of stun damage from drain but if I don't do that then every shapeshifter will be a magician of some sort.
A shapeshifter NEEDS to be a magician anyway, they are dual natured, permanently astrally active. They need astral defenses to really be viable.
I've got a player who's favorite character is a magically active shapeshifter. Overall it's not game breaking, as long as you're okay with a high level of magic in your game.
The priorities and need to split attribute points gut them at chargen, so they're actually rather weak when first made. Afterwards, their regeneration is a big bonus, but their dual nature works against them most of the time. (Not being able to ignore background count, even when doing physical things, getting stopped by every ward, being vulnerable to astrally projecting mages, etc.)
And finally, if your player is role-playing them well, just remember that they're animals that can change into human form. This gives them all sorts of social problems when they try to move in human society.
The priorities and need to split attribute points gut them at chargen, so they're actually rather weak when first made. Afterwards, their regeneration is a big bonus, but their dual nature works against them most of the time. (Not being able to ignore background count, even when doing physical things, getting stopped by every ward, being vulnerable to astrally projecting mages, etc.)
And finally, if your player is role-playing them well, just remember that they're animals that can change into human form. This gives them all sorts of social problems when they try to move in human society.
I haven't seen any high-karma shapeshifters, but early on, they really suck.
Their combat abilities in animal form are nowhere as good as those of a melee-oriented sam or adept, and their other main ability - regeneration - basically only comes into play if they really screw up, and can't be relied to keep them going because it does fail often enough to matter. Magic is the only thing that meshes well with their abilities, but the cost is a huge problem.
Their combat abilities in animal form are nowhere as good as those of a melee-oriented sam or adept, and their other main ability - regeneration - basically only comes into play if they really screw up, and can't be relied to keep them going because it does fail often enough to matter. Magic is the only thing that meshes well with their abilities, but the cost is a huge problem.
mmu1
How do you handle their combat skills? Do you make them learn serperate combat skills for human and animal form or let them use reaction for combat in animal form?
How do you handle their combat skills? Do you make them learn serperate combat skills for human and animal form or let them use reaction for combat in animal form?
I general, I stick to 2nd edition shifting rules, which are significantly better. No silly extra attributes, and the regeneration abilities are modified (including, no regeneratin in human form. Which means regeneration OR armor, but not both.)
Edit, already answered.
Come play a shape shifter in my game and see. Heh. We've never had anyone play one for long that's for sure...
The regeneration thing is pretty powerful, but as I discovered in my thread where I tried to make a face style shifter, with the cost of A: being a shifter, and B: being awakened (otherwise they get hosed by magic) it's hard to make a well rounded character (espeically with almost no gear, and no contacts). In a combat heavy game, where those few skill points can just be channeled to combat skills, it could be a bit overwhelming.
While it is difficult to build a good shapeshifter mage strong in both forms, it is not that difficult to build one good in 1 form. If you allow Edges and Flaws, then it would be easier as well. Also I allow (in fact I insist) using Reaction in animal form for unarmed combat.
| QUOTE (Sandoval Smith) |
| The regeneration thing is pretty powerful, but as I discovered in my thread where I tried to make a face style shifter <snip> |
Out of curiousity, how did you story that? It was an animal right? One that was going to interact with a slew of people? That seems a bit odd at first glance. Curious though...
I think the rules for shifters make them pretty lame but I'm a skills adict so it's probably just me.
It was an animal that found people simply facinating, and enjoyed being around them. So, very charismatic, and the adept version had Improved Social Ability: Etiquette and ISA: Negotiations, as well as three regular ranks of the skill to try and reflect that.
I play a shapeshifter, and it's a lot of fun to play. But there are a lot of things you have to consider when you playthem.
If you break the law in the UCAS and they find out your a shapeshifter they shoot you. No questions asked. You actually fall under the realm of animal control!! Yes if the star catches you you could be put to sleep!
You can't enter warded buildings without alerting someone or using masking usually.
You usually don't understand what is going on around you unless your have a skill in it. (I took a human culture knowledge skill)
Your stats suck starting out. So it's easier for you to get hurt.
It's not mentioned in the rules but all your food expenses should be doubled becouse you need to eat REAL meat.
And You get all the usual disadvantages of a shadowrunner.
You need regeneration just to survive.
But if shapeshifters were hard to play before they are "MUCH" more so now. "If" you use The optional rule they posted about shapeshifters can pretty much neuter the race.
If you break the law in the UCAS and they find out your a shapeshifter they shoot you. No questions asked. You actually fall under the realm of animal control!! Yes if the star catches you you could be put to sleep!
You can't enter warded buildings without alerting someone or using masking usually.
You usually don't understand what is going on around you unless your have a skill in it. (I took a human culture knowledge skill)
Your stats suck starting out. So it's easier for you to get hurt.
It's not mentioned in the rules but all your food expenses should be doubled becouse you need to eat REAL meat.
And You get all the usual disadvantages of a shadowrunner.
You need regeneration just to survive.
But if shapeshifters were hard to play before they are "MUCH" more so now. "If" you use The optional rule they posted about shapeshifters can pretty much neuter the race.
Have the shapeshifter be an adept, learn performance (maybe one for while they're in their animal form?) and burn some karma to be able to make rating 10 background counts at will aspected towards them. No muss, no fuss, no astral worries.
Make a shapeshifter adept with performance and a high athletics... then take the day job flaw and you can make a circus performing shapeshifter !!. preformer by day runner by night. 
| QUOTE (MidnightGhost) |
| It's not mentioned in the rules but all your food expenses should be doubled becouse you need to eat REAL meat. |
Or perhaps they should be reduced, as a shapeshifter living in Snohomish, or a seal shapeshifter living near water could simply hunt for food. Most animals I've seen don't get their food at Stuffer Shack.
| QUOTE (MidnightGhost) |
| Make a shapeshifter adept with performance and a high athletics... then take the day job flaw and you can make a circus performing shapeshifter !!. preformer by day runner by night. |
I'm having a really hard time picturing Midnight taking up a job as a circus performer, but what the hell. He's your character.
| QUOTE (Capt. Dave) |
| Or perhaps they should be reduced, as a shapeshifter living in Snohomish, or a seal shapeshifter living near water could simply hunt for food. Most animals I've seen don't get their food at Stuffer Shack. |
It would depend on what type of shifter you are in my game. A fox shifter, sure. But the character in question is a shapeshifting panther. Those animals require a hefty amount of meat. Catching the occasional squirrel or rabbit won't be enough, and even in Snomish I doubt there's that many deer roaming around. (If anyone who lives there wants to correct me, feel free.)
If the shifter lived in a smaller city in NAN territory or the like I'd agree with you. In this case though, I had a were-panther living in the middle of downtown Everett. He also elected not to go regularly hunting metahumans for food, and there are only so many dogs roaming around the neighborhood. (Hunting metahumans for food would open up an entirely new can of worms.)
| QUOTE |
| If you break the law in the UCAS and they find out your a shapeshifter they shoot you. No questions asked. You actually fall under the realm of animal control!! Yes if the star catches you you could be put to sleep! |
I so want to stress this. People make a big deal out of the so-called lack of rights of the SINless, but when push comes to shove they do have them. Shapeshifters don't even have basic human rights. UCAS law does NOT define shapeshifters as sentient, for reasons best known.
Eth problem with using reaction as the natural weapon combat stat is that ther is no possibility to get better at combat. Or to play a shape shifter that is not very skilled at combat (a valid choice for herbivorous types that rely on running away from a fight).
Not that high speed (quickens) and the ability to notice threats early (int) will result automatically in very high reaction (ability to strike with natural weapon). This may make sence for aggressive critter types but for passive or fleeing types it dose not work
MidnightGhost. Why would a shape shifter require real meat, shorly a canine shape shifter would be able to survive on whatever is in commercial dog food and why would a sparrow shape shifter eat meat at all (and don’t tell me a sparrow full magician wouldn’t be useful)
The most likely shape shifter I would play though would be dog shifter/shaman living a street lifestyle, I get my food the same way as every other stray.
A tom cat would be another option but the totem Cat doesn’t really work with a street lifestyle, I wonder if there is a totem Ally Cat.
Edward
Not that high speed (quickens) and the ability to notice threats early (int) will result automatically in very high reaction (ability to strike with natural weapon). This may make sence for aggressive critter types but for passive or fleeing types it dose not work
MidnightGhost. Why would a shape shifter require real meat, shorly a canine shape shifter would be able to survive on whatever is in commercial dog food and why would a sparrow shape shifter eat meat at all (and don’t tell me a sparrow full magician wouldn’t be useful)
The most likely shape shifter I would play though would be dog shifter/shaman living a street lifestyle, I get my food the same way as every other stray.
A tom cat would be another option but the totem Cat doesn’t really work with a street lifestyle, I wonder if there is a totem Ally Cat.
Edward
Here is another power thing to think about. Imagine an initiate shapeshifter with access to the metaplanes... You guessed it. That shapeshifter can now astral quest at very high ratings to learn spells and spell formulae with out worrying about failure. Now this isn't so brocken as to allow the shapeshifter that completes a rating 6 astral quest to automatically learn a force 6 spell it does give the shifter 6 extra dice for the learning attempt and reduce the karma cost for learning the spell by 6. This effectively gives a shifter the ability to learn high force spells without paying karma. The only thing restricting them from learning every spell in the books is a bit of time.
Should a gm allow them to regenerate damage from questing plane to questing plane or make the damage taken unregeneratable?
Should a gm allow them to regenerate damage from questing plane to questing plane or make the damage taken unregeneratable?
| QUOTE |
| MidnightGhost. Why would a shape shifter require real meat, shorly a canine shape shifter would be able to survive on whatever is in commercial dog food and why would a sparrow shape shifter eat meat at all (and don’t tell me a sparrow full magician wouldn’t be useful) |
Good point.
Sorry, I was thinking along the lines of my character for that part. I guess my point is you should watch what your character eats. Most human food is bad for humans and terrible for animals.
I don't think their would be domestic shapeshifters... but if there were, would that mean our problems with inbreeding "pure blood" dogs would come with them? maybe that's better left unanswered.
DragginSPADE,
No I don't see him being a performer either... but if he had grown up in a circus instead of Aztlan...naa probably not even then.
| QUOTE |
The only thing restricting them from learning every spell in the books is a bit of time. |
Ok, I must have missed somehting here. How does being dual natured help you with astral quests? As I recall going dual natured creaturs have to go to the metaplanes the same as everybody else.
They do have to go through the metaplanes just like everyone else but all an astral quest consists of is a damage resistance test on each plane. If you regenerate your damage from plane to plane then it's all null sheen.
ahhh, I always ruled that as magical damage.
| QUOTE (DrJest) | ||
I so want to stress this. People make a big deal out of the so-called lack of rights of the SINless, but when push comes to shove they do have them. Shapeshifters don't even have basic human rights. UCAS law does NOT define shapeshifters as sentient, for reasons best known. |
1: Because they're animals that can assume human form, not the other way around. They can not be held to the same standards of behavior as metahumans because of their bestial nature.
2: As for being put down by the Star, well the situation is the same for them as for most SINless runners. Don't get picked up by the law unless you've got some sort of connection to get you back out again.
3: Concerning food, my tiger Adept shifter LOVED to cook. Yeah, occasionly it was nice to get dinner hot, raw, and still bleeding, but do you have any comprehension of all the things you can do to a nice, thick, steak with only the most basic of seasonings?
According to some interperations Shapeshifter (and Drake) Adepts and Aspected Magicians can astrally project . If a GM uses this interperation then Shapeshifters instantly become much more useful.
As for the social probelms of Bestial Nature, they can be played many different ways. The bear shifter who eats out of dumpsters and stray pic-i-nic baskets wouldn't ingratiate himself to high society but he would fit right in with the homeless in the Barrans.
The female Fox shapeshifter Social Adept who lacks sexual restraint could pretty much wrap most men and some women around her little finger.
As for the social probelms of Bestial Nature, they can be played many different ways. The bear shifter who eats out of dumpsters and stray pic-i-nic baskets wouldn't ingratiate himself to high society but he would fit right in with the homeless in the Barrans.
The female Fox shapeshifter Social Adept who lacks sexual restraint could pretty much wrap most men and some women around her little finger.
Shapeshifters are cr@p.
Here's how to fix them.
Give them six stats like everyone else.
Give them the proper 'shifter stat boosts they get in critters.
Let any physad powers apply in animal form.
Add in Shapeshifter power stress.
Change cyberware stress block to 1-3 Regen, 4-6 Shapeshift.
Look at the bioware stress charts for ideas.
Any wound causing Regen stress points must heal as per normal healing rules.
Drain damage (including manawarp damage and the like) heal at 1 box/minute.
Realise where the rules are broken.
Ie. When astral anything happening to your aura happens to your body, despite the rules inferring the reverse is true as well, it isn't supposed to be. Otherwise how do you get the already dead projecting mage flying around seeking revenge scenario? So healing on the body shouldn't affect the aura.
Realise where the rules are fine.
Regeneration is a physical power. It doesn't work when projecting, such as to the metaplanes. Probably shouldn't even work on the body when the aura isn't around as it is a magical ability.
Follow this advice and you should have fun with them instead of them sucking to high heaven.
One further piece of advice... if you are going to play a shapeshifter (oh brave soul) then at least have the presence of mind to play a Physical Magician... just make sure your GM fixes the cr@ppy rules for them too.
Here's how to fix them.
Give them six stats like everyone else.
Give them the proper 'shifter stat boosts they get in critters.
Let any physad powers apply in animal form.
Add in Shapeshifter power stress.
Change cyberware stress block to 1-3 Regen, 4-6 Shapeshift.
Look at the bioware stress charts for ideas.
Any wound causing Regen stress points must heal as per normal healing rules.
Drain damage (including manawarp damage and the like) heal at 1 box/minute.
Realise where the rules are broken.
Ie. When astral anything happening to your aura happens to your body, despite the rules inferring the reverse is true as well, it isn't supposed to be. Otherwise how do you get the already dead projecting mage flying around seeking revenge scenario? So healing on the body shouldn't affect the aura.
Realise where the rules are fine.
Regeneration is a physical power. It doesn't work when projecting, such as to the metaplanes. Probably shouldn't even work on the body when the aura isn't around as it is a magical ability.
Follow this advice and you should have fun with them instead of them sucking to high heaven.
One further piece of advice... if you are going to play a shapeshifter (oh brave soul) then at least have the presence of mind to play a Physical Magician... just make sure your GM fixes the cr@ppy rules for them too.
After listening to everyones ideas and reading the optional rule on regeneration in FAN Pros FAQ I have come up with this improved version of regeneration.
1. Regeneration has a threshold of essence number of boxes per turn. This is the max number of boxes that can be regenerated in one combat turn. Any damage not regenerated must be healed normally.
2. Stun damage can be regenerated because it doesn't make sense for a were-tiger to be more afraid of being slapped around than being shot by an assault rifle with silver bullets.
3. Physical damage must be healed first, followed by stun damage.
4. Because Essence is the threshold shapeshifters are now allowed to take cyberware at the cost of being able to regenerate. All implants cost twice as much, do to the rather extreme lengths surgeons must engage in, in order to instal cyberware into a regenerating critter.
5. When astral projecting damage regenerates at a rate of 1 box per minute. (Mostly because all drain is physical damage when astral projecting)
6. After some damage is regenerated no furthing magical healing can be used as the regeneration itself was magical healing.
So an unarmored shapeshifter (because he just can't afford to replace it all the time or they've yet to come out with barding for tigers) is in a fight with a couple of gangers carrying smgs. The shapeshifter gets the drop on one of them and hits him with a force 6 manabolt taking moderate drain (3 boxes of stun). The other ganger lets the shapeshifter eat a full burst fire of led doing 10 deadly damage. Failing to get two 10s on the damage resistance test the shapeshifter takes deadly (10 boxes of physical). After regeneration the shapeshifter has 2 boxes of physical and 3 boxes of stun left and so must heal that normally.
Does a change like this make sense? Does it make shapeshifters too strong or too wimpy? Thanks for helping me debug my campaign.
1. Regeneration has a threshold of essence number of boxes per turn. This is the max number of boxes that can be regenerated in one combat turn. Any damage not regenerated must be healed normally.
2. Stun damage can be regenerated because it doesn't make sense for a were-tiger to be more afraid of being slapped around than being shot by an assault rifle with silver bullets.
3. Physical damage must be healed first, followed by stun damage.
4. Because Essence is the threshold shapeshifters are now allowed to take cyberware at the cost of being able to regenerate. All implants cost twice as much, do to the rather extreme lengths surgeons must engage in, in order to instal cyberware into a regenerating critter.
5. When astral projecting damage regenerates at a rate of 1 box per minute. (Mostly because all drain is physical damage when astral projecting)
6. After some damage is regenerated no furthing magical healing can be used as the regeneration itself was magical healing.
So an unarmored shapeshifter (because he just can't afford to replace it all the time or they've yet to come out with barding for tigers) is in a fight with a couple of gangers carrying smgs. The shapeshifter gets the drop on one of them and hits him with a force 6 manabolt taking moderate drain (3 boxes of stun). The other ganger lets the shapeshifter eat a full burst fire of led doing 10 deadly damage. Failing to get two 10s on the damage resistance test the shapeshifter takes deadly (10 boxes of physical). After regeneration the shapeshifter has 2 boxes of physical and 3 boxes of stun left and so must heal that normally.
Does a change like this make sense? Does it make shapeshifters too strong or too wimpy? Thanks for helping me debug my campaign.
Until now, with all the disadvantages that the shapeshifters get, any downgrading of the regeneration power basically makes shapeshifters mechanically unplayable.
Would any of you who allow shapeshifters allow a shapeshifter PC to have bioware?
Nope. Regeneration would make that kind of surgery impossible
| QUOTE (Aes @ Mar 21 2005, 09:10 PM) |
| Nope. Regeneration would make that kind of surgery impossible |
Actually, to quote SR Comp, pg. 37 "...next to impossible; even when it has been successful, the cyberware is usually purged from the body..."
(Emphasis mine)
So, by canon, one can implant bioware, and even cyberware into a shifter. Of course the cyberware is purged immediately afterwards, but it can be implanted.
It says nothing about purging bioware, or that a shapeshifter cannot accept bioware.
How did I know you'd take an interest in this particular thread? 
Bioware would be impossible too, IMO. Just to keep from giving myself a headache, I say that Regeneration heals something to match its astral template. Even if the surgery is done in such a way to keep from triggering immediate regeneration, once that kicks in, the foreign matter will always be expelled.
Also, Astelaron, how could cyberware ever work in a shapeshifter, even if it wasn't immediately rejected? Let's say the 'shifter get a replacement cyberarm. What happens if they shift into a seal? Or a bear? Are they going to have a random, human, metal arm sticking out somewhere? I din't even want to think about headware.
Also, Astelaron, how could cyberware ever work in a shapeshifter, even if it wasn't immediately rejected? Let's say the 'shifter get a replacement cyberarm. What happens if they shift into a seal? Or a bear? Are they going to have a random, human, metal arm sticking out somewhere? I din't even want to think about headware.
I was looking at regeneration as magical healing. If regeneration is like a really powerful anchored treat spell with a force of essence then the max number of boxes that can be healed is 8 for a shifter. Magical healing can't be applied after biotec healing is applied so surgery would be possible with this assumption.
Changing shape for a shifter would be like having an innate shapechange spell for one specific critter. The shapechange spell will transform cyberware because it is a magical transformation and cyberware has been payed for with essence.
I forgot to mention with the rules changes that when a regenerating creature takes deadly damage they must still roll the 1D6 to see if they regenerate at all.
None of these shapeshifter rule changes are cannon. I'm just attempting to balance them for my campaign if that is possible.
Changing shape for a shifter would be like having an innate shapechange spell for one specific critter. The shapechange spell will transform cyberware because it is a magical transformation and cyberware has been payed for with essence.
I forgot to mention with the rules changes that when a regenerating creature takes deadly damage they must still roll the 1D6 to see if they regenerate at all.
None of these shapeshifter rule changes are cannon. I'm just attempting to balance them for my campaign if that is possible.
Besides how many surgeons can do a 3sec operation? Even if they keep cutting to keep the wounds open.(and thats a lot of recutting.) They still have to deal with the regeneration.
Now all surgery counts as deadly damage but even if you make it you still are going to mess yourself up the first time you shapeshift, Ouch! Your organs are not going to shapeshift with you, even if you get it upgraded. They have already said that their is a intangible aspect to DNA. (The part that responded in some people during surge.)
Also shapeshifters have 8E giving them a bio-index of 11. Thats like a second edition troll.
So IMO I would have to say no they shouldn't be allowed to have bioware.
Amusing thoughts : cyberware and bioware (even though I don't think they should be able to have them imagen if they could!)
Super Thyroid = VERY hungry hunter then add platelets = bad news around feeding time.
You thought you dog had bad breath before .... get your wolf shifter a poison gland !
You want fast boosted reflexes + synaptic accelerator + animal form fox or tiger (example)
muscle enhancements !!!
And finally don't mess with our decker man you wouldn't like him when he's angry!
Now all surgery counts as deadly damage but even if you make it you still are going to mess yourself up the first time you shapeshift, Ouch! Your organs are not going to shapeshift with you, even if you get it upgraded. They have already said that their is a intangible aspect to DNA. (The part that responded in some people during surge.)
Also shapeshifters have 8E giving them a bio-index of 11. Thats like a second edition troll.
So IMO I would have to say no they shouldn't be allowed to have bioware.
Amusing thoughts : cyberware and bioware (even though I don't think they should be able to have them imagen if they could!)
Super Thyroid = VERY hungry hunter then add platelets = bad news around feeding time.
You thought you dog had bad breath before .... get your wolf shifter a poison gland !
You want fast boosted reflexes + synaptic accelerator + animal form fox or tiger (example)
muscle enhancements !!!
And finally don't mess with our decker man you wouldn't like him when he's angry!
There are "rumors" of cyberware designed to keep a shifter in human form being forcibly implanted by government and megacorps. I don't think cyberware or bioware would be benificial to a shapeshifter even if someone could find a way to prevent rejection.
Things like bonelacing might be possible. Why would when use a dangerous procedure to lace bones? Some simple ingested cocktails of the right chemical ingredients and a few shots of a special binder and presto chango you have laced bones. Sure it takes a while, normal recovery time, but no surgery. Muscle augmentation and toners could be handled in the same way. Symbiotes and Platlet Factories are okay as well. Of course no Shapeshifter would ever get Symbiotes.
Bonelacing wouldn't work because your bones change size when you shape shift So if you lace them the bone would tear away from the lacing. BUT I belive you have found a new way to torture a shifter.
Regeneration makes it almost impossible to implant cyberware or bioware into a shapeshifter.
So the only question left is, how many corps have researched the health or manipulation spell Suppress Regeneration?
So the only question left is, how many corps have researched the health or manipulation spell Suppress Regeneration?
I agree that according to cannon cyber and bioware is impossible for a shapeshifter. My question and what I have proposed is a change to those rules with the major assumption that regeneration is like magical healing. If biotech is used on a shapeshifter before he regenerates then the regeneration is no longer a problem.
The second big change is that shapeshifting is the result of an innate shapeshange spell. The shapeshange spell transforms all cyber and bioware that has been paid for with essense.
My question is not wether these changes are cannon. I know they are impossible according to the strict rules. I am attempting to change the rules to make shifters funner to play and less magically all powerful. If you think the changes are dumb, weaken the shifter too much, or give the shifter to much additional power let me know.
The second big change is that shapeshifting is the result of an innate shapeshange spell. The shapeshange spell transforms all cyber and bioware that has been paid for with essense.
My question is not wether these changes are cannon. I know they are impossible according to the strict rules. I am attempting to change the rules to make shifters funner to play and less magically all powerful. If you think the changes are dumb, weaken the shifter too much, or give the shifter to much additional power let me know.
| QUOTE |
There are "rumors" of cyberware designed to keep a shifter in human form being forcibly implanted by government and megacorps. I don't think cyberware or bioware would be benificial to a shapeshifter even if someone could find a way to prevent rejection. |
Cannon method for installing cyberware
Surgery automatically causes a deadly wound. When a shifter takes a deadly wound there is a chance that they won't regenerate ( on roll of a 1 on a D6).
Me, I was thinking about playing a Fox Voodoo shapshifter with an ally to start with. Stay in the fox form all the time,a nd have the ally act as mouth for my character. every morning wake up and summon up two force 8 or so Loa and always have a pack of watchers. This would mainly be for day to day living... In runs well it depends on things go. By the way, I do not think a well behaved fox on a leash would be stopped by lone star.
Yes,shapeshifter get fucked hard, but when it really comes down to it the thing I think I would really change would be the state rules. As it stands you basically are saying that shapeshifters cost 36(or 41) points to play. I mean, you pay 25 point, and you are a shapshifter, you have to pay at least 6 more points for the stats, and you may get a 5 or 10 point flaw..Duel nature. That is just a whole lot of points.
But as I recall, if you are duel natured and astually project your physical body goes with you,and you can then move your physical body at the speed of spirits.
Yes,shapeshifter get fucked hard, but when it really comes down to it the thing I think I would really change would be the state rules. As it stands you basically are saying that shapeshifters cost 36(or 41) points to play. I mean, you pay 25 point, and you are a shapshifter, you have to pay at least 6 more points for the stats, and you may get a 5 or 10 point flaw..Duel nature. That is just a whole lot of points.
But as I recall, if you are duel natured and astually project your physical body goes with you,and you can then move your physical body at the speed of spirits.
| QUOTE (Cynic project) |
| But as I recall, if you are duel natured and astually project your physical body goes with you,and you can then move your physical body at the speed of spirits. |
Only if you are native to the Astral, as Spirits are.
| QUOTE (Astelaron) |
| I agree that according to cannon cyber and bioware is impossible for a shapeshifter. |
By canon, cyberware is impossible, as it is purged from the body even if the surgery is successful. Implantation surgery is possible, by the book. They have cyberware rejection, not bioware rejection. Nowhere, in any book I've read, does it state that shapeshifters cannot accept bioware implants.
If you don't want shapeshifters to have bioware, then it becomes a houserule.
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